Square fanboys everywhere start to cry

[AB Positive]

http://www.opcoder.com/projects/chrono/

what an amazing project, check the trailer!

what an amazing project, dead as of tuesday. Square Enix decided enough was enough and killed what might have been the greatest remake ever. I would hope perhaps S-E would buy the team out and then release it officially, which could do nothing but net them HUGE chunks of cash. As 'the ugly one' would say: Dag, yo.

-AG

[EnemyZero]

pftttt......PPPFTTTTTTT damn you square-enix.....im STILL waiting for a good game ever since the 2 companies merged....

[SegaAges]

that sucks for them man.

it looked like it was going to be an amazing project

[SegaTecToy]

Some retarded lawyer or marketing idiot is responsible for this, no doubt. No one with a sane brain in his head would worry about a fan-made project. A shame that these business are always ruled only by this kind of "people".

[-hellvin-]

I was reading about this on another forum and didn't really care until I saw the screenshos and they looked pretty damn good, woulda been nice to see what came of it.

[Cauterize]

@_@ @_@ @_@ @_@

[Bronty-2]

Some retarded lawyer or marketing idiot is responsible for this, no doubt. No one with a sane brain in his head would worry about a fan-made project. A shame that these business are always ruled only by this kind of "people".

It sucks but I don't blame them. You let one person do this and you've set a precedent for a competitor to rip you off.

[Cmosfm]

pftttt......PPPFTTTTTTT damn you square-enix.....im STILL waiting for a good game ever since the 2 companies merged....

Oh CMON! Final Fantasy X-2 rocks! I'm happy with there work, then again, I'm no fanboy....just a fan of good fun games!

Now, personally, I've never played Chrono Trigger (or Cross), I plan to one day....but it's still sad that such an amazing project has to go unfinished. Graphics were amazing for a fan project.

I wonder if they'll finish it anyways....and if it will "leak out" by accident.

:eek 2:

[maxlords]

Hopefully Squenix has plans to do something similar :D

[Querjek]

pftttt......PPPFTTTTTTT damn you square-enix.....im STILL waiting for a good game ever since the 2 companies merged....
Yeah, I'm waiting for Kingdom Hearts 2 as well 8-)



pftttt......PPPFTTTTTTT damn you square-enix.....im STILL waiting for a good game ever since the 2 companies merged....

Oh CMON! Final Fantasy X-2 rocks! I'm happy with there work, then again, I'm no fanboy....just a fan of good fun games!

Now, personally, I've never played Chrono Trigger (or Cross), I plan to one day....but it's still sad that such an amazing project has to go unfinished. Graphics were amazing for a fan project.
FFX-2... it's not bad, but I wouldn't consider it a true FF game simply because it uses a different type of battle system that prohibited many of us from wanting to play it.

And you owe it to yourself to play Chrono Trigger... the SNES version if possible, but the PS1 version is ok too (just don't let the in-between-battle load times bother you).

[Nature Boy]

Some retarded lawyer or marketing idiot is responsible for this, no doubt. No one with a sane brain in his head would worry about a fan-made project. A shame that these business are always ruled only by this kind of "people".

If a company doesn't defend it's copyrights then the product becomes abandonware and they lose their ability to profit from it (I read something to this effect in a recent issue of Retro Gamer).

[ubersaurus]

FFX-2... it's not bad, but I wouldn't consider it a true FF game simply because it uses a different type of battle system that prohibited many of us from wanting to play it.


Yes, because the Final Fantasy series NEVER changes up it's battle system.

[Clay]

I saw this, and I believe that Chrono Trigger is pretty much perfect the way it is. A work of art, pretty much. And while what they were doing was amazing work, I almost think it's insulting to say that the game would be better, or even needed, a graphics update.

Or, maybe I am just a bit off. Either way, to each their own.

Clay

[Berserker]

It sucks but I don't blame them. You let one person do this and you've set a precedent for a competitor to rip you off.

I disagree. I think there's a huge difference between a fan project, made out of love and distributed freely(I would assume) on the internet, and a rival company looking to capitalize on Square's creation.

It is my guess that if this fan remake would've looked like total dogshit, Square-Enix probably wouldn't have done a thing. But since this honestly looks so good that it could actually have the possibility of competing with whatever future remakes they might decide to do, they had to put a stop to it. They could actually be working on a remake of it themselves, but I'm sticking with the idea that they're just protecting their options.

It's not all over, though. If Square-Enix should ever go out of business, they would be able to pick it up again. Who knows.

[kevincure]

You can lose your *trademarks* if you fail to defend them, but not your copyright. So, if someone makes a pointy-haired guy named "Cloud" and SQEnix doesn't challenge, they might lose that trademark (though not necessarily). If their program is on ROM and they don't sue, they certainly won't lose the copyright.

[Bronty-2]

So you disagree. Do you think the competitor's lawyers would have that same view in presenting their position?

Common sense doesn't matter here. The best thing square can do, from their profit-oriented perspective is to vigorously defend their property. It's all about ca$h, always is.

[WiseSalesman]

More support for my theory that was used to be my favorite company has gone completely to crap.

[LeGIt]

-Removed

[Berserker]

So you disagree. Do you think the competitor's lawyers would have that same view in presenting their position?

competitors? what competitors? what the hell are you talking about? O_O

I'm sorry, but I don't see any "competitors" here. I don't see anybody trying to greedily rip anybody off. The only thing I see are fans, working on a project derived from a game they love, and Square-Enix turning the power off.

Is it in S-E's best interests to have closed this thing down? From a purely monetary standpoint, maybe. But without providing good reasoning for such an action i.e. "We're currently in the works of remaking this game, saw you were doing something very similar, and would ask that you stop", theres the potential to turn off alot of people.

By all means they have the right to vigorously defend their property. It's their right. But it's also a gamble when you essentially defend it from the people who are your largest supporters. Of course in the big picture a move like this will hardly matter. But I think you can only take so many shots at your own foot without expecting to be limping back home. ;)

[TheRedEye]

Maybe I just don't "get" fan projects, especially with a game that has had a semi-recent sequel and a possibility for a revival, according to a recent survey. If you're going to put that much time and work into something that you're not legally allowed to make, why not make a unique game instead?

[Cmosfm]

pftttt......PPPFTTTTTTT damn you square-enix.....im STILL waiting for a good game ever since the 2 companies merged....
Yeah, I'm waiting for Kingdom Hearts 2 as well 8-)



pftttt......PPPFTTTTTTT damn you square-enix.....im STILL waiting for a good game ever since the 2 companies merged....

Oh CMON! Final Fantasy X-2 rocks! I'm happy with there work, then again, I'm no fanboy....just a fan of good fun games!

Now, personally, I've never played Chrono Trigger (or Cross), I plan to one day....but it's still sad that such an amazing project has to go unfinished. Graphics were amazing for a fan project.
FFX-2... it's not bad, but I wouldn't consider it a true FF game simply because it uses a different type of battle system that prohibited many of us from wanting to play it.

And you owe it to yourself to play Chrono Trigger... the SNES version if possible, but the PS1 version is ok too (just don't let the in-between-battle load times bother you).

I think one of the best things about FFX-2 s the battle system, it was different and more fast paced. I love being able to feel like I have a little more control over my character, and the constant thinking during battle makes it feel more like a game than a chess game.

I do plan to play Chrono Trigger one of these days, I've got the cart at home, but I may just emulate it here at work. Hell, that'll be after I finish Doom 3, KOTOR, Max Payne 2, Alice, Hit & Run, Splinter Cell, Need For Speed HP2, Sanitarium, Taz Wanted, Unreal.....

God my backlog makes me cry.

[AB Positive]

No one here read the forums from the site I see...

Earlier on in the game's development, these people got the blessing from Square Inc. to work on this, they didn't see any reason why a fan group shouldn't do this as an homage to their favorite classic.

Square-ENIX on the other hand saw a problem and put a stop to it.

Now here's a question, why didn't they buy the group out cheaply, cut them in on a small percentage, and let them finish a game that would have netted them huge amounts of bank, because let's face it, lots of us would have bought it regardless? This could have been easy money for them.

-AG

[kainemaxwell]

Tis a sad day indeed...

[GrayFox]

That trailer just blows my mind still. The graphics are amazing for a fan-made game.

I understand why Square-Enix did what they did, but I'm still angry about what they did. I wanted that game so bad.

Bastards....well...back to watching the trailer.

[Bronty-2]

So you disagree. Do you think the competitor's lawyers would have that same view in presenting their position?

competitors? what competitors?

I meant potential competitors. Like let's say a small company decides to sell a game called "KRONO TRIGGGERR" with a similar character that's an obvious take off - that sort of thing. That company might be able to argue that since SE allowed other people to use their character (or at least, didn't defend against it) that they should be allowed too.

Sucks to hear that they had permission from Square but not from Square Enix. That's freaking ridiculous actually.

[badinsults]

I'm with TheRedEye on this one... why put so much effort into something that was not legal in the first place?

[Ed Oscuro]

You know, taking over the project would've been nothing but a headache and recurring nightmare for Square Enix; I'm not convinced that the sales would've been there. If S-E had tried to take over the project they would've opened themselves up to lawsuits over stealing ideas, work, and so on. Check out #5 on the LucasArts legal page (http://www.lucasarts.com/legal/terms/).

I will agree that the game looked nice. REALLY nice. I've never seen a homebrew project that looked half as nice, and it's honestly a shame that such talent isn't being put into an original project (since this one won't be worked on anymore).

So basically, here's another harsh life lesson for game enthusaists. Game developers aren't ready to declare gaming a pure art form.

[NESu]

I remember apparently that people on the forum there were sending emails to square in the form of something like: Would you be interested in picking this project up?

So really really, seriously, do a fan project and keep it underground until it's done.

[badinsults]

So really really, seriously, do a fan project and keep it underground until it's done.

Personally, I think they just wanted attention, and had no intention on finishing.

[Ed Oscuro]

I remember apparently that people on the forum there were sending emails to square in the form of something like: Would you be interested in picking this project up?

So really really, seriously, do a fan project and keep it underground until it's done.
Unfortunately, the legal stuff still applies - possibly more so, since the charge of stolen program/works would definitely stick. Secondly, S-E's out there to give their employees work, not to create legitimate gripes about letting fans go make titles whenever they want to and backing it up.

[NESu]

how hard could it be to upload your work somewhere anonymously distributed. Then too late, the lawyers can do nothing. Although too late for this project in particular. And Program/ Works stolen? Beyond intelectual property I fail to see which program/ Works are "stolen", unless that's what works exemplifies which sounds like a tragedy because the group started from scratch and did all the "work" and programming there.

[Ed Oscuro]

Yes, exactly; when people do work for free and suddenly it's for sale...well...if the company was mean-spirited it could have pulled a Wild West Hero on these guys, I suppose. Still, I think game companies in general have looked at the lawsuits floating around - including the Grand Theft Auto one - and thought "let's never do that, ever again." It makes things simpler for them.

[Bratwurst]

Personally, I think they just wanted attention, and had no intention on finishing.

Ditto with RedEye and Evan, I'm thinking they had grandiose dreams of being scooped up by Square once they saw how magical and good they were as a dev team. Big businesses just don't play that way with their brand projects, they like to have complete control from the start.

The trailer's kinda funny since there's all this dramatic buildup while they throw their names around..

[ArnoldRimmer83]

Those graphics were pretty amazing. While it is a pity its been canned, like Redeye said, I feel these guys should try and create an original game. They seem to obviously have some talent. Would be interesting to see what they come up with.

[Berserker]

Well, having looked at everything there, I'm compelled to come to a similar conclusion. I was under the impression that this was an attempt, by fans, to remake the ENTIRE Chrono Trigger game. The thing I noticed about the trailer was that it wasn't really a demo of anything other than some updated models and graphics. I didn't see any demos of how the battle system might work, or any real movement through a game-world beyond dramatic shots and poses. But, I just figured it was an early look at what was in store.

If you'll look under the projects section of Opcoder's website (http://www.opcoder.com/projects/), it states the project as being:


CHRONO TRIGGER: RESURRECTION (PC/GAMECUBE/XBOX)
A 10-scene demo, replicating the magic of the SNES classic. Still in production.

That doesn't make much sense to me... and again, this could be due to the fact that I hadn't been following this project(I wasn't even aware of it's existence until I read this thread) or it's messageboards(which I was unable to locate since first having read this thread). They don't state that this is a replica of the original game, they just say that it's a 10-scene demo, replicating parts of the game...

why would they make it for Gamecube and Xbox, as a fan project? I'm hard-pressed to believe that they would just gladly hand out free copies on normal and mini-sized dvd-r's to any and all fans that happen to have a modchip installed in either. I'm guessing that what they were working on all this time was this demo....

why go through all that work just to make a non-playable set of scenarios(yes, I'm assuming from what I saw that it would have been non-playable, based off of the description and no screenshots of gameplay or anything like that) that, again, I'm assuming, would run not as a movie, but as one big in-game cinematic on your pc, gamecube or xbox.

Why go through all that work? Why not just make the 10 scenes into a short fanmade cinematic movie in the same format as the trailer? You could use all the polygons and effects you want, have it look that much better, and even Square-Enix would be hard pressed to jump down your throat if it was merely a movie put together by fans...

So the only conclusions I can come to, is that either they were doing this to get recognized and picked up by Square-Enix, or that they were just doing this demo as a bit of a teaser before launching into development of the full-blown game. The more I read, and look at whats there, the more unlikely I feel about the latter. AdamG mentioned that Square, Inc had given their blessing to the project... but, were they giving their blessing to what would eventually be a full-blown remake of the entire game, or were they just giving their blessing to the project that was listed, a 10-scene, ingame demo? Details seem fuzzy, and they don't seem to hold up very well to the little scrutiny I've put on it in sitting here thinking about it...

I'm sorry, but I can't believe that they were putting so much towards development on something as minor as an in-game teaser demo, for any reason other than attention, primarily from Square-Enix.

Sorry for the long post here, but since I started reading and learning more about this whole thing, the more something about it has sort of been itching me the wrong way.

[geelw]

i'll have to go with the red eye here (and all who agree)- if these guys are that talented (and that stuff is really impressive), they can do their own original RPG and shop it around. the cease and desist is also squenix's way to do two things: one, let these guys know that they're probably better than the company thought (square probably gave the ok and thought it wouldn't be a really professional job like too many fan projects), and two, leave the door open for the company to do a remake at some point in the future. after all, it's their IP and the need to protect it legally.

you also have to consider that squenix's japanese and u.s. branches operate somewhat independently of each other. this project might have been better off with japan approving it, and perhaps letting the movie show up on some sort of demo disc with tons of other stuff folks have created. here inthe states, the lawyers are the first to see everything, and advise more often than not to protect, protect, protect. i can see it now:

"well, suppose everyone here is killed in a horrible microwave popcorn fire? these "fans" would OWN your game lock, stock, and magus because they were the last people to actually DO something with it! we can't allow that to happen in this lifetime..." or something like that.

[AB Positive]

good point geelw about the us/jp offices idea, they probably would have been better off asking the japanese offices.

With all this hubbub now, I have to say: S-E better make their own CT 3D now, because it can obviously be done and done very well.

-AG

[Neonsolid]

Gone.

[slip81]

it's too bad they got shut down. That would have been a great fan project. I'd rather see them continue to do it secretly though than have SE release a version. Because that would mean that they just shut them down to seal their idea, which would suck.

I mean I know SE owns CT and all that, but if it were me and I found out about someone making a fan version of a game I released, if I liked, it I would employ them to make a legal version, that way everyone wins. They get to make the game they want and I get to cash in on the sales.

[Aussie2B]

I saw this, and I believe that Chrono Trigger is pretty much perfect the way it is. A work of art, pretty much. And while what they were doing was amazing work, I almost think it's insulting to say that the game would be better, or even needed, a graphics update.

Or, maybe I am just a bit off. Either way, to each their own.

Clay

I agree with you. While the graphics ARE impressive for a fan project, I always thought this was a stupid concept. Chrono Trigger doesn't need a remake, and the original 2D graphics were BETTER than these 3D graphics, if you ask me. Hell, I'm not even a fan of the crappy looking anime they added to the PSX version...

Like others, I also got the impression that they never actually made a "game". I mean, where's Marle, Lucca, and Robo? Why is there only concept art of Frog when there's stuff all the way up to Zombor and Magus and such?

[Ed Oscuro]

Even so, we didn't see one demo, not one indication that there was any real programming behind it. Sort of hard to play a game when your characters only exist in Lightwave, Maya3D, or 3DStudio, you know!