Beat 'em' Ups: A dying genre?

[PDorr3]

Whole writing in the topic for "which games were better on old consoles", something sparked my mind, I thought about games such as TMNT, Golden Axe, Streets of Rage, Double dragon, Battletoads, and wondered why we no longer see this classic genre style anymore. Im not talking about your typical 3d run around kill anything you see games, I mean the classic left to right, boss at end of level games.

Oh how I would love to see a Golden Axe IV, or a TRUE TMNT game.

I just wish more companies like namco, konami, or even SquareEnix would try and test their talent with these games.

The only honorable mention I can think of is The Bouncer on PS2, which is a pure classic beat em up.

Anyone care to enlighten me on some games I might have missed in the past few years, or care to discuss the dieing beat em up genre?

[digitalpress]

If it's dying, it's been dying since the 3D era was born. Think about it, it's been a long time since this was a popular genre.

There are a few: Gekido on PlayStation, Fighting Force on N64 and PlayStation, even the recent SpikeOut on Xbox. They do appear, but they've been very few and far between for the last TEN years.

[nate1749]

I'm a little confused by the specific type of genre you're referencing. So basically take a new 3d killing game like god of war and make it side scroller where you can also walk up and down (like on the street) within the screen and that's what you miss?

I was just playing some port of a game on dreamcast that was a streets of rage type of feel - I'll have to get the name for you. It wasn't anything great though. I'll have to check out the ps2 title you mention.

If I'm understanding you correctly then I don't see this genre totally dieing. At least not from the homebrew section of gaming, commerical releases on the other hand would be a different story.

Nate

[Lord Contaminous]

Man, the freestyle fighting scenes in "Shenmue" that's what a new 3-D Streets of Rage is made of.

[bargora]

So the freedom of motion of, say, Buffy the Vampire Slayer (Xbox) disqualifies it, in your opinion? If so, then I don't think you're going to see any more beat-em-ups released.

[WanganRunner]

Well, I dunno about "dying genre".

What differentiates a beat-em-up from a hack-and-slash?

Why isn't Dynasty Warriors or Devil May Cry considered a beat-em-up? I think they should be. I love Dynasty Warriors for precisely the same reasons I love Streets of Rage.

Is it just that one uses weapons and another doesn't? That's a pretty silly distinction....

Where's pragmatic insanester here, he's the big beat-em-up fan, isn't he?

[Ed Oscuro]

Beat-em-ups don't allow free movement? Hmm...I'm gonna say that the spirit of BEUs lives on in games like Gut's Rage (DC) and, well, actually in a whole metric ton of new games (i.e. Ninja Gaiden, and the new Altered Beast).

The old style of beat-em-up weren't terrible, but I'm incredibly tired of the standard jump kick. That style of game was incredibly limited.

[nate1749]

I always thought a HackNSlash was the same as a Beat em up, just a HackNSlash concentrated more on blood, guts, and gore (to sometimes, but not always, attempt to compensate for poor gameplay/storyline).

Like SplatterHouse for TG16 is a HackNSlash, but take away the gore and it's a beat em up. Weapons are used in streets of rage & tmnt (I think) so that wouldn't make a difference.

This would be like wanting a shooter game that doesn't move backgrounds (like duck hunt) over a game like silent scope or time crisis. This type of game was a stepping stone to get to where they are now, taking a step back with a new game may be appreciated by some gamers (even then only classic ones) - but I wouldn't think by the public.

I'm sticking with the homebrew scene as the place to go for "new" titles of this genre. These are people who make games for the love of the game and generally only have the resources to make games of this complexity.

Nate

[Ed Oscuro]

Like SplatterHouse for TG16 is a HackNSlash, but take away the gore and it's a beat em up.
The defining element of a beat-em-up is that you use mostly just your fists, and you can't one-hit-kill anybody; the emphasis is on hand-to-hand combat, not on platforming or fast gameplay.

[sharp]

Last beat 'm ups in that style I played were Sengoku 3 and New Team Zero. The first one only made it to the Neo Geo AES when it comes to homeconsoles. New Team Zero was from 1997 and thought it the most disapointing Seibu game as it's just a remix of the old one. Anyway I think it's a hard to locate game. Still don't get why there isn't a Zero team for consoles.

[jajaja]

Ye.. I would say so. Just look back in the days on all those beatem up titles. This is one of my favorite genre :) Too bad they make very few of it today.

I acctualy recived Gekido for GBA today. Only tried it for 3-4 minz and it seemed like a desent beatem up game.

[Gamereviewgod]

My qualifications for a BEU:

Must have combat only. No puzzles, no adventuring. Just straight fighting.

Must have a simple combo system in place.

Enemies cannot die with one hit.

Must be able to select from at least 2 characters with differing statistics.

Can have weapons as long as it features the above critiera.

Anyway, the souls of BEUs live on in stuff like Baulders Gate and God of War, but they are not true BEUs. Recent releases like Spikeout and Star Wars III on the GBA/DS fit into this category. Double Dragon on the GBA qualifies.

I've always fought River City Ransom. I don't believe it's a true BEU at heart. Too much RPG'ing.

[Promophile]

I don't see the big diff between say, God of War or for a more beat-em-up like game, the Bouncer, and a Beat-em-up, its just the natural progression. Same with Sonic. He used to be in blinding fast 2D sidescrollers and now hes in blinding fast 3D games.

[goatdan]

What about Batman: Rise of Sin Tzu?

And why don't the TMNT games count? They aren't the best games out there, but they are pretty much straight up beat-em-up style.

Then, as someone else pointed out, SpikeOut: Battle Street is another recently released one.

And even Rockstar has some big one coming out based on some old movie.

They definitely aren't as popular as they were when TMNT was ruling the arcades, but they are still around.

[PDorr3]

My qualifications for a BEU:

Must have combat only. No puzzles, no adventuring. Just straight fighting.

Must have a simple combo system in place.

Enemies cannot die with one hit.

Must be able to select from at least 2 characters with differing statistics.

Can have weapons as long as it features the above critiera.

Anyway, the souls of BEUs live on in stuff like Baulders Gate and God of War, but they are not true BEUs. Recent releases like Spikeout and Star Wars III on the GBA/DS fit into this category. Double Dragon on the GBA qualifies.

I've always fought River City Ransom. I don't believe it's a true BEU at heart. Too much RPG'ing.

I basicaly agree with everytihng you have said here. To me god of war and devil may cry are more along the lines of action/adventure. Games like baldurs gate are not BEU to me, as Paprocki said above, BEU are not one hit kill games, therefore the likes of baldurs gate are rules out in my opinion, and are more along the lines of a "hack n slash" game.

I have just played star wars on DS, and that is a true BEU game, scrolling from left to right, 2 characters with different abilities, no 1 hit kills, emphasis on combat, no platforming or adventuring.

[Cthulhu]

I think the beat-em-up genre has mostly evolved into other genres... so yes, it has mostly "died," but it's still around in a way. Dynasty Warriors and such are the main inheritors of beat-em-up traits, but games like Devil May Cry and God of War certainly inherited some aspects of beat-em-ups.

I'd rather companies not make them anymore, actually. The old ones are indeed classics (yay Streets of Rage!), but most modern attempts at these sort of game are pretty lousy (Bouncer anyone?). I'll just enjoy the old ones and hope that most companies stick to more contemporary stuff.

[ubersaurus]

My qualifications for a BEU:

Must have combat only. No puzzles, no adventuring. Just straight fighting.

Must have a simple combo system in place.

Enemies cannot die with one hit.

Must be able to select from at least 2 characters with differing statistics.

Can have weapons as long as it features the above critiera.

Anyway, the souls of BEUs live on in stuff like Baulders Gate and God of War, but they are not true BEUs. Recent releases like Spikeout and Star Wars III on the GBA/DS fit into this category. Double Dragon on the GBA qualifies.

I've always fought River City Ransom. I don't believe it's a true BEU at heart. Too much RPG'ing.

I seem to recall Battletoads and Double Dragon both being series where the heroes were pretty much identical-no differing stats.

Bloodrayne is totally a beatemup. Yes, it has some ranged weapon play, but then, who even USED the guns in that game? It was way more fun to eviscerate.

[DynastyLawyer]

I've always fought River City Ransom. I don't believe it's a true BEU at heart. Too much RPG'ing.

Jerk. :(


I think the beat-em-up genre has mostly evolved into other genres... so yes, it has mostly "died," but it's still around in a way. Dynasty Warriors and such are the main inheritors of beat-em-up traits, but games like Devil May Cry and God of War certainly inherited some aspects of beat-em-ups.

I'd rather companies not make them anymore, actually. The old ones are indeed classics (yay Streets of Rage!), but most modern attempts at these sort of game are pretty lousy (Bouncer anyone?). I'll just enjoy the old ones and hope that most companies stick to more contemporary stuff.

I agree with this guy, and why shouln't I? He's the destroyer of worlds. Dynasty Warriors inherited a lot of the old school beat-em-up flavor, and if you're gonna discount a game just because it has RPG elements, you're missing out on some good times.

That said, I'm still waiting on the game that carries graphics equivalent to the Bouncer, but plays like Streets of Rage.

[Melf]

Another thing most BEUs have in common is the ability to move on multiple planes, which lets you avoid or pursue enemies. I'm hesitant to label a game as a BEU if it lacks that. There are some that qualify without it, but most don't.

[Brian_Provinciano]

I myself find them to be just too repetitive nowadays. Games used to be much shorter... games today which are entire beat-em-ups are just too bland to be hugely successful.

[Push Upstairs]

I'd classify "Dynasty Warriors" as a "Beat em up".

But i consider "Gauntlet Legends" and "Dark Legacy" as shining stars in the "modern" beat em up world.

So they have RPG elements...so what? Some puzzles...yeah, well...but they are fun and you get to wail on various underlings.

[pragmatic insanester]

someone mentioned me by name already. heh.

i'm still working (though not nearly as fanatically as i used to) on my giant beat 'em up database.

here's some of my opinions on the topic:

devil may cry is NOT one, because of the platform/puzzle and pacing elements. weapons in beu's are usually carried by cheap bosses and often are inaccurate to prevent a complete halt of the game flow.

hack n' slash: prime example is golden axe. the magic fits into the "special" catagory, unlike most realtime modern games.

to the people complaining about how simple the old games were, how would you feel if your precious 2d shooters were reformatted into something like ace combat (that's a good series though).

there isn't a character limit in them (concerning the "minimum two different characters with different stats") as i have several single player games (growl, ufo kamen yakisoban) and weren't the lee bros. identical in stats?

[NESaholic]

Yeah since 3D i havent really played BEUs on new gen. stuff,glad i am not a real 3D gamer,i have always prefered 2D over 3D.

Otherwise i would have lost interest in gaming very quickly,i think alot looks the same in 3D.
Dont get me wrong i like 3D sometimes but not al genres,mostly RPG.

I mega love games like Double Dragon,Golden Axe,Streets of Rage,Final Fight and so on.
These games just totally rock in 2D,can not make these rock in 3D.

[slip81]

And even Rockstar has some big one coming out based on some old movie.

The Warriors

I am also in agreement with Gamereviewgod in my ideas of what makes a BEU a BEU.

To me games like the new TMNT, Gaunlet, God of War, DMC, X-Men Legends don't apply becuase they have too many other elements floating around in there. I'd say they are part BEU, but not a true one like SoR or DD.

I would also agree with him in that River City Ransom skirts the line, but to me it's a BEU because that is the main emphasis, there is very minimal RPG elements in there, and even the ones that are there only serve to regenerate health and upgrade weapons.

[Promophile]

really its a different world today. Most games aren't 100 pct one genre anymore. Even games like GoW and DMC and even sports games have RPG elements nowadays. Beatemups live on today in different forms.

[Ackman]

they aren't dead just hibernating.... mkay :hmm:

but even since the 3d streets of rage was cancelled they're still around

99-2005 E&OE

The Rage
Oni (FPS BEU hybrid)
Buffy Chaos bleeds
Spikeout Battle Street
etc

and even 2d

geikido Advance
Sekengou 3
Beats of Rage - can't wait for Age of the Beast
The Crystal Kings (very average)
etc

and they are still a part of very popular modern games

Manhunt - even has a brawl mode
GTA SA
POP WW (yes I know it's a strech)
etc

[PDorr3]

really its a different world today. Most games aren't 100 pct one genre anymore. Even games like GoW and DMC and even sports games have RPG elements nowadays. Beatemups live on today in different forms.

this is a good point, compaines are trying to incorporate so many different elements into their games until they find something that works.

[Aswald]

Well, if the genre is dying, then it's about time.

I mean, even the maze-chase genre did not last more than a few years. But these sorts of games, including the one-on-one fighting games, have lasted how long?

In the 1970s and 1980s, it seemed as though there was a never-ending supply of new ideas. But the 1990s were, for the most part, fighters, second-person car games, and gun games.

Maybe now they'll come up with something new?

[pragmatic insanester]

what is The Crystal King?

[sharp]

what is The Crystal King?

It was a game on the Crystal System, a supposed follow-up system for the Neo Geo MVS by Brezzasoft. Only two games where released (other is Evolution Soccer).

The game itself is a decent side-scrolling beat 'm up.

[Ackman]

what is The Crystal King?

HEY PRAG! :D

I'd say it's most like Capcoms D&D Shadow over Mysteria with a mix of Warriors of Fate and GH, it has multiple endings and a nice RPG thing going on if your interested it this type of game you MUST and I REPEAT you MUST try...


ragnarock battline online (offline version) a GGXX type beat em up for PC more info http://www.onrpg.com/ftopic9575.html

the full game is 3gig I don't know where to get a hold of it though damn Azions :D j/k

also check out Night Slashers Arcade and Violent Storm Arcade, as well as Vamp 1/2 from danbi, as well as Noisefactory's very average Gaia Crusaders, and the KOV series geez man I never stop.... The BEU live on in the Arcade the legend will never die

and Demolision Fist Sammy Arcade... BEU will never DIE sound that gong kind Sir!

The BEU topic rises from it's grave yet again!
sorry about the bad puncuation, grammar, spelling I'm at work and the angry fat lady is looking funny at me again O_O

[vulcanjedi]

Hmm

I really miss wave after wave of mindless enemies and repetitive backgrounds but didn't it only take one punch or kick to take care of most enemies in all the old sega punchers? Like Last Battle or The Ninja.

VJ