Screw Paypal. I'm done. (Rant and help request.)

[Kitsune Sniper]

I'm sick and tired of Paypal. It's bad enough that eBay charges us for sales (which I don't mind) but getting a chunk of my payment taken out because of Paypal? I'm done. I don't like the fact that eBay's getting money from my auctions -twice-.

So I need advice.

I want to switch to Bidpay/Money Order only auctions, but I don't know how to convince customers to do so. Most people only use Paypal because of the whole buyer protection program, which I think is fine... I just don't want my auction payments to get chopped up because of unnecessary fees.

So... any ideas on how to do this? Links to pages, and so on? And are there any other auction payment services I could use?

On that note, I need to ask a question regarding bank transfers. Why are they considered unsafe? I mean, you're transfering / depositing money to a bank. A bank keeps records. So why is that a problem?

Thanks.

[Yam]

When I buy on eBay I avoid BidPay like the plague. It almost always ends up costing the buyer more than PayPal would cost the seller, and it takes forever. If you don't want to scare people away you should just add the cost of using PayPal to your starting price, or say that the buyer has to cover the PayPal fees.

[Vroomfunkel]

say that the buyer has to cover the PayPal fees.

Ebay will pull your auctions for this. Or even ban you, if you do it enough.

Vroomfunkel

[XianXi]

say that the buyer has to cover the PayPal fees.

Ebay will pull your auctions for this. Or even ban you, if you do it enough.

Vroomfunkel

just raise the shipping like everyone else does. Paypal fees aren't much 2.9%+ $0.30 per transaction and 3.9%+$0.30 if it's cross border payment meaning international.

Alot of people try to avoid ebay fees by making the item a penny and shipping like $100, you can get booted for that, too.

I dont approve of raising the shipping to pay for things, if you want to sell on ebay you gotta pay like everyone else. Sad but true or you can always take only money orders and personal checks but you would lose buyers like that.

[philosophyst]

No offense to you at all and I agree that the paypal fees suck but...

I don't buy from sellers that are not accepting paypal.

The bottom line is, you will lose more money on your auctions not accepting paypal then paypal would charge you if you did.

On a side note, bidpay sucks.

[Vectorman0]

Even though this isn't allowed and many people here will probably say it isn't right, I'll say it anyway. You can always accept paypal with an extra fee but don't say what it is for or advertise it in the auction. Just let people who inquire about paypal know why you aren't doing it. It also might only be worth the risk/effort for only higher value auctions.

[Drexel923]

It's really quite simple. The shipping charge does not have to be for ONLY shipping...it includes handling. Just add an extra buck or two to the shipping and state in the auction that its for packing materials and such. Or like someone else said, just add a couple more bucks to your auction price.

While fees do suck, you will lose out on lots of customers by not accepting paypal.

[Promophile]

Welcome to business. Every time you use your credit card at a store the store has to pay the credit card company fees. The reason they accept credit cards is because they'll make more proft by accepting, even with the added processing fees. Same thing with paypal and individual sellers.

[Kitsune Sniper]

I've had bidders threaten me for having "outrageous shipping costs" in the past. I normally charge about 65 or 70 cents more in the shipping & handling costs to take care of Paypal and eBay fees... and as I mentioned, there are some bidders who complain because the shipping label doesn't have the same amount I posted in the auction.

My standard charge for shipping is $5. That covers shipping up to 1 lb. through Priority Mail, plus delivery confirmation. The usual shipping cost comes to around 4.25; the rest goes to pay bus fare, Paypal and eBay fees. Depending on the items, I charge more for shipping, and I do what other people don't - I combine shipping. I'm not that much of a crook.

Bah. Fucking Paypal. Why can't anyone start a class-action lawsuit against them for this? Isn't it a monopoly?

(Sorry for the swearing. I am reading your replies and they are helping. Thanks.)

[Tbowl]

Well, with Bidpay around, it isn't... LOL

Hey, someone has to pay for the millions of transactions Paypal does everyday, you can't just skate by that for free.

[dj_spryte]

yeah me i just add an extra buck for shipping and BOOM, my paypal fees and ebay fees are taken care of!!

[Griking]

On a side note, bidpay sucks.

That's only one person's opinion. I personally have used BidPay numerous times to both send and receive money and haven't had a single problem with it.

It's a great alternative to PayPal and doesn't cost a buyer much more than it costs to get in your car, drive to the store or post office and purchase a money order from them.

Most of the complaints I hear about BidPay are all from buyers who don't like the idea of having to pay a fee to pay for an auction. They'd all much rather the seller pay a fee to receive their auction payment. :roll:

As far as attracting bidders I'd suggest pointing out the fact that you (hopefully) have good feedback and keep your shipping fees very reasonable.

[SoulBlazer]

I do the same thing -- I charge a flat rate of $5 for Priorty Mail shipping with the confirmation. In the past, that's been enough to cover my PayPal fees -- figure $3.85 for the shipping and .40 cents for the confirmation. (I don't charge for the gas, since I go to the PO a lot for other things, nor for the package, since I normaly use bubble wrap I get for like 50 cents each).

Now with Priorty rates going up in January, I think I'll have to raise it to $6.

But no one has EVER complained to me about shipping.

Then again, I sell most of my stuff on Amazon, which automaticaly gives you a fixed rate to ship either Media or Priorty. :)

[philosophyst]

Most of the complaints I hear about BidPay are all from buyers who don't like the idea of having to pay a fee to pay for an auction. They'd all much rather the seller pay a fee to receive their auction payment.

Why should a buyer have to pay a fee to pay for an auction, that is ridiculous. I am much more a seller than I am a buyer and even I agree that the seller should be responsible for fees if they choose to sell, no question. Now, if a fee or whatever is included in the S&H and the S&H amount is clearly stated, that's one thing but to have the buyer pay an extra fee just to pay for an auction....get real.

[The Brown Eye]

I think that the main thing you need is the "I want to be able to pay for it online because I'm too lazy to get off my ass" option. Which can be Bidpay or whatever. As long as you have one of those other services, I can't see you losing a ton of buyers. If you just switch to money order/cashier's check, you WILL lose buyers unless you have a high-demand item. I'll bid on anything that I can pay for online, but if I have to go to the bank for a money order, and then go mail it out, well that's not happening.

You could also try something like this if you sell a lot:
http://www.995merchantaccounts.com/

Note: I have not used this service, I found it on the paypalsucks.com page.

[jajaja]

Dont know how it is in the US, but here in Europe is very common to use bank transfer (transfer from 1 bank account to another). My bank can transfer to 30 countries and it doesnt cost me anything. Its also fast. Within the country it usualy takes 1 day and maybe 1-3 days to other european countries.

I have done banktransfer to a guy in USA once so it should be possible. Dont know if it will cost you anything tho, depends on the bank you have.

[Austin]

Just also wanted to add that I very, very rarely purchase items from sellers that don't accept paypal.

I hate the fees, too, but there's not much that can be done. eBay will usually net you the most for my items, and I accept that as the price of the service.

[Griking]

Most of the complaints I hear about BidPay are all from buyers who don't like the idea of having to pay a fee to pay for an auction. They'd all much rather the seller pay a fee to receive their auction payment.

Why should a buyer have to pay a fee to pay for an auction, that is ridiculous. I am much more a seller than I am a buyer and even I agree that the seller should be responsible for fees if they choose to sell, no question. Now, if a fee or whatever is included in the S&H and the S&H amount is clearly stated, that's one thing but to have the buyer pay an extra fee just to pay for an auction....get real.

I personally think that it's unfair to expect a seller to cover the convienence of allowing a buyer to pay online via PayPal. As a seller I'm fine waiting for cash or a money order to arrive in the mail but if a buyer wants the "convienence" of making their payment online so that they won't have to get up off of their lazy asses and leave the house to buy a money order that's fine as well, but they should be responsible to cover the fees associated with that sort of payment. Again, they'd have to pay for a money order in the store, why should I have to cover the cost because they want to purchase on online?

This is coming from a buyer as well as a seller. I have 1325 transactions on eBay and they're probably divided 50/50 between buying and selling so I think I'm qualified to state my opinion as well.

Oh and lastly, I encourage everyone here to not purchase from people who don't accept PayPal. That way I get less competition and therefore lower prices when I purchase stuff from them. :P

[chaoticjelly]

Yes PayPal does suck, im nearing on 5000 feedback on eBay now and just think of the PayPal fees ive paid over the years!

It really irks me how (as I like to start alot of auctions cheaply) some guy in France can win lots of RPG books from me for 99p each.. and then shipping is like £45 and PayPal takes a fairly sizeable charge from the shipping cost etc, so at the end of it your left with nothing really..

I suppose thats the risk of starting at 99 with no reserve.. but there arent really any viable alternatives to PayPal.

Maybe if somebody started an auction website where the payments system was just integrated into the website (a bit like paypal) but maybe they make sending payments free instead of charging auction fees AND payment fees..

[jajaja]

I suppose thats the risk of starting at 99 with no reserve.. but there arent really any viable alternatives to PayPal.

I guess you live in England because u used £. If so, you can accept bank transfer. I do most of my shopping from France and Germany and if they dont accept Paypal I always pay with bank transfer with BIC/IBAN (International Bank Account Number) number.
If I were you I would call my bank and ask for these numbers and ask if it cost anything to recive money (it doesnt cost anything here).

[swlovinist]

I have been selling on ebay for over 6 years. I cannot think of a single other website that could of generated the money that ebay has. That is how you need to look at it. Yes they take a portion of your sales. Yes they take a credit card fee. I think of the thousands of extra dollars I have made by using their site. I think of the time I got to save by having ebay do all the dirty work of setting up a website that is seen by millions. As much as I agree with the double fees, I am still making out in the end.

[Mr.Faxanadu]

I have no issues at all with eBay or Paypal :D Figure this - I just sold 5 items for a grand total of $550 CDN. These items cost me only $48 to purchase. My best find in the lot was a CIB Ultima 2 that I bought for $2 and sold for $180.

Without eBay there's NO way I would have made as much. I mean they are letting you tap into a GLOBAL market. I think there fees are reasonable (I think it as 10% of the final sale once listing fees, ebay and paypal fees are considered) I must admit that I may start to dislike them if they raise their fees any higher. Right now I am ok with things as they are.

Oh and I don't work for eBay

LOL

[Kitsune Sniper]

You all raise interesting points... it's a pain, but I guess I'll have to deal.

Thanks for the interesting conversation. I hope I didn't irritate anybody with this thread. (Especially those that I -have- irritated with my opinions in this same forum.)

[Insaneclown]

Ill say this Bidpay and Money Orders suck balls. I dont know anyone that uses Bidpay and I get fucked over by scammers from sending money orders to them. Enough said!!!

Paypal is the only way to go!!!

[kevin_psx]

Most people only use Paypal because of the whole buyer protection program, which I think is fine... I just don't want my auction payments to get chopped up because of unnecessary fees. downgrade your paypal to a Personal account. No fees. Drawback - you can't accept credit cards.



I dont approve of raising the shipping to pay for things, if you want to sell on ebay you gotta pay like everyone else.
Agree. But Let the buyer pay the fees - they want the game movie whatever - let them pay. I'm not taking it from my seller's pocket. Throw the game in the trash before I lose money to ebay fees

[Kitsune Sniper]

Most people only use Paypal because of the whole buyer protection program, which I think is fine... I just don't want my auction payments to get chopped up because of unnecessary fees. downgrade your paypal to a Personal account. No fees. Drawback - you can't accept credit cards.



I dont approve of raising the shipping to pay for things, if you want to sell on ebay you gotta pay like everyone else.
Agree. But Let the buyer pay the fees - they want the game movie whatever - let them pay. I'm not taking it from my seller's pocket. Throw the game in the trash before I lose money to ebay fees

You're not allowed to use Personal accounts on eBay anymore. They changed that a few months back.

[kevin_psx]

Then what good are Personal accounts? O_O

[SoulBlazer]

You know, there are many other things you can do with PayPal BESIDES bidding on EBay. :P

THOSE are things you can use a Personal account for. :D

For example.....I've used it to send money to and fro friends and my parents when making cash gifts, paying loans, etc. I used to use their BillPay service to pay my credit card bills. Smaller companies (like here at DP) will use PayPal to accept donations or make purchases to buy items. Other people use a PayPal debit card.

[Truffle]

I have yet to start selling, but I perchase ALOT of stuff on ebay. I do not associate with auctions that dont use paypal.

Its not because I am lazy. I have short term memory loss and cant remember for the life of me to send off MOs.
I can always pay promtly with Paypal, but I have a really hard time sending off money orders and such.