the "HD era" is for real.... But it requires a HDT

[Anthony1]

Alot of people are somewhat unimpressed with what the 360 is showing in it's early launch games. Well, chances are, these people aren't playing them on a large, high quality HDTV display.


I can tell you right now, that a 360 hooked up to a proper HDTV display, looks freaking drop dead gorgeous. I mean, you will see shit that you never imagined was possible. The HD Era is for real as far as I'm concerned. Anybody that doesn't believe me, take a flight to Sacramento, California and come to my Garage. I got a 8 1/2 foot screen that will say otherwise. I run my 360 in 720p, and the Infocus X1 downscales it to 800 x 600 and still looks freaking amazing.


I'm talking totally amazing.


You see NBA 2K6 running in 720p on a that size of a HDTV screen, and you will literally wonder if what you are experiencing is real. No joke.

I'm dead serious.






Now... Here is the bad part. The bad part is that the 360 doesn't look that great on my 51 inch Sony in my living room. It looks impressive, but it doesn't look light years beyond Xbox 1 games. So, you are probably thinking, "Ok, so the 360 looks great on gigantic screens and looks mediocre on normal screens, who gives a rats ass, none of us have a 8 foot screen in our damn garages".

Well, the 360 looks absolutely astonishing on my little 30 inch 16:9 princeton graphics AF 3.0 HD precision HDTV reference display. Of course, it's no coincidence that a AF 3.0 can display the full native 720p signal in it's natural form.


For example.... Playing Madden '06 on the 8 foot screen is amazing, just for the sheer scope of it all, but playing it on my little Princeton Graphics 30 incher is an even better experience. Sure you sacrifice an incredible reduction in size, but you gain significantly greater detail. The detail gets so damn ridiculous at times that it actually distacts from the gameplay!!! I mean, it's like you have to stop sometimes and just admire what you are witnessing on screen. Of course, in alot of games, doing that will get you killed. Or sacked. Or posterized.


Right now, I have NBA 2K6, Madden 06, Perfect Dark Zero, Kameo, Condemned and Project Gotham Racing in my possesion. I'm renting Condemned and NBA 2K6. I ended up buying Kameo, Prefect Dark, Madden and PGR. All 6 of these games look absolutely amazing. Project Gotham Racing is probably the biggest Tour De Force. NBA 2K6 is a close second. Condemned, PDO and Madden are all very impressive as well. I'm happy as hell with these games.


But I can definitely say that all of these games look dramatically different on the various TV's that I play them on. It's amazing to me, how playing the 360 on different kinds of TV's, gives such dramatically different results.


The 360 on my 51 inch Sony HDTV looks quite mediocre. I mean, it definitely looks better than Xbox 1, but not by a drastic margin. And this is an ok HDTV. So I can imagine how dissapointing the 360 could seem on non High Def TV's.

However, seeing Madden on my Princeton Graphics or NBA 2K6 on my 8 foot dream is like a religious experience.

[stressboy]

Whoa.. you got a big screen? @_@

[-hellvin-]

I'm dead serious.

Look out, he's wearing his serious face.

[Leo_A]

I guess if you're in it for pretty graphics, you're all set.

[Pente]

You see NBA 2K6 running in 720p on a that size of a HDTV screen, and you will literally wonder if what you are experiencing is real. No joke.


I guess if you're in it for pretty graphics, you're all set.

Aww come on man.. who here DOESN'T want the most ultra realistic graphics ever? That's what games are all about! Just think of the possibilities....

http://www.thewavemag.com/images/articles/9001-10000/9273.jpg

:P

[Leo_A]

I just said it to bug RGB boy (Anthony1). :)

But I do disagree with you, graphics are nice but there's got to be a reason why I'm still buying and enjoying 20-30 year old games. It's not nostaliga if I never touched a certain game when I was growing up and still can buy it and enjoy it today.

Graphics are nice but they're only part of the equation. Graphics are most important for me for simulations anyways which most of these games aren't. That's a genre that's pretty much limited to PC gaming.

[Lothars]

You see NBA 2K6 running in 720p on a that size of a HDTV screen, and you will literally wonder if what you are experiencing is real. No joke.


I guess if you're in it for pretty graphics, you're all set.

Aww come on man.. who here DOESN'T want the most ultra realistic graphics ever? That's what games are all about! Just think of the possibilities....

http://www.thewavemag.com/images/articles/9001-10000/9273.jpg

:P

I mean graphics are good but Gameplay is the only way to go

Im not sure if really any of the xbox 360 games really have anything special to them, but it of course will change.

[Ed Oscuro]

I'm dead serious.

Look out, he's wearing his serious face.
I'm looking out...for dead pixels, and SUPER BUYS!!!

:D

[Anthony1]

Actually, the main point that I'm trying to convey with this thread, is that the XBOX 360 is a unique system, in that the perceived performance of the system is tied directly the the kind of TV that you are hooking it up to.


This is the first system, where this has really been a major issue. Sure, XBOX 1 looks great in 480p, and it's definitely a difference, and the Dreamcast looks great in 480p..... But the XBOX 360 is really designed with HDTV's in mind, and that is why MS keeps talking about the "HD Era" over and over and over.


I'm just saying that now I understand why MS keeps harping on the HD era over and over. It's because you can't really see the true value of the 360 unless you see it on a kick ass HDTV display. It's kinda sad really. So many people don't have a kick ass HDTV display, and then there is a good number that has a pretty kick ass HDTV, but still doesn't know how to hook it up the right way, etc, etc.


As for the whole graphics debate, well, I'm definitely a certified graphics whore, both with retrogames and modern stuff. But honestly, I can't understand why there is always this debate between graphics and gameplay. Like they are mutually exclusive or something? I mean, it's not like you can't have your cake and eat it too. Every 360 game that I have right now, is a very solid game. And all of them have graphics that are pretty amazing. Is that really so hard to achieve? Great graphics and great gameplay?


I think it's much easier to achieve both than most people think. Project Gotham Racing 3 might be the most beautful game on the planet right now, but it also has tremendous gameplay. I can say the same thing about a number of 360 games.


Whenever you get a brand new system, one of the first things that you use to judge it's power, is how good the graphics are. How much of a leap is there from the previous systems to this brand new one. Graphics is always going to be one of the major ways you decide just how powerfull a machine is. Gameplay is tremendously underrated, but so is sound. So many people totally forget about the sound part. But I digress......


Our initial opinions of a brand new system will always be dramatically affected by the quality of graphics of the launch games. It's always been this way, and it will always be this way. For good or bad. I remember the launch of the SNES, and judging the SNES based on some of the early games. Games which to this day are classic games, but also have some powerfull eye candy. Especially for 1991. Well the 360 is powerfull eye candy for 2005. Some things never change.

[Leo_A]

Problem is stuff like PGR3 don't do anything new beyond graphics. In fact PGR3 is more like a stripped down PGR2 in that it only has supercars and doesn't have the broad spectrum of choices the previous one did.

I'd want more in every area besides graphics to be truely happy. And definately don't let features be sacrificed for the sake of good graphics (Which seems to have happened to the EA games and PGR3's selection of cars in my opinion).

[badinsults]

I think the biggest problem with the HD era is that most HD TVs are still three times as expensive as regular TVs. In a couple of years things might be more even, but really, HD is not something most people care about yet.

[Arkaign]

AWESOME HD solution for gamers : http://cgi.ebay.com/SONY-TRINITRON-24-CRT-MONITOR-GDM-FW900_W0QQitemZ8727288940QQcategoryZ99235QQssPageN ameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Hard to find a 16:9 for that cheap that can do 720p, 1080p, etc.

[Chronodriftersx]

AWESOME HD solution for gamers : http://cgi.ebay.com/SONY-TRINITRON-24-CRT-MONITOR-GDM-FW900_W0QQitemZ8727288940QQcategoryZ99235QQssPageN ameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Hard to find a 16:9 for that cheap that can do 720p, 1080p, etc.

geez you wouldn't know it was widescreen by looking at those pictures

[Sylentwulf]

IMO, my opinion of the 360 graphics, and a lot of others comes from seeing them in store, setup, in kiosks...........

wait for it................................................ ..

Here it comes.............................................

On the HD Plasma screens that MS setup with the kiosks!!!

The menus look FANTASTICLY sharp. Then COD2 pops up on the screen and it looks like a 4 year old PC game, or a standard PS2 game frankly. I expected to be vaguely unimpressed when I saw the 360 in action, but I was COMPLETELY underwhelmed personally.

[Chronodriftersx]

Well I tried playing Perfect Dark in one of those 360 displays but the fricken thing kept going back to the menu whenever I pushed any buttons at all before the game would even get started, screw this thing. :angry:

[gepeto]

Hi Anthony 1

Quick question. I bought a cheap hdtv this weekend during black friday. It has an hdmi input with componets inputs.
I have a system selector pro. The 360 games look excellent but I am using s video on all the others any way to sharpen the gamecube graphics I believe took a hit not as sharp and crisp at least when playing re4. It still looks good though. The ps2 seems to hold its own the as well the dramcast.

[Arkaign]

AWESOME HD solution for gamers : http://cgi.ebay.com/SONY-TRINITRON-24-CRT-MONITOR-GDM-FW900_W0QQitemZ8727288940QQcategoryZ99235QQssPageN ameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Hard to find a 16:9 for that cheap that can do 720p, 1080p, etc.

geez you wouldn't know it was widescreen by looking at those pictures

Hahaha, yeah the guy who posted it must suck at posting stuff. Here's a better pic :)

http://img463.imageshack.us/img463/8362/gw9009nu.png

EDIT : Wow here's one for $225 + $100 shipping

http://cgi.ebay.com/24-SONY-HP-COMPAQ-A7217A-WIDE-FLAT-CRT-GDM-FW900-USB_W0QQitemZ8727288536QQcategoryZ99235QQssPageNam eZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

$325 is awesome for a progressive-scan 720p/1080p-capabale monitor like this.

[wberdan]

IMO, my opinion of the 360 graphics, and a lot of others comes from seeing them in store, setup, in kiosks...........

wait for it................................................ ..

Here it comes.............................................

On the HD Plasma screens that MS setup with the kiosks!!!

The menus look FANTASTICLY sharp. Then COD2 pops up on the screen and it looks like a 4 year old PC game, or a standard PS2 game frankly. I expected to be vaguely unimpressed when I saw the 360 in action, but I was COMPLETELY underwhelmed personally.


i must say, i think that the fault partially lies with the monitors.
i do not think those demo monitors are very good, despite being able to show somewhat higher resolutions.
final judgement should be saved for when this thing is used with a television/monitor that can do 1920x1080i without downscaling.
those monitors definetely can not.



willie

[Anthony1]

Hi Anthony 1

Quick question. I bought a cheap hdtv this weekend during black friday. It has an hdmi input with componets inputs.
I have a system selector pro. The 360 games look excellent but I am using s video on all the others any way to sharpen the gamecube graphics I believe took a hit not as sharp and crisp at least when playing re4. It still looks good though. The ps2 seems to hold its own the as well the dramcast.


Obviously, you are going to want to use the component cables for the 360, and make sure you click the little HDTV thing on the cable. You can either set it to regular TV or HDTV. Make sure to set it to HDTV, and make sure to go into your 360 menu and set it for 720p or 1080i.

As for the GameCube, definitely find a GameCube HDTV cable. It's well worth it for games like RE4. For PS2, you can get a cheap PS2 component cable off of Ebay, and games like Jak 3 will look amazing. If it has a VGA plug, make sure to get the VGA adapter for the Dreamcast.

[poopnes]

You know I just went and bought a new Phillips 27" regular old TV that had component inputs and I'm extremely happy with the quality of the graphics. Super sharp and no dot crawl at all. It was $249. Its not HD, but the difference from composite to component (hell even from S-Video) is amazing. A cheap alternative that for me was well worth it.

[Tritoch]

I'm one of those gamers stuck without a HDTV...at least until Tax Season 2007 in my case unless something radically changes (like I get a huge promotion). Too many other committments, planning for another baby, etc. I think the Xbox 360 looks great on my 32" Sony WEGA, but I can definitely tell I'm missing out on the full experience. :(

[Trebuken]

I think the biggest problem with the HD era is that most HD TVs are still three times as expensive as regular TVs. In a couple of years things might be more even, but really, HD is not something most people care about yet.

I think the biggest problem with new cars is that they are three times more expensive then used cars. In a couple of years things might be more even, but really, NEW is not something most people care about yet.

People get five times as much use out of their TV then their car, yet or only willing to spend a 30th the amount. Why? Vanity. No one sees you sitting in front of that embarrassingly small TV. They do see you in your new SUV. The money you can save on gas could pay for a HDTV.

Open Box Bargains..you can save a ton if your careful and no something about the product before you buy it....

Later,
Trebuken

[Anthony1]

Anybody that has a 360 needs to at the very least see the damn thing in High Def.



It's very cheap to get High Def up and running. Some very impressive High Def, by the way. You can spend under $200 and get a kick ass 21 inch HDTV with 5.1 experience.


Here is what you need:


1. Go immediately to www.craigslist.org and go to your closest city, and check under computer items. Find somebody with a 21 inch CRT computer monitor for $80 or less. Believe me, you can find one, because everybody wants lcd computer monitors now, so people practically give away the old huge CRT ones. But here's the thing, a nice 21 inch CRT computer monitor is like a 20 inch HDTV. It's just a $80 20 inch HDTV. A CRT monitor will give you a way, way, way better image than a LCD one. So you are getting a better image than what you see on those Samsung LCD monitors at the XBOX 360 Kiosks. It's not widescreen, but you can either letterbox it, or convert it to 4:3.

2. You are going to need to track down the XBOX 360 VGA cable. I think they are $29.99

3. You need to get a self powered mini 5.1 computer speaker setup. Get the one with a good subwoofer. Best one you can get for the leftover dough.



I'm telling you it's under $200, and it would blow most peoples home theaters totally out the water. Watching DVD movies on it will be hellla cool too. And you could get a XRGB-2 plus and play all your retro systems on it in a psuedo RGB mode.

[InsaneDavid]

Yet another thread shot to hell.

TRUNCATE YOUR LONG LINKS!!

However there's been so much quoting of the offending links, this thread shall remain unreadable.

[Jibbajaba]

I think the biggest problem with new cars is that they are three times more expensive then used cars. In a couple of years things might be more even, but really, NEW is not something most people care about yet.

Apple, meet orange. That is the worst analogy I have ever read.

Anthony, your $200 technique will only work with systems that have a VGA cable, right? Is there any way to go from component to VGA?

Chris

[Chronodriftersx]

Yet another thread shot to hell.

TRUNCATE YOUR LONG LINKS!!

However there's been so much quoting of the offending links, this thread shall remain unreadable.

WELL WHY DON'T YOU POST AN HANDY EXAMPLE HOW SINCE MOST PEOPLE DON'T BOTHER TO FIGURE IT OUT SINCE THE BOARD WON'T DO IT FOR OUR ASSES

[Trebuken]

I think the biggest problem with new cars is that they are three times more expensive then used cars. In a couple of years things might be more even, but really, NEW is not something most people care about yet.

Apple, meet orange. That is the worst analogy I have ever read.

Anthony, your $200 technique will only work with systems that have a VGA cable, right? Is there any way to go from component to VGA?

Chris

I know it's bad. People are constantly yammering about the price of HDTV's (and Xbox 360's for that matter), yet the reality is that HDTV's are not over priced. You'd pay more for a car to get extras and those extras are absurdly priced. People are just ignorant of HDTV technology and jealous they don't have one, or can't afford one...

The analogy is redundant because the 'too expensive' argument is redundant and, essentially, nonsense.

I believe 2009 is the new digital deadline for all stations to be broadcasting in digital (not sure if it passed the Senate yet). HDTV's have fallen in price but the technology continues to improve driving new models back up.

Get a HDTV if you don't have one. If you don't have the money, well then, sucks for you...

Later,
Trebuken

[Richter]

Yet another thread shot to hell.

TRUNCATE YOUR LONG LINKS!!

However there's been so much quoting of the offending links, this thread shall remain unreadable.

WELL WHY DON'T YOU POST AN HANDY EXAMPLE HOW SINCE MOST PEOPLE DON'T BOTHER TO FIGURE IT OUT SINCE THE BOARD WON'T DO IT FOR OUR ASSEShttp://tinyurl.com/

use it

[stonecutter]

I just got a HDTV, a Sony Wega model. But there are no 360s to be found now..... doh.

[Captain Wrong]

IMO, my opinion of the 360 graphics, and a lot of others comes from seeing them in store, setup, in kiosks...........

wait for it................................................ ..

Here it comes.............................................

On the HD Plasma screens that MS setup with the kiosks!!!

The menus look FANTASTICLY sharp. Then COD2 pops up on the screen and it looks like a 4 year old PC game, or a standard PS2 game frankly. I expected to be vaguely unimpressed when I saw the 360 in action, but I was COMPLETELY underwhelmed personally.


i must say, i think that the fault partially lies with the monitors.
i do not think those demo monitors are very good, despite being able to show somewhat higher resolutions.
final judgement should be saved for when this thing is used with a television/monitor that can do 1920x1080i without downscaling.
those monitors definetely can not.



willie

I was thinking the same. I played King Kong on a kiosk and damn, early PS2 graphics. I mean alright detail but jaggy as all hell. I hope it was the monitor, but you'd think they'd get something better after hyping this up as the second coming for HD graphics.


Yet another thread shot to hell.

TRUNCATE YOUR LONG LINKS!!

However there's been so much quoting of the offending links, this thread shall remain unreadable.

Ahh...you aren't missing a whole lot. Still, I do wish people would use TinyURL.

I wonder what would shock people more: destroying an Xbox360 or playing it through an old 13" portable black and white television?

[kainemaxwell]

Graphics mean nothing if the gameplay sucks though, remember that.

[Trebuken]

King Kong is a multi-platform title. It was noted early on that these sorts of titles would be much less impressive because they are not made for the 360 but for the PS2 or Xbox and then ported to the 360. It's graphics are less than inspiring, but you do get the feeling that the 360 is not really working hard when the game is in action. It is probably more fluid then the other versions. Yet it is a game based on a movie which are traditionally cheap and hurried...

Of course Call of Duty 2 does not have the same problem...

Later,
Trebuken

[Captain Wrong]

King Kong is a multi-platform title. It was noted early on that these sorts of titles would be much less impressive because they are not made for the 360 but for the PS2 or Xbox and then ported to the 360. It's graphics are less than inspiring, but you do get the feeling that the 360 is not really working hard when the game is in action. It is probably more fluid then the other versions. Yet it is a game based on a movie which are traditionally cheap and hurried...

Of course Call of Duty 2 does not have the same problem...

Later,
Trebuken

Point taken.

You'd think that for the first out of the box games MS might encourage original content rather than ports. Of course, I understand that's pretty much standard operating procedure for the industry these days and ports pad the launch lineup.

[kevin_psx]

The bad part is that the 360 doesn't look that great on my 51 inch Sony in my living room. "Ok, so the 360 looks great on gigantic screens and looks mediocre on normal screens, who gives a rats ass, none of us have a 8 foot screen in our damn garages".

Well, the 360 looks absolutely astonishing on my little 30 inch 16:9 princeton graphics AF 3.0 HD precision HDTV reference display.

Yeah good. But are the games FUN??? Take Star Wars Prequel Trilogy - beautiful computer graphics projected on a giant IMAX screen and 12 speaker surround. Wow.

But prequel trilogy sucked. It looked gorgeous. But sucked.

Are the X360 games fun?