Awaited for games Suck according to EGM

[Cmtz]

Well, I just got the new EGM and here are the scores.

GEIST = 4.5 6.0 5.5
Batman = 6.0 5.0 5.0
Fantastic 4 = 6.0 4.0 7.0
Sonic Gems = 6.5 5.5 6.5
Death, Jr. = 4.5 4.0 6.0

However ADVANCE WARS: DUAL STRIKE = 9.0 8.5 9.0

[davepesc]

Tough break about Death Jr. PSP needs more than emulation to make it.

As for the others, Movie games = teh suck.

I don't know much about the others to comment, but let me be the first to post the standard disclaimer about taking reviews with a grain of salt.

And I don't know if you are implying a bias with the Advance Wars score, but the first 2 games were great, so I'm not surprised that the follow-up is good as well.

[pacmanhat]

I wasn't expecting much from Geist...it just never looked that good (that's what it gets for not getting out before Halo 2, Half-Life 2, TimSplitters 3, and so on). But Death Jr.'s score is definitely disappointing. I had high hopes for that one.

[TheRedEye]

I call bologna, Death Jr. is lots of fun.

[PDorr3]

I was looking forward to Death JR, I will probably buy it once it can be had for cheap used at EB or something.

Also I dont care how low of a score sonic gems collections gets, I'm still getting that game! :-P

[Ridley30]

Yeah, but did you see the surprise rating of the new Hulk game???

HULK: 9.0, 7.0, 9.0

Who the f*** expected that one?

[s1lence]

I'm still going to get Death Jr, since just about everything else on the PSP is worse.

[TheRedEye]

Who the f*** expected that one?

Ooh, I did! I did! The reason being is that this is more or less the first superhero game to do what I've been saying they should do all along: ignore any kind of comic book/movie/cartoon/whatever continuity, and make a new VIDEOGAME continuity. It was so well-received that Marvel is doing a Hulk comic as a spin-off from this game. Pretty neat, huh?

[kevincure]

Did the new EGM really just arrive? The electronic version was out over a week ago! Maybe I won't switch back to print...

[Cmtz]

This one arrived kinda late for some reason they usually arrive 5 days before I got this one. This is the first time it happens.

[Famidrive-16]

Gems has Sonic CD right? I remember the EGM review of Mega Collection and they gave it a decent score, alos saying they would've given it higher if it had CD. Guess there's something screwey with Gems?

[roushimsx]

As for the others, Movie games = the suck.

You must not have ever played Bladerunner on PC. Amazing point n click adventure game that built on the source material and expanded the world of it. I miss Westwood.


Gems has Sonic CD right? I remember the EGM review of Mega Collection and they gave it a decent score, alos saying they would've given it higher if it had CD. Guess there's something screwey with Gems?

Or there's something screwy with EGM, which is far more likely. I don't really expect much in the way of consistancy when it comes to game magazines anymore, though.

[Cmosfm]

Gems has Sonic CD right? I remember the EGM review of Mega Collection and they gave it a decent score, alos saying they would've given it higher if it had CD. Guess there's something screwey with Gems?

Yeah there's something screwey.

Only 3 games, shitty Vectorman instead of Streets Of Rage & all those damn Game Gear games.....again.

Yeah, I don't like Vectorman, sue me.

The only thing that makes me want to buy it is Sonic Fighters, I'd have preordered if it had uncut original Streets Of Rage games and the original soundtrack on Sonic CD though. I have Sonic CD & Sonic R already.

1 subpar game I want on a collection does not make a purchase for me, I'll buy it when it hits 10.00.

[Lady Jaye]

I've said it before, I'll say it again (sorry for sounding like a parrot), but you can't decide the worth of a game based on one review only. That's why I consult Metacritic.com for those reviews, since it compiles the scores from various sources and makes out an average out of it.

For instance, here's the score (out of 100) for Death Jr. so far:
90 - Play Magazine
75 - PSM Magazine
50 - Official US Playstation Magazine
48 - EGM

As you can see, it's a bit early to determine whether this game is good or not, but it already seems like people either love it or hate it.

Oh, and Nintendo Power gave 85 to Sonic Gems.

[klausien]

The only thing that makes me want to buy it is Sonic Fighters, I'd have preordered if it had uncut original Streets Of Rage games and the original soundtrack on Sonic CD though. I have Sonic CD & Sonic R already.

1 subpar game I want on a collection does not make a purchase for me, I'll buy it when it hits 10.00.

Just import it! I know I will. Takes care of all the issues, and remember, it includes Bare Knuckle 3, which was horribly torn up when we got it. Worth the extra dough to skip on paying the bill for a copy of BN 3.

[SamuraiSmurfette]

For instance, here's the score (out of 100) for Death Jr. so far:
90 - Play Magazine

That has to be taken with a grain of salt. If the game in review involves jumping & collecting, Play pretty much gives an A+. No offence, it'a great read, but their blind love of platformers can get kinda silly.

[Neil Koch]

Yeah, I don't like Vectorman, sue me.

I never liked Vectorman either... nice graphics, but a boring game IMO.

I knew Batman Begins was going to be shitty and apparently EA did as well, since they didn't send out any pre-release review copies to game sites/magazines.

Fantastic Four I can also believe is crap -- just look at the source material :D

I played a bit of Death Jr and it was fun, but I could see how it become repetitive.

[NintendoMan]

Well, I just got the new EGM and here are the scores.

GEIST = 4.5 6.0 5.5
However ADVANCE WARS: DUAL STRIKE = 9.0 8.5 9.0

NO way Geist got that low! That sucks! For me anyways, I have been looking forward to this game for a while. Wasnt it suppossed to be some "BIG" fps game with aspects in it that nobody has ever done before.
But I am very surprised since it's a Nintendo published game!

On the other hand, it's good to hear such a high score for Advance Wars!
When did you get the issue in, I must be getting mine either tomorrow or saturday then, hopefully!

[Half Japanese]

Well, I just got the new EGM and here are the scores.

GEIST = 4.5 6.0 5.5
Batman = 6.0 5.0 5.0
Fantastic 4 = 6.0 4.0 7.0
Sonic Gems = 6.5 5.5 6.5
Death, Jr. = 4.5 4.0 6.0

However ADVANCE WARS: DUAL STRIKE = 9.0 8.5 9.0


Here's my take on a couple of those, and you know it's a great opinion since I've never played a single one of them:

GEIST: You could watch the demo for this on Gamecube kiosks and know it was going to be smelly. It honestly looks like crap with very little original to offer. Plus, graphics-wise it looked like a budget title.

FANTASTIC FOUR: Really? Who thought this was going to be a winner? When you look at the lineage, the last Fantastic Four game sucked, the movie sucked, so the game really had no chance of being anything more than a cash-in.

DEATH JR.: The thing that got on my nerves with this one, from all the previews I read is how it was designed to be a franchise from the start, with tshirts, comic books and other shi...swag cluttering Hot Topic stores in malls across America. It takes more than good character design to make a decent game. Also, why in the hell would anyone make a game with the grim reaper where you use guns instead of the scythe? You might as well make Chuck Norris & the Karate Commandos Macaroni Cookoff Challenge. (I realize you can use the scythe too, but I think Indiana Jones summed up that particular arguement quite effectively).

[PDorr3]

in a nutshell, what are the main complaints death jr is getting? I need a new game for psp and I had high hopes for this one. I like platformers, but I might not like this if it is too heavily reliant on shooting guns.

[RCM]

Play the games and judge for yourself. Hopefully bad reviews won't fuck with the sale of great games but it happens. EGM is by far the worst magazine on the planet. They suck and don't know it, amazing.

EDIT: Oh yeah, Sean Baby deserves ass rape for eternity.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

[Sothy]

If I get really really drunk I can mispell things exactly so it looks like CMTZ is typing sober.

Honestly you cannot just mimmick it. There is something sublime involved. Perhaps genious... or insanity.

[Lady Jaye]

For instance, here's the score (out of 100) for Death Jr. so far:
90 - Play Magazine

That has to be taken with a grain of salt. If the game in review involves jumping & collecting, Play pretty much gives an A+. No offence, it'a great read, but their blind love of platformers can get kinda silly.

Maybe, but the point I was making is that you can't rely on only one review to gauge whether a game is good or not. And I did say that there weren't enough reviews of Death Jr. to draw any conclusions from the reviews. In any case, RCM is right: the best way remains to play the game ourselves. That way we can figure out whether WE like the game or not, regardless of what reviewers think.

[Cmosfm]

FANTASTIC FOUR: Really? Who thought this was going to be a winner? When you look at the lineage, the last Fantastic Four game sucked, the movie sucked, so the game really had no chance of being anything more than a cash-in.

The one thing that has annoyed me about this game so far is the commercials that show NOTHING BUT CUT SCENES!

It screams "HEY THE GRAPHICS AND GAMEPLAY SUCK BUT LOOK GUYS PRETTY PICTURES!!!!"

And the sad thing was, the cutscenes they show in the commercials are utterly shitty, bottom barrel 1st Gen. Stuff.

[joshnickerson]

EGM is still around?

[petewhitley]

EGM is still around?

People still read EGM? Here's the thing that gripes me about gaming magazines, and someone in the industry (i.e. Zach) correct me if I'm wrong, is that they're usually reviewing non-finished versions of games in order to get the reviews to press on-time.
Now, that's not to say they can't get a damn good idea of how a title will play out from a pre-gold version. But with several quality internet sites (I consider Gamespot to be a quality site, you can choose whatever suits your tastes) regularly reviewing fully finished gold versions of games, I have to question the role of the print media in terms of valid gaming reviews these days. I read a couple of print mags, but not for their reviews specifically. I purchase OXM/OPM for the demo discs. I purchase Play for the beautiful pictures. I purchase Barely Legal for other reasons. But the point being, I go to internet sites these days for release date reviews, and I can't help but question how reliable an EGM review is of a game which was without question unfinished at the time of their write-up.

[Lothars]

EGM is still around?

unfortunatly I mean the magazine is horrible now,

though I will say I did enjoy the 3 console look it did for the ps3,xbox360 and revolution, it was interesting

but i never trust egm reviews they are as bad as the magazine itself and the magazine is blah

[Lothars]

sorry double post

[Griking]

Damn double posts. Wasn't there a filter installed here to prevent this from happening?

[Griking]

Why are people so defensive that these games got bad reviews? It seems like people are just defending theit console loyalties. Isn't it possible that the games actually do suck?

[Cmtz]

What's up with the double post!

[Cmtz]

What's up with the double post!

[SoulBlazer]

Very good point.

In the old days, magazines could wait until they got a finished copy of a game to review it, because there was no Internet. By the time you got the magazine with the reviews, sure, they were 2-3 months after the game came out, but no one minded much. By then you knew SOMEONE who had bought the game or product and could talk to them about it, and then compare it to the review.

Not with the Internet that's all changed. Online sites like Gamespot are sent finished copies just as they start being produced at the factory, which means that they will get their full online review out just in time for the release of the game. Insant news and information. Magazines can't compete. By the time THEY get their review out, due to the lead in time, it's too late.

That's a big reason why I don't read gaming magazines anymore, and why I turn to sites like Gamespot for reviews.

What magazines SHOULD do is just do PREVIEWS. Try to scoop the online sites by using their contacts to publish secret information and what not. If they time it right, you'll get the info on the game just as it's ready to be released, which can be a BIG help in determing if you should buy it at launch day or wait.

Print magazines are fast becoming obsolete anyway. :hmm:

[RCM]

EGM is still around?

People still read EGM? Here's the thing that gripes me about gaming magazines, and someone in the industry (i.e. Zach) correct me if I'm wrong, is that they're usually reviewing non-finished versions of games in order to get the reviews to press on-time.
Now, that's not to say they can't get a damn good idea of how a title will play out from a pre-gold version. But with several quality internet sites (I consider Gamespot to be a quality site, you can choose whatever suits your tastes) regularly reviewing fully finished gold versions of games, I have to question the role of the print media in terms of valid gaming reviews these days. I read a couple of print mags, but not for their reviews specifically. I purchase OXM/OPM for the demo discs. I purchase Play for the beautiful pictures. I purchase Barely Legal for other reasons. But the point being, I go to internet sites these days for release date reviews, and I can't help but question how reliable an EGM review is of a game which was without question unfinished at the time of their write-up.

They review full versions of games. Reviewing an incomplete version would defeat the purpose.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

[petewhitley]

They review full versions of games. Reviewing an incomplete version would defeat the purpose.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

I near 100% certain that is not the case, hence my post.

[RCM]

They review full versions of games. Reviewing an incomplete version would defeat the purpose.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

I near 100% certain that is not the case, hence my post.

I'm 100% certain you're wrong. Although there have been cases of magazines reviewing unfinished versions of games. But as a rule for movie reviews, music, book, game, etc. they review complete versions.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

[Griking]

They review full versions of games. Reviewing an incomplete version would defeat the purpose.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

I near 100% certain that is not the case, hence my post.

I'm 100% certain you're wrong. Although there have been cases of magazines reviewing unfinished versions of games. But as a rule for movie reviews, music, book, game, etc. they review complete versions.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM


I've seen many magazines make the claim that they only review completed retail versions of games myself.

[Captain Wrong]

In the old days, magazines could wait until they got a finished copy of a game to review it, because there was no Internet. By the time you got the magazine with the reviews, sure, they were 2-3 months after the game came out, but no one minded much. By then you knew SOMEONE who had bought the game or product and could talk to them about it, and then compare it to the review.

Not with the Internet that's all changed. Online sites like Gamespot are sent finished copies just as they start being produced at the factory, which means that they will get their full online review out just in time for the release of the game. Insant news and information. Magazines can't compete. By the time THEY get their review out, due to the lead in time, it's too late.

That's a big reason why I don't read gaming magazines anymore, and why I turn to sites like Gamespot for reviews.

What magazines SHOULD do is just do PREVIEWS. Try to scoop the online sites by using their contacts to publish secret information and what not. If they time it right, you'll get the info on the game just as it's ready to be released, which can be a BIG help in determing if you should buy it at launch day or wait.

Print magazines are fast becoming obsolete anyway. :hmm:

Funny. I was having the same thought before I saw this. I'll give you another example of how I think magazines are becoming irrelevant.

I think we can all agree that the biggest controversy in gaming right now is the whole GTA:SA/Hot Coffee patch vs. Jack, Hilary and Joementum thing, right? Of the three gaming magazines I received in the last week, only one had anything at all about it and even then it was only the opening volley in this spat (before they pulled the game and relabeled it AO) which has since then become a huge thing. (Ironically, this magazine seemed have reviews of some games everyone else covered already.)

That's just the breaks with print journalism. The gaming industry seems to have turned itself into an almost 24 hour news cycle sort of beast where as 20 or even 10 years ago you could get away with being a month behind as things weren't moving as fast.

Of course, I also think part of the problem is that there's a large quantity of free writing on the web that is darn good and that a lot of print mags seem to be aiming for pre-teens. And there's the always controversial issue of how much of the gaming media's opinion is paid for by the gaming companies (though it seems like a few years since I've heard any scuttlebut about editors being taken on expensive trips, or things of that nature.)

Plus, you gotta love it when the current issue of EGM has a 5 page advertisement pretending to be a game preview of "America's Army" by Ubisoft. I'll be interested to see how EGM rates that when it ships. :hmm:

[smork]

Heh, the new Advance wars *is* great, been playing it for a few months now ;)

I'm always glad when shitty licensed games get shitty reviews. Now if they would only put stickers on the boxed telling parents, "Warning! Shitty licensed game inside! Don't be fooled by the familiar game and buy this turd. Ask your game store clerk for some recs for a GOOD game!"

Why can't Jack Thomson be against shitty games that still cost $50? People never go on the right crusade.

[petewhitley]

They review full versions of games. Reviewing an incomplete version would defeat the purpose.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

I near 100% certain that is not the case, hence my post.

I'm 100% certain you're wrong. Although there have been cases of magazines reviewing unfinished versions of games. But as a rule for movie reviews, music, book, game, etc. they review complete versions.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

Someone get Zach Meston in here. How in God's name did EGM review the game Geist when it hasn't gone gold yet? Gamespot repeatedly posts previews of near (but not yet) finished games while that month's EGM has a "review" of it. Put two and two together here buddy. Buy the company line all you want, but let's get an industry insider in here to set you guys straight.

[starchildskiss78]

I agree with the general consensus that you have to be cautious with game reviews (although Official Dreamcast Magazine was right when they said Kiss Psycho Circus was going to be a suckfest full of too many simplistically rendered enemies and an insane difficulty level) so the ultimate test is us testing the games themselves.



EGM is still around?

unfortunatly I mean the magazine is horrible now,

though I will say I did enjoy the 3 console look it did for the ps3,xbox360 and revolution, it was interesting

but i never trust egm reviews they are as bad as the magazine itself and the magazine is blah

Oh, and I'm thinking of picking up EGM just for the Zelda poster they include in it for free. Might look nice on my wall. ;)

[TheRedEye]

I review incomplete versions of videogames for magazines almost monthly. A lot of times they're still buggy, but we know to look past those. This is a necessary practice when some magazines, i.e. Wired, have a three-month lead time. But hey, THE ONE, THE ONLY RCM says otherwise with "100%" certainty, so what do I know.

[Captain Wrong]

They review full versions of games. Reviewing an incomplete version would defeat the purpose.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

I near 100% certain that is not the case, hence my post.

I'm 100% certain you're wrong. Although there have been cases of magazines reviewing unfinished versions of games. But as a rule for movie reviews, music, book, game, etc. they review complete versions.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

Actually, I'm 100% certain you are THE ONE, THE ONLY WRONG, at least when it comes to music. As someone who does freelance music reviews, the cds I get sent are not always the same as the finished version that hits the stores. Most of the time it is the same, though often a cd-r with out art. But there have been times when tracks get changed around, added, dropped, remixed before it hits the store.

I'm sure this is the same for reviewers of other media. You review what people send you. Depending on how close a company wants to cut it, you're not always sent a finished project.

[RCM]

Well, let's put it this way gents, you guys aren't the only ones who have done reviews. I have reviewed games and film and the whole point is to review complete versions. But as I said before the that doesn't always happen. So go fuck yourself Redeye.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

[Oobgarm]

So, if final, retail-ready product is only available for review, how did Nintendo Power review (and have a cover story on, no less) Robin Hood for the NES so many years ago? Or how Official PlayStation Magazine reviewed Choplifter for PS2, a game that NEVER saw release here?

Just because things are a certain way for one person doesn’t mean that it’s the same for everyone. Wouldn't it benefit a publisher to get an 80% complete version of a game to a reviewer so it can be in the issue of their magazine that’s on newsstands just prior to its release? It might backfire, but why not give it a try, you know?

[Captain Wrong]

Just because things are a certain way for one person doesn’t mean that it’s the same for everyone. Wouldn't it benefit a publisher to get an 80% complete version of a game to a reviewer so it can be in the issue of their magazine that’s on newsstands just prior to its release? It might backfire, but why not give it a try, you know?

And that's exactly it. When you're on someone's mailing list and they want a review to hit the street at such and such a time, they'll probably send it along to get that review on time.

I think we're also talking the difference between someone who is "in the loop" and gets promos, screeners, testers, whatever sent in consideration for review and someone who spends their own money on a product in the marketplace to review. That's almost two different worlds we're talking about here.

[Griking]

Print magazines are fast becoming obsolete anyway. :hmm:

Yeah, but its still easier to read a magazine while on the can than it is to make the bathroom internet ready. LOL

[petewhitley]

Well, let's put it this way gents, you guys aren't the only ones who have done reviews. I have reviewed games and film and the whole point is to review complete versions. But as I said before the that doesn't always happen. So go fuck yourself Redeye.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

This thread was about video-game reviews. Not music, film, etc. The majority of gaming magazines review incomplete versions of games so that they get to print on time. This is not up for debate, ask anyone who reviews video-games for print magazines.

[TheRedEye]

Well, let's put it this way gents, you guys aren't the only ones who have done reviews. I have reviewed games and film and the whole point is to review complete versions. But as I said before the that doesn't always happen. So go fuck yourself Redeye.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

And I'm sure your reviews radiated with brilliant insight that could only come from THE ONE, THE ONLY RCM, the coolest most toughest internet badass in all of cyberspace, but it doesn't change the fact that you're wrong. The only time a print magazine reviews a finished, mastered game is when the game sucks so bad that the publisher doesn't want the reviews printed before it hits store shelves.

Are you going to follow up the "go fuck yourself" by threatening me again? Because that was pretty funny last time.

[RCM]

Well, let's put it this way gents, you guys aren't the only ones who have done reviews. I have reviewed games and film and the whole point is to review complete versions. But as I said before the that doesn't always happen. So go fuck yourself Redeye.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

And I'm sure your reviews radiated with brilliant insight that could only come from THE ONE, THE ONLY RCM, the coolest most toughest internet badass in all of cyberspace, but it doesn't change the fact that you're wrong. The only time a print magazine reviews a finished, mastered game is when the game sucks so bad that the publisher doesn't want the reviews printed before it hits store shelves.

Are you going to follow up the "go fuck yourself" by threatening me again? Because that was pretty funny last time.

You're wrong again fuckface. But i'm glad you're digging it. I actually contacted a friend of mine who is an EIC of a major national videogame magazine and he assured me 100% that they only review complete copies of video games, film, music, gear, etc.

So I suppose we may both be wrong, i know i'm shocked cause i'm almost never wrong. But i am right about this, you're a fucking hack. I would never threaten you though. You're so confused you fuck, calling for you to fuck yourself is no threat, it's a favor to you because it's clear no one else will. If we ever are in the same space be sure to introduce yourself. I promise I won't rape you too hard you ZM wannabe.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

[petewhitley]

Well, let's put it this way gents, you guys aren't the only ones who have done reviews. I have reviewed games and film and the whole point is to review complete versions. But as I said before the that doesn't always happen. So go fuck yourself Redeye.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

And I'm sure your reviews radiated with brilliant insight that could only come from THE ONE, THE ONLY RCM, the coolest most toughest internet badass in all of cyberspace, but it doesn't change the fact that you're wrong. The only time a print magazine reviews a finished, mastered game is when the game sucks so bad that the publisher doesn't want the reviews printed before it hits store shelves.

Are you going to follow up the "go fuck yourself" by threatening me again? Because that was pretty funny last time.

You're wrong again fuckface. But i'm glad you're digging it. I actually contacted a friend of mine who is an EIC of a major national videogame magazine and he assured me 100% that they only review complete copies of video games, film, music, gear, etc.

What magazine is it? Whatever it is, they must be about to go under seeing as that they're publishing reviews of games about 2 months past release date when you factor in turn-around time associated with print mags.

[Gamereviewgod]

Wow, this thread sure has become entertaining.


Print magazines are fast becoming obsolete anyway.

They said the same thing about newspapers, and while they're subscription rates are down, they're still here. Time still prints, People is still around, etc. They'll always be there, because a good portion of people still prefer actual printed media.

[zmweasel]

I'm currently reviewing the following games for PSE magazine:

Armored Core: Nine Breaker
Beat Down
Darkwatch
Romancing SaGa
RPG Maker 3

All of these games are on DVD-Rs. Two of them came with photocopied rough-draft instruction manuals, three of them with no instructions at all.

Beat Down even has a debug mode directly accessible from the title screen, allowing reviewers to watch movie sequences and skip around to various features without playing from start to finish (a kind feature, since the game totally blows).

I'm not sure which EiC of "a major national videogame magazine" Rob is speaking to, but his definition of "complete copy" is quite different from mine. Perhaps he means "reviewable code," which is at least slightly different from the final code of the retail version.

-- Z.

[zmweasel]

In the old days, magazines could wait until they got a finished copy of a game to review it, because there was no Internet. By the time you got the magazine with the reviews, sure, they were 2-3 months after the game came out, but no one minded much. By then you knew SOMEONE who had bought the game or product and could talk to them about it, and then compare it to the review.

Not quite right.

With a cart game, the code is complete for several months before manufacture, and magazines had plenty of time to get reviews into print as or before the game shipped. (Which magazines were you reading with reviews of games that were already out for two or three months?!)

With a CD/DVD game, it only takes a month at most to go from gold master to store shelves. Enthusiast magazines have adjusted by cutting down their lead times as much as possible--I think PSE is down to six weeks, which is crazy for a monthly magazine--and reviewing buggy "reviewable" betas instead of waiting for final code.

As TheRedEye mentioned earlier in the thread, when you review these betas, you write around the bugs, since they're usually stamped out before release. For example, disc optimization is usually the very last process in the game-development cycle, since code is forever shifting around. Hence, I usually don't complain about long load times, since they might not be present in the retail version.

I could also share several nightmarish anecdotes about writing Prima/Brady strategy guides for CD/DVD games, but suffice to say that I don't do guides anymore because I wanted to preserve what's left of my sanity.

-- Z.

[TheRedEye]

But i am right about this, you're a fucking hack. I would never threaten you though. You're so confused you fuck, calling for you to fuck yourself is no threat, it's a favor to you because it's clear no one else will. If we ever are in the same space be sure to introduce yourself. I promise I won't rape you too hard you ZM wannabe.

Shh, honey, calm down. Everybody here knows what a big, strong boy you are! No need to get all worked up. Anyone who messes with you is just jealous of your success.

[AtariFattie]

See, this is another reason collecting Atari is so great. I know exactly what a game is worth already. I don't have to wait around to hear if it's fun or not before I buy it.

[Captain Wrong]

See, this is another reason collecting Atari is so great. I know exactly what a game is worth already. I don't have to wait around to hear if it's fun or not before I buy it.

LOL

Well played.

[RCM]

But i am right about this, you're a fucking hack. I would never threaten you though. You're so confused you fuck, calling for you to fuck yourself is no threat, it's a favor to you because it's clear no one else will. If we ever are in the same space be sure to introduce yourself. I promise I won't rape you too hard you ZM wannabe.

Shh, honey, calm down. Everybody here knows what a big, strong boy you are! No need to get all worked up. Anyone who messes with you is just jealous of your success.

That's the best you can do? Ha.


I'm not sure which EiC of "a major national videogame magazine" Rob is speaking to, but his definition of "complete copy" is quite different from mine. Perhaps he means "reviewable code," which is at least slightly different from the final code of the retail version.

He said 100% complete. Your definition could certainly differ from his and others.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

[TheRedEye]

That's the best you can do? Ha.

Yes. Please don't rape me too hard, oh Grand Master of Awesome.

[RCM]

That's the best you can do? Ha.

Yes. Please don't rape me too hard, oh Grand Master of Awesome.

Ok, that was better. Carry on.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

[GrayFox]

I must say, I know Gems collection won't get the best reviews from magazines.

First, it's a compliation of some retro games, therefore, points are deducted right away with current magazines.

Also, the collection, I can even admit, doesn't look spectacular. Remember, this is ME talking. There just aren't that many games. Should've had Knuckles Chaotix on it.

Granted, I'm getting it for the ability to play Sonic the Fighters, which is decent, and for the ability to have Sonic CD and Sonic R on one disc, and to be able to play them with a Wavebird.

[NintendoMan]

Yep, just got my issue in today and saw the score for Geist! Along with the other too. It saddens me to see this, I still plan on buying Geist, but it just sucks GC doesn't get any FPS love. Exclusive love that is!!

[zmweasel]

He said 100% complete. Your definition could certainly differ from his and others.

Could you ask him to clarify his definition, Rob? By "100% complete," does he mean a packaged retail copy (which he can't), or a beta version dubbed "reviewable code" by its developer/publisher, or what?

-- Z.

[zmweasel]

Of course, I also think part of the problem is that there's a large quantity of free writing on the web that is darn good and that a lot of print mags seem to be aiming for pre-teens.

Which enthusiast print magazines do you think are aiming for pre-teens? Nintendo Power (not a real magazine, but anyway) just got an all-growed-up makeover; GamePro has been skewing toward older teens for years; every other print pub touts its twentysomething-male demo.


And there's the always controversial issue of how much of the gaming media's opinion is paid for by the gaming companies (though it seems like a few years since I've heard any scuttlebut about editors being taken on expensive trips, or things of that nature.)

It's only controversial if 1) you don't realize that gaming journalism isn't much different from other forms of entertainment journalism, and 2) you think that paid advertising introduces bias--which, given your comment on the America's Army advertisement, you do.

-- Z.

[Captain Wrong]

Of course, I also think part of the problem is that there's a large quantity of free writing on the web that is darn good and that a lot of print mags seem to be aiming for pre-teens.

Which enthusiast print magazines do you think are aiming for pre-teens? Nintendo Power (not a real magazine, but anyway) just got an all-growed-up makeover; GamePro has been skewing toward older teens for years; every other print pub touts its twentysomething-male demo.

Actually GamePro is one of the very ones I was thinking of. Tips and Tricks is another one that I'll admit may have changed since I last looked, but always struck me kiddie.



And there's the always controversial issue of how much of the gaming media's opinion is paid for by the gaming companies (though it seems like a few years since I've heard any scuttlebut about editors being taken on expensive trips, or things of that nature.)

It's only controversial if 1) you don't realize that gaming journalism isn't much different from other forms of entertainment journalism, and 2) you think that paid advertising introduces bias--which, given your comment on the America's Army advertisement, you do.

-- Z.

1) Fair enough, though the "everyone else is doing it" defense doesn't make it right. 2) I think that situation has gotten better but it still makes me a bit suspicious, yes. Actually I was more refering to ad content in general and how it's a drag to have to fight through all the advertising (and advertising in disguise) to find the content.

[zmweasel]

Actually GamePro is one of the very ones I was thinking of. Tips and Tricks is another one that I'll admit may have changed since I last looked, but always struck me kiddie.

I'd forgotten about T&T. No question that it aims for chitlins. GamePro don't aim for the kiddies no mo', however.


1) Fair enough, though the "everyone else is doing it" defense doesn't make it right.

I'm not saying that it's right--just that it's the way it is. Video game magazines primarily exist as a platform for publishers to push their product, just like movie magazines, music magazines, etc.

The major difference is that game magazines have to focus on the games themselves, because the people who create them are interchangeable dumpy white guys or skinny Japanese guys, while movie and music magazines focus more on personalities and less on product.


2) I think that situation has gotten better but it still makes me a bit suspicious, yes. Actually I was more refering to ad content in general and how it's a drag to have to fight through all the advertising (and advertising in disguise) to find the content.

American consumers haven't demonstrated a willingness to do what the Brits do and shell out more money for fewer ads, so American mags live and die by ad revenue. Again, it's just the way it is.

-- Z.

[RCM]

He said 100% complete. Your definition could certainly differ from his and others.

Could you ask him to clarify his definition, Rob? By "100% complete," does he mean a packaged retail copy (which he can't), or a beta version dubbed "reviewable code" by its developer/publisher, or what?

-- Z.

I thought it was pretty clear by what I said before Zack. Next time I talk with him i'll ask if I remember, but he's kinda busy being an EIC. You know how it is.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

[zmweasel]

I thought it was pretty clear by what I said before Zack. Next time I talk with him i'll ask if I remember, but he's kinda busy being an EIC. You know how it is.

Actually, it's not clear, Rob. That's why I'm asking for clarification. No major videogame magazine reviews retail copies, which is implied by "100% complete," so I assume he's talking about reviewable betas, which aren't "100% complete," either.

And why wait until you "talk" to him? Why not just shoot him an email or an IM and get an instant response?

-- Z.

[TheRedEye]

Because the Mystery Editor-In-Chief is big and important like RCM and doesn't have time for this nonsense. They're Big People, and you and I are Little People. You know how it is.

[RCM]

Don't worry about it Redeye and Zack, you guys are obviously always correct. That's why you're the real men on top in the industry. You are aren't you?

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

[Gamereviewgod]

And it just keeps getting better...

[zmweasel]

Don't worry about it Redeye and Zack, you guys are obviously always correct. That's why you're the real men on top in the industry. You are aren't you?

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

I'm not trying to be snide, Rob, or I'd point out that you've mentioned homosexual rape multiple times in this thread, which indicates an unhealthy fascination with that act.

I have no idea why you would claim that I'm "always correct" or "on top in [sic] the industry," as I'm neither, and I have no idea what my standing in the game industry has to do with my question. Could you explain the connection?

I'm simply curious what your EiC pal--and it's strange that you choose not to name him, as I don't know any game-magazine editors who jealously guard their privacy as opposed to posting detailed blogs and/or openly soliciting email feedback--means by "100% complete." He can't mean reviewable betas, and he can't mean retail copies, so what does he mean?

-- Z.

[RCM]

Don't worry about it Redeye and Zack, you guys are obviously always correct. That's why you're the real men on top in the industry. You are aren't you?

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

I'm not trying to be snide, Rob, and I have no idea why you would claim that I'm "always correct" or "on top in [sic] the industry," as I'm neither.

I also have no idea what my standing in the game industry has to do with my question. Could you explain the connection?

I'm simply curious what your EiC pal--and it's strange that you choose not to name him, as I don't know any game-magazine editors who jealously guard their privacy as opposed to posting detailed blogs and/or openly soliciting email feedback--means by "100% complete." He can't mean reviewable betas, and he can't mean retail copies, so what does he mean?

-- Z.

I asked in passing what his mags policy was and he simply replied we only review final product. I was satisified. It's clear you don't buy it and that's fine, so forgive me for getting a bit snippy. I have no reason to lie or reveal my sources ever. The comment was more for your little wannabe than you, so brush it off and lets move on. We've certainly said worst to each other.

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

[TheRedEye]

Don't worry about it Redeye and Zack, you guys are obviously always correct. That's why you're the real men on top in the industry. You are aren't you?

THE ONE, THE ONLY- RCM

This is coming from someone who says he's "almost never wrong" and refers to himself as "THE ONE, THE ONLY," folks.

[zmweasel]

I asked in passing what his mags policy was and he simply replied we only review final product. I was satisified. It's clear you don't buy it and that's fine, so forgive me for getting a bit snippy.

I'm not saying I "don't buy it." I'm saying I want to know exactly what he means by "100% complete" or "final product"--and which is it, by the way? You've now stated both--because he can't mean retail copies and he can't mean reviewable betas.

If he DOES mean either of those, his magazine has the shortest lead time in publishing history, or he's deceptively defining reviewable betas as "100% complete/final product." I absolutely understand why he'd choose to deceive, though. It's a much easier answer than trying to explain the process.


I have no reason to lie or reveal my sources ever. The comment was more for your little wannabe than you, so brush it off and lets move on. We've certainly said worst to each other.

I only came into this thread because someone mentioned to me that you'd used the phrase "ZM wannabe," which indicates that you continue to harbor intense dislike for me after, what, three or four months since we posted in the same thread. I haven't paid you a second thought since then, but you're obsessed enough with me to coin a phrase after me. And you think I need to move on?

Tell you what, though. This'll be my last post in the thread, unless you post again. Let's see if you can practice what you preach.

-- Z.