So, who is getting the MegaMan Anniversary Collection today?

[zmweasel]

Beats me, but from my understanding... the remixes ARE in the game... and from what I've played GCN does have the Navi mode. So I still don't understand how space limitations prevented what's already in the game from being in the actual Navi mode, since they already included it.

:o

SoulBlazer stated in his post that he couldn't find the remixed music anywhere in the GC version, but that it could be an unlockable. Any progress on that front, SB?

I'm trying to arrange an interview with the programmers of MMAC to get all these burning questions answered.

I'm surprised no one's yet mentioned that MMAC's emu has the same minor but noticeable flaw as every NES emu I've tried for the PC: the screen is almost square (NES video is 256x240), when the pixels should be horizontally stretched to simulate the NES's rectangular output.

Another very minor bitch: the Navi-mode help messages are barely comprehensible. I hope to find out what happened with those.

-- Z.

[NvrMore]

Going into things Capcom didn't know how big things were going to be. As a programmer, you can take a guess at the size of your program when you complete it, but it's just that, a guess. It's not that they didn't know limitations going in, it's that THERE WAS NO WAY FOR THEM TO HAVE KNOWN GOING IN HOW BIG THE FINAL PRODUCT WOULD BE OTHER THAN GUESSING!

What!?, good grief, what kind of software design process (or lack therof) disregards the target medium and in turn overlooks key target requirements to be adhered to when producing any software at a professional level.

That's the kind of short sighted code and cut mentality drilled out of students during their first year's education in software development, not the process implemented by a professional company who have over decade's experience working with physically limiting media.

Yes, to a limited extent, when you're developing a new piece of software there is a degree to which the physical size of the coded segments cannot be predicted, but this isn't anything comparible to the space taken by imported media such as audio, video and image files. Even with software modules coded from the ground up it is entirely possible to estimate and plan for, within a certain cussion margin, the physical space which said software will require.

However the argument of being unable to estimate space for a developed piece of software falls sharter still when you consider the intended project was working primarily with pre-existing software elements, the size of which was known to the developer from the very beginning of the development lifecycle.

C'mon, a developer as experienced as Capcom (who worked through the 8 and 16-bit era's before the emergence of the comparitively bottomless optical disk media) not taking the physical capacity of the intended platforms media into account during product design, let alone the feasibility analysis?.. hardly. Perhaps for an upstart outfit who were raised and trained post '95 with nothing but the bottomless well of optical media and a single focus platform, but certainly not for a company with the talent, resources and experience of Capcom.

Hell if that were the case I'd love to have a quid for every failed software project they undertook pre-optical media, their development cycle would have killed them. " 'Street Fighter 2 Alpha Delta Tango: Bumflop' - now in special 32 cart bankrupcy edition"


It's not like Capcom dropped the ball on this, it was beyond their control. That's how programming works and due to the GC mini-DVD format, GC owners get the short end.

Actually, yes, Capcom did, or rather they threw out a respectivly cheap lazy compilation to make some quick and easy money and their lack of effort simply shows through. With respect to missing content it's far more likely that it comes either as a under the table business gesture to Sony or they simply didn't optimize their work to limit production costs and time (coinciding with the cheap easy money point).

Regarding the GOD's, hell, the content of the compilation shouldn't even approach the capacity of the disk. Given the hardware based compression functionality, even if it contained an incredibly poorly written emulation package which didn't utilize modularity, functional definitions or inherritance, it still shouldn't approach exceeding the size limits of post '99 optical storage media.

But nevermind that, just stick with unmodified physical capacity and the fact that the GOD's look so ickle.


Now...is the remixed music actually worth all this fuss? ;)

I don't know, I really don't. I'm a shallow and simple gamer, I only care if the games are fun to play.. I like to play :eek 2:

Now, back to the lurking..

[zektor]

I purchased the GC version today. I really have no problems with the control scheme on this end. I had a feeling however that some of the games would be locked, as whenever a compilation hits they seem to love doing this (Namco Museum...Sonic Mega Collection). All in all a great compilation!

Anybody figure out any of the secrets yet?

[SoulBlazer]

I wish I DID have more progress to reprot, Zach, but I have'nt been playing the GC version since I realized how inferior it was to the PS2 version. :o Someone else who has the GC version will have to post on that. The information I've seen indicates there are some tracks that are unlockable.

As for secrets, the Codes section for the game on GameFAQ has some of them posted allready. :)

[spooie]

Yes, zmweasel, I've heard that the GCN remixes need to be unlocked. And if that interview pans out, please do ask them why they had to go and screw over 17 years of tradition in the most basic control scheme on the face of the planet.

:)

Anyway... I traded in the virtually unplayable to yours truly version of the game and replaced it with the PS2 version, and I'm having quite he blast. Though, I noticed they aren't exact ports of the game. I decided to give MegaMan 2 a whirl yesterday, what with it being my favorite of all the NES versions. I chose to try it out on easy, with 5 lives, on Navi mode... since I don't know whether or not the games got easier or harder with the new difficulties and MegaMan 2 was the only one that originally featured difficulty levels.

So far I have noticed that the pipe robots from MetalMan's stage break into 4 as if they do in the hard mode originally. And I don't remember Mecha Dragon having a stream of fire shoot out originally, as it takes slightly longer to defeat (I may be wrong, as I usually wasted him in 2 seconds). Also, The charged up Heat attack on Woodman doesn't finish him off in one blast like the original does, nor is Metalman taken out with one blade of his own weapon the second time around. And Bubbleman and Flashman both take 5 hits from the metal blades now, as opposed to 4 originally. The Alien Wily at the end takes about 2-3 times as many hits to take out, as does his ship. The "pause trick" against the "gun boss" with the the Crash bombs is no longer opperative. And they've even gone back and changed the "PASSWORD" text to read "PASS WORD". The screen also has small PAL-ish black bars on the side, which the NES version didn't.

I don't know whether this was taken from the Complete Works versions of the games for PSX in Japan or what, so I can't really comment... but I've heard that much of it was based on that line.

[zmweasel]

Yes, zmweasel, I've heard that the GCN remixes need to be unlocked. And if that interview pans out, please do ask them why they had to go and screw over 17 years of tradition in the most basic control scheme on the face of the planet.

I got in my questions yesterday, phrased somewhat more delicately than yours (heh), and I should have my answers next week.


The screen also has small PAL-ish black bars on the side, which the NES version didn't.

As I noted in an earlier post, the black bars have to do with the nearly-square 256x240 resolution of the NES. Emus don't properly "stretch" the pixels horizontally, like the NES did, to create a rectangular image.

-- Z.

[ClubNinja]

Well, I busted open my PS2 version last night and, as nice as it is, ended up playing the originals on the NES instead. I just can hang with playing on the PS2 controller. I'm sure I'll get used to it soon, but boy was it frustrating last night.

[spooie]

Yes, zmweasel, I've heard that the GCN remixes need to be unlocked. And if that interview pans out, please do ask them why they had to go and screw over 17 years of tradition in the most basic control scheme on the face of the planet.

I got in my questions yesterday, phrased somewhat more delicately than yours (heh), and I should have my answers next week.


The screen also has small PAL-ish black bars on the side, which the NES version didn't.

As I noted in an earlier post, the black bars have to do with the nearly-square 256x240 resolution of the NES. Emus don't properly "stretch" the pixels horizontally, like the NES did, to create a rectangular image.

-- Z.

Awesomeness. I look forward to reading it. :-P

[SKVermin]

I can't get over how big a stink people are making about the inversion of two buttons. TWO BUTTONS! My four-year-old can pick up nearly any game these days and master the control scheme even when the entire controller is used. How tough is it really to adapt to such a small change? :o

How are these people going to adapt to REAL change in life? What's going to happen to you if you ever lose your job? Hey, do you stop watching TV when your cable/satellite provider changes the order of channels? Do you get hopelessly lost trying to find your way to work/school if you encounter a detour along the way? If your WaveBird batteries die, are you unable to revert to a standard controller because the cable won't reach your comfy spot on the couch?

I mean, it's one thing to be a "purist", but give it a rest. There's a world of baseball purists out there that have accepted the designated hitter rule, even if they don't like it. They don't whine and complain about it at every opportunity.

I agree it took some adjustment time to get used to the B-Fire / A-jump config -- all of about thirty seconds. I think lab rats in a maze figure out the right/wrong way even faster than that, I must be getting slow in my old age.

Go ahead. Flame away. If you don't like my opinion, that's fine with me. After all, that's all it is. An opinion. :D

[asharru]

I can't get over how big a stink people are making about the inversion of two buttons. TWO BUTTONS! My four-year-old can pick up nearly any game these days and master the control scheme even when the entire controller is used. How tough is it really to adapt to such a small change? :o

How are these people going to adapt to REAL change in life? What's going to happen to you if you ever lose your job? Hey, do you stop watching TV when your cable/satellite provider changes the order of channels? Do you get hopelessly lost trying to find your way to work/school if you encounter a detour along the way? If your WaveBird batteries die, are you unable to revert to a standard controller because the cable won't reach your comfy spot on the couch?

I mean, it's one thing to be a "purist", but give it a rest. There's a world of baseball purists out there that have accepted the designated hitter rule, even if they don't like it. They don't whine and complain about it at every opportunity.

I agree it took some adjustment time to get used to the B-Fire / A-jump config -- all of about thirty seconds. I think lab rats in a maze figure out the right/wrong way even faster than that, I must be getting slow in my old age.

Go ahead. Flame away. If you don't like my opinion, that's fine with me. After all, that's all it is. An opinion. :D
http://www.tribalwar.com/forums/images/smilies/signed.gif

[Querjek]

Anyways... back on topic...



Today I ordered the PS2 version from EBgames.com. I originally was going to get the GCN verison because I have some weird mental bias that makes me think PS2 games are "cheaper" (less quality) than GCN games.

[norkusa]

I can't get over how big a stink people are making about the inversion of two buttons. TWO BUTTONS! My four-year-old can pick up nearly any game these days and master the control scheme even when the entire controller is used. How tough is it really to adapt to such a small change? :o

How are these people going to adapt to REAL change in life? What's going to happen to you if you ever lose your job? Hey, do you stop watching TV when your cable/satellite provider changes the order of channels? Do you get hopelessly lost trying to find your way to work/school if you encounter a detour along the way? If your WaveBird batteries die, are you unable to revert to a standard controller because the cable won't reach your comfy spot on the couch?

I mean, it's one thing to be a "purist", but give it a rest. There's a world of baseball purists out there that have accepted the designated hitter rule, even if they don't like it. They don't whine and complain about it at every opportunity.

I agree it took some adjustment time to get used to the B-Fire / A-jump config -- all of about thirty seconds. I think lab rats in a maze figure out the right/wrong way even faster than that, I must be getting slow in my old age.

Go ahead. Flame away. If you don't like my opinion, that's fine with me. After all, that's all it is. An opinion. :D

You might think it's no big deal about the controls in this game, but when they have been changed for no apparent reason after 15 years of having it a certain way, it is a pretty big fucking deal. People are used to playing these games a certain way. I personally could give a shit about the remix music and other stuff, but you *DONT* mess around with as basic as the control scheme in a series like this. This has nothing to do with being a "purist". It's about wanting to be able to play the stupid game the way it should be played.

Imagine if Nintendo decided to switch the A & B buttons around in Super Mario Bros in their GBA re-release. Sure, it'd be playable but it'll feel like a completely different game. That is how this MegaMan collection feels.

[SKVermin]

but when they have been changed for no apparent reason after 15 years of having it a certain way,

You're looking at two fundamentally different controllers between the GCN and the NES. The GCN has a "primary" button, being the A button. The NES had two identical buttons. Capcom and/or Atomic Planet may have considered that shooting was a more prominent function than jumping, hence assigned the buttons the way they did. Though my reasoning is purely conjecture, I stand by what I said. It's only two buttons, nothing to get so bent out of shape over.



This has nothing to do with being a "purist". It's about wanting to be able to play the stupid game the way it should be played.

pur·ist
Pronunciation: 'pyur-ist
Function: noun
: one who adheres strictly and often excessively to a tradition.

[SoulBlazer]

Forget the inversion of the buttons -- I bought both, remember, and I think the controlls are just overall plain BETTER on the PS2.

That, combined with the remixed music and loading time just as fast as the GC, is enough reason for me to suggest that version for anyone. :)

[spooie]

You might think it's no big deal about the controls in this game, but when they have been changed for no apparent reason after 15 years of having it a certain way, it is a pretty big fucking deal. People are used to playing these games a certain way. I personally could give a shit about the remix music and other stuff, but you *DONT* mess around with as basic as the control scheme in a series like this. This has nothing to do with being a "purist". It's about wanting to be able to play the stupid game the way it should be played.

Imagine if Nintendo decided to switch the A & B buttons around in Super Mario Bros in their GBA re-release. Sure, it'd be playable but it'll feel like a completely different game. That is how this MegaMan collection feels.

Exactly how I feel. I've been playing the games since 1987... and when I say that, I don't mean I PLAYED the games in 1987, I mean I've been PLAYING them, consistantly, since then. Every 2 or 3 months I'll pull the Megaman carts out and give it a whirl, and the shooting has always been to the left and the jumping has always been to the right.

What's sad is that I literally lost the "Feeling" of having the bottom of my thumb hover over the jump, and being able to tap down on the shoot. And because the controls have always been touch sensitive in the MegaMan games, it's hard to jump exactly where you need to go and hop your finger over a button in time to shoot. Just charing the weapon post MM4 and jumping is a pain.

I'm glad to see that lots of folks are getting the hang of it, but for me... it's like waking up after 30 years of driving and realizing everyone is forced to go on the other side of the road.

:o

[Avenger]

my thoughts are completely in between the ones that say "the controls are impossible" and the ones who say "get over it, its only 2 buttons"...

Yes its TWO buttons, i mean it doesnt get much simpler than that...but i dont think itas THAT much of a big deal....it is stupid of Capcom to do wat they did, and the best way to solve all this would have been to have button config....one for the hardcore mega man fan, and the other, this new control fig, for newbies....

In the end tho, you HAVE to expect some differences becuz a GCN controller is a lot different that a NES controller...

i dont know which one to get yet, im hopin to get one new, and then get the other version preowned a little later on...

[zektor]

For everyone who thinks it's a big deal that the two buttons were swapped:

Look at it this way, it is now a completely NEW challenge for you! Kind of like learning to master the game all over again. Sure beats just picking up the controller and breezing through the games like you are used to, eh? :)

[YoshiM]

Quick post to further derail this thread :) . A (or a few) posters on the IGN Gamecube boards contacted Atomic Planet (who actually did the coding) about the very issues everyone touched on.


Thank you for your email. Hopefully all of your questions will be answered below:

Also, it is my understanding that the remixed music found in Mega Man 1-3 was taken from the Mega Drive version, The Wily Wars....and that was a cartridge! The majority of the collection are old 8-bit NES titles ranging from 256KB to 4MB. Even if Mega Man 8 took up the entire PSOne disc of 650MB which I'm fairly positive it didn't, you should still have plenty of room.

Unfortunately the size of the original ROMs does not have any bearing on MMAC as non of the games emulated. All titles have been re-written for PS2 / GCN and this means that data size for graphics and sound has increased considerably when compared to the original game data. With 10 games on the package our emphasis was always on ensuring that the original games were as true to the originals as they could be on the target platforms. This means that frame rate, image quality and sound quality had to be of the highest standard. I’ve listed the size of the PSX re-releases of Rockman 1,2,3,4,5,6 and 8 below to give you an insight into just how big these games were to begin with in the hope that you can understand where all the space went! Please bear in mind that the machines that originally ran these games had very different architecture to the PS2 and GCN and so when image and sound data is converted it invariably has to increase in size.

The ps2 version of MMAC runs to 3.52gb and the GCN has been compressed down to fit into 1.35gb.

As you can see the original PSX games alone (excluding all bonus content, MM7 and the fighting games that are also included with MMAC) come to over 3gb – That’s twice the size of a GCN disk! This means we are already compressing the games down to under 50% of their original size before we even begin to add the new features.

Back to the music, why wasn't this mentioned sooner? Even on the promo video in retail stores it mentions the remixed music. As a huge Mega Man fan who was really looking forward to all that was promised in this title, you can understand my frustration. I do not own a PS2 sadly. And I really shouldn't have to because the GameCube media should be large enough.

Again, we are not emulating the original NES games. My points above hopefully answer this. Words in italics are the questions asked.

After all Factor 5 is able to fit an enormous amount of high quality video footage in games like Rogue Squadron III: Rebel Strike along with a ton of orchestrated music onto one disc in addition to the main game program. And it sounds superb.

It is my understanding that vast majority of the music in the rogue squadron games is actually chip music (sequenced tunes and not red book audio or any other type of compressed audio stream). If this is correct then this would explain why they can fit so much on a disc - You would have to check this with Factor 5 though! Unfortunately the remixed tunes in MMAC only exist as audio streams and so the option to play them back from much smaller sequenced data was not available to us during development.

My IT friends are laughing at this whole situation, they aren't buying the excuse either. It really sounds like you guys were just focusing on the PS2 version and when it came to crunch time to make the deadline, you bothered to not focus as much energy into the Cube version.

This is actually not true at all. Both versions were developed side by side and in fact the GameCube version was the first to be completed.

PS1 –Rockman
Original Image size: 273mb
PS1 – Rockman 2
Original Image Size: 384mb
PS1 – Rockman 3
Original Image Size: 466mb
PS1 – Rockman 4
Original Image Size: 591mb
PS1 – Rockman 5
Original Image Size: 584mb
PS1 – Rockman 6
Original Image Size: 488mb
PS1 – Megaman 8
Original Image Size: 318mb
Total for MM1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 and 8 = 3.03gb

Regards
Barry Smith
QA Manager
Atomic Planet Entertainment Ltd

There may be more of an in depth explanation at some place called "Retrofaction" but I don't have the time to look it up.

[Avenger]

someone ask them as to why they could be so stupid as to switch the ONLY 2 buttons....i agree it shouldnt be too hard to adapt, but seriously, what a dumb mistake...im sure the FIRST guy to test the game woulda pointed out the fact the buttons were backwards!

[zmweasel]

Thanks for the info, Yoshi. You see, Spooie? I really do know what I'm talking about.

-- Z.

[Captain Wrong]

Thanks YoshiM. Very interesting and informative (though dollars to doughnuts people are still gonna cry foul.)

[spooie]

Thanks for the info, Yoshi. You see, Spooie? I really do know what I'm talking about.

-- Z.

Okay... I'll admit it, you were right, seeing as to how they took the PSX versions.

;)

But if they WERE from the NES versions, and not direct from the PSX carts, I'm sure it would have balanced out closer to the way I described it as well.

:P

Of course... that begs the question... if the Cube version was done first, and they knew the tracks wouldn't be included... why did they still promote them as such? And why, oh why, mess the controls, or at least not include a defualt customization option?

@_@

Has anyone unlocked the episode of the cartoon, or the G4 interviews yet?

[lendelin]

Interesting and informative thread regarding the gameplay experience and technical specs.

I stick with my very early decision to buy the PS2 version because of the controller issue. Even in case without reversed buttons for the GC controller, the PS2 controller is more suited to get the nostalgic 8/16-bit Nintendo feeling back on a Sony system.

About the remixed music: it's not a dramatic issue, but certainly a nice optional feature to have in particular if you have already all the traditional MM games. The lack of the remixed music in the GC version is certainly a weakness of a compilation disc.

About the storage data issue: don't let Capcom so easily off the hook. The lack of the remixed music for the GC version after it was announced IS an indicator of very poor planning and misleading.

Experienced guys of Capcom should have known (and probably did) which amount of data is necessary to put it on the compilation disc. 1) are there no other ways to compress data when old 8bit games are conversed? 2) if you know that the games alone are about 2 or 3GB, then Capcom should have provided compressed audio stream in the first place knowing that the GC disc holds 1.5GB.

These explanations are no excuse for poor planning, and certainly no excuse for promises in the announcements which weren't delivered.

[zmweasel]

But if they WERE from the NES versions, and not direct from the PSX carts, I'm sure it would have balanced out closer to the way I described it as well.

Nope. As Atomic Planet's QA manager explained (and as I explained before that), "Unfortunately the size of the original ROMs does not have any bearing on MMAC as non of the games emulated. All titles have been re-written for PS2 / GCN and this means that data size for graphics and sound has increased considerably when compared to the original game data." And that's not including the front-end programming, the unlockable content, etc.

Even if AP had drawn upon NES data instead of PS1 data -- which would've meant inferior emulation -- there STILL would've been too much content for the GC disc.

Are you at least willing to admit that not every videogame publisher is conspiring against Nintendo and its fans?


Of course... that begs the question... if the Cube version was done first, and they knew the tracks wouldn't be included... why did they still promote them as such? And why, oh why, mess the controls, or at least not include a defualt customization option?

I assume the promotion was being done by Capcom, not Atomic Planet, in which case Capcom's PR department deserves a spanking. Then again, PR departments are often the last to know about anything, so it's not necessarily their fault for promoting a feature they'd been told would be included in the GC version.

As for the controls, while I side with the gentleman above who doesn't find it a violation of all that is good and decent to switch the functions of two buttons, I agree that AP should've attempted to make them configurable. Perhaps it was a technical issue that prevented them from doing so. Seeing as the rest of MMAC is very well-programmed, I give AP the benefit of the doubt.

-- Z.

[davidbrit2]

Not emulations? That is SUCH a lie. And if it's not, then it means they spent many hours of development painstakingly recreating the NES GPU's sprite overload flicker. And if they had actually made their emulator with a real NES sound chip engine, they wouldn't have had to waste hundreds of megabytes on digital recordings of freaking NES tunes. (Yes, that wouldn't help the size of the remixed tracks, I know, but it would have at least left enough room on the GC version).

And will someone please tell developers that if the game you are emulating runs on a system that uses non-interlaced low resolution graphics (like the NES) that you had damn well better use a non-interlaced video mode in your emulator??? There's seriously so much interlace flicker that it makes the games look much worse than the NES versions. Screw their stupid little "navi mode" menus and their high-res graphics - don't ruin the way everything else looks so you can add some useless "PS2 quality" graphics that any purist playing these NES games will ignore anyway.

It's a good thing the PS2 version controls well, or I'd be REALLY angry.

[Dobie]

I can't get over how big a stink people are making about the inversion of two buttons. TWO BUTTONS! My four-year-old can pick up nearly any game these days and master the control scheme even when the entire controller is used. How tough is it really to adapt to such a small change? :o


There's a reason why a four-year-old can pick up a controlller and master the control scheme faster than a grown adult. Young children can adapt to new movement patterns because their brain is highly adaptive and susceptible to change. As you get older, movement patterns get "hard-wired" essentially, and it is much more difficult for your brain to adapt to even the slightest changes.

For a lot of people on this board, they have played these games quite literally since the age of 4 with ONE controller setup. 15 years later, after having thse patterns fused into our brain and subconscious, Capcom switches them up. This will cause many problems for people who have played the games with the original set-up. Can they lre-learn how to play the game? YES. BUT, it will be a lot harder than the first time around.

Here's an example... Try throwing a ball with your left hand, after having thrown right-handed your whole life. Its tough. Can you learn to throw with your left hand as well as your right? Possibly, but its going to take a lot of practice to re-learn how to throw.

If you don't believe any of this, try picking up any book on human movement and motor patterns. They will tell you the same thing I just did, but probably in a little better fashion.

[Overbite]

its just a game (or ten) :roll:

[musical]

but when they have been changed for no apparent reason after 15 years of having it a certain way, The GCN has a "primary" button, being the A button. The NES had two identical buttons. Capcom and/or Atomic Planet may have considered that shooting was a more prominent function than jumping, hence assigned the buttons the way they did.

That sounds fair, but the Cube also has secondary buttons. Why not assign "jumping" to both left/right secondary buttons?... that way we geriatric gamers would still have the NES-style arrangement.

[davidbrit2]

As much as I like the Gamecube controller for modern games, Nintendo really should have saved us all the headache and done a typical 4-button cross layout like the SNES controller. This raises all kinds of hell any time classic games are remade for the system. Or at least allow every game to be remapped so that Y=fire, A=jump.

[VACRMH]

Got mine on Thursday, first thing I did was kick the crap out of Skullman :D

[spooie]

But if they WERE from the NES versions, and not direct from the PSX carts, I'm sure it would have balanced out closer to the way I described it as well.

Nope. As Atomic Planet's QA manager explained (and as I explained before that), "Unfortunately the size of the original ROMs does not have any bearing on MMAC as non of the games emulated. All titles have been re-written for PS2 / GCN and this means that data size for graphics and sound has increased considerably when compared to the original game data." And that's not including the front-end programming, the unlockable content, etc.

Even if AP had drawn upon NES data instead of PS1 data -- which would've meant inferior emulation -- there STILL would've been too much content for the GC disc.

Are you at least willing to admit that not every videogame publisher is conspiring against Nintendo and its fans?


Of course... that begs the question... if the Cube version was done first, and they knew the tracks wouldn't be included... why did they still promote them as such? And why, oh why, mess the controls, or at least not include a defualt customization option?

I assume the promotion was being done by Capcom, not Atomic Planet, in which case Capcom's PR department deserves a spanking. Then again, PR departments are often the last to know about anything, so it's not necessarily their fault for promoting a feature they'd been told would be included in the GC version.

As for the controls, while I side with the gentleman above who doesn't find it a violation of all that is good and decent to switch the functions of two buttons, I agree that AP should've attempted to make them configurable. Perhaps it was a technical issue that prevented them from doing so. Seeing as the rest of MMAC is very well-programmed, I give AP the benefit of the doubt.

-- Z.

[kainemaxwell]

I'm finally getting my copy tommorrow. Likely post a review Tuesday sometime.

[Sibs]

Got my copy for the PS2 a couple days ago and boy, am I lovin' these remixes.

[kainemaxwell]

Would some you think this is the best retro pak since AA?

[Predatorxs]

I can't wait for that zmweasel interview!! ooooohhhhhweeeeeeee!

hehheeh interview my ass!. i hear about these but never seem them?
..XS ( .....I'm Rick?? )

[kainemaxwell]

Just got my copy and loving it! 8-)

[kainemaxwell]

To those familiar with alot of the OCRemixes, do some of the "Navi Mode' remixes sound slike OCs to you? Also I take it flipping between regular and Navi in-between levels of the games don't count?

[Gamereviewgod]

Ok, I picked up the PS2 version today. From what I've read, the interviews are not in this version and that does tick me off. I really wanted to see them.

Anyway, the remixed music rocks. Skullman has one of my fave tunes ever so the remix is defintely special. Odd how some stages have remixing in one and two and other stages don't. I still beleive the tunes should be accesible without the navi mode.

I don't know if it's my controller, but it's not always responsive enough. I figured it may have something to do with the analog button stuff, but I may never know. The game will NOT work with a PS One controller oddly enough. He won't always charge up his blast and that can be annoying.

That's my preliminary report. Later: More thoughts.

[dethink]

got it this weekend (PS2 version)...i'm happy for my $30. i've noticed that some spots that i remember having vicious slowdown and flicker no longer do (though some of the same ones still do), so it can't be direct NES emulation. it's really great to go back and play all these games again...the series was always my fave on the NES, but i left off at #4...i played almost all the way through MM2 sunday, and i forgot how well the graphics stacked up to more modern 16-bit games. lots of the background stuff was really detailed and pushed what the NES could do in terms of colors/sprites...

BUT I FORGOT THE FREAKING ORDER OF THE BOMB ROOM!! LOL :angry:

also, i beat a couple guys in MM3 (top man/shadow man), it saved after the stages, and i went back to it through "load game", and all of them were back again...?!

can't wait for the SF anniversary collection. a MMX collection would be the pants too...but aren't they still making MMX games for the PS2?

[zmweasel]

While I've decided to post the ten-stupid-question MMAC interview on the Video Game Collector website when it relaunches within the next month or so, here's the stupid Q and interesting A regarding the control scheme.


Zach Meston (Freelance Weasel): Why aren't the controls reconfigurable?

Robert Johnson (Producer of MMAC): If we offered an option in each game, this would have involved changing the original code, something we were hesitant to do. We did some research, and believe that the control scheme we picked works well for the Collection. It might take a couple of minutes to get used to the change, but most gamers will adapt pretty quickly.

So it's kind of a programming issue and kind of a design choice.

It broke my heart to learn of the features that were planned for the MMAC, but dropped for time. It'll break all y'all's hearts, too.

-- Z.

[SoulBlazer]

At least the controls on the PS2 version are easier then the GC one. And I like the slide and autofire buttons.

Dropped features? Updated graphics would have been a wet dream. :P But it's still the BEST retro collection I've ever played.

[Querjek]

I've been getting into this game recently TONS, and really enjoy... although, well, two things (Warning: expletives ahead):


FUCK FUCK FUCK I FUCKING HATE THAT LITTLE ASS ICE MAN WHY THE HELL DOES HIS LEVEL HAVE TO BE SO DAMN HARD


Ok, now that that's out.... I actualy played completely through Megaman 8 on the PS1 back in 1999ish. I remember it being hard, but DAMN is it harder than I remember. Anyone have any tips for it? I'm stuck at the first level select.

[Tetsu]

Ok, I got this on Friday (PS2 version). Here I am Sunday after playing all weekend, with a few things to report.

The interface is kinda bare bones: I understand why they didn't allow configurable buttons for MM 1-6, but they took out the option menus in MM 7-8 where you could config your buttons too. Durnit, I like my slide on R1!
Furthermore, I've beaten MM 1-4 so far and the "secrets" suck ass. Some black and white pencil sketches, a couple of forgettable remixed tunes, and...the credits of the people who compiled this collection?! Sure, they deserve credit, but I was hoping for better secrets than that.

You can play the Navi mode of any game in any order as long as you beat and save at least one stage in each regular game. That is, if i were playing MM 1 on Navi Mode after choosing "New Game", I would be unable to play Navi Mode on another game until I beat MM 1. UNLESS, that is, I were start a new game in regular mode, beat at least one stage, and save. I did this for all of the games and now all of the Navi mode versions are playable.

Navi mode: Having Beat and Eddie point the way is unobtrusive most of the time, but the bigger power meter obsures some important details at times. The exclamation mark that pops up and gives you hints is useless 90% of the time, giving such obvious hints as "watch out! spikes in this area will kill you instantly."

The Navi Mode music varies in quality. I know it's from the Japanese PSX Rock Man re-releases. Some tracks in MM 1-3 are remixed, some are not. MM 4 is got the best treatment IMO and is almost fully remixed, including title music, game over screen music, password screen music, etc. MM 5-6's music is fully remixed but the arrangement quality suffers: not as good as MM 4, the tracks sound like an SNES upgrade. Also, the sound quality in MM6 suffers: lots of distortion even at a moderate volume, perhaps the result of heavy compression. Sounds like MP3's at 22khz and 56kbps sometimes.

The music on MM 1-6, including the original modes, loops instead of playing endlessly like it would from the NES chip. The music will loop at about 5 minutes of play; then it fades out briefly, and restarts.

Mega Man 8's FMV looks dirtier than on PSX, as if they compressed the already compressed video. The music skips in some places too. I'm not sure but I think the frames of animation when Mega Man is low on power and says "Time To Get Serious!" have been cut out.


Mega Man 7 looks a little drab, the colors dingy. The screen shimmers sometimes when it's scrolling, and there are jerky spots, especially when scrolling to another screen.

MM1-6 seem to have much less flickering than the NES versions. Also, there is very little slowdown. Finally, I'm seeing the games on my regular tv for the first time in the PS2's S-Video output instead of NES composite video or RF, and everything looks pleasantly sharp.

The game is a bit more difficult without the slowdown, especially if you've come to expect and compensate for it. This is made up for by the fact that the autofire makes killing some bosses, especially in MM1, easier. By default, all the games seem more difficult that I remember, bosses take more damage, do more damage, powerups are harder to come by, especially the big ones. MM2's difficulty is set to the "difficult" setting, although you can't select it at the beginning of the game. All the other games seem more difficult that I remember, with the exception of MM8 and MM1 (which couldn't get more difficult if they tried).

It is not possible to return to the Anniversary Collection screen from MM7 and 8, you have to just reset the system.

The ability to switch between weapons with the L1 and R1 buttons is great, especially since MM1-3 have a bit of delay when pressing the Start button to bring up the weapon menu.

in MM4, pressing L2 will let you cycle between the 3 Rush items (coil, jet, marine) and R2 will let you cycle between the support items (balloon and wire). great idea: wonder why they didn't let you do that with the support items in MM2 and the Rush items in MM3. Not to mention the Magnet Beam in MM1. They don't show up with the L and R 1 buttons, so you have to press Start to select them manually in these games. Dunno about the suit enhancements in MM6 yet, will find out soon.

The MM3 cheat where you plug in a 2nd controller and hold right on the directional pad to make Mega Man jump super high and become "invincible" has been removed. Trust me, I tried pluggin in a second ps2 controller, no dice.

A regular PS controller will not work with this game. Sucks. there goes my hopes of playing this with my excellent Ascii pad for PSX (resembles an SNES pad but with 6 face buttons).

The analog stick works with this game. It's cool if your feeling lazy and want to move Mega Man about without exerting too much thumb force, but for those life or death jumps, I switch to the digital pad.

Qjerk, play the Grenade Man stage first. Then go to Frost Man, then Clown Man.

[videogameking26]

I picked it up a few weeks back for the GameCube