Popping PSTWOS

[Xtasy]

Apparantly the new PSTWOS have been popping lasers like hotcakes...Ive talked to a few friends on the net who this happened to one had 6 that were in boxes in shop display...He modded 2 and left 4 unchipped and 4 are already dead...Blacked lasers


Really im not suprised...LOOK AT THE SIZE OF THAT THING! how are they able to adequatly cool it?


I instal a matrix in PstWo and work fine for some minutes and a smoke get out of lens,Yes in the lens and burn It ! Burn equal a cake, a bread ,the glass turn black !
Anyone have this or have a solution,to me try,maybe a Vaio notebook cd reader can work ! Thaks !"



urther to the post previously regarding a smoked laser, I now have 1 here also.

The unit was booting everything fine and then locked up, ie on browser/config screen. I had to pull the power cord at the back to switch off. I could smell that something had fried and indeed it had the laser eye is blackened.

The console still boots but there is no drive to the laser at all.

This happened after a reboot, after I had just forced pal through the infinty menu.

The console is PAL btw.



Another persons laser went before 4 hours when he was play SA


I thought sony had sorted DRE'S with this new pstwo but by eliminating dres they have caused laser smoking

What are your thoughts guys??


-Xtasy

[tholly]

What are your thoughts guys??


-Xtasy

another Sony piece of shit???

i have a sony laptop, ps1, ps2, and will get a psp, but you cant argue that they arent made very poorly

[Xtasy]

PSP..Meh what next? Exploding LCD's...THat could really harm your eyes


-Xtasy

[Nez]

GOd how could they fuck that up, I can't imagine that lens tecnology is that much different from other DVD drives.

[Xtasy]

GOd how could they fuck that up, I can't imagine that lens tecnology is that much different from other DVD drives.


It's mostly overheating....My friend who is also in the austrailian modchip company OZXCHIP fitted some resisters and shit and they are working well


-Xtasy

[kai123]

So ones that are modded are going faster than those that aren't? I say that because you quoted two people who modded their systems. Maybe sony has something new in the bios to check for it? I am not sure. It wouldn't suprise me if they are crappy lasers. :roll:

[Nez]

GOd how could they fuck that up, I can't imagine that lens tecnology is that much different from other DVD drives.


It's mostly overheating....My friend who is also in the austrailian modchip company OZXCHIP fitted some resisters and shit and they are working well


-Xtasy

Well that's not too suprising given the problems the original PSX had with heating.

[mhsy2a]

How many of the blackened lenses were on non-modded systems? Seems to me that the lenses are getting fried because the mod chips are overheating the system. The simple sollution here is to not mod the smaller ones and stay with the bigger models.

[Xtasy]

So ones that are modded are going faster than those that aren't?


Well it looks so....Probably a heat/eletrical issue


http://www.ps2-scene.org/forums/showthread.php?t=27983&page=1&pp=15


More there

-Xtasy

[Xtasy]

How many of the blackened lenses were on non-modded systems? Seems to me that the lenses are getting fried because the mod chips are overheating the system. The simple sollution here is to not mod the smaller ones and stay with the bigger models.

Well my friend has had 2 pop that are unmodded and its not even summer yet....The real fun is yet to come

-Xtasy

[evilmess]

Anytime you mod your console or pc you run the risk of damaging it.

Otherwise the new PStwos come with a full 1 year warranty. I'd be claiming warranty on those PStwos that are popping lasers within the warranty period.

[Tank]

But their so damn sexy :(

[digitalpress]

Hey just a little heads up.

There's at least one Sony exec who frequents this board and is very active in his pursuit of modchip-related activity. Some of the folks here already know this. I'm just telling you so you don't accidentally incriminate your friends.

That is all.

[Kilik Kurosawa]

Hey just a little heads up.

There's at least one Sony exec who frequents this board and is very active in his pursuit of modchip-related activity. Some of the folks here already know this. I'm just telling you so you don't accidentally incriminate your friends.

That is all.


Does that mean you can get in trouble for moding your ps2?

[SoulBlazer]

Just don't mention anyone by name and you'll be fine.

Sony COULD sue you for modding your system, but the worst they have done is go after companies.

Heck, I had my PS1 modded back in the day. ;)

[Kilik Kurosawa]

I just assumed what is yours is yours as long as you don't SELL it.

[kai123]

Hey just a little heads up.

There's at least one Sony exec who frequents this board and is very active in his pursuit of modchip-related activity. Some of the folks here already know this. I'm just telling you so you don't accidentally incriminate your friends.

That is all.


Does that mean you can get in trouble for moding your ps2?

It is in violation of the DMCA to modify something that has specific precautions to stop copyright infringement. Or so I have heard.

[tholly]

Hey just a little heads up.

There's at least one Sony exec who frequents this board and is very active in his pursuit of modchip-related activity. Some of the folks here already know this. I'm just telling you so you don't accidentally incriminate your friends.

That is all.


Does that mean you can get in trouble for moding your ps2?


someone is getting sued by sony and getting thrown in jail :evil:

[Flack]

If the cause of those lasers popping are the mod chips, that's an expensive lesson indeed.

Sony has been taking crap over DREs for the past four years. I can't imagine they would release something that would explode on its own in four hours. You have to think that after the last round, these units have been tested for days of play time.

[qbertandernie]

itd be kind of funny though if sony has the technology to pop a system that has been modded!

LOL

[Iron Draggon]

Sony sucks. And the very idea that they would have the audacity to pursue legal action against those who choose to mod their systems is merely more proof of just how much they suck. The PS2 is a piece of shit no matter how many times you redesign it, and modding it is the only way to fix it. I would wager that one reason they're so against people modding them is because if you actually fix it, then it won't break anymore and you won't need any of their expensive proprietary parts. This is why I'll never buy a Sony computer either. What would they do if I did, threaten to sue me for upgrading it? It's a well known fact that it's nearly impossible to upgrade a Sony computer, just as it's nearly impossible to play import games on a Sony console, without going through a ton of unnecessarily complicated procedures. So IMO, the sooner the GP tells Sony where to shove it, the better off everyone will be.

[Flack]

http://www.personal.psu.edu/staff/b/s/bso104/temp/crazy.jpg

[Kepone]

Hey just a little heads up.

There's at least one Sony exec who frequents this board and is very active in his pursuit of modchip-related activity. Some of the folks here already know this. I'm just telling you so you don't accidentally incriminate your friends.

That is all.

Too bad for him.

His company should learn to make better products before they go after people for modchipping.

I know. I have a PS2 that has already been repaired after it wouldn't read discs anymore.

[The Manimal]

wow. hopefully mine won't break...


to anyone who has one. when it is laying flat (kind of has to, given the stand isn't out yet), does the tray open all the way when you hit the 'open' button or does it open half-way and you have to push it the remainder up? mine only opens it half-way and I have to manually move the lid all the way open, though if I open it when the unit is held vertically, the tray snaps FULLY open really quick. ???. Door release is just weak?, but on it's side gravity isn't working as much against it?

[whoisKeel]

i hope this is some kind of joke. i've been seriously considering breaking down and getting one of these, i have no ps2 or pstwo as of yet...the dre problems was one of the reasons i never bought a ps2 in the first place. (i'm on my 4th FOURTH psx right now). if these pstwo's are breaking, i will not buy one.

[goatdan]

It is in violation of the DMCA to modify something that has specific precautions to stop copyright infringement. Or so I have heard.

It is in violation of the DMCA to modify something that has specific precautions to stop copyright infringement if the goal of the modification is to pursue copyright infringement activities. In other words, if you mod your PS2 and then play legally made homebrews on it (don't know much about that scene), it is no big deal. If you mod it to save games onto a hard drive and then play them later, that is a violation of the DMCA.

Of course, with how Sony sues, I wouldn't be surprised if they sued anyone with a mod-chip. Remember, this was the company that kept taking Bleem! to court and their case kept getting thrown out because it was meritless... but they kept going until Bleem! ran out of business and had to close shop.

And oddly enough, Bleem! wasn't hurting Sony... it was giving Sony a larger market to potientally sell too -- suddenly, you had the PC and the Dreamcast markets too...

But apparently, if it wasn't Sony in charge of that, you simply couldn't do it. Too bad :(

[Iron Draggon]

They really need to strike down all those damned DMCA laws! 3-2-1 Studios was right, they're totally being used in ways that they were never intended!

[Nez]

It is in violation of the DMCA to modify something that has specific precautions to stop copyright infringement. Or so I have heard.

It is in violation of the DMCA to modify something that has specific precautions to stop copyright infringement if the goal of the modification is to pursue copyright infringement activities. In other words, if you mod your PS2 and then play legally made homebrews on it (don't know much about that scene), it is no big deal. If you mod it to save games onto a hard drive and then play them later, that is a violation of the DMCA.

Of course, with how Sony sues, I wouldn't be surprised if they sued anyone with a mod-chip. Remember, this was the company that kept taking Bleem! to court and their case kept getting thrown out because it was meritless... but they kept going until Bleem! ran out of business and had to close shop.

And oddly enough, Bleem! wasn't hurting Sony... it was giving Sony a larger market to potientally sell too -- suddenly, you had the PC and the Dreamcast markets too...

But apparently, if it wasn't Sony in charge of that, you simply couldn't do it. Too bad :(

I thought SOny boght Bleem!. :hmm:

[Xtasy]

i hope this is some kind of joke. i've been seriously considering breaking down and getting one of these, i have no ps2 or pstwo as of yet...the dre problems was one of the reasons i never bought a ps2 in the first place. (i'm on my 4th FOURTH psx right now). if these pstwo's are breaking, i will not buy one.

This is NO joke at all...Just a heads up...Also as for that sony exec he cant sue me for talking about chips and thanks for that heads up DP

As for PS2 modchips in the uk they are now illegal because they always hold some code which allows you to play backup where as Xbox modchips are made for loading linux but some load hacked bioses and play copied games....

Also lets not forget MaXmediaplayter....plays cd-rs i tsa kinda bootdisk


-Xtasy

[jdc]

Here's the situation on modding systems...in layman's terms.

When you buy a system, in this case a PS2, you are buying the ownership of the physical machine.......the plastic case and the guts inside......as they are presented to you by a Sony dealer.

You are not buying, and have NO rights to the intellectual way that the machine operates and have NO rights to modify the intellectual workings to your own benefits.

As far as software is concerned, you are allowed to make a backup copy of a game that you MUST own the original copy of, for your own use. If you sell the original game then the backup copy must be destroyed.

This really only can apply to PCs and Dreamcasts (through a grey area loophole) since it is not necessary to modify the intellectual properties of these systems in order to use a backup copy.

I used to have to explain this stuff on a weekly basis. I'd have a Sony rep in my store and you'd get people walk in and ask how to mod a Playstation. It's illegal.

[omnedon]

Bad law.

Next step, it will be illegal to learn about electronics from a textbook. You might use the knowledge to do things! Things the toaster manufacturer NEVER INTENDED!!

x_x

[FantasiaWHT]

Can somebody confirm there's a year warranty (manufacturers?) on the PS2 70,000 model instead of the normal 90 days?

[slip81]

If the PStwo is crap without modding it wouldn't suprise me. It seems Sony runs into these problems with shoddy parts because they have to be the first out of the door in the hardware dept. It's probably a simple case of them rushing to get the thing out before Christmas to try and out sell the competition.

If the new PStwos are crap and you want a PS2 your best bet is to get a new PS2 while they are still around. Yeah they can have DRE's, but they are a lot better than the launch systems, and who wants to deal with a popping laser.

[kevincure]

jdc, I don't think that's true. First, it depends on the country (in much of the EU, for instance, mod chips aren't illegal). Second, Sony would need to prove that mod chips have no substantial noninfringing use - i.e., their main use is piracy. If you sell a mod chip advertising it as a way to pirate games, that's certainly illegal.

It seems like any legal qualms are easy for Sony to solve, though. Just let us play imports without a mod, and allow noninfringing uses like Linux XBox's. If the big three allowed this, there would be no reason to get a mod chip *except* to pirate games, and it would be an open-and-shut case with any vendor selling chips. I don't understand why Sony (and MS) think that stopping you from playing a JAP version of Mr. Mosquito 2 is worth the cost of losing lawsuits against modchip makers in a number of countries as well as offering a "moral exemption" for mod buyers.

[evilmess]

Can somebody confirm there's a year warranty (manufacturers?) on the PS2 70,000 model instead of the normal 90 days?

Last paragraph in this review of the new PStwo.

Linkage (http://ps2.ign.com/articles/557/557637p2.html)

[goatdan]

You are not buying, and have NO rights to the intellectual way that the machine operates and have NO rights to modify the intellectual workings to your own benefits.

{...snip...}

I used to have to explain this stuff on a weekly basis. I'd have a Sony rep in my store and you'd get people walk in and ask how to mod a Playstation. It's illegal.

You're wrong. The DMCA does not automatically mean that you have no rights to modify the system. You own the system, you can do what you want with it. It would be like if you purchased a car and were told that you couldn't make any changes to the inside without it being at the dealership because they didn't want you to know how it worked. No more trips to Midas to get the oil changed or to the local repair shop to get your oil pan fixed. Nope, only Ford could look at your Ford and only Honda could look at your Honda.

Of course, that sounds crazy. If you wanted to, you could take the engine out of your car and upgrade it. Mod chips are the same way. If you want to mod your system, there is _nothing illegal about it_. You own the property. You own the chips that you purchase to mod it. You have the right to decide to do what you want with your own property.

If, however, you are modding the system to play pirated warez, you are modifying it to purposely defeat the security system and steal a companies intellictual rights. It would be like if you made your car so that it sucked gas out of the gas pump in secret without having to pay for it, and then claimed that it was legal to get that gas because your car could. The modification to your car / PS2 is being used for an illegal purpose, and therefore it is illegal.

If you can prove that you are modifying your PS2 so that you can play legal software (which I'm sure that Sony would define as absolutely nothing, considering their situation with Bleem!, not even legally produced homebrews), it is completely legal. The problem is that most people that are modifying their systems aren't doing it to play legal stuff. Emulators are legal, but as soon as you put a ROM that you don't own on it, it is illegal. No matter how old it is. Pirated warez are not legal, regardless of if the game was released or not. That is what mod-chips are being used for and why Sony watches people that do as best as possible.

If Sony says that it is illegal to modifiy their PS2s, it is only because Sony would prosecute until you ran out of money regardless of the legality behind it, not because it necessarly is.

[goatdan]

Bad law.

Next step, it will be illegal to learn about electronics from a textbook. You might use the knowledge to do things! Things the toaster manufacturer NEVER INTENDED!!

Sorry for two posts in a row, but you're dead on. Even though the DMCA doesn't really apply in the situation of mod chips (because regardless of it, warez and roms would still be illegal), the entire point of the DMCA is to allow companies to hold onto properties forever and squeak as much money as they can out of them, regardless of the "good" of the common man. Is Steamboat Willy really making Disney that much money now? Would a huge black market of silent black and white cartoons open up if Steamboat Willy was made into public property?

The answer, of course, is no... but Disney's money told the politicians that they would be horribly hurt if they ever had to give up the properties to... well, anything and therefore the DMCA was made for the good of big business.

Gotta love the laws...

[tritium]

There's an anti- reverse engineering clause in the DMCA, but I remember hearing a judge pulled some its teeth...

-Tritium

[goatdan]

There's an anti- reverse engineering clause in the DMCA, but I remember hearing a judge pulled some its teeth...

Mod chipping isn't reverse engineering. It's just modifying.

Depending on how the reverse engineering is done, that has been shown to hold up in court. See the court decisions for Nintendo Vs. Tengen and Sega Vs. Accolade for details.

[downfall]

If you can prove that you are modifying your PS2 so that you can play legal software (which I'm sure that Sony would define as absolutely nothing, considering their situation with Bleem!, not even legally produced homebrews), it is completely legal. The problem is that most people that are modifying their systems aren't doing it to play legal stuff. Emulators are legal, but as soon as you put a ROM that you don't own on it, it is illegal. No matter how old it is. Pirated warez are not legal, regardless of if the game was released or not. That is what mod-chips are being used for and why Sony watches people that do as best as possible.

What about imports? That's the only reason I'd bother to mod a console in the first place - what's the legality of that?

[Xtasy]

What about imports? That's the only reason I'd bother to mod a console in the first place - what's the legality of that?


In real truth its illegal...Because your not supposed to have the game yet


-Xtasy

[goatdan]

What about imports? That's the only reason I'd bother to mod a console in the first place - what's the legality of that?

In real truth its illegal...Because your not supposed to have the game yet

...close.

In real truth, it is illegal... because it defeats the regional lock out that games have so that they can't be sold in other markets than where the manufacturers want.

[downfall]

...close.

In real truth, it is illegal... because it defeats the regional lock out that games have so that they can't be sold in other markets than where the manufacturers want.

Makes sense I suppose - although I don't guess you'd necessarily have to have a modded console to play imports - most of them have other ways around it (gamesharks, boot discs, or whatever). Probably still not much different though. I just can't see spending nearly twice what I paid for my US console to get an import console for a few games that will never see the light of day here.

Ah well.

[ddockery]

I read the other day that there is a new PS2 modchip out that ONLY allows you to pla legal homebrews. Backups will not work. An interesting development to say the least.

[SoulBlazer]

Yeah, that's the reason I put a mod chip into my PS1 back in the day -- to play imports. Either for games I did'nt want to wait a year to get in the States or to play games I knew would come out over here.

If the game has no plans to get released in North America, what's wrong with buying the Japanese game to play on a modded system? Or do you have to have a Japanese system as well?

Good points and facts that goatdan is saying. I learned the same things when studying copyright law. :)

[jdc]

You do have plenty of these "Joe Averages" modding their systems. They aren't interested in playing homebrews since they've probably never heard of them. They want stacks of the latest games for free. Most people who mod a system are using it for software piracy. In my previous post I was relating what I was told by an employee of Bleem, who I also employed during one Christmas season and had asked what the situation regarding modding was.

So mod chipping IS legal....but burning unauthorized software isn't. Is that correct?

[goatdan]

You do have plenty of these "Joe Averages" modding their systems. They aren't interested in playing homebrews since they've probably never heard of them. They want stacks of the latest games for free. Most people who mod a system are using it for software piracy. In my previous post I was relating what I was told by an employee of Bleem, who I also employed during one Christmas season and had asked what the situation regarding modding was.

So mod chipping IS legal....but burning unauthorized software isn't. Is that correct?

Yup, you're dead on accurate on both accounts -- Mod chipping is legal if it is done for the right reasons, but 99.9% of the people that are modding their systems are doing it not for legal reasons, but to run illegal software -- whether that software is illegal emulators with ROMs or illegal "back-ups" of games is another story.

I wouldn't call it burning unauthorized software either, as most homebrews are not "authorized" but burning illegal copies of games -- IE roms or pirated games.

It would be interesting to see how it held up in court if you had someone that modded their PS2 so they could create backups of the games that they had purchased. If Sony were to sue over it, and the person actually went to court, it would be interesting to see how that came out. Technically, it isn't necessarily legal to make your own back ups even with the original software but companies have for a long time said that it was fine too...

[Xtasy]

Hey going back to the popping lasers its only certain batchs that have bad lasers sony have said and have now halted production for a while....Problem is we dont know WHICH batchs have the bad lasers and thats the whole scary part. I'd hold fire buying a pstwo till sony has said the issue has been addressed and fixed

-Xtasy

[Lady Jaye]

That'd make sense that it's only certain production batches, since most people (myself included) hadn't had any problems with the PSTwo and yet some people did have extreme problems related to overheating.

Reminder to anyone who'd have a faulty PSTwo: just return it under warranty to Sony. You'll get another that works just fine.

[klausien]

On a side note, my Dad has had the same stereo receiver since 1973. It is a Quadrophonic KLH unit that was hand-assembled in Massachusetts. He bought it for about $400. It still sounds great.

He has also had a Sony XBR TV for about 20 years. The tube has been replaced twice in that time.

I had a PS2 for 2 years. I just replaced it right before they came out with the smaller unit.

Sony products are built to last for 2-3 years so you need to get a new one. It is their business model.

[Raedon]

A company would not cause their systems to fail out COMPLETELY from a mod chip. It makes no sense really. Think about it:

1) If you are going to kill a system because of a mod chip you would have a EEPROM set up to record the event and display a "YOUR SYSTEM HAS BEEN TAMPERED WITH AND IS VOID OF WARRANTY." otherwise, you just have a bunch of people returning systems after the fact.

2) they have your money and a new install base even if you buy used games (the same as stealing games.)

If there is a flaw it is real. But I haven't heard of any PSTwo's dying.

[Raedon]

You are not buying, and have NO rights to the intellectual way that the machine operates and have NO rights to modify the intellectual workings to your own benefits.


You should see my Corvette.. the Machine operates and is modified.. let GM sue me.

[Raedon]

Sony products are built to last for 2-3 years so you need to get a new one. It is their business model.

Are you kidding me? I work in the video industry and PDF can back me up on what I'm about to say. Sony equipment lasts. Their Triniton Studio monitors are amazing. I have one still working from the 80's. My Beta SP studio deck has seen more use then I care to mention and it's atominc clock solid.

Yea, Sony consoles are junk.. Or are they?

My modded V7 PS2 has logged over a 1000 hours of RPG's and who knows how much other stuff even movies.. Not a fart.. My PSOne with LCD still works great.. no problems there..

Sony is no joke when it comes to their equipment. It's some of the best stuff out there. Their first gen V systems are usually crap but that doesn't mean they all are.

What you said is like saying, "all Texans have a horse." It just isn't true.

[Flack]

Hey going back to the popping lasers its only certain batchs that have bad lasers sony have said and have now halted production for a while....Problem is we dont know WHICH batchs have the bad lasers and thats the whole scary part. I'd hold fire buying a pstwo till sony has said the issue has been addressed and fixed

-Xtasy

Hm hadn't heard that one yet, link?

[Dobie]

Sony is no joke when it comes to their equipment. It's some of the best stuff out there.

I'd agree with you for the most part. I LOVE their TV's. Like you said, they rock. I have had an original first-run Discman for years, and though it now skips at the slightest bump and has seen better days, it still works.

I've had less luck with some of their most recent stuff though. I bought a DVD player from them that I've had repaired TWICE since I bought it--I've only owned it for a year. I also have a Sony "Dream System" that blew a speaker in the first six months of purchase, with light use (I know the Dream Systems aren't top of the line, but they shouldn't blow out).

So I'd vouch for Sony's older stuff, but not recently. I just haven't seen it. I could be just unlucky though.

[Raedon]

I bought a DVD player from them that I've had repaired TWICE since I bought it--I've only owned it for a year. I also have a Sony "Dream System" that blew a speaker in the first six months of purchase, with light use (I know the Dream Systems aren't top of the line, but they shouldn't blow out).

So I'd vouch for Sony's older stuff, but not recently. I just haven't seen it. I could be just unlucky though.


The problem I've seen with any Sony product, as well as others, is when they get a bulk of say DVD drives from a company that has two qualities of DVD drive units. So when Sony makes a $80 DVD player it has no quality control but if you get a $300 DVD player you get something that will work great for a while.

I've found that the products that all major brands have strong "cheap" competition on they have cut corners. In a world of $30 DVD players, everyone should just get used to replacing them every two years or so. As for Sony sound setups.. Sony may make an Amp but Sony didn't make the speakers.

You want to see a company that really went from amazing quality to crap look to JVC.

[Mayhem]

PS2s are notorious for being more prone to failure than either the Xbox or Cube. Pretty much fact, given the countless tales, people and information I've gotten.

Case in point today, went into a gameshop, poor shop guy's trying to run games on the new PStwo and it's refusing all the DVDs. The unit he's using for display/demo purposes he tells me is less than a week out of the box. Looks like the DVD laser is burnt out, as it plays CD based games fine.

Ironically, one the uses Sony publicise as a plus for the PS2, the ability to play DVD movies, is the most laser intensive activities you can do. Or in other words, it wears it out the quickest...

[zmweasel]

PS2s are notorious for being more prone to failure than either the Xbox or Cube. Pretty much fact, given the countless tales, people and information I've gotten.

"Pretty much fact," no. No amount of anecdotal evidence equals fact.

-- Z.

[FantasiaWHT]

PS2s are notorious for being more prone to failure than either the Xbox or Cube. Pretty much fact, given the countless tales, people and information I've gotten.

"Pretty much fact," no. No amount of anecdotal evidence equals fact.

-- Z.

How much evidence would you need to declare it fact then?

I've talked with every manager of each EB within our district (18 stores) just to ask them. Every single one reported to me defective return ratios to be about 8:2:1 for PS2, Xbox, and GC over the last year. You're probably talking at least 6,000 units.

That a big enough pool for you?

[PS2Hawk]

Apparantly moded PSTwo's are dying!
There is a fix coming for them. I have my PSTwo and PS2 but the PS2 is working perfectly and still no complaints about PSTwo!!

Apparantly the PSTwo has better hardware than V10 PS2, SCPH 50001 3C and after.

[dendawg]

"Pretty much fact," no. No amount of anecdotal evidence equals fact.

:? You want fact? Here's a link for a class-action lawsuit against Sony because of the DRE's. This is most defintely not anecdotal.

http://www.sheller.com/Practice.asp?PracticeID=109
[/b]

[PS2Hawk]

PS2s are notorious for being more prone to failure than either the Xbox or Cube. Pretty much fact, given the countless tales, people and information I've gotten.

Case in point today, went into a gameshop, poor shop guy's trying to run games on the new PStwo and it's refusing all the DVDs. The unit he's using for display/demo purposes he tells me is less than a week out of the box. Looks like the DVD laser is burnt out, as it plays CD based games fine.

Ironically, one the uses Sony publicise as a plus for the PS2, the ability to play DVD movies, is the most laser intensive activities you can do. Or in other words, it wears it out the quickest...

You know you really need to stop talking to idiots. When ever a machine is manufactured its tested, Osciloscope is used to check the resistance of the laser. I have moded close to 78 PS2 and I never had a PS2 that I opened from the box, nor xbox or GameCube that never worked!

Just look at the disks, People have their greecy nassty finger pprints all over it and scratched.
Its always the disk never the laser in a new machine! this goes for xbox ps2 and GC ....

[PS2Hawk]

"Pretty much fact," no. No amount of anecdotal evidence equals fact.

:? You want fact? Here's a link for a class-action lawsuit against Sony because of the DRE's. This is most defintely not anecdotal.

http://www.sheller.com/Practice.asp?PracticeID=109
[/b]


^^^ sounds like a couple of idiots to me. People don't understand the precautions that have to take near this generation of consoles. They should not be placed on Rugs or Should not be anywhere near smoke. ALso the disks have to be clean, have u seen the blockbuster rented dvds or games ? No Wonder the freakin system dies.

[FantasiaWHT]

PS2s are notorious for being more prone to failure than either the Xbox or Cube. Pretty much fact, given the countless tales, people and information I've gotten.

Case in point today, went into a gameshop, poor shop guy's trying to run games on the new PStwo and it's refusing all the DVDs. The unit he's using for display/demo purposes he tells me is less than a week out of the box. Looks like the DVD laser is burnt out, as it plays CD based games fine.

Ironically, one the uses Sony publicise as a plus for the PS2, the ability to play DVD movies, is the most laser intensive activities you can do. Or in other words, it wears it out the quickest...

You know you really need to stop talking to idiots. When ever a machine is manufactured its tested, Osciloscope is used to check the resistance of the laser. I have moded close to 78 PS2 and I never had a PS2 that I opened from the box, nor xbox or GameCube that never worked!

Just look at the disks, People have their greecy nassty finger pprints all over it and scratched.
Its always the disk never the laser in a new machine! this goes for xbox ps2 and GC ....

I call bs on that one :P I have seen several brand new machines come back with laser problems at work.

[PS2Hawk]

PS2s are notorious for being more prone to failure than either the Xbox or Cube. Pretty much fact, given the countless tales, people and information I've gotten.

Case in point today, went into a gameshop, poor shop guy's trying to run games on the new PStwo and it's refusing all the DVDs. The unit he's using for display/demo purposes he tells me is less than a week out of the box. Looks like the DVD laser is burnt out, as it plays CD based games fine.

Ironically, one the uses Sony publicise as a plus for the PS2, the ability to play DVD movies, is the most laser intensive activities you can do. Or in other words, it wears it out the quickest...

You know you really need to stop talking to idiots. When ever a machine is manufactured its tested, Osciloscope is used to check the resistance of the laser. I have moded close to 78 PS2 and I never had a PS2 that I opened from the box, nor xbox or GameCube that never worked!

Just look at the disks, People have their greecy nassty finger pprints all over it and scratched.
Its always the disk never the laser in a new machine! this goes for xbox ps2 and GC ....

I call bs on that one :P I have seen several brand new machines come back with laser problems at work.

Okay .. 100 percent sure u are bullshitiing!

[FantasiaWHT]

Well, I shouldn't say several, sorry.

I've had at least a few come back brand new with bad lasers. Maybe 3 or 4.

[omnedon]

FACT:

Broken LOCAL PS2's make my rent and vehicle payment.

That is all.

[Raedon]

FACT:

Broken LOCAL PS2's make my rent and vehicle payment.

That is all.

Sweeeet.. See? They are creating WORK!!! GO SONY!!

[maxlords]

I'm just gonna chime in a bit here.

1. PS2s: Simple fact is...people treat their PS2s like shit. They move them around, take them to friends' houses, chain smoke while using them, etc etc. On top of that, have you seen the average gamer's discs? I wouldn't even want to touch them, much less put them in my system. People are flat out NOT careful with systems and games. Now, realistically, can you design a piece of hardware like the PS2 (which is now HOW old?) to take that sort of abuse? Well...Nintendo Gamecubes can, but they took a completely different design format. The PS2 is not designed for abuse. It's designed to be NON-portable...and to be cared for like a precision piece of electronics. No one does to their PCs what they do to their PS2s. If they did, there'd be mass failures of PCs. Instead there are mass failures of PS2s. Now granted, there are design flaws in the PS2...they collect dust badly, etc. But I bought my PS2 brand new the day they came out. You can't tell. Hell, it works flawlessly. I've NEVER had a problem with it. Why? Because I care for my electronics. I keep them pretty clean. I don't move them around. I won't put dirty discs in my PS2. I don't play DVDs in my PS2 either (partly cause they look like shit on that low end DVD player and partly cause I don't need to...I have a dedicated DVD player). And it works GREAT! I think the vast majority of PS2s die because people are too dumb to care for their rather expensive electronics properly. Simple as that. Electronics only last if cared for.

2. Mod chips: I have to say I agree with some of the people here. I ONLY would be interested in modding to play imports. In this day and age of a "global economy" is it REALLY realistic to make it ILLEGAL for people to mod to play imports just because some suit in a company doesn't think you want to? I don't think it is. If I want to play a game...I should be able to buy it. So what if it's in Japanese? Why does that matter to Sony? Are they saying we're not able to choose what we want to do? I just don't understand the logic behind that law. Especially with the VAST amounts of importing, the OBVIOUS demand for items that were not released domestically. It doesn't make sense. It's so easy to buy the stuff directly from the shops in Japan now that Sony (or any other company) can't possibly make the argument in this day and age that games they release in other countries should not be played in any other country than they were released. It's ludicrous.

[Mayhem]

You know you really need to stop talking to idiots. When ever a machine is manufactured its tested, Osciloscope is used to check the resistance of the laser. I have moded close to 78 PS2 and I never had a PS2 that I opened from the box, nor xbox or GameCube that never worked!

Just look at the disks, People have their greecy nassty finger pprints all over it and scratched. Its always the disk never the laser in a new machine! this goes for xbox ps2 and GC ....

He tried five different DVD based games in the machine... it refused to read any of them. And he was being careful with the discs, after all, these are ones he was also selling in the shop! You saying all five were defective? I don't think so. It was a Game Crazy btw, and he also tried a DVD movie from the Hollywood video side and that failed also.

Anyhow, I never said it was new out of the box. I said it was less than a week since he'd taken it out of the box to use for demo purposes (no play, just auto play on a monitor) within the store.

[zmweasel]

PS2s are notorious for being more prone to failure than either the Xbox or Cube. Pretty much fact, given the countless tales, people and information I've gotten.

"Pretty much fact," no. No amount of anecdotal evidence equals fact.

-- Z.

How much evidence would you need to declare it fact then?

I've talked with every manager of each EB within our district (18 stores) just to ask them. Every single one reported to me defective return ratios to be about 8:2:1 for PS2, Xbox, and GC over the last year. You're probably talking at least 6,000 units.

That a big enough pool for you?

I'm not disputing that vast amounts of anecdotal evidence indicate that PS2s break down more often than Xboxes and GameCubes. However, as I've pointed out before, there are so many more PS2s in North America than Xboxes and GameCubes that if all three systems broke down at an equal rate, you'd STILL have twice as many defective PS2s as Xboxes and GameCubes combined.

I'm just pointing out that anecdotal evidence does not and never will equal fact.

-- Z.

[neotokeo2001]

Hey just a little heads up.

There's at least one Sony exec who frequents this board and is very active in his pursuit of modchip-related activity. Some of the folks here already know this. I'm just telling you so you don't accidentally incriminate your friends.

That is all.

Hey Sony Exec. You guys make crappy systems. I have an Atari 2600 that has worked for over 20 years. I have had 3 PS2's in 4 years. But there is'nt a problem, Is There? x_x :hmm:

Hopefully the 3rd Party Software Companies will take their games to the other systems next time around. You know. The ones that work, Have better graphics, sound , etc....

I can't wait to see the return rate on the PSP.

[neotokeo2001]

I'm not disputing that vast amounts of anecdotal evidence indicate that PS2s break down more often than Xboxes and GameCubes. However, as I've pointed out before, there are so many more PS2s in North America than Xboxes and GameCubes that if all three systems broke down at an equal rate, you'd STILL have twice as many defective PS2s as Xboxes and GameCubes combined.

I'm just pointing out that anecdotal evidence does not and never will equal fact.

-- Z.

I've had 3 PS2's in the same time that I have had 1 X-Box and 1 Gamecube. To be fair the PS2 does see more gameplay. But not 3 times more. And there is always past history with the amazing flippable PS1. How many games did the Vertical PS2 set-up mangle??

I'm not a PS2 hater. Just the company who makes it and refuses to admit to their problems.

[Mattiekrome]

Yeah, sony just releases whatever they want. I went on a boycott there for about 6 months because best buy refused to replace my ps2 (bought on the first day, about 4 months later it became a doorstop) They can release pretty much anything and the public will buy it up no matter what it is :/ (imo)