Ebay saves America!

[christianscott27]

Cheney: Economic Stats Miss EBay Sales


By Associated Press

September 9, 2004, 9:30 PM EDT


Indicators measure the nation's unemployment rate, consumer spending and other economic milestones, but Vice President Dick Cheney says it misses the hundreds of thousands who make money selling on eBay.

"That's a source that didn't even exist 10 years ago," Cheney told an audience in Cincinnati on Thursday. "Four hundred thousand people make some money trading on eBay."

San Jose, Calif.-based EBay Inc. is an Internet auction site where anyone can sell just about anything, including clothing, cell phones, jewelry, memorabilia, trinkets and automobiles.

Democratic vice presidential candidate John Edwards responded that Cheney's comments show how "out of touch" he and President Bush are with the economy.

"If we only included bake sales and how much money kids make at lemonade stands, this economy would really be cooking," Edwards said in a statement.

Copyright © 2004, The Associated Press

[Kid Ice]

I have never commented in a political thread before, but boy is Edwards' response dead-on.

Then again, this is the party who put Joe Lieberman out there for VP four years ago...

[Adonick]

are you joking? The amount of money grossed by people who use ebay to sell would absolutely DESTROY his comment. It just shows how out of touch Edwards is with the current market to even comment on it.

It's like when Judge Judy awarded a $1,000 grievement charge against someone who made fun of someone else via a MSN name. She called it slander and awarded the amount.

GG edwards + judy.

[Bratwurst]

are you joking? The amount of money grossed by people who use ebay to sell would absolutely DESTROY his comment. It just shows how out of touch Edwards is with the current market to even comment on it.

You realize that the economy's health isn't reliant on how many middlemen there are, don't you? Probably not. Ebay is simply a cycle of property changing hands on a large scale. Nothing is 'made' on Ebay, factories do not put together bicycles on the internet, what you see on Ebay are (99% of the time, because there are nutjobs who sell their crappy custom jewelry) pre-existing products that were made and sold elsewhere prior to their arrival on the second-hand market, either through post-consumer or wholesale merchant.

Consider then, the act of assets moving around within a bubble. Nothing is going out, nothing new is coming in.

[KirbyStar27]

are you joking? The amount of money grossed by people who use ebay to sell would absolutely DESTROY his comment. It just shows how out of touch Edwards is with the current market to even comment on it.

You realize that the economy's health isn't reliant on how many middlemen there are, don't you? Probably not. Ebay is simply a cycle of property changing hands on a large scale. Nothing is 'made' on Ebay, factories do not put together bicycles on the internet, what you see on Ebay are (99% of the time, because there are nutjobs who sell their crappy custom jewelry) pre-existing products that were made and sold elsewhere prior to their arrival on the second-hand market, either through post-consumer or wholesale merchant.

Consider then, the act of assets moving around within a bubble. Nothing is going out, nothing new is coming in.

What he said!! :)

[Predatorxs]

Why don't Bush and Dick get the f#ck outta town... what a pair of shits!! :o

http://www.xs.dsl.pipex.com/avator/ms_ufo.gif..XS

[number6]

are you joking? The amount of money grossed by people who use ebay to sell would absolutely DESTROY his comment. It just shows how out of touch Edwards is with the current market to even comment on it.

You realize that the economy's health isn't reliant on how many middlemen there are, don't you? Probably not. Ebay is simply a cycle of property changing hands on a large scale. Nothing is 'made' on Ebay, factories do not put together bicycles on the internet, what you see on Ebay are (99% of the time, because there are nutjobs who sell their crappy custom jewelry) pre-existing products that were made and sold elsewhere prior to their arrival on the second-hand market, either through post-consumer or wholesale merchant.

Consider then, the act of assets moving around within a bubble. Nothing is going out, nothing new is coming in.

Well I am no economic expert, but I think Cheney's point was that a lot of people actually work full time making money off of ebay and these people are considered self employed. These self employed types do not factor into the labor statistics that the dems use to show how the economy is supposedly in the toilet. If you factor in all jobs, including people making a living off of ebay, you will find that our economy is much better off than the liberals would have you believe.

[fahrvergnugen]

Can we move this thread to off-topic where it belongs, with all the other political ideology bully-pulpit threads?

[Bratwurst]

Well I am no economic expert, but I think Cheney's point was that a lot of people actually work full time making money off of ebay and these people are considered self employed. These self employed types do not factor into the labor statistics that the dems use to show how the economy is supposedly in the toilet. If you factor in all jobs, including people making a living off of ebay, you will find that our economy is much better off than the liberals would have you believe.

400,000 is a drop in the bucket of 294,255,000. There are children and the elderly/retired in that number but it is still below 1%. I also doubt every one of those 400,000 has a garage stocked to the brim with items to sell, working full time off Ebay.

[Iron Draggon]

are you joking? The amount of money grossed by people who use ebay to sell would absolutely DESTROY his comment. It just shows how out of touch Edwards is with the current market to even comment on it.

I wholeheartedly agree. Remember folks, a great deal of ebay sellers are professional businesspeople with physical stores in addition to their online stores, and even more are professional businesspeople who are starting out with online stores until they can afford the additional expense of a physical store. So to say that all of ebay is nothing but private individuals trading worthless trinkets with each other is a gross overgeneralization of the ebay market. Anytime that you have money changing hands, you have commerce. Ebay is effectively the online equivalent of a flea market. It may not be as huge a factor as huge corporations like WalMart, but it is a huge factor.

However, I would just as soon that it remain ignored. If our goverment ever wakes up and realizes just how much commerce takes place on ebay, they'll start taxing the shit out of it and ruin it for everyone. It's much better to have it remain ignored, so small scale sellers can avoid having to report it on their taxes. Think about it. Most of us here who have sold on ebay should be reporting a shitload of income from doing so on our taxes. But do we? Of course not. Because it's all under the table. Good old American tax free money, that Uncle Sam doesn't have to know about. Like selling drugs, but even better because it's completely legal. Do we really want that to change? I guarantee that it will, if the government ever figures out what a sweet deal we "middlemen" are currently enjoying. Ride the wave while it lasts...

[kevincure]

Well, ebay style sales wouldn't really count in most reckonings of the GDP - the only value created is minor, and relies on some value added by the shipping prep and that sort of thing. To see why we don't count used good sales in GDP, consider a CD that is passed around to 100 friends, and which sold for 12 dollars originally. There is certainly a gain in consumer value, but the economy has certainly not produced 1200 bucks worth of goods and services.

I think Cheney, though, meant that ebay meant that the unemployment rate was too high (because many ebay sellers are not reporting their income as taxable and are essentially ripping the rest of us taxpayers off). Edwards is dead on that this is bogus. If .1% of the working population supported themselves off of ebay AND didn't report their income as taxable AND claimed unemployment benefits, I would be shocked and awed myself.

[number6]

Well I am no economic expert, but I think Cheney's point was that a lot of people actually work full time making money off of ebay and these people are considered self employed. These self employed types do not factor into the labor statistics that the dems use to show how the economy is supposedly in the toilet. If you factor in all jobs, including people making a living off of ebay, you will find that our economy is much better off than the liberals would have you believe.

400,000 is a drop in the bucket of 294,255,000. There are children and the elderly/retired in that number but it is still below 1%. I also doubt every one of those 400,000 has a garage stocked to the brim with items to sell, working full time off Ebay.

I have no idea where Cheney pulls the 400,000 number from and I agree that it is just a drop in the bucket as far as labor numbers go. There are many more jobs than this that are not counted in labor stats. I think the numbers the dems look at is the number of people on company payrolls. Since many small companies have only 1 employee, the owner, I guess they don't count? That's my take on the situation anyway.

[kevincure]

There are two ways of doing unemployment: payroll survey (they poll a representative set of companies) and household survey (they call a representative set of households). The guys at the Bureau of Labor Statistics aren't stupid, though - the numbers are adjusted for things like one-person companies.