How many times Nintendo shot themselves in foot on purpose?

[Sylentwulf]

How many times has Nintendo shot themselves in the foot on purpose? Keep the initial explanation to one sentance plz. Then you can rant and rave all ya want after that :)

Released special component cables for the gamecube that included special chip in cable, driving prices up, and only first party. Then removed component support from gamecube saying "see we told you noone wanted HD support"

Released the broadband adapter, with virtually no official support, games, or anything else, then said "see, noone wants online play"

Declined Sony's CD support on the SNES, then released another cart based system. (I don't believe they actually had the balls to say "see I told you so on this one"


I'm sure there's more.

[suppafly]

When they didnt choose a CD medium for N64...

[Gemini-Phoenix]

Released the VirtualBoy - "See, told you no one want's colour"

(Relating to how Lynx's, Game Gears, and PC Engine GT were all colour, and the GameBoy was still monochrome! They then superceeded it with a console with even less colours!)

[ubersaurus]

Virtual Boy - "See, told you no one want's colour" ]

(Relating to how Lynx's, Game Gears, and PC Engine GT were all colour, and the GameBoy was still monochrome! They then superceeded it with a console with even less colours!)

Yes, I'm sure glad you had the 700+ bucks to shell out for a color VB unit.

[Mayhem]

Released special component cables for the gamecube that included special chip in cable, driving prices up, and only first party. Then removed component support from gamecube saying "see we told you noone wanted HD support"

And thereby reducing the cost of the base machine for the vast majority of people buying a Gamecube (95%+) who would not be using the component port of the machine.

That's the logic. Same reason the power supply is on the outside; makes it easier to change if it blows.

[TeddyRuxpin]

It's so easy to beat down Nintendo for choices you disagree with. It's not as if other companies haven't made poor choices either. So what if Nintendo did poorly with VirtualBoy? Seems to me it's doing fairly well in the resale market [read: ebay].

On the subject of HD in general, it's NOT a standard yet. And it wouldn't BE a standard for about 10 more years if not for the industy FORCING it down everyone's throats. In case some here haven't heard, by the end of 2007 (as I recall) in USA all Network and Cable broadcasts will HAVE to be in HD thanks to a broadcasting law that will go into effect. Where does that leave "old fashion" TV owners? With a black bar on the top and bottom of their screens. Like I said, forcing it down people's throats.

My 27" TV works fine. I don't need a TV with a SMALLER SCREEN that costs 3 TIMES AS MUCH to enjoy TV or games. So what if it displays like a PC monitor and is the form of a movie screen? I don't like having the "new standard" forced down my throat. :grrr:

[le geek]

I'll state it here as well. I do not care AT ALL that the Nintendo is not supporting HD. IMO, if you are a gamer first, videophile second YOU shouldn't care either.

Period.

Now that's just my opinion though, so I'll let y'all have at it.

More on topic, I don't think they have INTENTIONALLY screwed up, I mean who would do that unless they were Zero Mostel or Gene Wilder? But in hindsight, the N64 should have been a CD based system, sure. Then FInal Fantasy VII would have stayed on Nintendo.

Cheers,
Ben

[Jumpman Jr.]

Only one thing bothers me about all the Nintendo's:


Lets create a HUGE end to the power supply on the N64.


That thing doens't make sense to me at all. Its so hard to store.
Ah well. I love the NES, SNES and N64... so I'm not complaining that much.

[-hellvin-]

I think their biggest mistake of all time is creating the playstation. If they just stuck with a cd format for the 64....who knows, maybe the psx would have never existed. Nintendo to me, seems too focused on whoring their franchises. They just do not care about things like HD video. For some reason they have it in their head that no one really cares about hooking up their systems to a nice component connection, they'll just settle for standard A/V. =\

I was really excited about the Revolution until I heard it would not have any kind of HD support. Now I don't even know if I'll be buying one.

[Sylentwulf]

Guess I worded this badly, I'm talking about decisions that nintendo made that were very odd. Releaseing an item with absolutley no support, or games, and a high cost, then basically blaming it on the gamers, developers, and everyone else when said item didn't sell well at all. IE the online adapters, virtual boy, component cables for the GC, etc....

Making the component cables cost $35 is ludicrous. They cost less than $10 for any other system.

And re - Teddy, they just moved the date for that up even further, march 2006 I believe, welcome to the damned 21st century. You can throw out your black and white TV too now. Might as well throw in that am/8-track radio in your car as well.

[Gamereviewgod]

With a black bar on the top and bottom of their screens. Like I said, forcing it down people's throats.

I'm betting you're watching movies "full screen" too. Not good, not good at all.

[poopnes]

IIn case some here haven't heard, by the end of 2007 (as I recall) in USA all Network and Cable broadcasts will HAVE to be in HD thanks to a broadcasting law that will go into effect.

I believe its only over-the-air broadcasts that have to be HD. They're just trying to free up some of the radio bandwith that regular TV is hogging up.

[TeddyRuxpin]

I'm betting you're watching movies "full screen" too. Not good, not good at all.

I have nothing against letterbox movies. In fact I prefer them. However, that is isn't the TV standard. The wide screen format has been around since the 40's (and maybe the 30's and before?). As a widespread consumer electronic, the TV popped up around 1950-1952, many years after many widescreen formats were around.

What HD is doing is basically making everything that isn't HD obsolete and less appealing.

This is like if they adopted a new frequencey for broadcast radio, and forced the FM stations to send out mono sound that works in one side of the balance on stereo radios. That would be pretty annoying, wouldn't it? Wearing stereo headphones and having mono sound come out of one side.

Sure, your FM radio would still work and you'd still get to hear music but it would be very annoying since you already bought the FM radio that worked fine as it was. But now there's an expensive new radio that picks up a different frequencey that you're being bullied into buying it because of limitations being put on your FM radio.

[Ed Oscuro]

As somebody mentioned in the Revolution w/o HD thread, the new regulations force all carriers to switch to a digital signal, not high-def resolutions, unless you say 480p is hi-def LOL

[TeddyRuxpin]

As somebody mentioned in the Revolution w/o HD thread, the new regulations force all carriers to switch to a digital signal, not high-def resolutions, unless you say 480p is hi-def LOL

I was told [suspicously by someone trying to sell me an HDTV] that it was HD, not digital. I guess that should be a clue that maybe he was wrong.. x_x

[Ed Oscuro]

Well, here's an interesting read - recent too. I'm just learning about this, too.

http://hdtvtechno.netfirms.com/dtv-mandate.htm

[Sylentwulf]

This is like if they adopted a new frequencey for broadcast radio, and forced the FM stations to send out mono sound that works in one side of the balance on stereo radios. That would be pretty annoying, wouldn't it? Wearing stereo headphones and having mono sound come out of one side.

Sure, your FM radio would still work and you'd still get to hear music but it would be very annoying since you already bought the FM radio that worked fine as it was. But now there's an expensive new radio that picks up a different frequencey that you're being bullied into buying it because of limitations being put on your FM radio.

Um..... AM? FM? XM? Any of this sound familiar to you? When was the last time you tuned in to a rip roaring time on 1380 AM on your radio?

[Flack]

Boy this thread's really making the Nintendo fans squirm, isn't it? LOL

[JJNova]

Yesterday, driving to work actually. Well, not AM, but I was bumping Oldies 96.3 the whole way there, and the whole way back. It's a typical thing I do on Monday - Saturday mornings. I sleep in on my one day off though.

[Gamereviewgod]

I have nothing against letterbox movies. In fact I prefer them. However, that is isn't the TV standard. The wide screen format has been around since the 40's (and maybe the 30's and before?). As a widespread consumer electronic, the TV popped up around 1950-1952, many years after many widescreen formats were around.

No, it was the other way aorund. Widescreen was first used in 1953's The Robe (useless knowledge? Yep). Widescreen was created specifically because of TV. Movie studios were losing share to the TV market.


What HD is doing is basically making everything that isn't HD obsolete and less appealing.

But you said that was because of widescreen, yet you have no problem with letterboxing films. If that's your main complaint, isn't it hypocritical?

And did you argue when the SNES replaced the NES? The Playstation repleced by the PS2? Same situation. Everything becomes obsolete eventually, and with games, it happens every few years. This TV standard has been around for LONG time. It's time to finally move on.

[TeddyRuxpin]

[quote=TeddyRuxpin]Um..... AM? FM? XM? Any of this sound familiar to you? When was the last time you tuned in to a rip roaring time on 1380 AM on your radio?

For the most part AM is included in radios with FM radios. XM isn't faising out FM. Why? XM costs a lot more than AM/FM radios.



But you said that was because of widescreen, yet you have no problem with letterboxing films. If that's your main complaint, isn't it hypocritical?

And did you argue when the SNES replaced the NES? The Playstation repleced by the PS2? Same situation. Everything becomes obsolete eventually, and with games, it happens every few years. This TV standard has been around for LONG time. It's time to finally move on.

It boils down to the poor way the transition is going. Instead of forcing the HDTV owners to either get special cable or satellite HDTV service like they SHOULD be doing until the cost of HDTVs goes down at LEAST 50% instead of punishing the people who own the STANDARD in TVs.

The TV standard has changed many times. Look up early TV ads. Many had ROUND screens in the late 40's/early 50's. Then they went to the more familiar square. And then color TVs became popular around 1960. And then cable TV became widely popular in the late 70's/early 80's, etc.

SNES replacing NES isn't a fair example. A game system such as NES or SNES has one function, games. And besides, an "obsolete" game system never changes it's form. It stays just as it was made. Changing your game system shouldn't mean you should have to replace your TV.

Think about what Atari did for the 2600. They included a switch so it's official games had support for both color and black & white TVs.

We can discuss this forever but the fact remains, owners of non-HD are being bullied into buying HDTV's when the prices are still sky high.

[Ed Oscuro]

The TV standard has changed many times. Look up early TV ads. Many had ROUND screens in the late 40's/early 50's.
http://www.area31.org/robs1.html for an illustration of what he means. The picture itself - if I'm tracking correctly - wasn't round, though. That's just the shape of the viewing glass. The picture was still the same NTSC standard. I don't see how the format has changed many times - I see the early definition, and then the late '53 adoption of guidelines for color. What else?

[evildead2099]

Declined Sony's CD support on the SNES, then released another cart based system. (I don't believe they actually had the balls to say "see I told you so on this one"

I once held similar thoughts toward Nintendo in that regard until I learned that Nintendo's partnership with $ony to create a CD-ROM upgrade for the SNES/Super Famicom meant that Nintendo no longer had a monopoly over that system's distributive media (With the NES & SNES, game developers were subject to Nintendo's scrutiny and censorship as they appealed for blank, licensed NES cartridges to transfer game data to for selling games in the commercial market). CD-ROMs, unlike NES cartridges, were and continue to be a standard format for media distribution.

I'm not saying that I approve of Nintendo's decision to stick with cartridges. Cartridges, as I'm sure you're aware, are expensive and have a weaker storage capacity than CD-ROMs. I am not pleased by Nintendo's decision to do what made them the most money instead of doing what consumers demanded - but, in the Big N's defense, the company was just 'looking out for number one,' doing "business as usual."

[evildead2099]

Released special component cables for the gamecube that included special chip in cable, driving prices up, and only first party. Then removed component support from gamecube saying "see we told you noone wanted HD support"

And thereby reducing the cost of the base machine for the vast majority of people buying a Gamecube (95%+) who would not be using the component port of the machine.

That's the logic. Same reason the power supply is on the outside; makes it easier to change if it blows.

That's a good point.

[evildead2099]

On the subject of HD in general, it's NOT a standard yet. And it wouldn't BE a standard for about 10 more years if not for the industy FORCING it down everyone's throats.

It's also not yet a standard because North America has generally been slow to adopt it. I generally agree with you, though: the fair thing to do would be to offer people the option to receive either regular or HD signals until HD televisions become affordable and commonplace. If HD isn't affordable by the time it, as you say, becomes forced upon television subscribers, my cable company stands to lose at least one customer (that being myself).

[TeddyRuxpin]

I mostly watch old TV programs so HDTV/widescreen TV would be a waste for me.

This thread has been about how Nintendo has ignored HDTV support and other "older" mechs such as monochrome gameboy for so long, the colorless virtualboy, using carts in N64, etc.

While it's true that Nintendo has done some things that might not have been the best choice but at the same time, they try to stay affordable and appealing to the masses without trying to be the best.

Think about the Nintendo DS vs PSP. Sure, PSP has better graphics, good titles and many other features .... but it also costs twice as much!

Sure, they milked monochrime gameboy dry, but look how poorly the more expensive, more powerful systems color did in contrast, due to battery life and/or weak titles.

The Atari Lynx was the most powerful handheld for 12 years (1989-2001) until GameBoy Advance came out. Yet it did miserabley due to lack of good titles. And then there's GameGear with Sonic games and had a TV attachment! And it didn't do that well due to poor battery life. (And it uses 6 AA's!!)

Don't get me wrong, I'm not bad mouthing these less sucessful handhelds. I own a GameGear and a VirtualBoy and enjoy them very much. ;) My point is the most powerful doesn't always equal the best.

The idea of movies in PSP disc format boggles the mind when portable DVD players are down to $100 at Wal-Mart as everyday prices. Seems wasteful to buy PSP movies. DVD players are going to be around longer than PSP most likely. Unless you plan to use PSP for most of your movie viewing I think it's a waste of money.

Where as GBA video carts make a little more sense and are more affordable all around. The sytem costs a fraction that PSP costs and is cart based. And as we all know cart systems last a lot longer than CD systems since there's typically no moving parts to have conk out.

[GarrettCRW]

The problem with the shift to HDTV is that a number of Neo-Cons (and the various broadcasters who are currently forced to simulcast their programming) are trying to enforce a hard switch-over date, which would force millions of consumers to either buy a converter box or an extremely expensive new TV. At present, the switch-over becomes final when 85% of the country has HDTVs (the chances of this happening by the end of next year are basically zero). Given that your average family replaces its TV only when their current one breaks down (which even for crummy TVs can be years), no one's expecting that 85% to happen anytime soon. Which displeases a number of companies to no end.

[evildead2099]

The Atari Lynx was the most powerful handheld for 12 years (1989-2001) until GameBoy Advance came out.

That's not true if you count the Neo Geo Pocket Colour (and possibly the original Neo Geo Pocket) which hit Japan in 98 and USA in 99.

[poopnes]

The Atari Lynx was the most powerful handheld for 12 years (1989-2001) until GameBoy Advance came out.

That's not true if you count the Neo Geo Pocket Colour (and possibly the original Neo Geo Pocket) which hit Japan in 98 and USA in 99.

Seems everyone's forgetting the Nomad. And I'd say that the Wonderswan was more powerful too.

[CRV]

Seems everyone's forgetting the Nomad. And I'd say that the Wonderswan was more powerful too.

Excluding portable versions of existing consoles, I would have believed the Lynx was the most powerful until the GBA, too. I'll gladly retract that if someone can get me some specs showing the Wonderswan and NGP were more powerful (which I find hard to believe).

[TeddyRuxpin]

That's not true if you count the Neo Geo Pocket Colour (and possibly the original Neo Geo Pocket) which hit Japan in 98 and USA in 99.

Seems everyone's forgetting the Nomad. And I'd say that the Wonderswan was more powerful too.

I guess I stand corrected. I could have swore the Lynx was though. But even still, the fact remains that monochrome GameBoy outsold the better, more powerful color units. I didn't forget the nomad exactly. Since it's a portable version of a console I left it out.

[TeddyRuxpin]

Excluding portable versions of existing consoles, I would have believed the Lynx was the most powerful until the GBA, too. I'll gladly retract that if someone can get me some specs showing the Wonderswan and NGP were more powerful (which I find hard to believe).

Atari Lynx specs:
http://www.cyberiapc.com/vgg/atari_lynx.htm

Wonderswan specs:
http://www.cyberiapc.com/vgg/wonderswan.htm

NeoGeo Pocket/Color specs:
http://www.cyberiapc.com/vgg/neogeo_pocket.htm

[Sylentwulf]

Seems like everyone is forgetting a LOT of handhelds.... TG express was more powerful than any of them, and had a great library

[TeddyRuxpin]

Seems like everyone is forgetting a LOT of handhelds.... TG express was more powerful than any of them, and had a great library

Again, a portable based on an existing console like Nomad.

[evildead2099]

The Atari Lynx was the most powerful handheld for 12 years (1989-2001) until GameBoy Advance came out.

That's not true if you count the Neo Geo Pocket Colour (and possibly the original Neo Geo Pocket) which hit Japan in 98 and USA in 99.

Seems everyone's forgetting the Nomad.

Forgot about the Nomad have I not; I didn't mention it because the Nomad is actually a console that Sega managed to squeeze down and slap a small display upon. Same goes for NEC and its Turbo Express handheld (based on the TG 16).

Hmm... According to those specs TeddyRuxpin provided links to, the Atari Lynx is more than twice as fast as the Neo Geo Pocket in terms of how many megahertz its processor is designed to handle. I guess it is I who stands corrected. My apologies for the erroneous statement that I made; it only seemed logical to assume that a handheld which came so many years after the Atari Lynx would be at least as powerful (if not moreso) than its predecessor.

Good call on the Wonderswan, though. However, the Wonderswan, like the Neo Geo Pocket (And Neo Geo Pocket Colour, unfortunately), never really caught on in North America... Too much damn Pokemon-mania stealing the spotlight away from such worthy and powerful handhelds :angry:

[Raedon]

And thereby reducing the cost of the base machine for the vast majority of people buying a Gamecube (95%+) who would not be using the component port of the machine.

That's the logic. Same reason the power supply is on the outside; makes it easier to change if it blows.

That is like saying, "no digital audio out" I think everyone could have used a digital audio port by now but noooo. Just because I don't have an HDTV I will some day and support would have been nice.

Like the Top Loader being well designed up until the stripes and the no AV out or the lack of S-Video support on the SNES Jr. I wouldn't have cared about those "cost saving" features back then but I care now.

[Ed Oscuro]

Hmm... According to those specs TeddyRuxpin provided links to, the Atari Lynx is more than twice as fast as the Neo Geo Pocket in terms of how many megahertz its processor is designed to handle.
It has far fewer colors (16/"scanline") and a smaller screen 160x~100) than the NGPC, though in terms of processing power it seems to have an edge (that's always nice).


Too much damn Pokemon-mania stealing the spotlight away from such worthy and powerful handhelds :angry:
Good games > Good hardware.

[evildead2099]

Too much damn Pokemon-mania stealing the spotlight away from such worthy and powerful handhelds :angry:
Good games > Good hardware.

I agree that Good games > Good hardware, and that's why I used the word "damn" to refer to Pokemon-mania; I find most console-style RPGs lame in general, and Pokemon is definately no exception to that preference (Give me an RPG that actually challenges me enough to THINKthroughout the course of its many battles, like the Fallout series or Shining Force!). Other than the Nintendo's franchise games (Zelda, Mario, Kirby, etc), the Gameboy library is comparable to the PS1 in terms of abundant crap (much of which is based on movie / television licenses). Although it boasts a smaller library, most of the Neo Geo Pocket's games are at least halfway decent.

[Ed Oscuro]

Pokemon still was a good game; it might not have been up your alley, that's all.

[Poofta!]

nintendo, my friends, has rocket propelled grenades mounted to its thighs to ensure the most quick and efficient way of blowing its feet away.


-third party policy - n64 :hmm:
-cart medium - n64 :(
-screw over sony - snes LOL
-virtual boy (reseller market doesnt help the company, virtual boy is a dud and everyone knows it) :embarrassed:
-no dvd playback - GC @_@
-no real online support to speak of - GC x_x
-color/aesthetic design - GC :eek 2:
-DS (there are like 5 games worth playing, and they are all the same. thanks for nothing. what a waste of my money that was) :roll:

did i miss anything?

[Ed Oscuro]

Yeah, actually...GameCube has both 56K and broadband modem options.

[Raedon]

"Gotta' catch 'em all!" kept Nintendo alive to this day as I see it. I think the money made from that is allowing Nintendo to make more hardware mistakes.

If they would stop putting all the money into hardware and just support their money maker software on other hardware everything will be fine.

A world without a new Zelda game every few years would be a sad place.

[Poofta!]

Yeah, actually...GameCube has both 56K and broadband modem options.

uh huh... and how many games support that? or how many games you actually wanna play? better yet -- how many games that are online enabled on the ps2 and xbox?

how many first party games?

[evildead2099]

Pokemon still was a good game; it might not have been up your alley, that's all.

I may have referred to Pokemon as a "damn" game, but I never said it was a 'bad' game - I merely categorized it as I categorize any other console-style RPG whose gameplay feels repetitive and totally braindead to me. The simple fact of the matter is that I generally do not prefer console-style RPGs, but I admit that fans of console-style RPGs could have a great time with Pokemon. I'm just a little jealous that Pokemon outsold Fallout by such a wide margin.

[Satac]

-DS (there are like 5 games worth playing, and they are all the same. thanks for nothing. what a waste of my money that was) :roll:

There are some great games - Nintendogs, Daigasso Band Brothers and Meteos are out now. And there are some nice looking games announced: New Mario Bros. , Castlevania DS, Mario Karts DS (supporting Onlineplay), Mario & Luigi 2, Advance Wars DS, Metroid Prime Hunters and Nanostray.
So don't judge the DS on the current titels, all consoles had few launch titles.

[CreamSoda]

Yeah, actually...GameCube has both 56K and broadband modem options.

That's true, but Phantasy Star gets old after awhile... LOL

[Ed Oscuro]

Yeah, actually...GameCube has both 56K and broadband modem options.

That's true, but Phantasy Star gets old after awhile... LOL
I hear FFXI isn't amazingly better in that regard ;)

[Sylentwulf]

I hear FFXI isn't amazingly better in that regard ;)

This in reference to the PS2 online capabilities and games? PS2 probly has more online games than the gamecube has offline games....

[Algol]

It's easy to see how Nintendo could have believed the world wasn't "ready" for CD games when you realize that neither the Sega CD, nor Turbografx CD, nor Amiga CD32, nor Turbo Duo, nor 3DO, nor CD-i had exactly set the world on fire. Although it probably would have been better if they had gone with Sony, of course.

I'm a bit surprised no one has mentioned the e-Reader yet. Interesting idea, but they hardly did anything to support it once they got it running. :hmm:

And of course, you have Nintendo "confirming" the Revolution's Virtual Console will be free, only to unconfirm it a few weeks later.