120th Nintendo World Championships cart found [Archive]

rbudrick

09-29-2005, 09:08 PM

I apologize if anyone is sick of me making new threads whenever I make new NWC discoveries. I figured it is the best way to start new discussion and to get people to read...I personally would be more apt to click on a new thread than see the last posts in a crusty old one. LOL

So Anyway, remember this auction?

http://cgi.ebay.com/NINTENDO-WORLD-CHAMPIONSHIPS-1990-EXTREMELY-RARE-NES_W0QQitemZ8219419765QQcategoryZ4315QQrdZ1QQcmdZ ViewItem

The seller is the nephew of the guy who was the executive producer of the show. I did an interview with his uncle...pretty interesting guy, no doubt. He was one of the partners at EMCI, the company that organized the event. EMCI was a talent company out of NYC..they used to run MC Hammer's and I believe Vanillla Ice's tours. I think Tina Turner too. I believe they are the folks that got Chevy Chase in to those Dorito commercials back in the day, just to mentiion a few things EMCI did.

Anyway, Steve Grossman was a primary partner and shareholder at EMCI, and later was CEO of ASC Games and now XSgames, both of which you likely recognize as publishhers of a good amount of popular games to grace our screens.

Steve is THE guy who conceived the event. It was his idea he brought to Nintendo.

Steve gave me some leads I'm going to chase for some more info on the show. I'll keep you guys tuned!

Pretty cool, huh?

-Rob

qbertandernie

09-29-2005, 09:37 PM

i didnt think these things sold for that much...damn.

� Gideon �

09-29-2005, 09:52 PM

rbudrick, are you a detective?

tarheelsnipe

09-29-2005, 10:00 PM

sweet post. i'm personally looking forward to more nwc posts.

i'm collecting all the pics i can find of these and putting them in my image database (when i find the time). this one just put me up to 13 images, 11 carts. eventually i would like to add owner names or a chain of ownership in the comments section. hopefully when people see how many of these are floating around the price will plateau.

http://www.tarheelsnipe.com/forums/album_cat.php?cat_id=1

badinsults

09-29-2005, 10:11 PM

Yeah, we were chatting to the seller on #vbender, and he has tons of NWC related prototypes, as well as many others.

hydr0x

09-29-2005, 10:23 PM

evan is speaking the truth, we were talking to that nephew ;)

Mianrtcv

09-29-2005, 10:58 PM

i didnt think these things sold for that much...damn.

I new they sold high but, X_x HOLAY MOLAY! I have amassed (just like many here) entire collection for less. That is some serious disposable income. Unless of course the purchaser pooled money with other buyers a la Bart Simpson, Millhouse and Martin for the coveted Radioactive man :) .

Seriously, that is a lot of coin. I would like to have one but am completely comfortable without one if that is what it takes. I can live nicely off that money for a while and get games on the side. I'd have to have old wrinkly white folks money to bust that move.

Zing

09-29-2005, 11:10 PM

Wow, so much money for so very little gameplay. ;)

Biff_McFresh

09-30-2005, 02:07 AM

Beautiful. Love the NWC investigative reports, keep up the good work :D

VG_Maniac

09-30-2005, 05:20 AM

Has anyone ever seen this NWC cart from www.atarihq.com? If so, has anybody ever found out what number it is? Can't see the number since it's in such crappy shape.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v357/Hero_of_Hyrule/nes1990cart.jpg

BTW...does anyone here remember that auction that was on ebay a couple years ago where a guy was auctioning off "pieces" of an NWC cart? Well, for all I know they could have easily been pieces of an SMB/Duck Hunt cart...but you never know.

Gemini-Phoenix

09-30-2005, 05:23 AM

I have a few questions, seeing as I have been following this story for some time...

How many of these carts were made? Or does no one know? Surely someone at Nintendo would know how many were produced?

I also assume that there have only been 120 known examples found surviving? Are the carts numbered at all? This one appears to hav been numbered number 0283, so does that imply there are at least 283 carts in existence? As it starts with a zero, i'd assume there are at least 1000 perhaps...

How do you know that certain carts aren't just getting passed around? Ie, cart number 73 may have had about half a dozen owners, but how do you make sure you don't count it six times? Is there like a register that people sign online to prevent this? Obviously, when this number 0283 was sold, it would have a new owner...

Is there any person here (Or anywhere) who owns more than one, and is anyone a NWC cart collector? I know if I had the cash, i'd set out to get as many as I could find, therefore increasing the rarity of the remaining ones.

Educate me!

Jumpman Jr.

09-30-2005, 07:43 AM

Is there any person here (Or anywhere) who owns more than one, and is a NWC cart collector? I know if I had the cash, i'd set out to get as many as I could find, therefore increasing the rarity of the remaining ones.

Educate me!

DreamTR just stated in another thread that, at one point, he had 6 gold ones, and that 7 have passed through his hands.
I think he's got at least one gold and one grey one now, but I'm not sure.

As for this topic, how do you keep on finding this information? Its really interesting, but I can't even imagine what you do in order to find this stuff.
:hail:

rbudrick

09-30-2005, 10:00 AM

Has anyone ever seen this NWC cart from www.atarihq.com? If so, has anybody ever found out what number it is? Can't see the number since it's in such crappy shape.

I've got a few leads on it and am currently investigating it.

rbudrick, are you a detective?

Lol, no. I sell computer equipment. Much like sales, I imagine detective work is all about following your leads and being aggressive about them.

As for the buyer having a lot of disposable coin, well I dunno. His name is Tod and I have been in contact with him. He is an orthodontist, and a reallt cool guy. I was flattered when he said my Ben Smith interview led to his enthusiasm (seeing my enthusiasm for all things NWC). He just wanted one of these carts after that! In fact I feel Ben and I are mostly responsible for the explosion of NWC items on eBay lately. :embarrassed: It's good I suppose in it's own way because there's a huge buzz of people talking about this stuff now. Let's hope the ball keeps rolling!

BTW...does anyone here remember that auction that was on ebay a couple years ago where a guy was auctioning off "pieces" of an NWC cart? Well, for all I know they could have easily been pieces of an SMB/Duck Hunt cart...but you never know.

No, but if anyone has any info or saved the auction page, I'd like to look into it.

Gemini-Phoenix, about the number of carts...90 finalists got one, 26 winners of Nintendo Power got a gold one. I have found 4 outside those people (non finalists, non NP winners...basically people proven to be the original owners of the carts). Yes, they are individually numbered, but there has been no sequencial pattern as of yet to the numbers found...mainly because so few have been documented so far. I am setting out to create exactly that catalog you speak of...it's been very hard work, but very fun.

Oh! I almost forgot. Grossman said the cart was programmed by Square, and made by NOJ. He said less than 1000 were made, probably around 500. No one has yet documented a cart serial number over 0343 yet though.

-Rob

pacmanhat

09-30-2005, 10:09 AM

Gemini-Phoenix

09-30-2005, 10:14 AM

Thois is all very interesting info. You have to really ask yourself, why bother numbering the carts like this if not sequentual? You'd think they would be numbered sequentually, as my Red PS2 is...

On a side note, I will also add that I am equally as much a "Detective" where it comes to owners of similar PS2's as my own. I have yet to come across some one who owns one with a lower production number than myself, but then, I never do expect that seeing as mine is fairly low as it is. Out of 2000, I have only met about half a dozen, with about the same amount of owners for the other colours.

I have made it my mission to chat to owners of these rare PS2's and ask them what inspired them to purchase such a rare machine. Many are like myself who wanted something different, and unique.

I guess with something as rare as these NWC carts, one could make it their life's work to track down any and all owners of such things. I certainly can't think of many rarer gaming goodies than these to have in one's collection, and I can't imagine anyone ever seeing one down a car boot sale anywhere any time...

drcurtis

09-30-2005, 10:26 AM

BTW...does anyone here remember that auction that was on ebay a couple years ago where a guy was auctioning off "pieces" of an NWC cart? Well, for all I know they could have easily been pieces of an SMB/Duck Hunt cart...but you never know.

You can read the odd story here:

http://www.digitpress.com/archives/ebay/nesuser2_nwcpieces.pdf

Daria

09-30-2005, 10:29 AM

Grossman said the cart was programmed by Square,

lol

I wonder how many Square collectors out there now have to buy a $4k cartridge.

norkusa

09-30-2005, 10:44 AM

Has anyone ever seen this NWC cart from www.atarihq.com? If so, has anybody ever found out what number it is? Can't see the number since it's in such crappy shape.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v357/Hero_of_Hyrule/nes1990cart.jpg

I'm pretty sure that's the same cart that I tried bidding on in a private auction in 1998. IIRC, the seller made a post in reg.games.video.classic that he'd be selling it to the highest bidder. Thought it was kind of strange that he didn't use Ebay but I guess not everyone knew about Ebay back then.

Anyway, I think I bid around $200 and the cart ended up selling for $500. If I only knew then what I knew now....

THATinkjar

09-30-2005, 11:08 AM

I have made it my mission to chat to owners of these rare PS2's and ask them what inspired them to purchase such a rare machine.

I have a rare PlayStation 2, in that it still works... LOL Sorry, I couldn't resist.

rbudrick

09-30-2005, 11:44 AM

So is that to say that the majority of those 500 or so still exist, and just haven't ever been documented? For example, might a bunch of them be sitting in a Nintendo warehouse somewhere? Or in the hands of a bunch of current or former NOJ/NOA employees?

I would assume that to be correct. OR...they could have recycled the carts...who knows. They may have been sold in the NOA employee store, but I have absolutely no record or rumor of that.

Oh, and that auction of the cart pieces appears to be bull. If you look closely and zoom in on the large piece, it appears to be the top corner of the cart where the dip switches would go. That part was cut out for the dip switches, so there you have it. FAKE.

I'm pretty sure that's the same cart that I tried bidding on in a private auction in 1998. IIRC, the seller made a post in reg.games.video.classic that he'd be selling it to the highest bidder. Thought it was kind of strange that he didn't use Ebay but I guess not everyone knew about Ebay back then.

I'm not familiar with IRC much, but does anyone know if there is an archive of this somwhere? I'd really dig another lead on this cart.

-Rob

Daria

09-30-2005, 11:47 AM

I'm pretty sure that's the same cart that I tried bidding on in a private auction in 1998. IIRC, the seller made a post in reg.games.video.classic that he'd be selling it to the highest bidder. Thought it was kind of strange that he didn't use Ebay but I guess not everyone knew about Ebay back then.

I'm not familiar with IRC much, but does anyone know if there is an archive of this somwhere? I'd really dig another lead on this cart.

-Rob

Erm I think reg.games.video.classic is a newsgroup of some sort. By IIRC he ment " If I recall Correctly" and not actually IRC.

hydr0x

09-30-2005, 11:59 AM

you can search old newsgroups on groups.google.com

� Gideon �

09-30-2005, 12:06 PM

rbudrick, are you a detective?

Lol, no. I sell computer equipment. Much like sales, I imagine detective work is all about following your leads and being aggressive about them.
Heheh. Well, you probably could be! Seriously, I've been following your work, and you've uncovered more truth about the NWC than I thought we would ever know. Good luck.

rbudrick

09-30-2005, 12:08 PM

Erm I think reg.games.video.classic is a newsgroup of some sort. By IIRC he ment " If I recall Correctly" and not actually IRC.

Oh, right...I know that, I was just confusing newsgroups with IRC chat, lol.

Evan, did Shamus give a list of all the NWC stuff he has by chance? I could ask him, but I figured I'd ask here first, since you mentioned it.

-Rob

rbudrick

09-30-2005, 12:59 PM

http://groups.google.com/group/rec.games.video.classic/browse_thread/thread/de21acf4fa40a0ae/4dab78e38baba611?lnk=st&q=%22nintendo+world+championships%22&rnum=30#4dab78e38baba611

I believe this is the ripped label cart guy...sure sounds like it. Scott Novak...hmmm....he just found it...

Anyone know this guy? I'd like to know where he found it so I can narrow it down by where any given finalists lived at the time, or if it was in the Redmond are near NOA.

-Rob

ice1605

09-30-2005, 03:13 PM

Gemini-Phoenix

09-30-2005, 03:28 PM

Lol! That NWC Pieces auction was funny to read. Talk about name dropping keywords all over the place!

rbudrick

09-30-2005, 05:35 PM

Why would Nintendo sell an NWC cartridge in their company store? They were rare, even back then, and given out as prizes. They wouldn't just sell them where anyone could buy them (or at least employees). I hope that some day I can afford one!

Ice

Well I heard they sold the DKC competition carts in the employee store. They've been known to sell some oddities there, including older games from the NOA employee game library that people didn't call much on anymore (less games needed for employees to borrow out). They'd buy several copies of popular games for the GPCs to borrow out, and as it's popularity waned, they'd sell off the extras that weren't being borrowed.

-Rob

Chronodriftersx

09-30-2005, 06:53 PM

norkusa

09-30-2005, 07:22 PM

I believe this is the ripped label cart guy...sure sounds like it. Scott Novak...hmmm....he just found it...

Anyone know this guy? I'd like to know where he found it so I can narrow it down by where any given finalists lived at the time, or if it was in the Redmond are near NOA.

-Rob

Oh man, I remember that guy. I forget what about, but there were some pretty harsh flame wars with Novak on r.g.v.c back in the day.

Anyway, about the NWC cart...I think the story was that he found it in a thrift store for a buck or two (sorry, can't remember the state). Didn't even know what he had until he asked around the group for a bit. That's when he decided to auction it off privately I think.

rbudrick

09-30-2005, 11:55 PM

Oh man, I remember that guy. I forget what about, but there were some pretty harsh flame wars with Novak on r.g.v.c back in the day.

Anyway, about the NWC cart...I think the story was that he found it in a thrift store for a buck or two (sorry, can't remember the state). Didn't even know what he had until he asked around the group for a bit. That's when he decided to auction it off privately I think.

Cool, thanks, Nork. I just realized I misspelled his name...It's Nowack. Sorry. :) I wonder where I could find this guy...

-Rob

vintagegamecrazy

10-01-2005, 12:24 AM

rbudrick I think you'll like this auction since you are doing so much NWC research, probably isn't a bad price either.http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=8222558205&ssPageName=MERC_VIC_ReBay_Pr4_PcY_BIN_IT

rbudrick

10-01-2005, 11:06 AM

Thanks,VGC. I actually got 7 of those when I was 12 years old at the event. I had Ben Smith sign them all when I met him. It's probablly the most common thing that pops up on eBay NWC related. I remember there were stacks of them by the entrance. Thanks for the heads-up, though!

-Rob

skaar

10-15-2005, 03:57 PM

Re: The "500" carts.

Hi there, I just found this thread and you're all naughty people for talking about me behind my back ;)

Nice to find out the name of the guy who wanted to interview Steve. He laughed his ass off when I told him how much the game went for - he apparently chucked his copies ages ago. I'm hoping they might be buried in his basement - I'll know after christmastime! It's a gold mine of video game stuff ;)

rbudrick

10-16-2005, 02:22 AM

Re: The "500" carts.

Hi there, I just found this thread and you're all naughty people for talking about me behind my back

Nice to find out the name of the guy who wanted to interview Steve. He laughed his ass off when I told him how much the game went for - he apparently chucked his copies ages ago. I'm hoping they might be buried in his basement - I'll know after christmastime! It's a gold mine of video game stuff

Skaar, I'm confused...are you Shamus?

-Rob

skaar

10-16-2005, 01:35 PM

Yep. Tod pointed me to this site after he bought the cart, he said he was talking to you guys for awhile. I've been idling on IRC ever since as TenchiEF.

rbudrick

10-17-2005, 10:24 AM

Ah, I see. Good to see you here, Shamus! This is Steve Grossman's nephew, folks. You've got some pretty cool NWC items that keep going up, Skaar! What else have you up your sleeve? :)

So your uncle thinks he threw out his NWC carts? How many did he think he had back then?

-Rob

skaar

10-19-2005, 10:55 AM

Dunno how many, really. I only ever saw the one on his desk, but I think there were a few in the office. I think most of the protos I have came from NWC leftovers, actually ;)

rbudrick

10-19-2005, 12:00 PM

Well the protos you've been selling are from the 17 or so confirmed 3rd party game companies that had equipment at the NWCs. Any word on whether the Solstice cart is any different than the released version?

-Rob

skaar

10-22-2005, 09:34 AM

Not sure.

The carts I've got kicking are:

(NES)
Street Fighter 2010 (on ebay - was removed by ebay)
Solstice (on ebay)
Princess Tomato in the Salad Kingdom
Ninja Gaiden II
Tecmo World Wrestling
Mega Man 3
Startropics
Super C
.. probably a few more, I'll check when I wake up again ;)

(GB)
Boxxle
Burai Fighter Deluxe (Sold)
Cadillac (on ebay)
Snoopy's Magic Show (Sold)
Final Fantasy Legend II (Sold)

There's probably more in boxes somewhere. I remember having a copy of Wrath of the Black Manta too.

Were these all companies from the show? I put some pics of the guts from Solstice on the auction - I note you're currently high bidder ;)

rbudrick

10-23-2005, 02:24 PM

http://img446.imageshack.us/img446/2831/powerwalk7cs.jpg

Taken straight from the NWC pamphlet. I believe this is a complete list of the manufacturers (but not a complete list of games that were there), but I would welcome any correction.

I don't recall seing Princess Tomato there...but it did come out in 1990 by Hudson, so maybe it was there.

I want that NGII cart. :-) I remember playing it while I was there...who knows...maybe it's the same cart...

-Rob

skaar

10-26-2005, 01:25 AM

I've got Wrath of the Black Manta SOMEWHERE... not sure where though. Some bastard probably borrowed it and never returned it.

rbudrick

10-26-2005, 02:57 PM

Funny thing about Wrath of the Black Manta...it was out for a little while before the NWC even started...not sure why they had it there, since most of the games at the show were there because they were unreleased. So, it's interesting that it was a proto, since the game was quite available by then. I remember because I asked one of the GPCs in a "stump the GPC" stage session about how to beat the last boss. I knew how, but I just wanted to see if they'd answer, since the counsellors wouldn't do so over the Nintendo hotline (they wouldn't give away tips on how to beat final bosses and such). He did answer correctly, so I felt like they cheated at their own rules, heh heh.

I wonder if I could get US release dates of every game showed there so I could compile a list of what games were and were not released yet (just an interesting tidbit to know). I'm also still trying to get dates of every show so I know exactly how long the tour was. I know Ben Smith was on it for 10 weeks, but I don't believe he attended every show.

-Rob

skaar

10-29-2005, 02:35 PM

I don't know if it was at the show or not, but it wasn't a retail copy. It had a clear white label on it with typewritten letters if I recall. Maybe it was easier for them to produce the special carts?

I think Nintendo was hoping it was going to be another Ninja Gaiden.

rbudrick

10-31-2005, 10:57 AM

Well, it was definitely at the show.

Nintendo knew it wasn't another Ninja Gaiden, but they knew they could market it as one. In fact, the game kinda blows...but it was cool in it's quirky little ways. It was more like Shinobi than NG. It even had some side scrolling shooter levels and some first person scenes. They tried to mix genres a lot with this game, which I commend them for, but the game was just kind of blah nonetheless. That HUGE first boss was amazing to me when I was a kid...that they got the NES to do that. It was also the hardest boss in the game by a looongshot (the game wasn't balanced very well).

The NES era had a crazy fad of making Ninja-related games...there was a crapload of them. After Ninja Gaiden, they tried with WotBM to sell it as another NG...I rememeber a lot of press for it in Nintendo Power in late 89 and early 90. They knew it wasn't but Black Manta I think sold pretty well due to the NP coverage. Hell, I bought it because of NP, lol.

-Rob

Blitzwing256

10-31-2005, 11:42 AM

Sunsoft also had fester's quest there as well.
(it was already out in stores)

my mom took a picture of me playing it there for some unknown reason.

one proto I'd love to see show up is the castlevania 3 they had running there, it had a built in invincibility code going.
I remeber getting all the way up to alucard because of it.
(the game resets after like 20 minutes, so i couldn't get further sadly)