From Kotaku: Generation NEX verdict - SUX

[boatofcar]

http://www.kotaku.com/gaming/emulator/generation-nex-verdict-sux-135179.php

Red Wolf at VintageComputing got his hands on this NES clones for an in-depth review. He writes that his initial impressions were good, because the packaging was pretty nice. But once, he opened the clear plastic box and plugged the machine in, things got a little ugly. Everything thing about he machine blows monkey chunks. To get an idea of how rotten the machine is, Red Wolf lists “don’t explode when you turn it on” as a good feature. Who’s to blame? Those self-proclaimed saviors of gaming, Messiah Entertainment. Seems the Anti-Christ is alive and well, making crappy Nintendo emulators.

----
Boy, am I glad I didn't fall for its good looks.


EDIT: Forgot the link to the actual review.

http://www.vintagecomputing.com/index.php/archives/6


Yeah, I know it's been discussed to death on DP, but it's nice to hear someone from outside the boards saying the same things.

[Graham Mitchell]

Yipes. They really need to get those compatibility issues ironed out. That's just plain unacceptable. Who really cares about the wireless controller or the manual shaped like a NES cart? If the thing doesn't play like a NES or a Famicom, then there's no point in it.

[njiska]

Talk about a colussal disappointment. I was looking forward to the NEX and given Messiahs past i thought it'd be great. Sadly something went horribly wrong.

[suppafly]

wow im glad I didnt order one of these. Thanks for the information!

[Simply Dave]

Same here, I'm glad I waited to see what people thought of it first before putting in a order.

[Crush Crawfish]

Ugh. I'm really glad I didn't jump the gun and preorder one of these. What good is an NES that can't play River City Ransom correctly? I'll just stick with my top loader.

[Niku-Sama]

this acually makes me want to get one more but only to open it up and see if i can fix it my self....i was checking the compatability list and i noticed alot of them saaid not working due to a "game connector issue, try a different copy of the game"....who screwed up and ordered the wrong connector there? its common sence to get a quality connector int he first place so its not like a toaster in the next 5 years and you are blowing your guts out trying to get the game to work.

thats is if the "game connector" is a real problem and not something entirely else...


has any one else had compatability problems with a YoBo NOAC or the NOAC's in the 5 gazillion in 1 controllers and a converter?

[Damaramu]

If you want to a glimpse into why the NEX has so many problems, check out this thread as provided by Jagasian:

http://nesdev.parodius.com/bbs/viewtopic.php?t=698

It would seem the hardware was outsourced to some company in Asia; they did a less than stellar job in it's design.

[Niku-Sama]

i noticed that from al the beta-fix-it wires....still though, i like poking and proding to see if i can fix things....some times i stumble across something

[Nesmaster]

I too, am glad I didn't jump the gun. Too bad though, as I had high interest in the NEX. Could've been an awesome product, but alas..

[Melf]

Who’s to blame? Those self-proclaimed saviors of gaming, Messiah Entertainment. Seems the Anti-Christ is alive and well, making crappy Nintendo emulators.


Lol, that's just too rich. :roll:

[Jagasian]

still though, i like poking and proding to see if i can fix things....some times i stumble across something

The guys at NES Dev have already discussed possible ways to improve the wiring of the cartridge connectors. Correctly wiring the NOAC will put the compatibility on par with other Famiclones such as the NeoFami. So it wouldn't be an impressive improvement, but it would make the system's compatibility as good as the NeoFami's.

[Rev. Link]

I don't see why everyone's so down on the NEX. I have had very little trouble at all with mine. Aside from the few compatibility issues (which I'll get to in a second) I've only had two very minor problems. Sometimes when I start a game the controller buttons won't respond. This is rare, and turning it off and on again always fixes it. The only other problem I've had with it is that it's kind of quiet. I just turn up the TV, no big deal.

As for the compatibility; yeah, that kind of sucks. But hey, I still have my toaster to play those few games on. If I can play the rest of the games on a system that actually starts up the first time virtually everytime, and plays Famicom games, where's the problem?

[Lothars]

As for the compatibility; yeah, that kind of sucks. But hey, I still have my toaster to play those few games on. If I can play the rest of the games on a system that actually starts up the first time virtually everytime, and plays Famicom games, where's the problem?

Good point I am still thinking of getting one even thugh there is the problem

[CosmicMonkey]

Well, this whole NEX business is turning into a bit of a saga isn't it. All these lies and excuses to cover up what's really going on.

Messiah said it was a newly produced PPU clone and was the baddest thing going. Turns out it's just a dodgy Famiclone with incorrect wiring!!, leading to crap compatability.

And this has infuriated many people.

But this also shows that there are enough people interested in a decent Famiclone to make it worthwhile redoing the PPU. The actual design of the NEX with the two cart ports is quite nice. It seems to me that the guys over on NESdev really know their stuff. Get a bunch of them together (including that Kevtris chap) in a room with all the required equipment and I'm sure they could come-up with a new 99% compatable acurate PPU/CPU clone.

And this is why people are so gutted, NEX claimed to be this, and it wasn't. Make a Famiclone that has a decent acurate cloned PPU/CPU, with RGB/S-VHS/Composite & stereo output, Famicom and NES cart sockets and proper NES pad sockets and you're on to a winner.

[poloplayr]

Why oh why won't Nintendo just issue a 20th Anniversary NES system at a nice price??? I'm SURE it would sell like hotcakes.

[n8littlefield]

Why oh why won't Nintendo just issue a 20th Anniversary NES system at a nice price??? I'm SURE it would sell like hotcakes.

I think their answer would be the Revolutions "Virtual Console" thing allowing NES games to be playable.

[Mianrtcv]

I for one, in good conscience will not get one. I do not like to support hardware that could have been better produced. Yes consoles all have issues. This is different. This is a re-make of existing technology. It doesn't have dvd or other issues. It has a basic compatibility issue. Even if it is few, I have many NES consoles (so many people I know just gave them to me when they upgraded). If you have a decent old NES, I see no reason to "upgrade" to a unit that actually plays fewer games.

I was looking forward to this machine too. Oh well.
Then again, they can re-release a multitude of things and I'd be looking forward to most of them. Only now I'm a little more selective where my disposable income gets placed.

[Jagasian]

Why oh why won't Nintendo just issue a 20th Anniversary NES system at a nice price??? I'm SURE it would sell like hotcakes.

I think their answer would be the Revolutions "Virtual Console" thing allowing NES games to be playable.

It should be noted that the Revolution will most likely support even fewer games and peripherials than the NEX, simply because you will be restricted to games that Nintendo or licensed 3rd parties agree to re-release on the Revolution. Similarly, NES and Famicom peripherials will most likely NOT be supported. Dare I say that the Revolution is very over-hyped? Now if Nintendo said that they were going to sell a cart adapter and controller adapters so that you could play your actual carts and peripherials on the Revolution, then we'd be talking about something big!

But we are not. The Revolution is just NES software emulation running on a modern console. This has been done before with the Dreamcast, GBA, and Xbox. The Xbox NES emulator is actually quite good, and since it is unofficial, it doesn't restrict you to running games that Nintendo or 3rd parties decided to re-release. You can rip your own games and play them at will. However, there is no peripherial support, and the emulation isn't 100% perfectly accurate and compatible. Though it is better than the NEX, but then again, that isn't saying much if you know your emulators.

Nintendo could easily make a 100% compatible and accurate re-release of the NES, using modern fabrication technologies. It would cost very little to manufacture for them, and they could include their multi-out A/V connector seen on the SNES, N64, etc, so the system could have RCA composite, S-video, and even RGB!

Most of us don't want a new gaming system. We just want a better NES :/

[Ed Oscuro]

It would seem the hardware was outsourced to some company in Asia; they did a less than stellar job in it's design.
Christ. Pony up and hire some hardware enthusaists to do it!

[Cmosfm]

Why oh why won't Nintendo just issue a 20th Anniversary NES system at a nice price??? I'm SURE it would sell like hotcakes.

No it won't, the only people that would buy it would be the very small percentage of hardcore classic gaming enthusiasts. Large companies release items that the general public want, not just a selected group of people.

[omnedon]

Pony up. easy to post that isn't it.

Easy to criticize. Harder to actually do something.

[Mangar]

Easy to criticize. Harder to actually do something.

Yeah really. How dare someone criticize a product that hyped itself heavily, and then ended up sucking. They should just shut their stupid mouths about it already. How dare someone knock an inferior product!!

Don't you have a personal vested financial interest in the NEX? :D

[Ed Oscuro]

It's also easy to take money from classic gamers whom you've misrepresented a product to, isn't it?

I'm pretty surprised you'd post something like that, omnedon. Whose side are you on, here?

This sort of criticism is good for the hobby and indeed the industry - we really don't want people turned off of classic gaming because one company has made lousy decisions.

Again, these folks should've known of kevtris and his system, and he possibly would've let them have exclusive rights to sell the design (good thing that didn't happen, though, with the goofy design choices Messiah made this time around with the controller). I don't see how it could've cost more money to just pay him to use his design, and the company would certainly have a brighter future than it does now. On the other hand, there are still the issues with bad design and the apparently suspect build quality.

[Ed Oscuro]

Don't you have a personal vested financial interest in the NEX? :D
Whoa, just because Omnedon has one post up about the NeX doesn't mean he's in bed with the company. I don't see Messiah listed as a "friend" company, nor in any ads, nor are they listed as a company he does repairs for.

I think Omnedon's just lost his senses momentarily :P

[Mangar]

Whoa, just because Omnedon has one post up about the NeX doesn't mean he's in bed with the company. I don't see Messiah listed as a "friend" company, nor in any ads, nor are they listed as a company he does repairs for.

I think Omnedon's just lost his senses momentarily :P

Actually: His company is the Canadian distributor for the NEX system. A direct financial interest and link. If not for that, i'd agree with him losing his senses :)

[n8littlefield]

I'm not certain why he stands up for Messiah so much, but I will say I don't think it's directly financial. None of us here are likely to make him a huge profit selling the thing since most of us won't be buying it. I think it's likely that he knows more what went into getting the system released and has more sympathy towards Messiah given that. But that's just the impression I get, I certainly can't put words in his mouth...

[omnedon]

OSG sells Messiah products in Canada.


How dare someone criticize a product that hyped itself heavily, and then ended up sucking.

:angry:

WHERE ANYWHERE DID I SAY IT WAS BAD TO CRITICIZE ANYTHING? FIND WHERE I SAID IT AND QUOTE IT PLEASE.

:angry: :angry: :angry: :angry: :angry: :angry: :angry:
It is a simple fact that it is easier to talk about pie in the sky ideas, about ponying up money and doing it right from the comfort of your keyboard, THAN IT IS TO DO IT. Simple reading comprehension. Do you lack it?



ACTUALLY TRY TO DO SOMETHING and prepare yourself to be vilified by the community. It is pathetic.

Criticize, dislike and post to your hearts content. The guys behind Messiah are just like us, except they actually tried to DO SOMETHING. I can handle all the crap the GNEX deserves, such as issues about its pathetic compatibility (it's only 95% plus what crooks! :roll: ), and it's being expensive.

IT'S THE VILIFICATION OF THOSE WHO ACTUALLY TRIED TO BRING A PRODUCT TO THE COMMUNITY ARE BEING CRUCIFIED AS CROOKS AND THIEVES THAT IS MAKING ME QUESTION THE VALUES OF THIS COMMUNITY.

This place is starting to make me sick.

[fishsandwich]

This place is starting to make me sick.

Take a break, dude. This place has driven me to nausea on occasion, too. It's worth it in the end.

:puke:

[Jagasian]

I can handle all the crap the GNEX deserves, such as issues about its pathetic compatibility (it's only 95% plus what crooks! :roll: ), and it's being expensive.

95% is just another way to spin the problems. What does that number really mean? It really means that 95% of commercial USA NES games run, though possibly with additional bugs, on the NEX. It does not mean that they run correctly, without additional glitches. In fact, it is well documented (by NEX owners themselves) that games listed as working in Messiah's belated compatibility list from which the 95% number is derived, have additional unlisted glitches, bugs, flickering, missing sounds, inaccurate sounds, and incorrect colors. Furthermore, the 5% that do not even run are some of the most popular NES games. Also, reproductions of highly popular games such as Earthbound Zero, Final Fantasy 2, etc do not work on the NEX, yet they work on a real NES. You throw around the 95% number in order to play-down the truth.

The truth is that the NEX is one of the least compatible Famiclones. Its compatibility is also worse than emulators.

So Messiah is still not being up-front about the technical issues with its system, and neither are you. For crying out loud, it has been documented by the guys at NES Dev that the NEX wires its cart connector in such a way that it might actually damage games used with the system, or even the system itself! Imagine how happy somebody will be when the NEX fries their game and itself.

[omnedon]

You win Jag.

[Ed Oscuro]

Sorry, Omnedon, but they tried and failed.

I don't think it's apparent that Messiah lied - but they didn't make a very strong effort to verify with their contractor that work was going as planned, and that sort of thing starts lawsuits and throws companies into bankruptcy all the time.

I don't think it is realistic to expect a company, when faced with the apparent dilemma Messiah had, to issue a pre-release recall and simply swallow the losses, but they should have. This issue has destroyed any trust we could have in their brand. They should have recalled the units and started over to fulfill the promises they made to preorder customers.

I'm not especially happy that Sony's PS2 or Microsoft's 360 won't be fully backwards-compatible, but I'm very grateful they've been honest about this issue. Imagine what would happen if these consoles released to hype such as "our system is fully backward compatible!" People would be up in arms! Indeed, Sony is getting in trouble over the silver slimline PS2s not playing all PS2 games; it remains to be seen how that issue will be resolved, but we all should be able to expect they should do their best to inform consumers and not take the Messiah way of simply scaling back the system's compatibility and calling it fair.

It is the company's responsibility to verify with their outsourcing company that the project is proceeding as planned. A consumer should expect no less. Don't eat horse apples because the label said "peanut butter" and the brand owner was told by the farmer that they were getting peanut butter ;)

Furthermore, folks coming on here and spreading FUD about Jagasian's best and ultimately correct investigative work with regards to the Messiah, have hurt the community in much the same way I had with my bad game sale.

I never intended to hurt the community or lie, and indeed I never did if you define lying as having made your mind up to make a false statement - yet it was postponed for half a year, regardless, so the impact is the same! That "good will at the onset" didn't reduce the hurtful nature of what I did nor lessen my need to come make amends for it (which I think I mostly succeeded in doing). Likewise, if people are going to come here and spout nonsense about Messiah's products that hurts our ability to rely on the Roundtable as a forum for educated, mature discussions of our interests. Fanboys are one thing, but well-respected members with suspect agendas are harder to detect.

That is what we're up against. If you can't even admit that Messiah is well deserving of criticism, I have to protect myself and start looking to find - and call out - statements that hurt the community. That is what I always have tried to do. Sometimes it seems petty to say such-and-such a factoid is wrong, but sometimes it serves a greater good.

[Ed Oscuro]

Finally, yeah, I'm a bit concerned as well that Jagasian's post about claims regarding the NEX centered more on individuals than the company's pronouncements - but it's always nice to know what people are saying ;) Overall it's a credit to the community that somebody's fighting the good fight.

Oh boy, I have here a rare copy of...SHIT, the NEX fried it. Guess I don't!