The PS3 is not a console

[Wavelflack]

When I was a young'un (in the 80's), we had two Trinitrons in a row go to shit. My parents gave up and bought a GE TV, and it's still doing fine.

I have a fancypants Walkman that no longer works, though it's Panasonic replacement still lives.

I have enough anecdotal evidence just in my own family to convince me that Sony is not really a reliable brand of product. The name carries some weight, but it's not really justified anymore.

Oh, and PSX systems also had a fairly high defect rate. Just speaking for the realm of videogame machines, that is.


My personal theory? Sony made well made products up until Betamax, and decided to spite the universe for picking VHS instead.

"Ah! So consumers don't rike quarity? Fine! PS2, here we come!"
*gong*

[Bluteg]

Ed, I'm sorry but when has turning an original Playstation upside down equal high quality (gold) manufacturing. How many original 1st gen Playstations are still working? The only thing good Sony makes is TVs... no one will argue there.

However ask the home theater crowd (www.hometheaterforum.com) about Sony CD players and home theater speakers and AV recievers... cheap junk...

Ask the the car audio (www.caraudioforum.com) crowd about Sony Head Units/CD players, speakers and amps and a LARGE majority will agree that its... cheap junk...

The two examples I stated parallel the video game crowd in a sense that you have a few stories of "well I've had sony product xxxxx, and it has worked for xxxxx" while the vast majority of the people have problems with the products and recommend against Sony products... The name is hurt, its no Denon or Eclipse so just live with it.

[Ed Oscuro]

Ed, I'm sorry but when has turning an original Playstation upside down equal high quality (gold) manufacturing. How many original 1st gen Playstations are still working?
Mine, for one.


The name is hurt, its no Denon or Eclipse so just live with it.
But it is more like a Toshiba, Samsung or Panasonic. Denon does have a large line of consumer products, but their focus is on professional items.

And this "Cheap Junk" stuff - you've gotta look at the bigger picture. I'll trust the word of the guys on that forum but I wouldn't trust them with my wallet...sure, some Sony stuff is junk, but other stuff isn't. That's "price range" coming into play. I've had an older Sony 5-disc CD changer system for home audio since 1995 that was top of the line at the time (and plays CDs better than a lot of the newer crap that tries to detect MP3s and the like); it still works flawlessly outside of the drive motor for the changer being slow. Denon, Eclipse, and Kenwood do make better stuff (on the average) - in their limited fields, but do they invent any new formats? No. When you're buying a Sony product, you're also buying into the Sony program that pushes the state of the art. Blu-Ray might or might not be the best new consumer playback format, but it doesn't really matter - it's competitive and the indicative thing here is that Sony can go head-to-head with the whole DVD forum in making it. Sennheiser makes better headphones, and so does Grado. This is nothing new. However, you're going to pay a lot more for those better brands.

With consoles, however, everything is changed. Sony's hardware isn't incredibly expensive (though I definitely would like to see a more expensive, super-reliable model sold), but you're getting a complete package. Wavelflack mentioned Betamax, and that's pretty ironic - Betamax failed because Sony didn't have a movie library available to back up the format (which wasn't really better, anyhow).

The quality issue goes two ways. PS2 hardware didn't start out profitable, but take a look at the whole Xbox business - not a penny in Microsoft's pocket yet.

If people really cared about quality, they'd stop buying Sony consoles (that '97 model PSX is still the only Sony console I've bought). But, in the end, it's about the games library and the overall experience.

[sabre2922]

I tried sooo freakin hard to like Sony. PS2 about all my friends play at all :frustrated: they are completely :whip: by Sony.

I always new that a PS2 would never be able to replace my beloved Dreamcast and it didnt even with great 3rd party support it wasnt enough to win me over.
Ive had 2 crappy PSones and 3 yes 3 PS2's crap out on me :angry: and I take care of my game consoles too.

Im sick of taking it up the a$$ from Sony with their shoddy hardware and I will never buy a PS3 no matter how popular it may be with the uneducated mass of casual gamers out there.

Next Gen will be all about the 360 and Revolution for me.
Until then I will stay busy collecting and playing my Gamecube and DC.

[Ernster]

[quote=vintagegamecrazy] ONE product has started this belief. Sony's reliability has been the gold standard since the company came to the US in the 1960s. Incidentally, it was the after-sales service that was intially lacking.

Nope sorry your wrong.

PSX - As I remember sometimes you had to turn it upside down to get the disks to load, it also had other problems such as "not working for no good reason"

PS2 - Disk read error need I say more?

PSP - Shooting UMD's, sticky buttons, etc, some Sony rep, said deal with it, we made it like that and not going to change it.

That's 3 crappy made systems out of ...3. Yes Sony can't make a quality system if there life depended on it, and it's safe to say the PS3 will be the same. If it's not, well that's good for everyone...

[FurinkanianFrood]

but other stuff isn't


There are exceptions.... As much as hate Sony, I admit that some of their products actually have absolutely nothing wrong with them. They went to pot some time in the 80's though.

It's just that overall, the quality of their products has been going down for a long time, and now a far too of their products seem to be shoddy.

If you consider how much they cost, and the reputation of the company, there is no excuse for the proportion of messed up products.



The only thing good Sony makes is TVs... no one will argue there.


I will. They are overpriced, overrated. They function. They don't blow up a year after you buy them, but so what.



but do they invent any new formats


Sony doesn't invent anything that impresses me.



Sony program that pushes the state of the art


Erm. What?

They push on people to make them believe their stuff is state of the art.

They just take well established principles up a small step now and then as an excuse to take people's money.

It doesn't take a genius to figure out that a lower wavelength laser can read data squeezed in tighter.

And, last time I checked CDs still are inferior to nice vinyl.

Basically, you have loads of "advances" by a lot of companies that are nothing but the result of taking things that exist (data pressed on to optical discs, transistors), and minaturizing them over and over again.

Fix things that ain't broke and the early adopters will fling cash at you.



I honestly think that this is WAY too early to call anything.


Yeah, but one can talk about how one thinks the US market might react under certain scenarios.



Additionally, I learned not to discuss politics on the net


Yeah, point taken. I'm not gonna censor my opinions about videogames, but politics tends generate the mother of all flame wars.



the PS2 has the most well-balanced library in every genre with the most choices (first quality and second rate games) for the simple fact that it is the most established system. When the other systems launched, the PS2 finally overcame its poor lineup of titles of the first nine months, and after two holiday seasons the race was over....because of GAMES


And I say it has a rotten library. It did win because of games, games that I consider pretty damn weak.

It won because it had the games that the mass market wants. It has rotten hardware. I feel that the software is largely rotten also.

You say that it has is well balanced with first quality games in every genre. If is your opinion, alright then, but mine opinion is nearly the polar opposite.

I can count the truly worthwhile US RPG's (including strat) on one hand.

There aren't any action RPG's on it that I would touch (and I 've tried. Desperately).

I can count the worthwhile action games on one hand.

It has a few shmups, but only a couple of them are good enough to actually buy IMO, and one is JP only. I have so many better shmups on PCE, Saturn, Megadrive it would be pointless anyway. It might as well have no shmups at all.

VF4 is a step down. I don't care what anyone says. VF2+3 both played much better.

As far as other fighters? Messed up ports of games I already have + Tekken. Tekken is OK for a few minutes now and then, but it's quite disposable.

Platformers. Hmmmm. It actually is pretty decent in that regard, probably my bias against 3D creeping in too much kept me from some of them.

Both other consoles have quality over quantity IMO, but to be honest, I'm not all that thrilled about the current gen.

The last two system libraries that I would really consider good were Saturn and DC. Everything else has just had a few games that I really liked.

I'll admit there are a few PS2 games that I would gladly play if I had them, but they are more secondary and tertiary stuff.

I honestly feel that the first PS had a rather weak library also.

I did have more games for it than I played than for N64, but I was never a Rare fan, so that just leaves a few first party titles on there.

If the PS2 had anything on the level of Zelda:OOT or Mario 64 I would have kept it just for those.

I'm not normally adverse to keeping consoles with poor libraries. I have a Jag and PCFX in plain sight, and I play them relatively often considering their limitations.

But:

1. Those both have a couple games that I consider relatively unique and very playable.
2. The hardware isn't so failure prone.

The last thing about Sony that ticks me off is how they try to make it difficult for people who import. So bah.

Let's leave the Jag out of this. I used it to illustrate a point, but I don't want to start an argument about that thing, or about the the quality/lack-thereof of the ports of Tempest, etc. As for the PCFX, if you've actually played it enough to talk about it feel free to let me know.

I like a significant number of popular games from the old days, and love a few newer ones now and then but these days I find myself dismissing more and more as rubbish.

I think that the game market is just proceeding on a slow march away from what I really want to play.

First the abstraction of the golden age faded away.
Then, as time went by, controls grew to be needlessly complex, 3D games became the standard long before most developers could design/program them worth a damn, and as time went by less and less games actually have a point.

Only a few games on a given systems actually add anything to any genre, and fewer still create new genres/subgenres.

Mass produced rehashes without end.

The characters blend together, the stories, everything.

Gaming as I most cherish it, 2D shmups, 2D platformers, old school RPGs, the stuff Sega made when they weren't so damn high on sequels, and Nintendo also.

Back when Konami actually held up their reputation. When Taito was a real developer. Before Toaplan and Technos bit the dust.

When Squaresoft actually made RPG's and not piles of dung.

Before a nearly perfect console, the last chance, was murdered by Sony and their idiot cronies.

When sometimes Castlevania actually played like Castlevania and the evil specter of Playstation had yet to be born.

There was gaming.

Then there was Sony. And Sony's flash and hype have been devouring what is left ever since.

I refuse to forget what real videogames are, no matter what the aggregate behavior of the masses does to prevent less of them from being made.

I play games, not Sony's damn shadows. That's just how I feel. I didn't set out to become enraged at Sony, it occured slowly over many years.

[DCVision]

However, Sony's value in consumer electronics has been notoriously slipping over the past few years
Show me where their products are going bad. Nobody else is saying that; there's no public outcry over Sony's product quality outside of the PS2 and I argue that's because the standards haven't actually lowered, certainly not in relation to other companies at all. Any "slippage" would be, again, due to the fact that they put out items at high tolerances for relatively little money, but their products perform no worse than those of their competitors.

Products going bad... sorry but I have to step in and say something. My buddy got a mad 5.1 surround sound sony DVD home theatre system about 3 years ago and paid somewhere along the lines of $900 for it. Pure insanity.
The thing got loud... but it was distorted and very touchy.

I picked me up an Onkyo DVD Home Theatre system for $550 about 2 years ago and it absolutely blows Sony's system out of the water. So much as that I would have expected MY setup to run me $900+ and his to run around $400....

Quality is something Sony lost over time. It's as simple as that. They lose focus... they get big and expand... and then hire idiots to assemble their products resulting in flaky crap.

There... I feel better now ;)

You may all return to the thread that will burn in flames... (I got a bucket of water I'm willing to sell for $24.99 shipped, PM me for details ;) LOL )

[PS2Hawk]

I have a SCPH 5501 model big PS1, still looks new & plays perfect.

I have a PS2 SCPH 30001 R model, works awesome..
(its a versin 5)
the SCPH 30001 models, v 1 2 & 3 ps2s were at launch and some had DRE errors.....There was alot of talk about that & I personally believe that people who never even bought/had a PS2 made up shit about their PS2s dying.

I bought my xbox in Dec 2001, like a month later after the launch & every single game is scratched up in the dvd...

Hmm Dreamcast.... yea alot of SEGA fan boys can't seem to let Dreamcast go, I only played Skies of Arcadia & Sword of the Breserk...tried Shenmue thats it ... I think the system wasn't anything special...
if it was it hadn't died in less than 3 years..Its condsidered a FLOP

[Ed Oscuro]

Nope sorry your wrong.

PSX - As I remember sometimes you had to turn it upside down to get the disks to load, it also had other problems such as "not working for no good reason"
Wow, I'm convinced right there. One person's experiences aren't the rule.

Hmm, what about that other early CD-ROM based system, the Saturn? I bought one a while back, and I don't think it works. Hooray. Or another early CD-ROM system - the Neo Geo CD. No great reliability there, and the CDZ apparently makes things even worse. It's not Sony, it's the medium - cheap, we demand it, and we get scratched discs and drives that die. Live with it or buy N64 games (which, incidentally, is the system I bought the most games for). Other than that...I'm not looking to troll here, so I'm going to ignore anything else you say until you say it with a more reasoned tone. Pissy fangirls whining in my ear tend to give me a headache ;)


As much as hate Sony, I admit that some of their products actually have absolutely nothing wrong with them.
Imagine that. If any of the other home entertainment equipment makers were as big as Sony were, you'd definitely find stuff to complain about there as well. With big comes bloat, and with big comes opportunities for small screw-ups or quality failures to become huge scandals. Volume does tend to expose flaws.




The only thing good Sony makes is TVs... no one will argue there.

I will. They are overpriced, overrated. They function. They don't blow up a year after you buy them, but so what.
Have any of you gentlemen used Sony's high-quality monitors recently? I've got a Sony P110, 21-inch monitor rebranded as a Compaq. It's a great piece of hardware, though I haven't had the chance to use it recently.




but do they invent any new formats

Sony doesn't invent anything that impresses me.
Stop and think...does Sony give a rat's ass what you think? Or I think, since we actually think alike on the issue of quality? Better yet, should they? The rest of the world adopted the PlayStation format, and everybody else is still playing the SMS or Dendy ;)




Sony program that pushes the state of the art

They push on people to make them believe their stuff is state of the art.

They just take well established principles up a small step now and then as an excuse to take people's money.
Sony has a knack for taking large, expensive things and making them smaller. Well, they certainly make things small. People like that. If you don't want to give them money...I need not go further.


It doesn't take a genius to figure out that a lower wavelength laser can read data squeezed in tighter.
Sony sold the world's first blue laser DVD recorder. Did you know that the Blu-Ray disc uses a highly advanced form of paper printing? Your "genius" seems underfunded.


And, last time I checked CDs still are inferior to nice vinyl.
Heh, that can be so.


Basically, you have loads of "advances" by a lot of companies that are nothing but the result of taking things that exist (data pressed on to optical discs, transistors), and minaturizing them over and over again.
AND making new products that people want and "need." You can't and shouldn't knock that.


Fix things that ain't broke and the early adopters will fling cash at you.
So, you would have us store our computer programs on vinyl...wait, I got a great one for you, it's The Thompson Twins Adventure Game, in stores never!


When sometimes Castlevania actually played like Castlevania and the evil specter of Playstation had yet to be born.
You can blame Konami - and director Igarashi - for THAT one.


There was gaming.
Speaking of gaming, there was a nice little Neo Geo game released in 1995 that blew me away - Metal Slug. People didn't throw money at it (unless they're trying to collect the home cart version), and last I checked it had taken the Castlevania route of recycling everything - actually, it's even worse than Castlevania. It also appears the only thing that stopped this borrowing was the death of the Neo Geo - for Konami's part, the new 2D Castlevania on the DS looks to be a solidly original, if funky, game with all sorts of new stuff. It'll be on a Nintendo system.


I refuse to forget what real videogames are, no matter what the aggregate behavior of the masses does to prevent less of them from being made.
The hillarious thing here is that the most video-game-like game given a 1st place ranking by 1up.com for their e3 coverage was Ohkami, for the PS2. It looks set to be a classic action game and looks awesome - as much as I like my 2D art, nothing I've seen compares with the easy watercolored grace of this game. It also plays like it should. What was given first for the Xbox? Half-Life 2. What was given first for the GameCube? A new Zelda game featuring an especially slender-jawed Link...frankly, THAT franchise is losing ground to other adventure games. Look at Wind Waker. Nintendo slipped.


I didn't set out to become enraged at Sony, it occured slowly over many years.
It doesn't make one any less blind to progress. Yeah, guys, American cars were SHIT back in the 1970s. Does anybody still think Ford sucks, or Chevy sucks? Aside from car fanboy types, that is.

[Bluteg]

It doesn't make one any less blind to progress. Yeah, guys, American cars were SHIT back in the 1970s. Does anybody still think Ford sucks, or Chevy sucks? Aside from car fanboy types, that is.

Actually you have the car market backwards except for a few import fanboys who think 60's and 70's muscle cars are RWD junk. The average car consumer hold great respect for older domestic cars. NOW only a few domestic fanboys still think that domestic cars are quality. The Chevy Cavalier/Pontiac Sunfire is considered to be the worst dollar value vehicle you can buy with your money by car reviewers everywhere. Even F-Body fans will tell you they are junk. The domestic car name is tainted with unreliability just as much as the Sony name is.

You keep defending Sony Ed, but you've yet to show an example of a good quality Sony product except for the Sony monitors. Which with the dawn of HD is almost a TV. LOL Anyway I've had a Trinitron monitor that lived a full healthy life, a Sony PVM monitor (RGB gaming) and soon to be 2 Sony TVs. I think they are all great products but OUTSIDE of the TV/monitor market but I cannot see how you could be so blind to think Sony = quality.

I don't hate PS2 I'm on my second 39001 model and have a library of around 55 games of which I mostly enjoy. I just cannot equate Sony with quality craftsmanship. I went through two Sony AV recievers which averaged around 18 months each. Now I've had an EQUALLY priced, maybe cheaper... Pioneer AV reciever that works good and has put out good quality sound for 3 years now... Go to ebay and just look at how many broken PS2 consoles are listed

[Ed Oscuro]

Actually you have the car market backwards except for a few import fanboys who think 60's and 70's muscle cars are RWD junk. The average car consumer hold great respect for older domestic cars.
1960s cars? "Unsafe at any speed" created a sensation for a reason. 1970s cars? The Pinto would've been one of the safest cars around, had Ford invested in a $12 part. Other than that, domestic '70s cars would get you water in the trunk, really horrible gas mileage and a host of other problems. People got sick of that real fast. Heh. As for your "horrible imports," I'm aware of the recent scandal with Mitsubishi, but that's pretty much it. Nobody's arguing that domestic cars today aren't great - but so are lots of imports. I'm driving a Hyundai, and that's from Singapore. Not a bad car at all, and gets great mileage for a V6.

I've got nothing against your bucking conventional wisdom; it's just that what you're saying isn't making much sense. While we're on the topic of cars, why not get further adrift and bring up something like FDR's supposed warring policies towards Japan? That seems like the sort of thing right up your alley!

As for a good quality Sony product, there's the original PlayStation again ;) Mine works great, and that probably has something to do with not abusing it.

Back on topic. No, I'm not an apologist for Sony's hardware (if you look at an earlier post of mine, I think you'll see I've backed off my first claims a bit, though I am not the one who shold be backing off). Why is the PlayStation a great system? Because Sony learned from Betamax. They learned you need to have a great library, and they made sure they got it.

[dethink]

"Ah! So consumers don't rike quarity? Fine! PS2, here we come!"
*gong*

LOL LOL LOL

sony stuff was the pants up until the mid 80's/early 90's, no doubt. honestly, i've NEVER had a problem with my PS1 or 2, i think it all comes down to the owner. i think many of the problems with the hardware stem from the fact that many owners treat them like toys, and as such, they are not up to the task of being left on the floor, etc.

the overall mediocrity of their products nowadays and corporate attitude is going to bite them soon, if the mass market catches on to their scheme...but i don't think most people are that smart. when i bought my JVC set to replace my aging mitsubishi, the first question out of anyone's mouth that came over and saw it was "why didn't you get a sony?" don't get me wrong, they make a fine TV, but when i can get equal the picture quality and more features (better speakers, more component inputs) from an equally reputable manufacturer, for almost 2/3 the money simply because it doesn't have the sony name... *sigh*

better example: sony's digital cameras are widely known in the photography world to be competent, but ho-hum devices, yet people snap them up like hotcakes. spend $500 on a sony, and you can probably get equal the camera in a $350 canon, which will take much better pictures, not be tied to silly proprietary memory formats, offer something besides crap JPEG capture, etc.

why do people buy them? well, look at all those fancily named features! "carl zeiss lenses," "memory stick duo pro," lots of fancy sounding acronyms for the same processing features almost every other camera on the market worth it's silicon does...i mean, if you're a clueless consumer, memorizing and pointing out all these trademarked names and acronyms to your equally clueless friends makes you look like a tech wizard. AMAZING!

who wouldn't love looking down their nose at the joneses and saying, "oh...my camera uses the ultra advanced memory stick duo pro."

people love to get into these "mine is better than yours" pissing contests - it's not just for console fanboys. hell, look at ANY forum on the internet that pertains to any kind of product, or a site with product reviews. the best product is whichever one you bought or are making payments on, and is supported by a bunch of mindless drivel and reciting of corporate slogans that seems to have been typed by a monkey, that probably reads something like this:

"WELL I NO MY CIVIC Si ISNT FASTAR TEHN A SUBARU STi BUT IT HAS MOER ADVANCED TEKNOLOGY W/ VTECH!! TURBOES ARE OLD TECH AND ONE DAY VTEK WILL BE FASTER ONCE HONDA UNLEASHES TEH HIDDEN POWER BSIDES I HAVE AN AEM INTAKE ON MY CAR AND IT GIVE ME 30 MOER HP NO ONE NEEDS A CAR WITH AWD UNLESS U LIVE IN SNOW AND TEH INTERIOR IS A POS IN TEH SUBRU NO GIRLZ WILL WANT TO RIDE IN A KAR WITH BLUE SEETS AHAHAHAHAHAHA SO WEN YOUR PASSIN ME & UR GIRLFRIEND IN MY CAR WITH YUOR SUBRU JUST REMEMBER TAHT VTECK > TERBO!!1!1!!!1!!!"

sony knows how to push buttons and package things to appeal to the bulk of our society which seems to be impressed with such things.

the cell seems to be more of this, and while i don't think MS is going to take sony down this generation, i think sony's hype machine is finally going to start taking potshots from the mainstream that fell for them before.

[dethink]

whoops, almost forgot in my longwinded-ness: all these extra multimedia features of the PS3 are going to be novelties just like they've been this gen. the all encompassing "set top box" is a fallacy. does anyone really thing that sony, a company in the business of selling as many electronic devices as possible is going to build an all encompassing machine that does everything (well)? LOL it might have a lot of possible functions, but it's never going to do them well enough to convince anyone with half a brain to chuck the _____ it's trying to replace any time soon. i think MS has done a much better job of expanding the traditional game console outside it's "box" by making the software more flexible (i.e. successful online implementation/integration, customizable sountracks, downloadable/user created content, etc.), and not saying "hey look at this, we have a bunch of ports and stuff on here, that one day might do ____, _____, or ______!" then limiting their use to a few gimmicky applications (eyetoy) that no one cares about.

[Ed Oscuro]

people love to get into these "mine is better than yours" pissing contests - it's not just for console fanboys.
Eh, there aren't as many competitive listeners out there as you might think ;) Or maybe more, but the point is that I don't think "better than" is the reason most people buy brand-names. They buy because of advertising. Heck, look at cereal - people don't buy for the toy inside the box, they buy because it's been advertised (unless, of course, it's Cracker Jack you're talking about...I guess people will put up with that garbage just to get a cheap Popeye tattoo or something).


[i]"WELL I NO MY CIVIC Si ISNT FASTAR TEHN A SUBARU STi BUT IT HAS MOER ADVANCED TEKNOLOGY W/ VTECH!!
VTECH JUST KICKED IN, YO

ROFL

[dethink]

ed -

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v206/drecian/vtecthis.jpg

LOL

[Ed Oscuro]

whoops, almost forgot in my longwinded-ness: all these extra multimedia features of the PS3 are going to be novelties just like they've been this gen. the all encompassing "set top box" is a fallacy. does anyone really thing that sony, a company in the business of selling as many electronic devices as possible is going to build an all encompassing machine that does everything (well)?
If it gives them more market power. They've got power over media, they've got power over content (movies), and a system they make is a system they control. Besides, don't underestimate their ability to invent wireless "necessities," i.e. doo-dads, to go with it. The PS3 isn't a set-top box; it's got a specific set of features and while it's closer to a set-top box and probably could do everything you need, it's not going to replace actual media players any time soon (oh, god, let's hope so). It's not quite the all-singing device they've hyped it up to be. Only fools believe that story.

Oh, and the Sony camera thing had me rolling since I've got one (didn't buy it, though, boy am I spoiled) LOL . I agree, the Carl Zeiss lens is neat but its main feature seems to be the brand name and overall hugeness. 5x zoom is nice, though.

That said, we're talking about consoles. You need more than a team of opticians or sound technicians to make a console. Sony might not have quite what Canon or Kenwood has in their fields, but you don't see Canon or Kenwood putting out game consoles. Why? They simply don't have the momentum or wide-ranging expertise.

[Ed Oscuro]

ed -

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v206/drecian/vtecthis.jpg

LOL
I know, sillybones. I knew somebody would do that, but thank god it was an image macro! LOL

While we're at it, I hear this "aging" process is better than sex.

It works like this:

Input -> NES Contra visuals
output -> Neo Geo Metal Slug visuals!!!

UNFUCKIN' BELIEV'ABL

[dethink]

good thing the PS3 doesn't have VTEC, it would all be over before it even started.

[Bluteg]

As for a good quality Sony product, there's the original PlayStation again ;) Mine works great, and that probably has something to do with not abusing it.

I've still yet to see you find a quality sony product outside of TV/monitors that a majority of the population find to be quality. YOU are in a large MINORITY of owners of 1st gen Playstations that are still working. Not every console owner who had a faulty Playstation "abuses" it as you put. I've know plenty of people who've had playstations crap out on them and take GREAT care of them. They never even moved the damn things and they still overheated and got DREs.


As for your "horrible imports," I'm aware of the recent scandal with Mitsubishi, but that's pretty much it. Nobody's arguing that domestic cars today aren't great - but so are lots of imports.

I've never once said that modern imports are horrible, quite the opposite. People ARE arguing that domestic cars aren't great, in fact many people think they are junk and that is why Toyota and Honda are taking over the car market. Also people got real tired of 60's and 70's cars being leaky, low MPG getting buckets of rust and thats why we can get old classic Mustangs, Chevelles and Chargers for pennies on the dollar. :roll: In fact they are quite expensive because they were quality crafted machines, unlike todays domestic vehicles.


Why is the PlayStation a great system? Because Sony learned from Betamax. They learned you need to have a great library, and they made sure they got it.


The reason Sony got a large amount of 3rd party software is because of Nintendo's cartridge mistake and Sega's shitty marketing. Developers wanted a cheaper format in which Sony had. They stayed with PS2 because of the sucess of the Playstation. 3rd party developers create a large quality library not a hardware manufacturer. Money cannot buy a great library... Microsoft proved this with the Xbox.

[sabre2922]

PS2Hawk have you actually PLAYED a Dreamcast? or do you just name off games that ppl talk about? just wondering ;)

Another thing a gamer doesnt have to "let go" of damn thing thats what Retro gaming is all about; enjoying the "older" game systems from DC to atari2600 or anything before or anything in between.

No offense PS2Hawk but I think you may be more comfortable over at the Gamefaqs forums or IGN forums.

I really dont think you get the jest of what the DP boards are all about.

Yeah there are a lot of ppl on here that do like the Dreamcast and there are many that like the PS2 (I think).
Hell there are gamers that post on here that luv the Vectrex even the 32X thats just the way it is on this board so dont go around posting "get over it" statements like that belong on those OTHER boards.

You see we here at DP share a common interest and (I know it sounds cheesy) LOVE for this hobby therefore we have interest in all that is "old" and new not just what is the most popular with the masses of casual gamers out there.

There are many knowledgeable ppl on here. I learn something new on these boards all the time and I have been a gamer for over 25 years.

It seems as though some dont like these so called "flamewars" but they are much more civilized on here than any other video game board on the net.

I dont mind a good confrontation once in a while sometimes it can be fun.

Also if you want to TRY to talk down on the Dreamcast just go right ahead although I think it may be in vain you just stated "get over" it yet how many posts have you put up talking $hit on the DC? :D

I think much of this has to do with the fact that Sony has burned more than a few gamers here over the last 10 years since the release of PS1 with shoddy hardware and that is a FACT no matter how many post there are stating HEY I HAVE AN OLD PSX THAT STILL WORKS! like its a miracle or something and well I guess it is a miracle LOL

OK im finished with my rant now Im going to go back to my FAN-BOY hide out and devise a plan to bring those corporate dogs to there knees :devilish: :2gunfire: :bareass:

[Captain Wrong]

Where do you guys find the time to write these long ass posts about something that ultimately doesn't matter for shit? I'm just curious because even if I did give a damn about yet another pointless fanboy pissing match I'd have to block off at least half a day to read this one fucking thread.

(Yes, I know, if you don't like it, don't read it. At least someone please come up with a new and original way to tell me to go fuck myself. KTHNKS.)

[Moon Patrol]

Hey! I have a great idea!!!!! Lets all choose sides about which nextgen console is going to be the best, almost a year before they are all released for a tried and true side-by-side comparison??? It'll be great! We can quote all of these news sites and read into some hype that was said on some major television channel, and then bash each other continuously on a forum?

Sounds great? Wait! There's more! Not only will we bash the hell out of each other, but we can race our VTEC honda's too! Oh! So it'll be an equal race, we'll all take off our leet mods on our cars, and put these on it:

http://www.personal.psu.edu/users/a/t/atl126/ricers1.gif

YO YO TUNA SANDWICH!

[Ed Oscuro]

I'm just curious because even if I did give a damn about yet another pointless fanboy pissing match I'd have to block off at least half a day to read this one fucking thread.
I had some free time. But I'd appreciate it if wasn't lumped in with the fanboys.

Ultimately, yes, arguing this is a waste of my time.

[sabre2922]

hey moon patrol I luv that car man it looks like my buddies 1990 lazer :rocker:

[Griking]

http://home.comcast.net/~griking/sucks1.jpg

[Bluteg]

Ed if you put a big Sony vinyl sticker on the back of your Hyundai it will add 30 horsepower and will beat the vettes. LOL

[Nature Boy]

Lets be realistic. 99.999999999999999999999% of the game playing WORLD don't know crap.

And .000000000000000000001% are elitist snobs, is that the point?!?

[Nature Boy]

I'm not sure why Zach is taking such a beating (actually I do...), but I'll chip in and say I'd consider myself a hardcore gamer, and I'm definitely thinking that my one launch day purchase will be a PS3 over a 360.

Pretty much for the reasons Zach listed too. The PSP connectivity doesn't interest me much (as GBA connectivity has done nothing for me so far), but I've been happiest with PS2 this gen (I have 70 games for it, compared to 20 for the GC and 12 for Xbox) and I see no reason I won't be similarly happy with PS3 long term. I know I won't use the backwards compatibility much, but when I do use it I'll love it...

[bargora]

Help me Captain Wrong, you're my only hope!

Help me Captain Wrong, you're my only hope!

Help me Captain Wrong, you're my only hope!

[badinsults]

I find it funny how people keep saying that Sony products are manufactured poorly. Have you never tried playing an old toaster NES?

As for the anti-Chinese made sentiment, get used to it. If people want the US to have trade with other countries, it should play fair.

As for the next generation consoles, the speculation by the uninformed disgusts me. Really, who is to say which console will be the best? There are hardly any games announced for any of them. Besides, about half of all gamers (at least in the US) only care about the latest sports games, Halos and GTAs. Most people don't care about other games. I predict that nothing will change in the next generation.