Most technically advanced Super NES N64 & PS1 games?

[kevin_psx]

(No not Donkey Kong Country) LOL LOL LOL (That's just standard 2D sprites)



Super Nintendo?
N64?
PS1?

Not beautiful but Most graphically-technically advanced 2D game on each? (pushes the console to its limits)

Most graphically-technically advanced 3D game on each? (pushes the console to its limits)

[prismra]

Well, for SNES, I have heard that Final Fantasy VI was the most technical game released for the system but I wonder about Star Ocean as well...

[fishsandwich]

Tekken 3 pushes the PSX to its limits
Driver 2 goes beyond the those limits

Turok 2 pushes the N64 pretty hard, as does Sin & Punishment

[kevin_psx]

Driver 2 goes beyond the those limits

Is that bad?


Loved Turok 2! It was fun watching those lizards flop around on the ground. LOL

[heyricochet]

Are we including the super fx chip in "graphically advanced"? Cause then we get actual 3d power with Star Fox and Vortex and all those. It makes the argument much simpler when you're just arguing about 7 games or so.

Though I'd like to say Yoshi's island with the mode 7.

[Ed Oscuro]

Super Metroid always been been pretty stunning, and if you can get past Rendering Ranger's prerendered sprites (not that hard since they look pretty good), it's a very accomplished game that throws tons of stuff onscreen at once.

DOOM for SNES, of course, using the Super FX chip.

For N64, Turok 2 is pretty amazing - though I hear Turok 3 was even better. Conker got high marks, as well as Diddy Kong Racing. For import-only, there's Treasure's Sin and Punishment.

[prismra]

Though I'd like to say Yoshi's island with the mode 7.


I knew I was forgetting something! Didn't that use a special chip like SuperFX 2 or a special DSP or somthing?

[fishsandwich]

Driver 2 goes beyond the those limits

Is that bad?
LOL

Oh, yes! Driver 1 pushed the PSX damn hard without overtaxing it too much.

Driver 2, on the other hand, pushes the hardware beyond its limits. The game has got LOADS of slowdown... sometimes it's less than 10 frames per second. Entire city blocks pop up mere feet in front of your car. There's nothing quite like hiiting a decent rate of speed and then slamming head-on into a building that just jumped up in front of your eyes. I hate that damn game, and I really wanted to like it. I loved the first one.

[Retsudo]

Tekken 3 pushes the PSX to its limits



I agree. I remember they were saying the PS needed a add-on for the game to work. Boy did Namco surprised everyone. :P

[boatofcar]

I think Killer Instinct for the SNES really pushed the hardware to its limits.

[klausien]

Ridge Racer R4 was pretty sick on the PSX, as was Soul Blade. Namco had the PSX dialed.

On the N64, I would actually go with The Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask. Rogue Squadron, Battle for Naboo and Perfect Dark also pushed the system to the max.

On SNES, Terranigma was pretty hot, as was Final Fantasy VI. Also need to give special note to Space Megaforce. Compile managed to make a hell of a shmup considering the how slow the SNES CPU was.

[badinsults]

Yeah, Tekken 3 rules. Me and my friends used to play it for hours.

But yeah, in terms of snes games, Rendering Ranger is up there. At times there is up to 20 or so sprites moving on screen at once, and there isn't a bit of slowdown. Super Metroid is also a technical achievement, the game is huge and has amazingly varied graphics and sound. There is a reason why it takes a couple of seconds to load each room when you enter. F-zero was a technical achievement when it was released. The mode7 graphics were revolutionary, and at the time could only be replicated with expensive computers. Tales of Phantasia is another advanced snes game. It was one of the largest in terms of size, and did not use any special chips. It had a large amount of sampled voices, thought impossible for a cart.

[fishsandwich]

G Police: Weapons of Justice is another PSX game that really pushed the hardware. The first one was pretty damn graphically intensive, but the 2nd one (WoJ) was just too much. The developers actually resorted to WIRE FRAMES for some of the buildings in the near distance so you could see them coming before your chopper slammed into them. As you got closer, the wire frames would fill out with textures (but you were on top of them at that point.)

[Ed Oscuro]

Super Metroid is also a technical achievement, the game is huge and has amazingly varied graphics and sound. There is a reason why it takes a couple of seconds to load each room when you enter.
That's just a stylistic preference for the program - it's not necessary to do this. Even in the days when Metroid was on disk, the game only needed to load once per side, as the system held all the data from one disk side in memory at once.

[Famidrive-16]

Pokemon Puzzle League for the N64 had some FMv scenes. Pretty impressive, since FMVs were rare on that system.

[heyricochet]

Though I'd like to say Yoshi's island with the mode 7.


I knew I was forgetting something! Didn't that use a special chip like SuperFX 2 or a special DSP or somthing?

From Wikipedia:
The term Mode 7 originated on the Super NES video game console, on which it describes a simple texture mapping graphics mode that allows a background layer to be rotated and scaled. By modifying the scaling and positioning of the layer on a scanline-by-scanline basis a simple perspective effect can be applied, transforming the layer into a 2D horizontal texture-mapped plane that trades height for depth.

The super fx chip was real 3d, while mode 7 was a technique for making 3d from 2d.

[PS1Expert]

2D on PSX would have to be Lomax. They kept parallax scrolling in with smooth frames of animation (lots of frames!). Maybe Gunner's Heaven is second, although a two player co-op would have made it the #1 choice.

[Ed Oscuro]

Pokemon Puzzle League for the N64 had some FMv scenes. Pretty impressive, since FMVs were rare on that system.
So did Resident Evil 2.

[crazyjackcsa]

Pokemon Puzzle League for the N64 had some FMv scenes. Pretty impressive, since FMVs were rare on that system.
So did Resident Evil 2.

Just wanted to point out that it wasn't the systems limitations that kept FMV For the most part out of The N64's Library. It was space on the Cart. So there is nothing technically impressive with FMV on the N64. Hell the Genesis had FMV in a couple of games.

[Ed Oscuro]

It was space on the Cart. So there is nothing technically impressive with FMV on the N64.
Think about what you said for a while.

Then run into a wall.

Or don't, but thinking is a good thing in any case.

[CYRiX]

When my brother was playing Pokemon Stadium 2 I thought it was an early PS2 game because it looked so good.

[njiska]

Pokemon Puzzle League for the N64 had some FMv scenes. Pretty impressive, since FMVs were rare on that system.
So did Resident Evil 2.

Just wanted to point out that it wasn't the systems limitations that kept FMV For the most part out of The N64's Library. It was space on the Cart. So there is nothing technically impressive with FMV on the N64. Hell the Genesis had FMV in a couple of games.

RE 2 on the N64 is a pure technical master piece. Compressing the 2 cd's down to 512 Mb and then adding extra's was no small feat.

[mojofltr]

I was always impressed with Axelay on the SNES. I don't know that it was pushing the system to it's limits... ?

[Ed Oscuro]

RE 2 on the N64 is a pure technical master piece. Compressing the 2 cd's down to 512 Mb and then adding extra's was no small feat.
512Mbits of course (as you're aware, just clearing this up if anybody was wondering), which is only 64 megabytes.

That's smaller than the camera memory cards at my local charity store.

[crazyjackcsa]

It was space on the Cart. So there is nothing technically impressive with FMV on the N64.
Think about what you said for a while.

Then run into a wall.

Or don't, but thinking is a good thing in any case.

What is technically impressive about a developer making a choice between making a bigger game or making a small game with FMV? There is Zero that is techincally impressive about that choice. Remember all of the FMV on a the Sega CD? A techincally inferior system than the N64 could run far more FMV only due to the fact it was a CD based system. I thought this thread was about the system not the media that the system handled. I stand by my original post. It's not more technically impressive to run FMV on the N64 than it is to run Rendered sprites on the SNES. The only prohibitive factor is the size of the media as has been pointed out. A game that pushed the CART to the limit? No doubt in my mind. A Game that pushed the power of the system? Not a Chance.

Run into your own damn wall.

[kevin_psx]

It's not more technically impressive to run FMV on the N64 than it is to run Rendered sprites on the SNES.
Well said! Squeezing 1000 megabytes to 64 megabytes is not an N64 trait. It's the codec's efficiency & Pentium-PC used to crunch data. The N64's not creating the Video - merely playing it back like a VCR/DVD. So not taxing the console.

More impressive is the Zelda cut-scenes - the flashback to the Birth of the Triforce - they are created in real-time by the N64.



trivia - strip away the videos and RE2's program is only 25 megabytes. The Zelda programs are larger at 32 megabytes.

[njiska]

It was space on the Cart. So there is nothing technically impressive with FMV on the N64.
Think about what you said for a while.

Then run into a wall.

Or don't, but thinking is a good thing in any case.

What is technically impressive about a developer making a choice between making a bigger game or making a small game with FMV? There is Zero that is techincally impressive about that choice. Remember all of the FMV on a the Sega CD? A techincally inferior system than the N64 could run far more FMV only due to the fact it was a CD based system. I thought this thread was about the system not the media that the system handled. I stand by my original post. It's not more technically impressive to run FMV on the N64 than it is to run Rendered sprites on the SNES. The only prohibitive factor is the size of the media as has been pointed out. A game that pushed the CART to the limit? No doubt in my mind. A Game that pushed the power of the system? Not a Chance.

Run into your own damn wall.

Are you even paying attention to the subject at hand? The question is most technically advanced games. Compressing 2 cd's into 512 Mb, that's 64 MB, while mainting the same quality, keeping the the FMVs and adding bonus content, is a technical marvel.

[Whiskers the Wonder Cat]

Any Squaresoft/enix games seem to push the limits for the SNES and PSone.

[Jorpho]

For the SNES, I imagine it would be Tales of Phantasia. It's one of few 48 Mb games ever made, and the vocal piece is quite impressive. Star Ocean is probably up there too.

[kevin_psx]

It's not more technically impressive to run FMV on the N64 than it is to run Rendered sprites on the SNES. Are you even paying attention to the subject at hand? How rude.

Are you paying attention? "Most advanced (pushes the console to its limits)". Playing back pre-recorded videos don't challenge the console's CPU or GPU at all. Playing pre-recorded video is a brainless activity for the N64, PS1, Genesis, or any other system.



"fishsandwich"]Driver 2, on the other hand, pushes the hardware beyond its limits. The game has got LOADS of slowdown... sometimes it's less than 10 frames per second. Entire city blocks pop up mere feet in front of your car.
I may have to buy that game. Always wondered what a game looks like when it pushes a console with too many polygons.

What about Pokemon Stadium - does that push the N64 to its limits?

[sabre2922]

IMO these are the games that push BOTH THE CONSOLE AND THE GAME ITSELF (N64) TO THEIR LIMITS and still look and run GOOD

Snes:

Tarrinigma VERY IMPRESSIVE great colorful graphics that faar surpass 75% of the 2-D games released on PSX

3-D for Snes-DOOM sure it looks like crap now but when I first got this game I was very impressed that the old SNessy could actually do a decent DOOM plus it had the FX chip (rumored to be multiple FX chips something like 2-3)

Killer Instinct- literally KILLS the shitty hackjob N64 version IMO THIS IS THE GAME THAT REALLY PUSHED THE SNES AS FAR AS IT COULD GO



N64- Resident Evil 2 NO DOUBT ABOUT THIS ONE so incredible that they were able to compress 2 freaking cds into ONE N64 CART and actually make it all work FMV and everything

the two Zeldas pushed the N64 and still look decent today and thats saying something for a N64 game

Playstation-Metal Gear Solid

2-D Castlevania:Symphony of the Night -I remember reading and interview with a couple of the programmers that had worked on the game and they stated that they used every trick in the book to get the PSX version as perfect as possible therefore pushed the system more than most gamers think HELL THE SATURN VERSION WAS INFERIOR TO THE PSX VER and that is a rare thing indeed when cosidering the Saturn was a basically a 2-D POWERHOUSE when compared to the PSone.

I have to add Metal slug X also I thought it was a damn good port and impressive running on the PSX

Saturn:
Panzer Dragoon Saga NO QUESTION ABSOLUTELY BEAUTIFUL FLYING AND BATTLE SEQUENCES

2-D: Streetfighter Alpha 2 the most perfect arcade home port to a console ever in my opinion

[kevin_psx]

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I like this topic

[Ed Oscuro]

bump

I like this topic
D'ya have anything to add to it? ;)

[fishsandwich]

It's been said time and time again, but Radiant Silvergun really does show what the Saturn could do. Any given point in the game will features multiple layers of parallax scrolling (did I say that right?) along with hundreds (thousands?) of texture-mapped polygons and hundreds upon hundreds of sprites whizzing around the screen. It's 2-D and 3-D combined in a way that I haven't seen in any other game. I think the gameplay itself is a bit overrated, but that's just me.

I've read that Treasure developed (and possibly FINISHED) a port of Radiant Silvergun for the PSone but decided not to release it as it was a pale imitation of the Saturn original. Anyone else heard that?

Burning Rangers pushed the Saturn pretty hard. So did Grandia. Dead or Alive was pretty damned impressive, too.

[Jorpho]

Word is that Sin & Punishment is quite impressive on the N64.

[incubus421]

My vote on the SNES game that pushed it to the limits is Star Ocean all the way.
The cartridge actually had two chips of data in it, and one of them was a chip containing all the graphic packages. Needed two chips to fit all the kickassery into this great game.

[Iron Draggon]

(No not Donkey Kong Country) LOL LOL LOL (That's just standard 2D sprites)



Super Nintendo?
N64?
PS1?

Not beautiful but Most graphically-technically advanced 2D game on each? (pushes the console to its limits)

Most graphically-technically advanced 3D game on each? (pushes the console to its limits)

This doesn't make any sense. You want to know what is the most graphically-technically advanced 2D game on the SNES, but you say that DKC is just 2D sprites? All 2D games are just 2D sprites. So DKC (or one of its sequels) should certainly qualify as the most graphically-technically advanced 2D game on the system. No other 2D game on any system looks like it, except for the DKC games on the GBA. Its whole selling point at the time was that it looked even better than any of the 32X games for the Genesis, and it didn't require any additional hardware or even an additional chip to do so. I'd say that's extremely graphically-technically advanced. How else were they able to do it?

[Ed Oscuro]

DKC isn't the most graphically advanced simply because it's using canned material, and really - when you consider that bigger games exist (48 megabit ROMs for example), it's not even eligible under the pretext of ROM space.

As far as a graphically impressive game with prerendered stuff - I'd say Rendering Ranger beats it in that department. Still, both games aren't nearly as impressive as games that make heavy use of Mode 7 and/or multiple layer effects/transparency masks (Axelay, Super Metroid, Demon's Crest).

Asthetics would be a discussion for another thread. I doubt DKC would win there either ;)


N64: Seconding votes for Resident Evil 2 (for the movie) and Perfect Dark Zero. Also adding in Sin & Punishment: Successor of the Earth, if that wasn't mentioned yet.

[Doonzmore]

Rayman 2 on N64 looks beautiful.

[GuilewasNK]

SNES...

2D - Street Fighter Alpha 2

Yes, this game had issues with loading, but when you conisder everything that was squeezed into the cart it was quite impressive.

3D - Stunt Race FX

At the time the game was a pretty fast racer on the SNES and I think it was really fun for it's time. It had the best 3D world IMO.

N64

2D - Ogre Battle 64

Just a beautiful game. I'm a sucker for sprites.

3D - Resident Evil 2

This game REALLY pushed the system. The in-game engine was very sharp and the cutscene were still very good despite the compression.

PS One

2D - Castlevania: SOTN

Beautiful from start to finish. The little details were really amazing.

3D - Dead or Alive, the Fear Effect series.

Dead or Alive's visuals were superb and still look very good today.

The Fear Effect games seemed to get everything it could out of the system. The pre-rendered backgrounds were great and the character models are still awesome. Those games are some of the few 3D games on the PS One that aren't painful to look at today.

[rbudrick]

I think you all make some valid points...why the arguing? You're both right in your own ways.

Anyway, it's very hard to judge with some systems who pushed the hardest with their game unless you are one of the programmers and knew the hell you had to go through to make it work. I personally think that it's easier to judge how far a system was pushed with less advanced systems. Anyone ever seen the three Marios demo for the Atari 2600?!

-Rob

[incubus421]

N64

2D - Ogre Battle 64

Just a beautiful game. I'm a sucker for sprites.

3D - Resident Evil 2

This game REALLY pushed the system. The in-game engine was very sharp and the cutscene were still very good despite the compression.

Ah, the great Ogre Battle 64. Got to agree with you there, that games visuals stunned the hell out of me seeing them come from the N64. I should play through that game again sometime, it has been awhile...

[fishsandwich]

Rayman 2 on N64 looks beautiful.

I forgot about that one! That IS one beautiful game. Beats the crap out of the PSX version. Shadowman did the same, though it's not quite as pretty.

My 2 cents of the FMV thing... it IS amazing that Angel Studios was able to cram so much FMV into an N64 cart. However, it didn't tax the N64's processor at all. Turok 2 and Rayman 2 really pushed the systems PROCESSORS while RE2 was an impressive technical feat for a cartridge-based game.