Do you correct people when they incorrectly identify a genre

[DeputyMoniker]

Do you correct people when they say they like RPGs and then name games like GTA, Zelda and Ratchet & Clank? What about when they say they like racing games and name Mario Kart? When I hear racing, I think Ridge Racer, NFS or Gran Turismo. Its weird because Mario Kart is a race to the finish but I dont consider it a racer because of its battle elements...but I do consider Wipeout a racer...I think when you combine weapons, low speed and saturday morning Disney visuals & characters, I stop considering it a racer. (I love Mario Kart though...its just more of a party battle than it is a racer to me)

[pragmatic insanester]

i feel like this when i search for "beat em ups" on ebay and get a bunch of results for "mortal kombat" and "tekken".

[roushimsx]

yea, but no one ever listens *shrug*

edit - and I'd consider Mario Kart a racer but in the Kart Racer subgenre with all of the other Kart Racers.

Some games just defy being pigeon holed, like GTA:SA. Others are pretty equally balanced between multiple genres (River City Ransom is both a beat em up and an RPG and Deus Ex is a FPS and an RPG).

I think the only reason why games like Legend of Zelda ever got lumped in with RPGs is because they feature adventure elements (though Zelda II doesn't feature some bare-bones character stats and leveling, which I consider a fundamental difference between adventure games and rpgs).

Tangent -> I never liked the acronym "CRPG" because, really it could stand for Console RPG or Computer RPG. Maybe if it was dedicated to Consoles instead of PCs and then we adoped PCRPG then it'd be easier to shorthand the fuck out of discussions about how Anachronox should have been made for a console to begin with.

Seriously, why wasn't it made for Dreamcast? Why did the proposed Xbox sequel get shot down? Is there no god?

[jdc]

Yep. I used to cringe when I'd hear people put the terms "Resident Evil" and "role playing game" together. Although......technically....you ARE playing the role of Jill Valentine. Maybe they're right....maybe they're wrong. Meh....in the end, who gives a crap anyways. I stopped being bothered by it when the majority of RPGs went from being turn-based to real time. Watered down RPGs for the masses.

[DeputyMoniker]

yea, but no one ever listens *shrug*


Amen, brother.

[AMG]

Sometimes I do (or did at least), but most of the time I just don't bother anymore.

[kevin_psx]

Do you correct people when they say they like RPGs and then name games like GTA, Zelda and Ratchet & Clank? (I love Mario Kart though...its just more of a party battle than it is a racer to me)

YOU"RE WRONG! LOL LOL LOL LOL - Mario Kart is a racer but it falls in the kiddie or fantasy genre. Like Beetle Adventure Racing.

I laugh at people that call Grand Theft or Ratchet a RPG! I ask if they think Pac-Man is an RPG too? LOL

[RJ]

No, but I had someone over last week that called an Atari system the "5800."

I had to stifle my laughter- I had to be nice since I'd invited him over to play games!

[Dangerboy]

The worst actually happened the other day, exact customer quote:

"Yeah, I so think Mortal Kombat Shaolin [Knights] is a better RPG than Final Fantasy....it just flows better."

I know X, X-2 and VIII are bad, but damn man....

[Haoie]

All the time.

Especially when it comes to calling platformers adventure, and such.

[njiska]

If they're way off i do. For example i won't correct someone who calls Zelda an rpg, but i would correct a major screw up like calling The Warriors a fighting game.

[Whiskers the Wonder Cat]

Yes, at times. But, I also don't want to act like an a-hole when I do it. Because I HATE it when people correct me and end it with an "Idiot" or "Noob"

Just correct the person. Don't call him/her names. I hate those kinds of people.

[Damaramu]

Nope.

For the most part, I don't give two shits what people want to categorize Pac-Man or Ninja Gaiden.

I'm not so anal that I'm going to go around correcting people, as it's fucking annoying when people do it to me (especially when their correction is in fact wrong).

Remember that silly "Kung Fu Games" thread? Where the hell is my roll eyes icon? Ah, here it is: :roll:

[Thetik]

sometimes

I haate when people list Zelda Ocarina of Time in thier favourite RPGs. i dont know why. Zelda is not an RPG people its an adventure game :angry: or mabye even an adventure PRG....nawww. It just ticks me off when they say that. i consider it an adventure game.

[Dimitri]

Only whenever my friend tries to tell me that Metal Slug is a shmup, but Granada isn't. 'effin' backwards, that boy is.

And what's up with those brits calling fighters "beat 'em ups" and beat 'em ups "brawlers", eh? ;)

[Tron 2.0]

I all ways correct a person if they call "Contra or MetalSlug" a, shooter when there realy run'n gun games.

[kevin_psx]

I all ways correct a person if they call "Contra or MetalSlug" a, shooter when there realy run'n gun games.

What's the difference? Isn't contra just a third-person shooter?

[Whiskers the Wonder Cat]

Technically, they do shoot. And alot. There's nothing wrong with that.

[sharp]

I think genres are corss-over a lot of times. It's just what a person wants to make from it. That people call games rpg is mainly on ebay just like almost every game is rare if you tend to believe the sellers. You even see ultra-rare SMB/Duck Hunt carts for the NES.

[Biff_McFresh]

I really don't bother anymore, so much meshing of genres going on, and many games that you can make an argument deserve to be in this or that genre. *head explodes*

[boatofcar]

Nope.

For the most part, I don't give two shits what people want to categorize Pac-Man or Ninja Gaiden.



Ding ding ding! We have a winner!

[MrSmiley381]

Here's how I classify my games:

Fighters: Involves people fighting. The term QCF and Hadouken are generally used a lot in this type of game.

Shooters: Involves a 3D environment. Has a first-person or over the shoulder perspective. Generally very explodie.

Racers: People attempt to win a race. 'Nuff said.

RPG: Has stat and level-building. GTA is not an RPG. However, Elder Scrolls is. Final Fantasy and Shin Megami Tensei fit in this group.

Beat 'Em Ups: Involved people beating the shit out of each other in a pseudo-3D or 3D environment. Ninja turtles are prone to appear here.

SHMUPS: Involves space-ships blowing shit up. Contra and Metal Slug kinda fit here for me, because there's a shitload of things exploding. Almost anything made by Treasure fits here.

Action: Get to point A to B and kill anything that gets in the way. Doesn't necessarily have a save point or password system. Castlevania is an action game.

Adventure: Run around fighting things and it's an adventure. There's generally a lot more puzzles in adventure games. I would put GTA, Zelda, and the later Castlevania games in this group.

Given, there's all this cross-genre crap too. Give me a specific game and I can probably put it at least one group. Given, I'm not saying my post defines games for everyone. They just define games for me. Contra isn't always a shmup to people, which I suppose is fair enough.

Edit: If someone really makes an ass of himself, yeah, I correct him. If someone compares Halo to Street Fighter, I cut their balls off. Other than, I can't give a crap. Although comparing GTA to Final Fantasy also sounds pretty crazy.

God damn American games that brainwash people!

[Mianrtcv]

Regarding game identification of genre. No.

Regarding pornography, yes. A critical example follows. Because, as we all know a threesome of two girls and a guy is classified as gross (unless you are the guy). Whereas a threesome of girls... is classified as art. :D

[Ed Oscuro]

Its weird because Mario Kart is a race to the finish but I dont consider it a racer because of its battle elements
?!?!

[davepesc]

Nope.

For the most part, I don't give two shits what people want to categorize Pac-Man or Ninja Gaiden.



Ding ding ding! We have a winner!

I'll third that. "Proper" classifications don't mean much to the vast majority of players. I don't correct unless it's a big mistake, like telling me they are buying a game for a system I know they don't own or something.

[ZombieFish]

If they make an obvious mistake, such as call a game like Super Mario Bros. an RPG, I correct them. Besides that, I just let it go, I think it's really annoying when people correct me like that.

[TurboGenesis]

Halo = FPS as in FIRST PERSON shooter - walking aimlessly in hallways and fields with some firearm

R-type = Shooter as in 2d scrolling 1(sometimes 2) characters vs the world/universe

I'm tired of arguing with people over this so now i have resorted to calling a shooter/shoot 'em up, SHOOTIES. yes sir no one misunderstands me when I refer to Chaos Field as a shootie. It sounds so silly no one would want to put that lable on a big bad macho game like battlefield 2.

[Hep038]

I let Comic Book Guy do all of my video game genre correcting.





http://animatedtv.about.com/library/graphics/cbg_small.jpg


"Pong is a sports game not a RPG!"

[Daria]

sometimes

I haate when people list Zelda Ocarina of Time in thier favourite RPGs. i dont know why. Zelda is not an RPG people its an adventure game :angry: or mabye even an adventure PRG....nawww. It just ticks me off when they say that. i consider it an adventure game.

You need thicker skin.

[Tron 2.0]

I all ways correct a person if they call "Contra or MetalSlug" a, shooter when there realy run'n gun games.

What's the difference? Isn't contra just a third-person shooter?
I see, Conta as more as run'n gun given how much controll you have over it.

[Tron 2.0]

Given, there's all this cross-genre crap too. Give me a specific game and I can probably put it at least one group. Given, I'm not saying my post defines games for everyone. They just define games for me. Contra isn't always a shmup to people, which I suppose is fair enough.

Agreed.

[Aussie2B]

Considering that everyone has their own personal definition for the various genres and there is yet to be any set standard, there's really little point in correcting people. Of course, I secretly want to scream "That's not an RPG!" to people sometimes, but what can you do. To some people, all you need for an RPG is anime-style characters and some form of stats (just look out how often simulation games, even dating sims, are called RPGs).

I don't think I'll ever be able to stop cringing over the term "Action RPG", though. It's a complete oxymoron to me. If you make a spectrum of game genres, action is at one end and RPG at the other. You can't just slap the two words together and call it a day. There are strategy RPGs and real-time RPGs and even other kinds of RPGs besides the traditional, but none of them feature true action-based gameplay. The games that DO have action-based gameplay shouldn't be labeled as RPGs in the first places, such as Zelda, Faxanadu, StarTropics, etc. Those are all adventure games, a genre term far underused these days (except in cases where it is misused, such as when describing a modern platformer).

[TRM]

I don't think I'll ever be able to stop cringing over the term "Action RPG", though. It's a complete oxymoron to me. If you make a spectrum of game genres, action is at one end and RPG at the other. You can't just slap the two words together and call it a day. There are strategy RPGs and real-time RPGs and even other kinds of RPGs besides the traditional, but none of them feature true action-based gameplay. The games that DO have action-based gameplay shouldn't be labeled as RPGs in the first places, such as Zelda, Faxanadu, StarTropics, etc. Those are all adventure games, a genre term far underused these days (except in cases where it is misused, such as when describing a modern platformer).

No, no no...they are not adventure games. Well Faxanadu is, but the others are not. Faxanadu is to Zelda/Star Tropics as Zelda/StarTropics is to Final Fantasy. They are different enough - type games...so how can they be lumped with Faxanadu as "adventure" games, yet not lumped together with FF as RPGs?

[anagrama]

And what's up with those brits calling fighters "beat 'em ups" and beat 'em ups "brawlers", eh? ;)

It's been like that at least since SFII first debuted back in '91. Who's to say it isn't all you 'merkins who've got it wrong? ;)

And no, none of it bothers me in the slightest. Anyone getting wound up about such definitions probably has far too much time on their hands - why the obsession to pigeon-hole every game anyway? For any genre you could think of, there's always going to be cross-overs, borderline cases and exceptions.
Enjoy games for what they are, not because of the box you want to fit them into.

[Ackman]

It always been IIRC and everyone in the know has always told me....

Fighters = Fighting games SF2, MK, KOF, Tekken etc

party fighters = SSBM, Powerstone, Isuka

brawlers/beat em ups = brawlers double dragon, final fight, streets of rage etc etc

it's not hard

shaolin monks isn't helping any either it does have a fight mode in it too and look like it set to get fighting game of the year in one those stupid fixed gaming awards if the fiddy cent game doesn't nudge it out OH GAWD x_x

[Aussie2B]

I don't think I'll ever be able to stop cringing over the term "Action RPG", though. It's a complete oxymoron to me. If you make a spectrum of game genres, action is at one end and RPG at the other. You can't just slap the two words together and call it a day. There are strategy RPGs and real-time RPGs and even other kinds of RPGs besides the traditional, but none of them feature true action-based gameplay. The games that DO have action-based gameplay shouldn't be labeled as RPGs in the first places, such as Zelda, Faxanadu, StarTropics, etc. Those are all adventure games, a genre term far underused these days (except in cases where it is misused, such as when describing a modern platformer).

No, no no...they are not adventure games. Well Faxanadu is, but the others are not. Faxanadu is to Zelda/Star Tropics as Zelda/StarTropics is to Final Fantasy. They are different enough - type games...so how can they be lumped with Faxanadu as "adventure" games, yet not lumped together with FF as RPGs?

And you've just proved my point that everyone has their own personal definition of the genres. ;) It would be pointless to argue over it.

But I will point out that Nintendo themselves, the creators of the Zelda games, label them as Adventure games. I personally always place the genre definition stated by the developer above all else.

[kevin_psx]

I don't think I'll ever be able to stop cringing over the term "Action RPG", though. The games that DO have action-based gameplay shouldn't be labeled as RPGs in the first places, such as Zelda, Faxanadu, StarTropics, etc. Those are all adventure games,

What about Kingdom Hearts or Tales of Destiny? they are action games but use stats to determine battle outcome. Action-RPGs.

Maybe Non-Turn RPG would be a better name?

[Aussie2B]

I don't consider the gameplay of the Tales series to be true action. Like Star Ocean and the ilk, I classify them as real-time RPGs.

I've never played Kingdom Hearts, so I'll refrain from commenting on it. What little I know of it makes it sound like a Secret of Mana-style adventure game, but I could be completely wrong as far as I know.

[Ed Oscuro]

Nope.

For the most part, I don't give two shits what people want to categorize Pac-Man or Ninja Gaiden.
Ding ding ding! We have a winner!
I'll third that. "Proper" classifications don't mean much to the vast majority of players. I don't correct unless it's a big mistake, like telling me they are buying a game for a system I know they don't own or something.
Personally, I try to do things "right" when talking about games, because it makes me look smarter ;)

But in the case of somebody else talking about games, you can't hold it against them. Listen to their observations about the gameplay, that'll tell you what they know about the game and is often much better than trying to pare the description down to a simple three-word label.

[kevin_psx]

I don't consider the gameplay of the Tales series to be true action. Like Star Ocean and the ilk, I classify them as real-time RPGs. What little I know of Kingdom Hearts makes it sound like a Secret of Mana-style adventure game, but I could be completely wrong as far as I know.


KH has a window full of stats just like Square's other Final Fantasy games. But it's not turn-based. It plays like Tales of Destiny/Symphonia/Star Ocean. You should play Kingdom Hearts. It has a good story. End on a cliffhanger & I can't wait to see Part 2!

How is Secret of Mana an adventure game? It felt RPG to me - leveling up & all that jazz?

Real-Time RPG sounds like a good description to me. Turn-based VS. Real-Time. I will adopt that from you.

[TRM]

I don't think I'll ever be able to stop cringing over the term "Action RPG", though. It's a complete oxymoron to me. If you make a spectrum of game genres, action is at one end and RPG at the other. You can't just slap the two words together and call it a day. There are strategy RPGs and real-time RPGs and even other kinds of RPGs besides the traditional, but none of them feature true action-based gameplay. The games that DO have action-based gameplay shouldn't be labeled as RPGs in the first places, such as Zelda, Faxanadu, StarTropics, etc. Those are all adventure games, a genre term far underused these days (except in cases where it is misused, such as when describing a modern platformer).

No, no no...they are not adventure games. Well Faxanadu is, but the others are not. Faxanadu is to Zelda/Star Tropics as Zelda/StarTropics is to Final Fantasy. They are different enough - type games...so how can they be lumped with Faxanadu as "adventure" games, yet not lumped together with FF as RPGs?

And you've just proved my point that everyone has their own personal definition of the genres. ;) It would be pointless to argue over it.

But I will point out that Nintendo themselves, the creators of the Zelda games, label them as Adventure games. I personally always place the genre definition stated by the developer above all else.

How can Faxanadu be classified as an adventure game, and Startropics and zelda be classfied as an adventure game, when Faxanadu is totally different from the other two?

[anagrama]

How can Faxanadu be classified as an adventure game, and Startropics and zelda be classfied as an adventure game, when Faxanadu is totally different from the other two?

Because trying to fit every game ever made into a finite set of definitions is simply an impossible exercise?

[Ed Oscuro]

Interesting article, by the way, that deals with the change of game genres over time:

http://arstechnica.com/articles/paedia/gaming-evolution.ars

Haven't read past the first page, but it looks promising so far. Some good discussion in their forums as well (here) (http://episteme.arstechnica.com/groupee/forums/a/tpc/f/174096756/m/866009475731/p/1).

[Aussie2B]

My personal definition of an RPG involves much more than level ups and stats. You could throw those features into virtually any kind of game, but it doesn't suddenly make it an RPG. For example, Castlevania: Symphony of the Night has stats, leveling up, spells, equipment, and lots of RPG type features, but the gameplay itself is not that of an RPG. It's more akin to a Metroid game. Which, incidentally, I also consider to be adventure games. Like the RPG genre with its multitude of sub-genres (strategy, turn-based, ATB, real-time, etc.), the adventure genre must also be broken into sub-genres to account for the significant differences one may have from another. This is why Faxanadu, while certainly different from Zelda and StarTropics, fits into the genre. It's close enough to the games to belong (especially in comparison to Zelda II), yet too far from the gameplay of an RPG (or action game, for that matter) to fit there.

[mezrabad]

I never liked hearing Diablo called an RPG when it first came out. I didn't know what to call it (fantasy, stat driven clickfest?) To me an RPG was a game like one of the middle Ultimas.

I don't get bothered much by mis-genred videogames now.

What does bother me, is when "movie" mainstreamers refer to the "animation genre". As in "I generally don't find much of interest in the 'animation genre'."

My response: :puke:

Animation is not a genre, it's an artform!

I *am* very pleasant when I say "Oh, so there are two 'Movie' genres are there? The 'live-actors genre' and the 'animation genre', is that what you mean?" The discussion continues from there. I usually wish I hadn't brought it up. It's hard to teach a pig to sing. It usually wastes my time and I find that it often annoys the pig.

[Iron Draggon]

I don't correct anyone, but I hate it when people call games like Zelda an adventure game. Myst is an adventure game. Zelda is an action RPG.

[Arcade Antics]

I don't correct anyone, but I hate it when people call games like Zelda an adventure game. Myst is an adventure game. Zelda is an action RPG.
How does Zelda not qualify as an adventure game? @_@ I'd say that Link goes on quite an an adventure.

And Myst isn't an adventure game. It's a boring game. ;)

[Aussie2B]

Zelda was labeled as an adventure game LONG before Myst even existed. ;) I agree that Myst is an adventure game, but I'd simply place it in the sub-genre of point-and-click adventure games (where you also find games like Shadowgate and Maniac Mansion which are annoyingly refered to as RPGs occasionally as well).

[kevin_psx]

Zelda is a Real-time RPG? Wow. Didn't know. Please show me the following stats - or equivalent

strength
intelligence
defense
magic defense
luck
thank you



Super Metroid = 3rd person adventure
Metroid Prime = 1st person adventure - not FPS

Just clarifying. :D :-P :) ;) :kiss: :bigmac: :cheers:

[mezrabad]

Zelda is a Real-time RPG? Wow. Didn't know. Please show me the following stats - or equivalent

strength
intelligence
defense
magic defense
luck
thank you



Forgive me for going a little off-topic. This thread was supposed to be more of a discussion about behavior as it relates to the communication of genre opinions, rather than arguments for a game being in a particular genre.

Kevin, it looks like you're asking your question to "prove a point", and, quite frankly, you don't. The manner in which you present your request seems to suggest that since no one can produce those stats in Zelda, then it isn't an RPG. Because an RPG without stats, just isn't an RPG. Because you say so. You're entitled to that opinion, but I ask you to consider mine.

I think you're making an assumption that a role playing game is only a role playing game if it has the stats you listed and if it includes the feature that allows a player to examine their character and look at the numbers which indicate the "power" or "level" of each of those stats.

Personally, I don't think that needs to be the case.

What does every RPG water down to? Your character starts off with very little in the way of weapons, defense and abilities. As time passes and your character's experience in the world increases, you gain better weapons, better defense and more abilities. Along the way there's a world to explore and plots and subplots to uncover and enjoy.

All of that growth allows you to explore increasingly dangerous areas and allows you advance the storyline.

The whole point of ANY RPG, in my opinon, is the development of your character, your character's exploration of the world and the advancement and discovery of the plot and subplots.

Does that not describe Zelda? I'm only familiar with The Wind Waker, but that that sure as hell sounds like Zelda to me.

I think stats are just one way to help you see and gauge your character's growth. The use of stats in Zelda is minimized but you can still see your character's growth in the way of added abilities, better weapons and defense as well as increased health and magic reserves.

Some RPGs might cause the player to say: "Hey, my strength has increased to 18/75, I can carry more!" while a player in Zelda would say "Hey, I'm stronger now! I can lift bigger rocks!" The whole point is: you got stronger.

It's a genre-mix, no doubt, as RPGs in the traditional sense don't require any reflexes and give you plenty of time to make choices while Zelda clearly has real-time action elements that do rely on the coordination of the player.

Now that I think about it. IF we can call Zelda a type of RPG, for the reasons I gave (It posesses the elements that contribute to the feeling of growth of the player's character through improvements of weapons, defense and abilities also functioning to advance the player through world areas and move the story along) then we could call Metroid a type of realtime RPG, too. Though I don't think there are many people who would buy into that.

My overall point would be: it's pretty subjective, don't act like it is cut and dried.

[Yamazaki]

Actually you could say every game is an RPG!

A Role-playing-game!
You don't play yourself in the game, you play somebody else be it Tekken, Mario or Zelda.


To me if someone wants to correct me or gets pissed off because of that , he just appears like some stupird nerd.