Famicom Disk System and FDS Format

[Epicenter]

Hey, I'm considering getting an FDS for my Famicom .. but I'd like to know, what kind of format are the disks in? It's probably not MS-DOS .. is there software I can use to write an FDS image to the disk, and a program to convert NES->FDS ROM images? Can I just use standard floppies? Do they need to be 1440K or 720K? DD/HD?

This is doubtful, but will the FDS work with the NES, too? (with the adapter, of course?) I know it plugs into the cartridge slot, but how about that one on the bottom too? Does it use famicom-specific features? ..

Thanks. :)
-- Epicenter

[spoon]

I have one. I haven't had much time to mess with it. I am waiting on my A/v famicom to arrive before I really mess with it. I actually haven't even gotten it to work correctly. There is a memeber on the boards that I bought a replacement belt from, (can't remember his name, check the Restoration forum), and I know he is knowledgeable on the subject. Ask him or Ace from Simply NES. It will work on a top loader or toaster style NES. You need to Cut the lockout chip (On the toaster style) and use a Fami to NES converter. I know you can't use standard disks. It is easy to copy the disk by using a disk copier.

If you happen to have any extras or just want to chat about the FDS, shoot me a pm or e-mail.

Some links:
http://nesdev.parodius.com/#DocsFDS

http://www.nesplayer.com/technical/FDS.htm

http://simplynes.emucamp.com/fdsguide.html

[maxlords]

It uses proprietary Nintendo disks :) They're a really weird shape too! :D

[Ed Oscuro]

WTF is this "what format"? Oh, you mean how are sectors written? Well the disks are the same type as used in some proprietary Hitachi MIDI computer. 128K/side is really too small to worry about writing sectors and including a file system such as FAT would be a waste of space, but as they don't load the whole disk at once you still need some way of deciding how much data is read or whatever at a time. To quote from NESdev's Parodius FAQ (http://nesdev.parodius.com/fds-e.txt):


Data on disk is, as shown on the table below,
recorded in a unit of block. The first byte
in a block is recognized as identification of the
block, and data length is decided. At the start and
the end of the block there are "Block Start Mark"
and "Block End Mark" recorded respectively. Although
it is not so important for emulators, the
"Block Start Mark" is the value $80, and the
"Block End Mark" is 2-byte CRC value(?) of recorded
data, which is used for verifying the data in a block.

Woohoo! It seems that there's a possibility for arbitrary size data blocks if the second-third-etc bytes determine the block length size...only you probably want to keep the size of a block low so the FDS can actually load the whole thing into data.

[Cmosfm]

i have one and use it a lot, it will work with a toploading NES with a converter and the disks are unlike any shape youve ever seen so no, you cant copy a game onto a regular floppy and I've never seen a unit (other than the japanese in store game copier thats rarer than and more expensive than the Nintendo World Championships cart) that would let you do any kind of copying.

So get on eBay, buy what you can, and be happy! I have an extra copy of Doki Doki Panic I'd be willing to let go for a good trade!

[Ed Oscuro]

the disks are unlike any shape youve ever seen

Oh really? Next time you see a 3.5 floppy, you've seen something pretty close. The window's different, though. Now the size, that's what's different.

[Epicenter]

Ah, OK. I just want to be able to play games from normal floppies .. ;P What are the names of some of the devices that can do that? I know one was made at some point (unofficial, of course) .. alternately, maybe there's an NES/Famicom EPROM/EEPROM/Flash cartridge out there somewhere? :)

[leonk]

What you're looking for was very common for the SNES (I've seen a few of these in person in different stores). But one for the NES.. I've never seen/heard of one that is an add-on on the NES (but rather a complete PC style box that has a FD on it that does not connect to an NES)

[spoon]

There is a device that would allow copying of the disks at home. I hagve seen one on the net before. I wil post a pic of it later. It looks kinda like an external zip disk drive.


@cmosfm: I am intereted in that Doki Doki disk. Is it complete and in eorking condition? PM me.

[mrhaboobi]

I have one. I haven't had much time to mess with it. I am waiting on my A/v famicom to arrive before I really mess with it. I actually haven't even gotten it to work correctly. There is a memeber on the boards that I bought a replacement belt from, (can't remember his name, check the Restoration forum), and I know he is knowledgeable on the subject. Ask him or Ace from Simply NES. It will work on a top loader or toaster style NES. You need to Cut the lockout chip (On the toaster style) and use a Fami to NES converter. I know you can't use standard disks. It is easy to copy the disk by using a disk copier.

If you happen to have any extras or just want to chat about the FDS, shoot me a pm or e-mail.

Some links:
http://nesdev.parodius.com/#DocsFDS

http://www.nesplayer.com/technical/FDS.htm

http://simplynes.emucamp.com/fdsguide.html

SPoon that would be me :)

Anyways these are 3" format disks.. yes you can copy them, there are a few ways to do it, firstly you can use a copier, something like a disk doctor etc. i have one of these for my system, however it seems to copies are not exact as you need the copier plugged in to play the copied games , at least with the one i have. Also there is another way to set up two famicom drives side by side with a homebuilt cable that allows you to copy from one drive to the other.. i found a japanese site that explained how to do this. but dont have the link on me..

You should be able to hook a famicom disk system up to a Lop loading nes, but good luck with a normal nes, you could do it, but it would be a pain in the ass..

Aside from that if anyone needs replacement belts i have some left. :)

[spoon]

That would be the man.

Greg, I keep getting error 22 and 23's. You mentioned before about adjusting the speed of the drive. I replaced the belt (That you sent me). That part is working fine. Any ideas?

Anybody have any disks for trade or sale?

[mrhaboobi]

You have to adjust the speed that the motor spins the belt at..

ok once you have the belt on, put that metal cover back on. flip the drive over and look towards the end end of the drive ( the end that the power connector plugs into ).. there should be a round motor ( its connected to the small cog that the belt sits over. ), on top of the motor is a little round black hole ( its covered witha rubber material.. if you put a very small jeweller screw driver in the hole there is a screw that adjusts the speed that the drive spins at. Its a little bit of trial and error but twist the screw a small ammount and try the disk again.. youshould be able to get it working.. I should really take a few picture of a drive and make a guide..