Recent (and painful) discovery about Sealed NES games

[orrimarrko]

Well, I knew this would happen at some point.

Typically, the rule of thumb has always been:

Licensed NES games are originally sealed if they have the horizontal seam on the back.

A guideline like that makes it easy - no seam, not originally sealed.

WRONG!!

I bought a Namco Pac-Man sealed MINT off of eBay. When I got it - it looked brand new in EVERY way - perfect! However, NO horizontal seam on the back. Also, the shrinkwrap was a little thicker and not malliable like the other sealed games I have. So, I immediately checked another sealed Namco Pac-Man. Sure enough - it had the horizontal seam.

OH SHIT. I've been duped! (or so I thought)

Figuring that it was not originally sealed, I opened it. I was dead wrong. It was as pristine and untouched as the day it left the manufacturing line.

Anyway, the moral here is that the old rule means exactly shit.

Just because it doesn't have the horizontal seam on the back doesn't necessarily mean that it's not factory sealed. I know that's already true for the majority of the unlicensed NES games, but I can definitely say that it can also be true for licensed ones as well.

Just an FYI.

Steve

[portnoyd]

... Namco games for the NES (Pac and Ms Pac), don't have seams. The only exception to the rule. Sorry D:

[Jive3D]

<insert pac-man death SFX>

[Kejoriv]

That sucks. Well at least you learned your lesson I guess x_x

[Dr. Morbis]

What about late-era licensed games that weren't manufacured by Nintendo? For example: Terminator 2 was manufactured by Akklaim. Would this have the horizontal seem or not???

[Arqueologia_Digital]

... Namco games for the NES (Pac and Ms Pac), don't have seams. The only exception to the rule. Sorry D:
Bad moment for our friend. It doesn´t matter orrimarrko if you have a sealed or not sealed game, well for me, it´s not VERY IMPORTANT to own sealed games (my non-open games are games that i hate)...

Matías

[Buyatari]

Sometime ago I bought out the contents of a storage locker owned by American Technos.

Appearantly they were having trouble and moved their stuff into a storage locker until they got it all straight. Well they didn't get it straight and they went under (I think). Well this much I know, they didn't pay the bill so the contents were up for grabs and I came along to lend a helping hand.

Anyway one of the many items was a Crash and the Boys for NES which was sealed but no horizonal seam ?

I still don't know what to think about this one. Reseal? It doesn't make sense.

Adam

[charitycasegreg]

why would you get a sealed game if you are goin to open it? Isnt the reason you get one is to be like "yeah its sealed thats so cool".

[Achika]

why would you get a sealed game if you are goin to open it? Isnt the reason you get one is to be like "yeah its sealed thats so cool".

I don't think he was going to open it originally. He only opened it after he thought it was a fake "new seal", only to find that he was wrong and it was new.

[Jorpho]

Isn't it possible that the game was "pristine and untouched" and still re-shrinkwrapped?

[Buyatari]

Isn't it possible that the game was "pristine and untouched" and still re-shrinkwrapped?

Some game stores do this. Its possible his was originally sold at a place which did this.

But I still have no idea why American Technos would have a resealed game in their inventory.

[orrimarrko]

Thanks Adrienne - I couldn't have replied any better myself.

I rolled the dice, and came up craps.

The good news is, I paid $25 for the sealed copy, and would have paid the same for an unsealed copy in the same condition. SO...


Adam - I don't believe that you have a re-seal. I think that there are more examples of this out there that will surface occasionally.

I know for a fact that I have seen a Namco Pac-Man AND Ms. Pac-Man with horizontal seals on the back, so I think it's possible that this happens occasionally.

The reason why? Any idea would just be conjecture at best.

Only one thing to do...(RRRRIIIIPPPPP!!) LOL

[Ed Oscuro]

Only one thing to do...(RRRRIIIIPPPPP!!) LOL

X-Ray fool! ;D

Also, as for the whole "horizontal seal rule means ZIP!" thing...well, it seems that some games may have all been sealed one way, some another way (w/o seal), and perhaps there's even some games that had the type of sealing used change during the production run. I wouldn't discount the rule offhand for titles from manufacturers known to use it, though. Goes to show...buy games from folks you know! :)

[briskbc]

What about Camerica games. I had a sealed copy of Micro Machines I bought through eBay. It was from a seller (highscoreusa) who had been selling new copies of this game for months. The game I received did not have the seal on the back. I didn't know about the seal when I got the game so I never gave it a second though. It seems unlikely he had a bunch (a couple dozen) of mint copies of one game that he resealed.

[orrimarrko]

My experience is that Unlicensed games do NOT have the horizontal seam.

I have never had the seam on a Sealed Camerica game, and I almost had the entire set.

Steve

[Anotherfluke]

I've got several Super NES games that don't have the line on the back, but are factory sealed. My guess is that there is a second machine that handles overflow or unexpected runs.

What I can say is that for the SNES no-line sealed games, the plastic is thinner, but usually tighter, with vertical seams along the left and right sides (assuming you are looking at the face of the box). And horizontally along the back (running from one seam to the other) is an unsealed overlap that is between 3/4-1" wide.

[Cmosfm]

I made this mistake with a "Batman: Return Of The Joker" for NES I got in trade. Didn't trade much for it thankfully but it pissed me off nonetheless.

I dunno, gotta take your chances I guess.

[tynstar]

... Namco games for the NES (Pac and Ms Pac), don't have seams. The only exception to the rule. Sorry D:

ouch!

[kai123]

I have a sealed gauntlet that I bought on ebay years ago and it doesn't have the seam. Do the unlicensed versions of gauntlet have the seam?

[NintendoMan]

why would you get a sealed game if you are goin to open it? Isnt the reason you get one is to be like "yeah its sealed thats so cool".

Can't you read? The reason he opened it because he thought it wasn't a true sealed game, so opened it to see the contents. :D

[NintendoMan]

Just some tips that everyone should read, well the people that collect sealed games!!!
Well, when I first joined ebay, about 2.5 years ago, I was just browsing for the first time and discovered that there was still sealed games out there. So that's how I started collecting sealed NES games. There was one seller on there that had about 10-15 sealed nes games a week on there, the very rare ones too. Too make a long story short, after about 2 years of selling and had to make at least, I swear around 50,000-75,000. The guy had 2 user ID's. One to buy games and one to sell, this was found out after the scandel. The ID he bought games with was he used it to buy perfect complete games. Then he bought a plastic sealing machine, so he just resealed the games and even had the horizontal seam on the back. Luckily I only won 1 game from this seller, that was a SMB3 for about $120 though. The guy was caught when one buyer just happen to open one of his games, and found the contents to not even be the same game as what he though he was buying!

Tips I learned from this are is just cause it has the horizontal seal on it doesn't mean it's sealed.
Look and see if there are any creases or wear on the top flap, where you would open the game.
If there is any pen marks, hair, etc. on the inside of the plastic wrap.
If there is anything wrong with the box, but NOTHING with the shrinkwrap over it.
ONe thing I personally use, it this is becuase I don't trust sellers with low feedback. It's too easy to reseal a game, and unfortunately I don't buy from sellers with low feedback ratings. I don't have the money to take chances!

Hope some of these tips can help a few people! :D

[NintendoMan]

Just some tips that everyone should read, well the people that collect sealed games!!!
Well, when I first joined ebay, about 2.5 years ago, I was just browsing for the first time and discovered that there was still sealed games out there. So that's how I started collecting sealed NES games. There was one seller on there that had about 10-15 sealed nes games a week on there, the very rare ones too. Too make a long story short, after about 2 years of selling and had to make at least, I swear around 50,000-75,000. The guy had 2 user ID's. One to buy games and one to sell, this was found out after the scandel. The ID he bought games with was he used it to buy perfect complete games. Then he bought a plastic sealing machine, so he just resealed the games and even had the horizontal seam on the back. Luckily I only won 1 game from this seller, that was a SMB3 for about $120 though. The guy was caught when one buyer just happen to open one of his games, and found the contents to not even be the same game as what he though he was buying!

Tips I learned from this are is just cause it has the horizontal seal on it doesn't mean it's sealed.
Look and see if there are any creases or wear on the top flap, where you would open the game.
If there is any pen marks, hair, etc. on the inside of the plastic wrap.
If there is anything wrong with the box, but NOTHING with the shrinkwrap over it.
ONe thing I personally use, it this is becuase I don't trust sellers with low feedback. It's too easy to reseal a game, and unfortunately I don't buy from sellers with low feedback ratings. I don't have the money to take chances!

Hope some of these tips can help a few people! :D

[The Manimal]

I've bought new games before with "bent" sides of the boxes..

[leonk]

I've purchased a few boxes from a local store. The boxes for the carts had full size styros inside and sealed with the line in the back! O_O

I guess they were some kind of special store display or something...

don't follow the seals. They ain't right!

[1bigmig]

I sold two sealed Acclaim games, WWF King of the Ring and Simpsons (I think it was Bart vs the Space Mutants). Both of these did not have the seam, but Im pretty sure both were factory sealed. The guy who won the WWF left feedback saying it was indeed new ( I had put in the auction I wasnt sure). If you look at the back of Acclaim games they have their name stamped in the grey plastic of the cart so likely they manufactured nearly everything themselves and may have sealed them differently.

Also, I got a great list about tips for looking for fake sealed games and here it is:

my comments in double parentheses:

Cracked paint-
ANYTIME you fold a flap for the first time, it cracks the paint. Look for
white hair-thin lines along the edges of games.

Inner damage-
This is pretty obvious. There's no way you can bend, crush or puncture a
game box and not damage the plastic. ((This is not entirely true you can bend or crush the box and keep the plastic nearly undamaged, but the point is that there shouldnt be damage to the box that could not have affected the plastic))

inner dirt-
If a game is truly factory sealed then there shouldn't be any crap
underneath the plastic. Hair, fuzz etc.

Re-coloring-
This refers to the'cracked paint'. Re-sealers will try to color in the white
lines with similarly colored markers. Check the edges of your games. (tip:
Black ink will give off a purple reflection when it dries. try it)

Rough seal lines-
A dead give away. Horizontal/vertical seal lines ar ALWAYS smooth. There
should be no signs of stress. If you run your fingers across it, it should
barely be noticeable.((generally true but I think he gave this more emphasis than it warrants, the games I have seen have some variation in the roughness of the lines, but are generally uniform and professional looking))

High profile games-
Face it. Aint nobody tryin' to re-seal M.C. Kids or Cobra Triangle. Dragon
Warrior 4? Look out. Tengen Tetris? Look out. Peek-a-Boo-Poker??!!! Better
call in the proffessionals!! Pay closer attention to the more valuable
games. If you shell out $20 for a bulls&*# Mario 3, who cares. But drop $600
on a bogus Mega Man 1 and someone's gettin' their arm broken!!

Weight-
This one's a bit tougher since most non-geeks don't know the average weight
of a game (4.9327 ounces)((I havent checked this out)) but you'd be surprised the difference one poster
or instruction booklet makes. Sometimes, the truly evil re-sealer wont even
put a game in the box!! You're not gonna open it right? Well I have. And
you'd be horrified at what I've found.

Idiots-((good point, watch out for people with less than Id say 10-20 feedbacks or even people with a lot of negatives within their feedback))
This refers to a person selling a game. "Gee, I dont remember where I got
this" or "I dont know if its new or not". And my personal favorite;
"$400....ok $300!.....$200......gimme $50 for it" Its also wise to be
cautious of any seller who has 297 friggin' copies of any game.

me again: It's my personal experience that most games ARE factory sealed. I'd emphasize looking for the horizontal seam (this may not be present on unlisenced games), the high profile games, and watch out if a seller all of a sudden has a ton of rare games up all with exquisite perfect plastic (this happened not too long ago). If a person offers more scans or more pictures of a game you want you probably want to get them if the ones he has up arent good enough.

[mr_nihilism]

Truly unbelievable as I too recently bought a Namco Ms Pac-Man and noticed there was no factory seal along the back. I opened up thinking the seller screwed me over, yet discovered everything to be truly mint and never before had it seen the light of day.

Ugh !!!

[kainemaxwell]

Anyone got comparision pics?

[Simply Dave]

Thanks for the heads-up...I've learned quite a lot in the ten minutes it took to read through this topic.

[mickoz]

About that tips:
"Its also wise to be cautious of any seller who has 297 friggin' copies of any game."

Is not a seller having a lot of copies of the same game more trusty? I mean usually if you have 200 pristine mint copy of a games, big chance are he bought a brand new lot. Unless that guys has been looking for pristine mint copies of 200 games and did get them all and resealed...

[mickoz]

Also I am pretty sure some company did not had the H-seam, but maybe I am wrong. (I talk about the one that did the H-Seam).

Probability is someone resealed it (still new, but not original factory seal).

I have heard of some sunsoft games not having the H-Seam, I am waiting to get those games actually. But apparently one guy did get them from sunsoft and they did not had the seam, but I will be more able to judge when I receive the games, I bought them very low anyway.

It will be interesting to find people that have worked in those factory...

Probably most of the time it will be a reseal from a store? Just a guess...

[mickoz]

I just got in the mail today some games I bought cheap from a guy on ebay. I talked a lot with him and he said his brother did get them from sunsoft (if I remember his brother tested some games). He had a bunch of manuals, games, psx import, some sealed nes games. I did get some SNES manual, NES manual and did won some of his sealed games.

Those were all sunsoft stuff for his sealed nes games and 90% of his stuff were from sunsoft.

I have not won, but his Lemming was apparently with the horizontal line (the only auction I haven't won, but I know who won it). All the other did not have it. I won them too. But I am looking at them right now and they look really new.

What his answer was, is that his brother said they did shrink their stuff themself... I don't know how he could know this and if it is true, but by looking at the box, they all look new.

Title are Xenophobe, Fester Quest, Batman Return of Joker and Journey to Silius.


They all have a 3 line seam around the box, only side not touching is top. Maybe they had internal cheap machine, the seam don't look that good... fester quest for example, it is still unopened but seam is opening a little on side...

But it is an interesting story. I am sure there is exeption for the seam, but how we can tell...

At less that story seem to be true... for the price he got, etc. and the story, and how he got a lot of sunsoft stuff, it looks true.

Any other people with similar story?

[lendelin]

The sealed game-threads are very informative and educating. I'm glad that it was discussed so openly; because in the end knowledge acts more of a protection of honest buyers than as useful information for dishonest sellers.

I would never go for the crazy sealed game business. The simple fact is that it is always a gamble. There is and and always will be uncertainty if you actually get a sealed or resealed game. Considering the crazy amount of money at stake, it is not worth it to go after sealed games.

I have on my shelves a Castlevania Dracula X and a Mega Man X2 and X3 minty mint. If I knew how to produce an H-seal, noone of you could tell just looking at the boxes if it is used or not. No fine white line on the edges where you open the box.

The simple fact is: if a lot of money is at stake, it attracts scam artists. And if you put a lot of thought in scamming people, you can. The set-up is ideal: people who are interested in sealed games won't open them which is the only way to tell if they are originally sealed or not....and then you wonder that you got sealed games with no games in it?

I understand the attraction of sealed games, but considering the uncertainty and amount of money spend makes it a crazy enterprise. If you like gambling, go for it! But like with all gambling, the players won't profit.

I say, buy mint complete games, open the darn things, and plug them in. It is enjoyable and entertaining, much cheaper, and no high risk involved!

[Ed Oscuro]

Quite true. I bought a sealed Dracula X a year ago, and the fact is that while I'm very much certain it's got an original seal - I can never be completely certain. I'm pretty much DONE with sealed games. They aren't worth it.

[Blackjax]

I'm pretty much DONE with sealed games. They aren't worth it.

No kidding... you can't play em! LOL

[Ed Oscuro]

Well, after that post I wrote up yet another "post yer CV (Castlevania, sorry CVision fans)" reply on my other forum...realizing that many of the games you like most you ONLY own sealed is a horrible thing. For example: Akumajo Dracula (Super Famicom - this being Super CV IV by another name and with some slight differences), Dracula XX, and Aria of Sorrow. I still can't play practically anything as I don't have a good working MSX 2, nor a Famicom I want to use, or a working x68K (until I get that other one put back together), or a Super Famicom, or a PC-Engine. I can emulate everything and play Dracula X right off ye Magick Engin, but that's NOT the same thing, not at all.

So basically, I've put lots of money into shit I don't play. Go me.

[Cauterize]

this happened to me with a sealed Megaman 3.. thought it was resealed as there was no seam down the back.. then found a Mint, never played, all inserts megaman 3 there!

[Bronty-2]

Just to clear up some points from earlier in this thread:

- the namco pacman/ms pacman came both with the seam and without
- fire n ice is the same way - both with seam and without
- ALL unlicensed games DON'T have the seam
- some late issue ljn and acclaim games don't have the h seam - most of these have a "vertical overlap" seam instead. This would include stuff like that bart simpson, thrilla's surfari, terminator 2, etc.
- return of the joker had no seam. I'm not aware of other sunsoft games that came this way although it's possible.
-every crash n the boys that I've seen DOES have the seam. Both the technos games have it.

..but the h seam thing still very much holds true for the most part. We're just talking about exceptions here, and considering there were like 800 games issued, the above as a list of exceptions isn't bad at all..

[NintendoMan]

I'm pretty much DONE with sealed games. They aren't worth it.

No kidding... you can't play em! LOL

Yes, but you can look at them. And that's great as long as I have a playable copy too!

[NintendoMan]

this happened to me with a sealed Megaman 3.. thought it was resealed as there was no seam down the back.. then found a Mint, never played, all inserts megaman 3 there!

Well, the game could have still be resealed. I know sellers do this when the original plastic around the game is ripping like crazy in places, so they then take off the plastic then re-wrap it. I mean the game is still new and all, just not with original plastic wrapping.

I'm glad your game ended up being MINT!!!

[mickoz]

My return of joker is one of those that do not have seam and was from the sunsoft stuff I bought. I wonder if there is version with seam.

Are you sure those overlap seam are true? (Were they done only that kind of way?) I thought not... I saw some and thought they probably might be fake. You think it is in FACTORY that they put those vertical overlap seam?

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About the store that resealed. The game still new yes, but not original seal and there is pretty big chance that the plastic won't feel the same as the original plastic (?), but then we will need to get plastic expert ;-)

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It is almost sure there is exception to almost all our game, heck even Nintendo title might have been sealed another way one day or another or maybe we can conclude that most of these might be new but resealed.

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A lot of games I get are pretty cheap price. I don't see people going and fake for such title for now.

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Is the nintendo H seam easy to fake?

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I am happy to not be an hardcore sealed Genesis collector ;-). I thought for some console I would go for not sealed collection, but then I have no space already in my house now... ;-) I wish I won't have to sale my collection :\

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Next step:

- How to tell new PAL nes games (as most of them were not sealed) ;-) [or new unopened PAL games ahhaha]
- Create a professionnal VG Rating company, like those craziness in collectible card and comics... :S I somehow wish it won't happen, but who know... it happens in all field...
- Value based on quality. I.e. a Sealed games not mint, a sealed games perfect mint, etc. ;-)

Ok I stop.

I should concentrate on one thing (ok maybe nintendo collecting in general :P) and document it well on a website. What are the exception, etc. Unfortunately people might use that to do fake...

But how hard it is to reproduce an H seam? how hard it is to find gem mint boxe of NES games... etc.