One thing about Shmups...

[Gunstarhero]

One thing about Shmups ...is you always seem to be able to get an ultra-powerfull ship in the beginning rounds, which enables you to blast thru enemies with relative ease, even the bosses. But then IT happens. You catch a bullet and lose your ultra-powerfull ship. With this, you've lost the initiative, you've lost the rythm that you had going up to that point, and you've lost your concentration a little bit. All of a sudden, your on the defensive trying your damndest to weave thru tons and tons of bullets just to get One powerup, and it seems like a losing battle the rest of the way where you spend more time dodging bullets instead of before when the enemy didn't even have a chance to fire any bullets because YOU were filling the screen with them!

One thing about Shmups...I hate losing a ship before I've spent my cache of
Special Weapons. It makes me feel like a loser.

[maxlords]

Most of the purist shmuppers try to not use them at all :) And you're right...shmups are one of hte most challenging genres cause you can lose it all and be complete toast in the blink of an eye.

[Kid Fenris]

I find that my favorite shooters are the ones that don't use the crutch of robbing you of all of your weapons upon defeat. Radiant Silvergun, Axelay, and Ikaruga never resort to this gimmick, and when they frustrate me, it's because of their challenging design, not because of an unfair power-up system.

Other shooters sidestep the problem by making it easy to regain your powerups. ESP Ra.De. always has a ton of "P" icons wafting across the screen, and Blazing Lazers throws a weapon upgrade at you every five seconds.

[Captain Wrong]

Most of the purist shmuppers try to not use them at all :)

*raises hand*

I'm about halfway between a purist and forgetful that I have them. :) I'll always pick them up if they give you points, but I rarely use them.

What's really fun is when you get comfortable at a game seeing how far you can get without even powerups. Some games are nearly impossible like this, but others can be done.

I don't think it's cheap when you lose your powerups if you die. I think it gives you greater incentive to stay alive. I find games where you get everything when you come back tend to lull me to sleep. (Axelay and Ikaruga don't have power ups, that's why you don't lose them. :P But man it pisses me off in Axelay when someone shoots out my prefered guns (the first one.))

[Ascending Wordsmith]

Losing all your weapons ain't too bad... unless it's on a later stage. Gradius is notorious for taking away your ship's speed and putting you against even faster enemies.

Does anybody else hate when you get a powerup you didn't want? This happens to me alot on some SHMUPS. I destroy an enemy that's carrying a powerup. I don't want this particular powerup but thanks to a barrage of bullets headed my way, I'm coaxed into getting it.

OR some SHUMPS have powerups that cycle. You have to time it just right or you'll get a powerup you don't want.

[jaydubnb]

Losing all your weapons ain't too bad... unless it's on a later stage. Gradius is notorious for taking away your ship's speed and putting you against even faster enemies.

Does anybody else hate when you get a powerup you didn't want? This happens to me alot on some SHMUPS. I destroy an enemy that's carrying a powerup. I don't want this particular powerup but thanks to a barrage of bullets headed my way, I'm coaxed into getting it.
.

UGH..i HATE when that happens. One of the biggest culprits of that is Gunhed/Blazing Lazers. That game spews a crap load of powerups at you and on the harder levels, bullet dodging=picking up the wrong item >:(

I remember I bought this topic up @ Shmups.com's messageboard a while ago, and of the "uber-elite" basically said i was a crap player :hmm: I'm glad someone here understands 8-)

[Iron Monkey]

Is Shumps not Member "Three Stooges" Clan?
Attack with Force!
HAAAAAAAAAI!

[Kid Fenris]

I'm about halfway between a purist and forgetful that I have them. :) I'll always pick them up if they give you points, but I rarely use them.

What's really fun is when you get comfortable at a game seeing how far you can get without even powerups. Some games are nearly impossible like this, but others can be done.

I don't think it's cheap when you lose your powerups if you die. I think it gives you greater incentive to stay alive. I find games where you get everything when you come back tend to lull me to sleep. (Axelay and Ikaruga don't have power ups, that's why you don't lose them. :P But man it pisses me off in Axelay when someone shoots out my prefered guns (the first one.))

Maybe I'm just a shmup poseur, but I don't get the whole "beat it in one continue" or "beat it without any power-ups" schools of thought. Both seem to indicate either some desperate boredom or the desire to falsely extend a game's value. There are a few superb shooters where you can't help but play to the point of self-imposed challenges, but that's more of a fun expression of familiarity than a reflection of how the game is meant to be played.

(And I never implied that Axelay and Ikaruga have power-ups. :P :P )

[Captain Wrong]

Naah, I don't think you're a shmup poseur. Hell, I'm just happy other people enjoy playing them.

I really don't know how to explain it. I guess it's like this, the one continue thing, for me anyway, comes from not having a lot of money as a kid. When I'd play these games in the arcade, I had to get as far as I could on one quarter, because that was probably all I had. Plus, I really think that's how these games were meant to be played. As any mainstream reviewer could tell you, shmups are awfully short and lacking challenge if you're continuing constantly.

The no powerups thing, it's like climbing Everest. Why do it? Because you can! It's fun to me just to really test myself like that. I like feeling like I've mastered a game and for me that's the ultimate sign of mastery.

I could go farther, there's some games I play totally going on reflexes not shooting ANYTHING. Ikaruga plays pretty well like that, there's some obstacles you gotta shoot, but because you can time out the bosses it's possible to finish without shooting a single enemy. (I've never done it, but it can be done.)

Now, you're probably thinking I'm really off the deep end! Not really tho. It's not boredom or trying to stretch replay value. For me I see shmups as being really open ended in the ways you can play. I just like to try as many different ways as I can. I think a lot of games were designed with this in mind (example, you get a special rank in Ikaruga for finishing a level without shooting an enemy) and I like to find the different things the creators had in mind.

[bargora]

me = crap player, for sure.

The thing is, I feel like every shmup with an "ending" throws down a gauntlet and sneers "bet you can't make it with one credit." Plus, if you're playing for score, you're finished when your first credit is.

No matter how many continues I use, though, I still can't get to the end of Xevious. ;)

[bargora]

@jaydubnb: Check this thread out--the uber-elites are all bitching about the horrors of picking up one too many speed-ups!

http://dynamic5.gamespy.com/~shmups/shmupsforum/viewtopic.php?t=1258