Drilling locks and other questions

[portnoyd]

Ok, so we went overboard last month, and got nine new cabs, plus one for DP himself, and one for another DP member. Luckily, DP's cab was and made it there 100%. The other one not ours we haven't fired up yet, but it just needs a cap kit.

However, the remaining nine all need work. We got:

Turbo, a Nintendo VS., Bubble Bobble, Rastan, Silk Worm, a Neo 4-slot, Dynasty Wars, Sports Jam, and GROBDA.

Now, their problems are of all varying severity. Sports Jam, for example, had its monitor go dead on the way home. Rastan simply needs a new JAMMA harness. But to assess and fix most of these, I need to get the locks off.

How should I go about it? Drill? I tried a screwdriver and hammer approach, with very limited success. The Nintendo VS. also has circular locks... eww.

I have been partially trained by the pimplord of Arcade Alley, Mr. Stonic, but there is more for me to learn. This is probably not the last post I will make on these machines! To get an idea, here's what I see right now, with only being able to get into 3-4 machines.

Turbo: Works great, but sometimes, the game doesn't load when I turn it on. Switching it off and on has always fixed the problem.

Grobda: A messy conversion. Was ultra cheap. *shrug* I want add a button onto the right side, as there are two buttons on each side of the stick, but both do different things. >.< Also would like to put in a new stick. Some monitor work would help it, but is not really necessary.

Nintendo VS: Missing buttons, one monitor fires on with a couple pixels on, no sounds. Probably going to be the worst job out of all of them.

Bubble Bobble: Fires on, shows garbled graphics, screen goes blank, garbled, blank, repeat.

Silk Worm: Booted up fine at the show, when I got it home, just displays garbled text. The controls needed work at the show.

Dynasty Wars: Monitor is all white when turned on. Someone cared for this cab, because it has a credit button in one of the coin slots.

Sports Jam: As said before, monitor died on the way home. The Naomi GD boots up fine, and you can hear the game in attract mode. At the show, it was working 100%.

Rastan: Nasty cig tray on the front, that's gone. Coin door wouldn't closed, but hammered that down so it does. Monitor is a replacement, and it has massive Wizards of Wor burn-in, which doesn't show through when playing. The only problem now is the messy JAMMA harness. Frayed wired, crossed wires, soldered switches... made playing tough because one button press might cause two seprate actions (say jump and sword at the same time). No point in even cutting down the existing wires - they'd be too short. Already put new switches in, but I need to get the back lock out in order to completely remove the old harness.

Neo 4-slot: One of the easiest. Adjust monitor brightness, new switches for control panel, and new buttons to match original MVS color scheme.

So that's where I stand. To answer the coming question, anything that wasn't turning on, we paid next to nothing for. Thanks for any help you can all give.

[DogP]

Heheheh... yeah, you guys really did go overboard :P . For getting into locks, I usually find it easiest to pick the crappy single bitted locks... just take a small flat head screwdriver and turn left and right while wiggling a paperclip against the lock bits. Usually it'll pick in under 30 seconds.

If that fails, I get a screwdriver the size of the lock hole, jam it in as far as I can and bend the screwdriver back and forth until pretty much the whole insides are ripped out, and then I just turn. If that doesn't work, just take a drill and drill straight down the middle, the door will just fall off once you knock the back of the lock off, or sometimes if you rip the insides of the lock enough, it'll spin (usually depends on the size of the drill bit). I personally like a larger drill bit for the standard locks, since it rips the insides out well.

For the circular lock, you can try a pen... you can pick the cheap ones like that, but a lot of times finding a pen the right size is hard to do (if you haven't seen it, search for krypton pen trick). Otherwise, you can drill right down the middle of the cheap ones too, but if it's a hardened case, you'll probably have to drill each individual pin.

In case you haven't noticed, I'd prefer any method but drilling, mostly because drilling makes a mess... you'll have metal shavings all over the floor, and most of the time INSIDE the cabinet. If you do drill, make sure none of the metal shavings got on any of the PCBs or monitor chassis. Also, make sure you're wearing shoes... metal shavings in your foot aren't fun either :P .

I think you're right about the VS being the worst of all... Nintendo monitors are a total PITA. For the Turbo, I'd check the power supply voltage, that seems to cause a lot of problems like that. Same with the Bubble Bobble... did that work at the show? I remember seeing that cab having garbled graphics, but I thought someone fixed it and reauctioned it... if so, check the PS and any connectors (especially burnt ones). Same with Silk Worm... check the PS and JAMMA connector. For Dynasty Wars, it sounds like a PCB problem, assuming the monitor brightness isn't all the way up. It's a CPS-1, so you can probably find another compatible CPS-1 board and swap the DW stuff, or even find another PCB. What monitor is in the Sports Jam? Have you checked all of the connectors? Do you hear the monitor power up at all?

BTW, how far are you from the auction? I'll be up there again for the auction on the 14th, I could probably drop by to look at some of it if you still need some help and it's not too far away.

DogP

[portnoyd]

Thanks man! This is the info I needed. I'll try the locks again with your methods, and avoid drilling if possible.

We're an hour and a half north of the Cherry Hill. :\ Not to mention we probably won't go to the next auction. My wallet and nerves can't take another big hit like that! We appreciate the offer, and I also apologize for not formally introducing myself... I was a bit frazzled when I got back with the truck, to say the least. ;)

So how do you check the voltage? Bubble Bobble turns on, and shows garbled graphics. If it did work at one point at the show, we didn't see it.

For DW, the Rastan board slides out of its cab very easily, so I think that will make a good candidate to test DW with.

The problem with Sports Jam is that it is insanely heavy. I have to have two friends over just to tilt the thing back on the hand truck. I do not hear the monitor power up at all though.

[Arcade Antics]

Nintendo VS: Missing buttons, one monitor fires on with a couple pixels on, no sounds. Probably going to be the worst job out of all of them.
Could be something simple like a bad (or in this case, missing) ROM. If you scour the 'net, you might be able to find a picture of what your monitor shows that corresponds to which ROM is the bad one. There's definitely a site that has displays for Donkey Kong and matches them to bad ROMs, but, well, it's Donkey Kong. A little more popular than the vs. system, but you never know. :) I've grown to really dig the vs. setup over the years, so I'll scout around and see what I can come up with. Recapping the Nintendo machines is most certainly a PITA, although it will force you to get your soldering skills up to par quickly. LOL

Anyhoo, check the vs. PCBs and see if any ROMs are missing. If there's a two player/dual screen game in there like Baseball or Tennis, BOTH complete sets of the same ROMs need to be on the board, not just one like with the regular 1-screen games (SMB, Duck Hunt, etc.).

[DogP]

When checking voltages, most importantly you should check for +5V at the chips. To do that, I find it easiest to check on most chips between the corner pins. Turn your multimeter to DC Volts (I assume you have a Multimeter, preferably digital... if not, you need one ;) )... then on a chip like this:
http://www.jhu.edu/virtlab/demos/Circuits/cmos1.jpg
check with the red probe on the upper left pin, and the black probe on the lower right pin. Make sure the notch is oriented the same way as in the picture. You can do the same thing with most ROMs and other chips too. It has to be at least 5V, but I typically adjust it to 5.05V to 5.1V.

Of course with all of this, be careful as there is a lot of high voltage in there, so just be aware of what you're touching.

I don't remember BB running last time specifically... I'm probably thinking of the previous auction. IIRC the first time they tried to sell it, it went for $20 not working (buyback I assume)... then they moved it over a row and resold it working... but it didn't go for much that time either, so they probably bought it back again. Then I guess brought it back to the last auction and it wasn't working again :P . Anyway, usually when that stuff happens, it's a bad connector, a lot of times the JAMMA harness is loose and doesn't make good contact, or the power supply voltage is too low.

With the Sports Jam, when you turn it on, you should hear the high voltage going to the screen... if not, I'd say it's probably just a loose connector, or maybe a bad fuse holder. And yeah, I'd test DW with the Rastan board, or any other JAMMA board, since a pure white screen usually means the PCB has issues, but the rest of the cab is fine.

DogP

[portnoyd]

Looks like I'm buying a multimeter! Hehe, I'll give it a shot, why the hell not.

With BB and DW, and umm, pretty much every cab, right now, it's the locks that are in my way. I'm happy to hear that the outlook on these machines is better than I anticipated! So I will have more to report as we clean up the basement (oh ho ho, and I thought the cabs were a problem), and I crack open locks.

I don't hear anything besides the Naomi fan kicking in when I turn on Sports Jam. I'd imagine something bumped out of place on the way home, and if that's true, I know exactly where on the way home it happened. >.<

Mr. Giantrusso, when I meant couple pixels, I meant like 3 or 4. That's it. Imagine a starless night, and seeing one star in the pitch blackness. That's one of the monitors. The other is blank. Fyi, the games are Vs Gradius and Vs. Goonies (OMFGSEX). I want this working the most though, you are right - it is very cool.

I really wish I got one cab there but we hadn't 'opened the flood gates' at that point - a Sheriff cocktail, perfectly working. For a Nintendo nut like me, this was a sight to see. It was actually very bonertastic, but went for $250 or so.

[Arcade Antics]

when I meant couple pixels, I meant like 3 or 4. That's it. Imagine a starless night, and seeing one star in the pitch blackness. That's one of the monitors.
Hurm... Could still be a bad ROM or two seated somewhere. I had a DK that when booted up only showed a solitary "0" (zero) in one corner of the screen. Turned out to just be a bad ROM. :)

I'd definitely pull all the ROMs from their sockets and then reseat them on the side that gives you the few pixels. At worst, you'll spend an hour or so getting used to the procedure for carefully rocking them out of the slots without bending any pins. You'll need a small flathead "jeweler's" screwdriver to pry them out, gently and slowly, back and forth on either end to get the ROM out without bending or breaking any pins. Once you've taken them out, replace them just as carefully. Match up the pins, slowly and evenly press them back into place and then power up the machine again. Hopefully, you'll get a game to come up. :) If not, back to troubleshooting.


The other is blank. Fyi, the games are Vs Gradius and Vs. Goonies (OMFGSEX). I want this working the most though, you are right - it is very cool.
Sweet - vs. The Goonies is outta sight. :) Come to think of it, some of the later games used one daughter board instead of the individual ROM chips. If that's the case with Goonies or Gradius, you'll have an easier time reseating them. The cards, however, do take some wrangling to get properly seated - more pressure than you might think.

[ClubNinja]

I really wish I got one cab there but we hadn't 'opened the flood gates' at that point - a Sheriff cocktail, perfectly working. For a Nintendo nut like me, this was a sight to see. It was actually very bonertastic, but went for $250 or so.

Sheriff, wow. I haven't seen one of those in ages. Admittedly, I definitely would've gone for that piece and called it a day, instead of grabbing up a slew of troubled JAMMA cabs. Of course, that's just me and my interests in arcade cabs are "unique".

[portnoyd]

Sheriff, wow. I haven't seen one of those in ages. Admittedly, I definitely would've gone for that piece and called it a day, instead of grabbing up a slew of troubled JAMMA cabs. Of course, that's just me and my interests in arcade cabs are "unique".

I passed because, at that point, it was between renting a truck and not renting a truck. Like I said, flood gates were closed. Not to mention I didn't have much cash to go around...

@Dave: That sounds like a plan. I hope that's all it needs!

[AlanD]

If you are trying to get into the back of some of the cabs, you can often remove the marquee from the front. You can then reach through with a socket on extension and take the nut off the back of the rear door lock. That should let the rear open. From there you can usually reach through the back of the machine to the rear of the coin doors and take those locks apart.

Remove the locks, pop in new ones and away you go.

This doesn't work on a few machine since the light is mounted on a board that will block access to the lock but it is quick to take the marquee out and try it.

[portnoyd]

Thanks for all the help, but Dr. Stonic came to town, and in an hour and a half, he diagnosed everything and made some fixes. DogP, you were pretty spot on with your assessment, btw.

Sports Jam: Power reaches the monitor, but doesn't go through the heat voltage thingie (my words :P). The neck board checks out, but the main board couldn't be examined, and I don't have, and Scott didn't have a way with him, to discharge the monitor. The problem is most likely right there.

Turbo: Loose connection to the PCB. Tighten it - and now perfect.

Silk Worm: Bad power supply! A $25 fix. (Controls withstanding)

Bubble Bobble: Bad logic board. A new one will cost $XXX?

Dynasty Wars: Ding, brightness was all the way up. Works perfectly. Still don't understand why it didn't make any noise at the show, yet made noise (loud noise) at home. The monitor fuse was loose, so when Scott examined it, it wouldn't turn on. He gave it a tighten, and away we go.

Nintendo VS.: Circular locks be damned! No progress until I get drilling.

Neo 4slot: Passed that one. I know what's wrong with it and how to fix it. (Imagine that!)

Rastan: JAMMA Harness, indeed.

Grobda: One lock, to be drilled.

Thanks for all the help everyone who posted. Updates will come in time.

[Arcade Antics]

Thanks for all the help, but Dr. Stonic came to town, and in an hour and a half, he diagnosed everything and made some fixes.
I love that guy. :)

[DogP]

Cool... glad you got a lot of it diagnosed/fixed... do you have a camera? Since you're able to get into the Sports Jam, if you can take a pic of the chassis, I could probably help you out some more. Or Stonic... did you recognize the chassis?

BTW, did you replace the power supply in the Silkworm yet? I've got a bunch of extra power supplies if you need one you can have it for shipping.

I'm not sure about the price for a Bubble Bobble PCB, but there's an untested one on ebay right now: http://cgi.ebay.com/BUBBLE-BOBBLE-ARCADE-GAME-PCB_W0QQitemZ6242289462QQcategoryZ13718QQssPageNam eZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem . I can rapair PCBs too, so if you can't find one and want to mail it to me, I can at least look at it, and hopefully fix it. If the monitor is something that I have to test, I can almost certainly fix that.

DogP

[DogP]

Ah... sweet, I love K7000's... they're so easy to work on :) . My only complaint is the lack of markings on the solder side... Anyway, since Randy Fromm's site is still down :( , you can get the flow chart here: http://www.mameworld.net/dosmame/images/other/wg-k7000-flo.jpg .

If you've got HV, but no heater, check R213 on the neck board and bad solder joints on the flyback. More than likely it's a bad solder joint, since it was working before getting moved. BTW, K7000's discharge themselves when they turn off, but you should still manually discharge it, just to be safe.

DogP

[portnoyd]

The monitor was a K7191 or K7197... I found a flowchart real quick of one version, but the monitor was actually the other.

Once again, thanks to Scott again for the help. :)

I'm going to do a big Bob Roberts order for a bad of stuff, including the power supply. I need switches and all kinds of stuff, so no worries, but thanks for the offer DogP. :)

I also found a guy on usenet with a BB board, so we'll see what happens with that.

dave

[DogP]

The monitor was a K7191 or K7197... I found a flowchart real quick of one version, but the monitor was actually the other.

The K7000 flowchart works for all K70XX and K71XX monitors... this should be the one you need: http://www.mameworld.net/dosmame/images/other/wg-k7000-flo.jpg .

DogP