No one talks about Thunder Force. Why? [Archive]

Ulticron

11-30-2005, 08:58 AM

I'm constantly shocked at how little is said and known about the Thunder Force series. I talk to people offline and you can say R-Type, Life Force, or Gradius and they're like "Yeah I've played that." then you say Thunder Force and all you get is "What the heck is that?"

Searching the web is about as equally dead end too. There's a few websites out there with a few facts on the games, but there's really no major fan base. I've even tried finding a ROM for the original Thunder Force (it was on the MSX) and I can't.

I'm curious, is it that no one really has ever heard of these games, or is it just that everyone hates these games.

Flack

11-30-2005, 09:06 AM

klausien

11-30-2005, 09:18 AM

Too many games, too little time. Add to that the fact that Tecnosoft, or Technosoft if you like, is gone, along with Compile and all the other great shmup companies. ThunderForce is sadly fading into true obscurity. Hell, I like ThunderForce III better than any of the R-Type games and all the Gradius games until Gradius V. ThunderForce III - V were all incredible.

It also has to do with a strange, unfounded negative attitude against traditional shoot 'em ups industry wide. Yes, there was a glut in the early 90's. So what? Hopefully someday the current glut of FPS games will be seen the same way as a little revenge. On a side note, I cringe every time I hear what the industry has to say about Next Gen. I'm sorry, gameplay does not materialize through "better" graphics.

It is unfortunate that the only shmups we seem to get are Psikyo crap (not a fan). I guess we are just not allowed to have the glorious Cave shmups because we're American. I hate Sony sometimes.

jajaja

11-30-2005, 09:23 AM

I've played a thunderforce game for PSX. Its pretty good. But there are alot of games in this genre that are damn great, but are either forgotten or unknown to the average joe.

fishsandwich

11-30-2005, 09:54 AM

Yeah, it's a series that doesn't get its due. I loved Thunderforce 5 on the Saturn, and you can get parts 2-4 plus a special remix on the Saturn.

From the net...

In 1996, Technosoft released the "Thunder Force Gold Packs" for the Sega Saturn exclusively in Japan, which contained re-releases of previous Thunder Force games. Two packs were released: Thunder Force Gold Pack 1 which included Thunder Force II and Thunder Force III, and Thunder Force Gold Pack 2 which included Thunder Force IV and Thunder Force AC. Each Gold Pack disc has exclusive CG animated introduction sequences and a few extra easter eggs, but the actual games remained mostly unchanged (although the slowdown present in the Megadrive/Genesis version of Thunder Force IV is removed in its Gold Pack version).

Captain Wrong

11-30-2005, 10:07 AM

I think it's because you really have to search out Thunder Force in the States where as Gradius and R-Type are much easier to come across.

Doesn't help that we haven't had all the Thunder Force games released here and what we have has a re-title or two in the mix.

So Thunder Force...highly underrated. 3-5 are awesome and, yeah, I'd say better than recent Gradius and R-Type instalments. Good stuff. I'm not a huge horizontal shmup fan, but I always dig Tecnosoft's series. (Compile too. :D)

syd

11-30-2005, 10:33 AM

To tell you the truth, I haven't even heard of this series before. What systems were these games released on, besides the MSX and Saturn?

roushimsx

11-30-2005, 10:38 AM

Thunderforce I and II weren't very good, imo. Also, the first game wasn't on MSX (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thunder_Force), which is why you can't find a ROM for it anywhere.

I did enjoy 3 - 5 a good bit, though. One of these days I'll have to track down the Saturn version of V just so i can record some videos showing off the differences.

Also, Thunderforce 3 on SNES was the first shmup I can remember single credit clearing (not exactally a difficult game to do so...but hey...this was back when I still couldn't 1CC/1LC Legendary Wings, heh)

Melf

11-30-2005, 10:45 AM

To tell you the truth, I haven't even heard of this series before. What systems were these games released on, besides the MSX and Saturn?

They were the defining shmup series on the Genesis (http://www.sega-16.com/Feature-%20Thunder%20Force.htm)

NE146

11-30-2005, 10:48 AM

Neil Koch

11-30-2005, 11:10 AM

I played Thunderforce II in an emulator a couple of months ago (yes I had the cart since back in the day) to do one thing: Complete the sonofabitch. I forget how I did it but I think I turned on a cheat for invincibility and finally did what I couldn't ever do and that was see the ending. I think some credits just came up.. but oh was it satisfying LOL

Now Thunderforce III on the other hand, I've always liked it a little better because it didn't have the overhead scenes and also.. it was beatable! :)

It took me forever to beat TF2 back in the day... that damn part where it starts scrolling super-fast always ate up my reserves of extra guys. But once you get past that boss, the last level is pretty easy.

I thought the "ending" sucked as well.

swlovinist

11-30-2005, 11:41 AM

In Japan they were bigger, they even made two Sega Saturn Games with the series on it. Working Designs I transilated Thunder Force V, so the series DID GET SOME RECOGNITION. Other than the shmups website, you aren't going to see alot of recognition for the series. The sad truth is that the Thunder Force series will go on being just another shooter series.

Ed Oscuro

11-30-2005, 11:41 AM

Thunderforce I and II weren't very good, imo.
Bah, whatever; Thunderforce II is a classic and deserves praise for the cool top-down perspective (that makes the game a favorite of mine, actually).

Check out the x68000 port of TF2, by the way.

Ed Oscuro

11-30-2005, 11:42 AM

The sad truth is that the Thunder Force series will go on being just another shooter series.
I kinda doubt there's ever going to be another...

Xexyz

11-30-2005, 11:45 AM

Psikyo crap? The last two games we got from Psikyo were Gunbird 2 for the DC and Strikers 1945 II for the PS1 back at the turn of the century. I know about Mobile Light Force, but who wants to play a butchered Gunbird? And besides, Psikyo folded back in 2002, almost 4 years ago.

Anyway, back on topic. I've never played TF V, but III & IV are among the top of my horizontal shmup list. TF II was below average thanks to the overhead levels, and I heard the origional was over head levels only, so it's safe to conclude that it was probably even worse. it would be cool if some company got the rights to these classics and published a Thunder Force collection, including the first two.

Ulticron

11-30-2005, 11:59 AM

syd said:

To tell you the truth, I haven't even heard of this series before. What systems were these games released on, besides the MSX and Saturn?

Well 2-4 were on the Genesis, 4 was actually called Lightening Force here in the US, and the intro is slightly different than it's JP counterpart, otherwise same game. 5 was on the Saturn and PS. As for the first one roushimsx just stated that it's not on the MSX, which brings me back to square one of not knowing and asking what system it's on.

roushimsx said:

Thunderforce I and II weren't very good, imo. Also, the first game wasn't on MSX, which is why you can't find a ROM for it anywhere.

I wished I could find the image I saw on google images that mislead me to believe it was on the MSX, but oh well easy come, easy go w/the net. Since it's not on the MSX do you know what system the first one is on?

Also on a side note, has anyone heard anything about a new Thunder Force game coming out called "Thunder Force Forever". I seem to remember reading something about that last month.

KingCobra

11-30-2005, 12:02 PM

Wasen't Zero Gunner 2 a Psikyo shooter? That was good and Gunbird 2 was allright.

Anyway's, Thunder Force was always over shadow'd by other shooters here in the states, and not promoted much. I got TF V for the Playstation, what a horrible port, now if I was able to get the Saturn port back in the day It might have thought differn't.

Speaking of shooters, what the Hell is Treasure and GRev up to? These's new 3D/2D shooters are awesome!(Ikaruga, Gradius V and Border Down)

rbudrick

11-30-2005, 02:24 PM

First, the TF games are my favorite shoting series, with Gradius second.

TF1 came out for the X1 computer. However, I too have heard rumors and may even have an image file of an MSX version. Either way, I know I've heard many times, misconcepotion or not that the first game came out for MSX. Maybe it came out there too, and the rom or image is very rare, but whatever...it defeinitely came out for the X1 first.

Thunderforce I and II weren't very good, imo.

1, maybe. 2, sacrilege. TF2 was quite ahead of its time and nothing quite that great was out for home systems, being an early Genesis title (hell, it played like a 2nd or 3rd generation Genesis title). Some don't like 2 because it's 10 times harder than 3, but it is an incredible game. Try the infinite lives cheat to see the whole game if you don't like it...you'll see it rocks. The alternating side scrolling and overhead scenes was awesome in its day. One of the defining Genesis games, for sure.

Part three is one of my top 5 favorite Genesis games. It's a bit easy, but a true 16-bit masterpiece. It completely blew my mind in the day to see graphics like this at home, let alone on the Genesis...I just couldn't believe what I was seeing. I used to be so good at it, I could beat it with one hand using a regular SNES controller (on the SNES version of TFIII-Thunder Spirits). One of the top 3 Genesis soundtracks, no doubt. I have a copy of the extremely rare soundtrack...man does it kick ass! Who was that musician?!

I've got to be honest..I've never played 4 and 5 and I would really like to...just never had a copy of it. They cmae out for PS and Saturn, but only in Japan, right? Which games came out for which here? What would I need to play them?

-Rob

CRV

11-30-2005, 02:28 PM

Since it's not on the MSX do you know what system the first one is on?

According to Wikipedia's Thunder Force entry:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thunder_Force

"Thunder Force was released in late 1983 exclusively in Japan. Known versions of it exist on the following Japanese based computers: Sharp X1, Sharp MZ-1500, NEC PC-6001 mkII, NEC PC-8801 mkII, and Fujitsu FM-7. In 1984, an add-on was released named Thunder Force Construction for the Fujitsu FM-7, and NEC PC-9801 computers. The add-on allowed players to create custom made areas."

Dire 51

11-30-2005, 03:56 PM

Thunder Force = great. I own II, III, IV (it is the U.S. version, but I refuse to call it Lightening Force), all for the Genesis, and V (Perfect System for the U.S. PSX). It's one of the best shmup series ever created, imo.

I may have to pick up a copy of Thunder Spirits at some point. It's the one U.S. released TF game I've never owned.

Haoie

11-30-2005, 04:35 PM

The PS TF [5 I think it was, or 6?], I'm sure it didn't get a PAL release.

And if it did, I've never seen it. But I'd like it.

I love shooters [vertical/horizontal].

Hung Long

11-30-2005, 04:49 PM

The only Thunder Force game I have is Thunder Force V translated and published by Working Designs. Still have it in great condition too. But the days shoot-em up are long gone.

CosmicMonkey

11-30-2005, 07:45 PM

TF III & IV are easily among the finest shmups on the MD. I have both in NTSC-J format, great case art. TFII seems very interesting, I may well give it a go at some point.

TFV on the Saturn is class too. Not as good as the originals, but very good. And worth getting the Saturn version over the PSone 'Perfect System' release. The PSone version has extras, but the graphics are better in the Saturn release.

Thunder Force VI was in development for the Dreamcast. I was gutted to find out that it was canned, although I'm not sure how much development was actually completed. All that remains is an intro vid and 3 tunes by the band Noise.

I'd love to know what did exist of TFVI. To find a GD-R is surely one of the 'Holy Grails' of gamery, IMO. Even if it was only a demo or a very very early build with a couple of complete(ish) levels. It'd be great to see what graphical wizardry TS had planned for the DC.

Oh, and TecnoSoft also did BlastWind for the Saturn. That's another shmup worth checking out. However, somewhere along the lines someone seems to have mentioned that it's rare (or even L@@K R@RE!!!!), hence the daft Ebay prices.

Melf

11-30-2005, 08:58 PM

Thunder Force VI was in development for the Dreamcast. I was gutted to find out that it was canned, although I'm not sure how much development was actually completed. All that remains is an intro vid and 3 tunes by the band Noise.

I'd love to know what did exist of TFVI. To find a GD-R is surely one of the 'Holy Grails' of gamery, IMO. Even if it was only a demo or a very very early build with a couple of complete(ish) levels. It'd be great to see what graphical wizardry TS had planned for the DC.

I think the video and music tracks are all there is. I was hoping there would be more, but Technosoft left gaming, no?

Anyone who wants to see the TF VI video can check it out at my site. Just remember to bring some tissue... :(

klausien

11-30-2005, 09:03 PM

Psikyo crap? The last two games we got from Psikyo were Gunbird 2 for the DC and Strikers 1945 II for the PS1 back at the turn of the century. I know about Mobile Light Force, but who wants to play a butchered Gunbird? And besides, Psikyo folded back in 2002, almost 4 years ago.

Point taken. Bad time to rip on Psikyo, especially since I have most of their stuff, and have admittedly enjoyed it at times (especially Cannon Spike). I am just bent because I can't afford to get a Jp PS2 to enjoy all the Cave goodness. :/

Sorry to derail...

gepeto

11-30-2005, 09:17 PM

When I talk about great shooters Thunderforce will always be in the top 3 for me. The series was awsome for its time. They did an excellent job mixing up the levels.

I remember t2 getting all 9.0 in egm. When Thunderforce 3 came out I couldn't wait I imported it at the time for 75.00 and it was well worth it. Great creativity. I just wish todays games had half the creativity.

Icarus Moonsight

12-01-2005, 01:19 AM

:bawling: Thunder Force VI :bawling:

Good to see all the love for III - V but wtf is wrong with II? Damn good game IMO... kicks my ass yes but, it's not a POS just because it dutifully, time after time, hands out large portions of player ass! Damn wimps LOL

Nothing is more enjoyable than Thunderforce on the go via a Nomad. Try it... you'll like it :D

Snapple

12-01-2005, 01:59 AM

No one talks about Thunder Force. Why?
Well, yesterday was pretty hectic. I just bought a new truck so I had to run back and forth between the credit union and the car dealership. Then I had a server go down and I was working hard on that, and then I had a workstation infected with a virus that I had to work on for a while.

So I guess Thunder Force just never came up.

Hahaha. I needed a post like that.

Thunder Force III was the first shmup that made me really go WOW. At the time it came out, that game had the most beautiful graphics I think that I had seen on a home console at that time.

And you know, it did pretty much strike me as a Gradius clone, but that didn't really bother me at the time.

Of course, nowadays, half of all shmups are Gradius clones anyway.

Eternal Champion

12-01-2005, 07:04 AM

Gotta give love to Thunder Force. I'm an old-school schmup player, going back to River Raid, then Zanac on NES. Thunderforce II was the first Genesis game I played, along with Revenge of Shinobi, back in 1990. I loved it instantly. Of course, III blew me away, and yes, I absolutely love the music in III and also in II.

Thunderforce II and III are probably my favorite shooters ever. Gaiares looks cool, but dying and taking you back is damn cheap, like in R-Type III, probably the best-looking (but frustratingly cheap-ass) 16-bit schmup. Cheap as hell.

I don't understand the hatred of the overhead stages in TFII. Compile's Zanac and Space Megaforce are both overhead, and are considered classics (and are still awesome today).

12-01-2005, 09:09 AM

I bought TF V from a co-worker awhile back.

Played it once or twice, decided it was way too hard for me to spend/waste time on, sold it shortly after for credit toward another game.

Now Philosoma, that's pretty decent!

mr_pollock

12-01-2005, 03:30 PM

I appreciate. Now give me a nickel!

TurboGenesis

12-01-2005, 04:27 PM

I like all the Thunder Force games. Thunder Force III was one of the first shooties that I was able to 1cc. Nothing but love here for Thunder Force and Technosoft.

Now lets talk another Technosoft shootie--Hyper Duel. It seems that this game doesn't get much love but the game play to me is pretty much just like Thunder Force with some added Macross style game play though I never use the robot form in the game. Also of note the Saturn version is superior to the arcade version as it has polish and a great new look. Unfortunatly the price is prohibitive as it is a great shootie. If you truely like Thunder Force and are a fan of Technosoft pick this up if you can for the Saturn! The arcade version is also on the Saturn disc so its like 2 games for 1 :D

suppafly

12-01-2005, 04:59 PM

Im a HUGE shmups fan, and Thunderforce 4 is the best shooter ever IMHO:.....

Daniel Thomas

12-02-2005, 12:26 AM

I don't think anything was ever made of TF VI besides that rendered intro that found its way online some time ago. It certainly was super-cool, with all the explosions and spinning spaceships and all. I'd guess almost nothing beyond the planning stage was ever completed. So I guess that's yet another reason to mourn the Dreamcast.

At some point, I actually did find an emulator for one of the old Japanese computers that ran the original Thunder Force. I never could get the thing to work, though, so I couldn't say how it was. I did find one screen shot somewhere and posted it on my website for a while. It didn't really look like much, and would never be remembered if not for its Genesis sequels.

The X68000 version of TF2 is better than the Genesis one, with better graphics and more levels. It's always been a good game, but fiendishly hard in the later levels.

Never did see TF5 on Saturn or PSX. I do remember the Next Gen review, which was somewhat dismissive (no big surprise there). I really should do something to change that.