Sony PSP showing up over $300.00 at Game Crazy

[swlovinist]

I have a buddy who works at Game Crazy and he has noticed that the PSP in in his computer at 350.00..........the thing that scares me is that EB has the DS for 150.00.........I know that the price of the PSP is not released, but is it really going to be that high? Dang, if it is....count me out on launch date

[Cryomancer]

I won't be surprsied one bit.

[EnemyZero]

me neither, i work at gamecrazy as well, and we have DS listed at 150, and thats what our rep told us as well....as for psp i didnt check , but.....I wouldnt be one bit surprised, i wont buy the psp if they payed me too anyways

[Lemmy Kilmister]

If sony thinks that they are just going to take over the handheld market like they did with the console one then their nuts. Nintendo has owned the handheld market for 15 some odd years and with the price point sony is going to be selling the psp at it looks like nintendo has nothing to worry about.


But wait!! @_@ I can watch movies on it!! I just need to rebuy them on a newer format. -_-

[gamegirl79]

If the PSP is really going to be $300 or more I won't even consider buying it...I don't care if it can play movies or music, that's just too much money to spend on a handheld. :eek 2:

[maxlords]

That'd lock the DS market :)

[FantasiaWHT]

My question is...

knowing Sony's track record of the first 3 version of a machine being pieces of crap... who the hell is going to buy a PORTABLE of theirs that's going to get beat up on a regular basis?

Even the middle series of PS2 sucks... the 39000 series is having major problems reading what's essentially the most popular game of the year- Madden 2005.

Remember when they flushed a GBA down the toilet and it still worked? Or the guy who left his out in the yard over WINTER buried under snow and it still worked? hehe

[RCM]

if Sony brings the PSP to market at $250 it's still too much. Sony gained momentum (with Playstation) out of the gate with a reasonably priced piece of hardware, awesome original software, and a major exclusive (MK3). They really don't have any of this with the PSP. If they fuck this up and start tarnishing the Playstation name with the general public it could be a big problem for the PS3. I firmly believe that you could have slapped the Playstation 2 logo on any piece of shit hardware and millions still would have bought it on name alone. I don't wish death to the Playstation brand, but I would like to see a more balanced console war next round! If it means the failure of the PSP to do so I say bring it on. It would be ironic if this happened. I admit that if it did, I wouldn't be too upset, unless I bought a PSP at launch.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

[FantasiaWHT]

I firmly believe that you could have slapped the Playstation 2 logo on any piece of shit hardware and millions still would have bought it on name alone.

Isn't that what they did? ...

[Sylentwulf]

I would bet anything the PSP will be priced at $300, then maybe after it doesn't do so well in japan, it will be changed to $250 for the american release.
Then, after 3-6 months it will be knowcked down to $200.

[Crush Crawfish]

I still haven't seen any reason to buy a PSP, especially at that price. I'll be quite happy with my DS, anyway.

[swlovinist]

I know that the price at Game Crazy COULD be way off..........but I still can't get out of my head the possibility that Sony could be making a huge huge mistake....What are they thinking O_O

[davidbrit2]

Overpriced obscurity, thy name is PSP (formerly N-Gage, formerly Game.com...)

[Parodius]

Game.com wasn't expensive, just crappy.

[Sylentwulf]

Even $150 for the DS is overpriced IMO. When it's under $100 I'll probly get a DS, same thing with the PSP.
Only problem is, that means I'll have a DS 6 months after release, and a PSP 2 years after release :)

[davidbrit2]

Game.com wasn't expensive, just crappy.

And thus expensive at any price. ;-)

[EnemyZero]

$150 isnt bad at all...remember the original gameboy??? HMMM??? that sold very well at its price

[-hellvin-]

150 is OK for a handheld but pushing it. 300 makes me laugh down inside. I hope Sony shoots themselves in the foot walking blindly into the handheld market so Nintendo can once again destroy everything in it's path. Lynx, Game Gear, Game Com, Neo Geo Pocket.....will the PSP finally break the curse? I'm guessing not at that price point.

[pixelsnpolygons]

$150 isn't surprising... I mean, what do you guys expect? It has two screens and the power of an N64... the GBA has one and the power of a SNES. You might not have the cash, but everyone should be able to see where the money is going - not to mention one of those screens is a touchscreen. Anyway, I'm gonna have to find a way to get both. I get 10% off everything where I work. I'll need it with the PSP.

[Pedro Lambrini]

The thing that worries me is that the PSP price point fits with the market they are aiming at - the older gadget geek (also known as I-Pod owner). The reason this worries me is that all these folk who buy all the latest and 'coolest' gadgets won't buy the DS cos it'll be seen as a bit of a toy. Nintendo needs to keep as much koudos as it can since it suffers from a distinct lack of it already in the eyes of the general public. Also, Sony's marketing is mega powerful. Virtually everybody I know thinks Sony always produces the best gear, you know the statement "Oh me? I always buy Sony, it's the best..." . This portable market is seen as being pretty new to the masses and it is becoming a consumer market thanks to the touting of digital convergence and Sony is the king of the consumer market.

[RCM]

150 is OK for a handheld but pushing it. 300 makes me laugh down inside. I hope Sony shoots themselves in the foot walking blindly into the handheld market so Nintendo can once again destroy everything in it's path. Lynx, Game Gear, Game Com, Neo Geo Pocket.....will the PSP finally break the curse? I'm guessing not at that price point.

The GB killed all of those other handhelds. But I do remember claims that Game Gear did outsell Gameboy in America for a time. Anybody else remember?

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

[zmweasel]

150 is OK for a handheld but pushing it. 300 makes me laugh down inside. I hope Sony shoots themselves in the foot walking blindly into the handheld market so Nintendo can once again destroy everything in it's path. Lynx, Game Gear, Game Com, Neo Geo Pocket.....will the PSP finally break the curse? I'm guessing not at that price point.

Whatever the PSP's initial MSRP turns out to be, Sony is certainly not "walking blindly" into the handheld market. If anything, Sony has been exceedingly patient, making sure it had thoroughly pummeled Nintendo in the home-console market before challenging it in the handheld market.

And I don't understand the reasoning behind your implication that Nintendo's handheld-market dominance is somehow better than Sony's home-console dominance. What makes Nintendo "good" and Sony "evil"? Is it because Nintendo is "hardcore" (a ridiculous statement, since the NES was the most mainstream videogame console of the 1980s, and the Game Boy is the most mainsteam handheld ever)?

-- Z.

[zmweasel]

The thing that worries me is that the PSP price point fits with the market they are aiming at - the older gadget geek (also known as I-Pod owner). The reason this worries me is that all these folk who buy all the latest and 'coolest' gadgets won't buy the DS cos it'll be seen as a bit of a toy. Nintendo needs to keep as much koudos as it can since it suffers from a distinct lack of it already in the eyes of the general public. Also, Sony's marketing is mega powerful. Virtually everybody I know thinks Sony always produces the best gear, you know the statement "Oh me? I always buy Sony, it's the best..." . This portable market is seen as being pretty new to the masses and it is becoming a consumer market thanks to the touting of digital convergence and Sony is the king of the consumer market.

What "worries" you about the possibility of the PSP being a commercial success? Do you think it's better that Nintendo has a virtual monopoly on the handheld market, and if so, why?

And you're right in that Nintendo is (and will always be) fighting its image as the consoles-for-kids company. That's why I was so impressed with the redesigned DS. The old look was Game & Watch-y; the new look is modern and grown-up. Nintendo seems to realize that it's competing with Sony for the adult demographic.

-- Z.

[RCM]

ZMweasel wrote:

Nintendo seems to realize that it's competing with Sony for the adult demographic.

The "adult" design is a start but you wouldn't know they were competing for adult bucks by the 1st party software they've shown.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

[Pedro Lambrini]

Don't get me wrong! I don't like any sort of monopolistation of a market. Tee difference between Nintendo owning the portable market and Sony owning most of the music and movie industry and then owning half the market that produces the previously mentiond martkets is pretty scarey! As an example:

Sony buys Philips for it's DVD technology and then says that it must be a great format cos the 3 major movie companies in holly wood say so. Lo and behold Sony own the 3 major movie companies. Sony also owns the biggest plant that produces the DVD discs as well! This form of business synergism is not good for growth and development and I fear this happening in the console market too.

Just in case you might feel I'm just a Sony basher I also think that if Nintendo had competition in the portable market maybe the GBA would've had a back light first time round and maybe the first party games wouldn't be so reliant on ports and old IP.

[zmweasel]

if Sony brings the PSP to market at $250 it's still too much. Sony gained momentum (with Playstation) out of the gate with a reasonably priced piece of hardware, awesome original software, and a major exclusive (MK3). They really don't have any of this with the PSP. If they fuck this up and start tarnishing the Playstation name with the general public it could be a big problem for the PS3. I firmly believe that you could have slapped the Playstation 2 logo on any piece of shit hardware and millions still would have bought it on name alone. I don't wish death to the Playstation brand, but I would like to see a more balanced console war next round! If it means the failure of the PSP to do so I say bring it on. It would be ironic if this happened. I admit that if it did, I wouldn't be too upset, unless I bought a PSP at launch.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

My memories may have faded with time, but I recall MK3 receiving very little attention at the time of the PS1's successful launch, especially since the coin-op was such a disappointment. In the fighting genre, Tekken and Battle Arena Toshinden certainly received much more attention in the press. Twisted Metal was another PS1 killer app. But MK3? Nah.

-- Z.

[zmweasel]

ZMweasel wrote:

Nintendo seems to realize that it's competing with Sony for the adult demographic.

The "adult" design is a start but you wouldn't know they were competing for adult bucks by the 1st party software they've shown.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

Good point. Nintendo and Sony are both porting their biggest IPs to their new portables, but Nintendo's franchises are mostly for the kiddies. (No wonder NoA is so enamored of Metroid.) I can't see many mainstreamers picking up Super Mario 64x4 instead of Gran Turismo PSP.

-- Z.

[RCM]

ZMweasel Wrote:

My memories may have faded with time, but I recall MK3 receiving very little attention at the time of the PS1's successful launch, especially since the coin-op was such a disappointment. In the fighting genre, Tekken and Battle Arena Toshinden certainly received much more attention in the press. Twisted Metal was another PS1 killer app. But MK3? Nah.

You're right, your memory must have faded. MK3 was exclusive to PS for 6 months. No other 32bit system (Saturn) could get a port. It was very important to Sony at the time to get this. MK3 also was specifically mentioned in PS print ads at the US launch! I never said MK3 was a killer Application. I just said it was a major exclusive. At the time it was. MK3 made a lot of money. Maybe not as much as its predecessors, but it did. THe evidence? Many sequels!

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

[zmweasel]

ZMweasel Wrote:

My memories may have faded with time, but I recall MK3 receiving very little attention at the time of the PS1's successful launch, especially since the coin-op was such a disappointment. In the fighting genre, Tekken and Battle Arena Toshinden certainly received much more attention in the press. Twisted Metal was another PS1 killer app. But MK3? Nah.

You're right, your memory must have faded. MK3 was exclusive to PS for 6 months. No other 32bit system (Saturn) could get a port. It was very important to Sony at the time to get this. MK3 also was specifically mentioned in PS print ads at the US launch! I never said MK3 was a killer Application. I just said it was a major exclusive. At the time it was. MK3 made a lot of money. Maybe not as much as its predecessors, but it did. THe evidence? Many sequels!

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

The MK franchise was destined to be milked whether MK3 was a major hit or only modestly successful. And while Sony considered MK3 important enough to hype as an early exclusive, Twisted Metal and Tekken and Toshinden and NFL GameDay proved to be more important in the PS1's first Christmas at retail. Those were the games that had consumers and journos buzzing, not MK3. An exclusive, yes--a major one, no.

Incidentally, Midway itself privately acknowledges that MK3 was the beginning of the franchise's long period of mediocrity. Ed Boon says he had very little to do with MK3 or MK4, and that he was thrilled to restore the franchise to respectability with Deadly Alliance. Which has nothing to do with the thrust of your argument, but I find it interesting to note. :)

-- Z.

[RCM]

The MK franchise was destined to be milked whether MK3 was a major hit or only modestly successful. And while Sony considered MK3 important enough to hype as an early exclusive, Twisted Metal and Tekken and Toshinden and NFL GameDay proved to be more important in the PS1's first Christmas at retail. Those were the games that had consumers and journos buzzing, not MK3. An exclusive, yes--a major one, no.

I'm not disputing the fact that other titles were more important to PS at retail. But there was a lot made of the fact that Sony got MK3 on PS before Sega got it on Saturn. The Saturn later got Ultimate MK3. Some people (people can be defined as, consumers, salespeople, journalists) thought it was major to get MK3 exclusively. Regardless of the sales numbers the title put up, it was seen as a major exclusive. Looking back it didn't make much of a difference in the Playstations long life cycle. I totally disagree, it was major.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

[petewhitley]

But wait!! @_@ I can watch movies on it!! I just need to rebuy them on a newer format. -_-

But wait!! @_@ I can play Nintendo 64 games on the DS!! I just need to rebuy them on a newer format. -_-

[Lemmy Kilmister]

But wait!! @_@ I can watch movies on it!! I just need to rebuy them on a newer format. -_-

But wait!! @_@ I can play Nintendo 64 games on the DS!! I just need to rebuy them on a newer format. -_-

Atleast your buying the remakes 100 dollers cheaper. ;) Come on do you really think their just going to port over n64 games. If anything i'm going to bet that the psp well have more shovelware then the ds sony even said it themselfs. Atleast the ds's gimmick comes with the system.

[kai123]

I will buy a psp when the price comes into my range, which is about $170. I love all systems!!! Why whore yourself to one system when you can whore yourself to them all? Come on be a videogame slut like me. :embarrassed:

[zmweasel]

The MK franchise was destined to be milked whether MK3 was a major hit or only modestly successful. And while Sony considered MK3 important enough to hype as an early exclusive, Twisted Metal and Tekken and Toshinden and NFL GameDay proved to be more important in the PS1's first Christmas at retail. Those were the games that had consumers and journos buzzing, not MK3. An exclusive, yes--a major one, no.

I'm not disputing the fact that other titles were more important to PS at retail. But there was a lot made of the fact that Sony got MK3 on PS before Sega got it on Saturn. The Saturn later got Ultimate MK3. Some people (people can be defined as, consumers, salespeople, journalists) thought it was major to get MK3 exclusively. Regardless of the sales numbers the title put up, it was seen as a major exclusive. Looking back it didn't make much of a difference in the Playstations long life cycle. I totally disagree, it was major.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

For me, a "major exclusive" is one that receives critical and commercial success. MK3 certainly had some of the latter, but none of the former. It bombed with MK fans, and put the franchise into a tailspin that only Deadly Alliance pulled it out of.

As for Ultimate MK3, it certainly didn't revive the Saturn's fortunes, and acts as another example of the irrevelance of the franchise at that point in time.

I certainly don't recall any of my journo friends at the time being excited about MK3; we were stoked about Tekken and Twisted Metal and Warhawk.

I'm always fascinated by the varied perceptions of why a game system failed or succeeded. In my eyes, MK3 had virtually nothing to do with the PS1's success, but you consider it a "major exclusive." Another person in the forums blames piracy as a primary cause for the failure of the Dreamcast, while I believe that piracy was a non-factor--that SEGA's marketing sucked, it couldn't rebuild its burned bridges with fanbois and retailers, and everyone (publishers, consumers, journos) was killing time 'til the PS2.

Ah, well. We agree to disagree, anyway.

-- Z.

[petewhitley]

Come on do you really think their just going to port over n64 games.

After the precendent Nintendo has set with their GBA line-up, yes. Yes I do.

[Black Dragon]

the sony PSP has a known estimated price as $300 being the lowest and $500 being the highest, DS estimated price is where $100 being the lowest and $180 being the highest, also PSP game are going to be around $50 and DS games being around $20!

The Sony PSP forums had a poll on what system is better and it said DS WON!!!!!!! :eek 2:

The PSP maybe the "virtual boy" of sony!!

[RCM]

For me, a "major exclusive" is one that receives critical and commercial success.

I disagree. The definition might be acceptable in a perfect world. You and I don't live there. Also, while game journalism generally sucks today it was far worse in 1995. I remember one magazine declared that ToShinDen was far superior to Virtua Fighter. I found that laughable then and certainly laughable today. So to say that critics scored MK3 poorly means nothing. Although I admit it's not a masterpiece.



I'm always fascinated by the varied perceptions of why a game system failed or succeeded. In my eyes, MK3 had virtually nothing to do with the PS1's success, but you consider it a "major exclusive." Another person in the forums blames piracy as a primary cause for the failure of the Dreamcast, while I believe that piracy was a non-factor--that SEGA's marketing sucked, it couldn't rebuild its burned bridges with fanbois and retailers, and everyone (publishers, consumers, journos) was killing time 'til the PS2.

Ah, well. We agree to disagree, anyway

I am glad you're fascinated by such things. Go back and look at magazines and ask people, ask your journo buddies, Mortal Kombat was still a major deal in 1995. MK was past its prime, but it still was a major deal. Major enough to advertise on television when the arcade version was coming out. Major enough for SOny to secure the exclusive 32bit rights to. That sounds major Major Meston! Jog that memory some more fella.

I agree to that we clearly disagree.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

[Gamemaster_ca_2003]

Nintendo will still be in control of the handheld market eventhough the psp will get some of the market share away from nintendo but in the end sony will just be the 10th company that tried and failed ( the others being Sega, NEC, Atari, Tiger Electronics, Bandai, SNK, Tapewave, nokita, and one other I don't remember.)

[Lemmy Kilmister]

Come on do you really think their just going to port over n64 games.

After the precendent Nintendo has set with their GBA line-up, yes. Yes I do.

Besides the obvious remakes of mario 64,banjo kazooie,mario kart and the zelda's what else would they use? True their are tons of remakes and shovelware on the gba but the snes also had a bigger library of classic titles. As much as i liked the n64 it didn't really have to many solid titles on it.

[davidbrit2]

Besides the obvious remakes of mario 64,banjo kazooie,mario kart and the zelda's what else would they use? True their are tons of remakes and shovelware on the gba but the snes also had a bigger library of classic titles. As much as i liked the n64 it didn't really have to many solid titles on it.

Goldeneye, Perfect Dark (spare me the licensing gripes), any one of several "Cruisin'" games, Smash Bros (well, that would be pretty sweet, actually), etc. etc. Let's just hope they don't dig up Superman. ;-)

[Lemmy Kilmister]

Besides the obvious remakes of mario 64,banjo kazooie,mario kart and the zelda's what else would they use? True their are tons of remakes and shovelware on the gba but the snes also had a bigger library of classic titles. As much as i liked the n64 it didn't really have to many solid titles on it.

Goldeneye, Perfect Dark (spare me the licensing gripes), any one of several "Cruisin'" games, Smash Bros (well, that would be pretty sweet, actually), etc. etc. Let's just hope they don't dig up Superman. ;-)

Alright alright maybe their is a couple more games i forgot to mention. Though even if they do make remakes of most of their n64 games chances are they would add something fresh to the games to add some life to them. Look at the mario 64 (X4) it's going to have a four player mode in it and i sure thats just the beginning of what nintendo has in mind.


Plus i would rather play classics then metal gear acid by the looks of it.

[FantasiaWHT]

DS is in EB's computers at $200

[petewhitley]

Plus i would rather play classics then metal gear acid by the looks of it.

It's just than in general, I'd rather Nintendo concentrate on making new classics than milking the old ones for all (or more) than they're worth.

[Ed Oscuro]

We know no console released at $400 has made it...how about $350? Hmm, I hope that $50 makes a difference, for Sony's sake. LOL

[zmweasel]

For me, a "major exclusive" is one that receives critical and commercial success.

I disagree. The definition might be acceptable in a perfect world. You and I don't live there. Also, while game journalism generally sucks today it was far worse in 1995. I remember one magazine declared that ToShinDen was far superior to Virtua Fighter. I found that laughable then and certainly laughable today. So to say that critics scored MK3 poorly means nothing. Although I admit it's not a masterpiece.

My definition of a "major exclusive" certainly doesn't need a "perfect world" in order to exist. There are plenty of major exclusives, under my definition, that exist in our imperfect world.

I am absolutely confident that the PS1 would have been equally successful at launch if it hadn't had MK3 as an exclusive, or even had it at all. That's hardly a "major exclusive."

It wasn't just critics ragging on MK3; it was gamers, as well. It was a very poor sequel. The atrocious new characters, the cheesy dial-a-combos, the retarded "-alities..." I got to spend lots of time with both the coin-op and PS1 versions for a strategy guide, and it was pure pain. Tekken et al were 3D wonders that ably demonstrated the PS1 hardware and the future of console videogames.

I don't know which magazine cited Toshinden as better than Virtua Fighter, but it's foolish of you to say that all magazines of the era "sucked" because one reviewer for one publication had an opinion that differs from yours. Do I suck because my opinion of MK3's importance to the PS1's launch differs from yours?

-- Z.

[zmweasel]

the sony PSP has a known estimated price as $300 being the lowest and $500 being the highest, DS estimated price is where $100 being the lowest and $180 being the highest, also PSP game are going to be around $50 and DS games being around $20!

The Sony PSP forums had a poll on what system is better and it said DS WON!!!!!!! :eek 2:

The PSP maybe the "virtual boy" of sony!!

We can pretty safely assume that the PSP will be more expensive than the DS, as the former has more (and more powerful) tech. But a "known estimated price" of $500 is pure fanboi fiction.

The PSP won't be Sony's Virtual Boy. It will have more games available at (or shortly after) launch than the Virtual Boy had during its brief lifetime. It will have exponentially more marketing and retail support.

Nintendo quickly buried the Virtual Boy in North America because it was a smelly turd, and I give the company credit for that. It was a successful failure. The PSP, however, is a handheld that many publishers, developers, retailers, and gamers are thrilled about. It has plenty of buzz. The VB had none.

Even if the PSP doesn't succeed at the record-setting levels of the PS1 and PS2, it would have to be a wipeout of unfathomable proportions not to experience more success at retail than any previous challenger to Nintendo.

-- Z.

[zmweasel]

Don't get me wrong! I don't like any sort of monopolistation of a market. Tee difference between Nintendo owning the portable market and Sony owning most of the music and movie industry and then owning half the market that produces the previously mentiond martkets is pretty scarey! As an example:

Sony buys Philips for it's DVD technology and then says that it must be a great format cos the 3 major movie companies in holly wood say so. Lo and behold Sony own the 3 major movie companies. Sony also owns the biggest plant that produces the DVD discs as well! This form of business synergism is not good for growth and development and I fear this happening in the console market too.

Just in case you might feel I'm just a Sony basher I also think that if Nintendo had competition in the portable market maybe the GBA would've had a back light first time round and maybe the first party games wouldn't be so reliant on ports and old IP.

I apologize for suspecting you of fanboi-ism, and I share your fear of corporate oligarchies, although in arguably more important aspects of life (news media, retail outlets).

-- Z.

[EnemyZero]

who cares how many publishers, developers and retailers are into the psp, if no one buys it at 300 smackers (if that is indeed the launch price) its all for naught and unless they can market it at a lower price...there doomed.... yeah alot of gamers are hyped about it, and i know a lot of them, but they also said they wont be dishing out that much money for one

[Griking]

also PSP game are going to be around $50 and DS games being around $20!

I'd be VERY surprised if we saw any $20 DS games for a long time. Weren't GB and GBA games originally cheaper than regular console games at first? Then little by little the retail price creeped up and up till they reached the $35-$45 range that they're at now. I fully expect the DS games to sell in this same price range. Sure, there will be some discount titles but I bet they'll be the exception.

[zmweasel]

DS is in EB's computers at $200

Whereas swlovinist, who started this thread, said that EB's computers had the DS listed at $150. Who's right? Who's wrong? Who the hell knows? And who cares, as long as it gives fanbois another excuse to root for Nintendo (the "good guys") and against Sony (the "bad guys")?

-- Z.

[FantasiaWHT]

also PSP game are going to be around $50 and DS games being around $20!

I'd be VERY surprised if we saw any $20 DS games for a long time. Weren't GB and GBA games originally cheaper than regular console games at first? Then little by little the retail price creeped up and up till they reached the $35-$45 range that they're at now. I fully expect the DS games to sell in this same price range. Sure, there will be some discount titles but I bet they'll be the exception.

Where are you buying your GBA games?

Everything is $30 except a few first party titles that are $35. And the Classic titles that are $20

[kai123]

I have to agree with the previous poster you need to shop around. The most expensive Gba game I have bought was Tactics Ogre for $40. All others have been $30 or less.

[RCM]

My definition of a "major exclusive" certainly doesn't need a "perfect world" in order to exist. There are plenty of major exclusives, under my definition, that exist in our imperfect world.

I am absolutely confident that the PS1 would have been equally successful at launch if it hadn't had MK3 as an exclusive, or even had it at all. That's hardly a "major exclusive."

It wasn't just critics ragging on MK3; it was gamers, as well. It was a very poor sequel. The atrocious new characters, the cheesy dial-a-combos, the retarded "-alities..." I got to spend lots of time with both the coin-op and PS1 versions for a strategy guide, and it was pure pain. Tekken et al were 3D wonders that ably demonstrated the PS1 hardware and the future of console videogames.

I don't know which magazine cited Toshinden as better than Virtua Fighter, but it's foolish of you to say that all magazines of the era "sucked" because one reviewer for one publication had an opinion that differs from yours. Do I suck because my opinion of MK3's importance to the PS1's launch differs from yours?

-- Z.

Yes, there are some major exclusives that exist under your defintion. But your definition is too narrow and flawed.

I am glad you're confident about the PS being a success at launch without MK3. That's just speculation though. Give me something concrete. Show me something that truly backs your claims. I will answer for you. You can't.

I clearly don't think MK3 was the second coming or anything. I don't need the lesson. I was there and I played both Tekken and MK3 at length. But would I be wrong if I preferred MK3 over Tekken? Just because you loathed it doesn't mean I would be wrong in the slightest if I or anyone else preferred the title. You're arguing about preferences. We don't need to. It's boring. Try something else to argue about that goes beyond personal taste.

Go back and read the post. I didn't say all mags of the era sucked b/c one preferred ToShinDen over Virtua Fighter. Read before you respond. The VF/ToShinDen thing was called an "example." I was merely stating my opinion. Sorry if I offended you and your journo buddies, but the work wasn't that great and continues to be poor. You have an amusing problem of getting the wrong idea consistently. Or is your attempt at playing devils advocate to encourage thoughful debate? Please, it's boring.

Do you suck b/c our MK3 opinions differ? Do you suck b/c our opinions differ in general? Na. You're just boring and unnecessary at times such as this. You don't help anyone on the boards in trying to play the role as the "great white father." Just live and let live. Just b/c you worked with the beautiful Betty Hallock doesn't mean you're the be all end all videogame guy. More often then not your posts that ive encountered are as flawed as the people you criticize (excluding me of course). I say keep coming with your posts, sometimes they are amusing. Just know your place. Oh yeah, What is Betty's phone #?

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

[FantasiaWHT]

DS is in EB's computers at $200

Whereas swlovinist, who started this thread, said that EB's computers had the DS listed at $150. Who's right? Who's wrong? Who the hell knows? And who cares, as long as it gives fanbois another excuse to root for Nintendo (the "good guys") and against Sony (the "bad guys")?

-- Z.

I highly doubt there will be regional price differences on the DS within America... sorry swlovinist, someone told ya wrong ;)

I don't HOPE the PSP is going to fail, but I think it ultimately will

1) Sony makes sucky hardware, and portables take a BEATING
2) Many many companies have tried before
3) Sony doesn't have quite the insane amount of money they are willing to lose like Microsoft did to get the Xbox into homes
4) Nintendo portable dominance/loyalty/fanboyism

[Hakkenden]

Not even the release of a good Metal Gear Solid game can save this system at that price. It will die faster than a Game.com and possible jinx Sony the way Sega was. But then again they might change that price or people will buy them anyways. N-Gage survied to make a second version didnt it?

[calthaer]

Ngage survived because of the deep pockets of Nokia, not because of any success in the marketplace. Likewise the PSP may succeed but unless it has worthwhile, intriguing, and fun games it will fail as well.

Sony software on the PS / PS2 is mediocre, IMO. Crash, Spyro, and Ratchet & Clank are like poor men's versions of Nintendo's characters. They may be able to mimic Nintendo's formula, but IMO it always feels like an imitation. When I consider the PSP, I see no bright spots of brilliance in their forthcoming games - I see a lineup of wannabes.

The DS, however, is guaranteed to have at least SOMETHING that I know I will really enjoy, because Nintendo has almost always had a system with something I really enjoy. Their darkest hour was the N64, but Ocarina of Time was still a masterpiece.

I don't care about sports games and racing games and Tomb Raider XXVII, I want quality titles with beaucoup gaming magic. It's not set in stone yet and we'll have to wait and see, but if I had to wager I know where my money would go.

[zmweasel]

Yes, there are some major exclusives that exist under your defintion. But your definition is too narrow and flawed.

I am glad you're confident about the PS being a success at launch without MK3. That's just speculation though. Give me something concrete. Show me something that truly backs your claims. I will answer for you. You can't.

I wish I had some NPD/TRST sales figures to cite, but all I can do is explain why I disagree with you about MK3's (un)importance to the early success of the PS1.


I clearly don't think MK3 was the second coming or anything. I don't need the lesson. I was there and I played both Tekken and MK3 at length. But would I be wrong if I preferred MK3 over Tekken? Just because you loathed it doesn't mean I would be wrong in the slightest if I or anyone else preferred the title. You're arguing about preferences. We don't need to. It's boring. Try something else to argue about that goes beyond personal taste.

I agree that it's meaningless to argue about personal perferences. In fact, that's the point I made in my earlier response to you, when you lumped all videogame magazines and journos together with a sweeping generalization, because one journo in one magazine preferred Toshinden to Virtua Fighter. ("Also, while game journalism generally sucks today it was far worse in 1995.")

The rest of your post is insulting, condescending bullshit, so I'll ignore it.

-- Z.

[zmweasel]

Not even the release of a good Metal Gear Solid game can save this system at that price. It will die faster than a Game.com and possible jinx Sony the way Sega was. But then again they might change that price or people will buy them anyways. N-Gage survied to make a second version didnt it?

SEGA wasn't "jinxed" -- it simply made a series of major blunders (SEGA CD as FMV machine, 32X as half-assed SNES competitor, Saturn surprise-launching at $400 and several months before third parties had their games ready).

As for the N-Gage, calthaer pointed out why it "survived" despite one of the worst hardware launches ever.

-- Z.

[RCM]

I agree that it's meaningless to argue about personal perferences. In fact, that's the point I made in my earlier response to you, when you lumped all videogame magazines and journos together with a sweeping generalization, because one journo in one magazine preferred Toshinden to Virtua Fighter. ("Also, while game journalism generally sucks today it was far worse in 1995.")

The rest of your post is insulting, condescending bullshit, so I'll ignore it.

-- Z.

Get me a violin. You still missed what I was saying. Oh well. It seems that you ignore more then just the "condescending bullshit" in my posts. I am a little surprised, you can't take what you dish? I am sorry that you were offended, but I call it like I see it. It doesn't mean you have to agree and it's clear you don't. I would write more but I have to get back to playing UMK3. Liu Kang is so cool.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

[Ed Oscuro]

Where are you buying your GBA games?

Everything is $30 except a few first party titles that are $35. And the Classic titles that are $20
Best Buy, maybe; stuff is expensive there.

[zmweasel]

I agree that it's meaningless to argue about personal perferences. In fact, that's the point I made in my earlier response to you, when you lumped all videogame magazines and journos together with a sweeping generalization, because one journo in one magazine preferred Toshinden to Virtua Fighter. ("Also, while game journalism generally sucks today it was far worse in 1995.")

The rest of your post is insulting, condescending bullshit, so I'll ignore it.

-- Z.

Get me a violin. You still missed what I was saying. Oh well. It seems that you ignore more then just the "condescending bullshit" in my posts. I am a little surprised, you can't take what you dish? I am sorry that you were offended, but I call it like I see it. It doesn't mean you have to agree and it's clear you don't. I would write more but I have to get back to playing UMK3. Liu Kang is so cool.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

I'm not asking for your sympathy or anyone else's. I'm just pointing out that most of your previous post was a series of awkward attempts at personal insults. I wasn't offended, just saddened, as you can't seem to engage in debate without resorting to assholey behavior.

-- Z.

[Ed Oscuro]

Plus i would rather play classics then metal gear acid by the looks of it.

It's just than in general, I'd rather Nintendo concentrate on making new classics than milking the old ones for all (or more) than they're worth.
Sony has avoided much of this scourge, but MG Acid there...well, Konami is guilty of it to some degree. Hopefully Neo Contra won't keep that going. Speaking of which, a Contra on the PSP might possibly alter the balance of things in my view in the DS/PSP debate.

Personally, I wouldn't mind if Mario disappeared altogether outside of the Paper Mario RPGs, the Kart series, and the odd good game here and there (Mario vs. DK apparently is one of them...). Super Mario Sunshine a system seller? Maybe, but I think in releasing so-so games they're hurting their classic frachises and really making themselves look out of touch with what their fans want.

There's a few games on the DS I might get, but I am rather jittery about buying a Metroid game that's not on par with Prime, because the last two 2D titles were ripoffs.

[RCM]

I'm not asking for your sympathy or anyone else's. I'm just pointing out that most of your previous post was a series of awkward attempts at personal insults. I wasn't offended, just saddened, as you can't seem to engage in debate without resorting to assholey behavior.

-- Z.

You've got my sympathy regardless. I will make it very obvious for you when my goal is to offend you. If you don't want to hear the truth then don't ask for it. You are the one resorting to childish name calling and clumsy insults. Assholey? Ha! It's laughable and I welcome it.

It is tough to debate with you though. Not b/c you're some genius or anything, but b/c of your unwillingness to admit when you're wrong. That genius crack was not an insult to be perfectly crystal.

Lighten up Z, i'm not out to get you. I'm not out to offend you. If you don't like the way I debate then don't single my comments out. Everytime you do I will explain myself whether you like it or not. It's clear that you can't accept what I have to say a majority of the time. And that's fine. I find a lot of what you have to say to be inaccurate. That's my feelings, and it's not meant as an insult, but take it as you will. If you were right about the whole thing (or anything we were discussing) I would be reasonable enough to admit you were. You can't seem incapable of doing so. When you are in an unfavorable position you resort to childish bullshit. Take a step back and examine yourself. You might find that things you find unagreeable about me and my condescending bullshit posts to be thriving in yourself. You may be offended by all of this, but it isn't meant to offend.

By the way, were you really saddened? I think not. How condescending.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

[RCM]

You can't seem incapable of doing so

What I meant to say was:

You seem incapable of doing so.

sorry. carry on

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

[zmweasel]

You've got my sympathy regardless. I will make it very obvious for you when my goal is to offend you. If you don't want to hear the truth then don't ask for it. You are the one resorting to childish name calling and clumsy insults. Assholey? Ha! It's laughable and I welcome it.

Our debate was going fine until the post in which you became unhinged and let loose with personal insults. I'm not sure what triggered your lapse into assholiness, but I felt inclined to point out why I was ignoring so much of your post. (A poster in another thread erroneously assumed that I was agreeing with the sections of his posts I ignored, and I didn't want you to do the same.)


Lighten up Z, i'm not out to get you. I'm not out to offend you. If you don't like the way I debate then don't single my comments out. Everytime you do I will explain myself whether you like it or not. It's clear that you can't accept what I have to say a majority of the time. And that's fine. I find a lot of what you have to say to be inaccurate. That's my feelings, and it's not meant as an insult, but take it as you will. If you were right about the whole thing (or anything we were discussing) I would be reasonable enough to admit you were. You can't seem incapable of doing so. When you are in an unfavorable position you resort to childish bullshit. Take a step back and examine yourself. You might find that things you find unagreeable about me and my condescending bullshit posts to be thriving in yourself. You may be offended by all of this, but it isn't meant to offend.

I certainly don't think you're "out to get me" or "offend" me, and I'm fine with you thinking that I'm "not right about anything we're discussing." I singled out your MK3 comment because I strongly disagreed with it, and I was enjoying your defenses of your opinion...until your awkward attempts at insulting me, which derailed the debate.


By the way, were you really saddened? I think not. How condescending.

I was genuinely saddened that you had to resort to assholey behavior. I was enjoying our debate until that point.

-- Z.

[RCM]

RCM wrote:
You've got my sympathy regardless. I will make it very obvious for you when my goal is to offend you. If you don't want to hear the truth then don't ask for it. You are the one resorting to childish name calling and clumsy insults. Assholey? Ha! It's laughable and I welcome it.


Our debate was going fine until the post in which you became unhinged and let loose with personal insults. I'm not sure what triggered your lapse into assholiness, but I felt inclined to point out why I was ignoring so much of your post. (A poster in another thread erroneously assumed that I was agreeing with the sections of his posts I ignored, and I didn't want you to do the same.)

Quote:
Lighten up Z, i'm not out to get you. I'm not out to offend you. If you don't like the way I debate then don't single my comments out. Everytime you do I will explain myself whether you like it or not. It's clear that you can't accept what I have to say a majority of the time. And that's fine. I find a lot of what you have to say to be inaccurate. That's my feelings, and it's not meant as an insult, but take it as you will. If you were right about the whole thing (or anything we were discussing) I would be reasonable enough to admit you were. You can't seem incapable of doing so. When you are in an unfavorable position you resort to childish bullshit. Take a step back and examine yourself. You might find that things you find unagreeable about me and my condescending bullshit posts to be thriving in yourself. You may be offended by all of this, but it isn't meant to offend.


I certainly don't think you're "out to get me" or "offend" me, and I'm fine with you thinking that I'm "not right about anything we're discussing." I singled out your MK3 comment because I strongly disagreed with it, and I was enjoying your defenses of your opinion...until your awkward attempts at insulting me, which derailed the debate.

Quote:
By the way, were you really saddened? I think not. How condescending.


I was genuinely saddened that you had to resort to assholey behavior. I was enjoying our debate until that point.

-- Z.

So the "assholely behavior" can be defined as the "personal insults?" So I could conclude that in your subsequent posts you are as much as an "assholey" as I? What were you offended by? Perhaps you think my "insults" were "awkward" because in truth they weren't meant to be insults at all. Why can't you accept that? I've said many times now that my comments shouldn't have been taken as insults. But when you ask my opinion I will give it. If you can't take it leave. I suspect you can though.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

[davidbrit2]

FANBOY FIGHT.

[zmweasel]

So the "assholely behavior" can be defined as the "personal insults?" So I could conclude that in your subsequent posts you are as much as an "assholey" as I? What were you offended by? Perhaps you think my "insults" were "awkward" because in truth they weren't meant to be insults at all. Why can't you accept that? I've said many times now that my comments shouldn't have been taken as insults. But when you ask my opinion I will give it. If you can't take it leave. I suspect you can though.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

You shouldn't conclude that, since I'm not being an asshole to you, merely pointing out your assholey behavior towards me, and how it's ruined a good debate and an interesting thread. You know quite well which of your statements are insulting, and you insult me further by suggesting that they aren't.

-- Z.

[zmweasel]

FANBOY FIGHT.

I really hope you're not suggesting I'm a fanboi.

-- Z.

[davidbrit2]

No way d00d, j00 r a sk8erboi. ;-)

[calthaer]

I skip over all of weasel's posts, along with the posts of anyone with whom he's conversing. Nothing to see here - move along. These aren't the droids you're looking for.

Everybody has to have it out with weasel before they hit their 300th post. They have to be "put in their place."

[RCM]

You shouldn't conclude that, since I'm not being an asshole to you, merely pointing out your assholey behavior towards me, and how it's ruined a good debate and an interesting thread. You know quite well which of your statements are insulting, and you insult me further by suggesting that they aren't.

-- Z

I didn't say that they weren't insulting. Again, you aren't reading my posts correctly. What I did say was that they were not meant to be insults and so they shouldn't be taken as such. But you have every right to take a offense if you choose to do so.

I don't believe the thread is ruined. If you think so you can at the very least place half the blame on yourself.

I'm sure a lot of what I said could be taken as being offensive. That wasn't anywhere near the goal of my comments though. I would never try to personally attack anyone on this board. I will never censor or sugarcoat my opinions though. If you don't like my opinions there is a simple solution- stop talking with me. Simple as that.

You clearly enjoy fighting just for the sake of fighting. That's what you have turned this thread into. A boring fight. Shame on you. Shame on you for trying to turn this on me.

If you are not being an asshole to me then I am not being one to you. Don't try to play the victim here. It's amusing though.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

[RCM]

Everybody has to have it out with weasel before they hit their 300th post. They have to be "put in their place."

So Weasel and I wouldn't be having this debate if I had over 1,000 posts like yourself? If you say so.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

[zmweasel]

I skip over all of weasel's posts, along with the posts of anyone with whom he's conversing. Nothing to see here - move along. These aren't the droids you're looking for.

Everybody has to have it out with weasel before they hit their 300th post. They have to be "put in their place."

I'm not trying to "put anyone in their place." I don't want to "have it out" with anyone. I merely challenged what I considered to be an incorrect statement about the (un)importance of MK3 as an early PS1 exclusive, and enjoyed the resulting debate until RCM launched a personal attack.

-- Z.

[Jibbajaba]

RCM, zmweasel, you guys should do this in PMs. Your discussion has nothing to do with the topic and if it doesnt stop then a mod is going to lock was at one point an interesting and productive thread, not that it really matters now since you two have basically hijacked it.

Here come the flames.