Philosophical cheating discussion

[Chrome]

How do you guys define cheating when it comes to classic games? What do you think about using turbo controllers? Cheat codes built into the game? Cheat codes from Game Genie or others?

When it comes to turbo controllers, I'm a little torn. On one hand, they make some games alot easier to play. On the other hand, I'm sure the game designers didn't have them in mind.

Cheat codes built into the game still make me feel as though I'm cheating, but they were put into the game on purpose (excluding glitches). So, I guess they are an "official" method for playing.

When it comes to using Game Genie's, I hands down consider this cheating. Afterall, you're using a device designed to rearrange the original games coding.

I've often thought about this, just wondered what all you guys thought about this, and whether you care about cheating in your games or not.

Later,
Chrome...

[googlefest1]

personlaly i think that is all cheating and i feel no sense of accomplishment finishing a game useing somekind of cheat

occasionaly i use a controler with a turbo and slow button for shooters - sometimes i need it to reduce some agrivation but i still feel like im cheating so while the agrivation gets reduced - it still remains to a degree

[Jibbajaba]

I agree with the Googlemeister, in that I think that everything you mentioned is cheating. That being said, if you are having fun cheating, then what's the harm in that? I cheat in games all the time, but again like The Googleman said, you don't get that feeling of acomplishment anymore. Basically, if you beat a game by cheating, you didn't beat the game. But it sure can be fun to play Call of Duty with all the weapons and unlimited ammo. Invinsibility makes it not fun anymore though.

Often I cheat in FPS games just because I like using certain weapons that aren't available on all of te levels. I really like playing WWII-themed FPSes on my computer, anf my favorite weapon is always the Thompson, but it also seems to be the one given to you the least, so I just give myself the weapon using a cheat code.

Lamest cheat ever is using a turbo controller on Track and field.

Chris

[daynum]

I agree that it's all cheating, including the deliberately built in codes. I sometimes wonder why those codes are put into games in the first place. The Contra code for example takes a challenging game and turns it into a walk in the park that can be easily finished on your first go. You can hardly claim to have genuinely beaten the game using that code.

[Snapple]

I try to cheat as little as possible.

I also consider looking up solutions to a puzzle-solving game to be cheating.

It's basically just what the other guys' said. I don't think there's anything really wrong with cheating, as long as you're not gloating about it or trying to hide the fact that you've cheated. It just takes away any sense of accomplishment. People who cheat are really only cheating themselves.

I have no moral problem with it though.

I do find one thing kind of funny though. Nowadays, people try to find ways to make playing games easier. 20-25 years ago, one of the biggest selling points they put on games was "challenge." You'd never see a commercial these days where they go, "This game is insanely challenging!" It's just not part of the values of the common consumer anymore.

[Porksta]

I agree that it's all cheating, including the deliberately built in codes. I sometimes wonder why those codes are put into games in the first place. The Contra code for example takes a challenging game and turns it into a walk in the park that can be easily finished on your first go. You can hardly claim to have genuinely beaten the game using that code.

They are put in the game so that playtesters can take a quick run through the game to make sure that all the weapons work right, all the levels exist, etc.

[LocalH]

My belief is, anything that can be done without modifying the ROM isn't cheating, from the perspective of private single-player gaming. For competitive or multiplayer gaming, cheating is whatever the group agrees on.

[Hep038]

"Eating is Not Cheating"







sorry I could not resist.

[Kid Ice]

My definition of classic games would only include pre-crash console and arcade games. In most of those games it is not possible to cheat. In MAME and most of the classic arcade compilations you can play around with the settings to add extra lives or put the game on an easier difficulty setting...I would rather play the game as I remember it.

If I extend my definition to include NES games, the answer would still be no...when I originally played those games, I was not an avid gamer who was into magazines, strategy guides, cheat codes, etc. I just played them as is. I've never used the Konami code. So when I play those games now, I don't cheat because that's not how I played them back then.

[Slimedog]

How do you guys define cheating when it comes to classic games? What do you think about using turbo controllers? Cheat codes built into the game? Cheat codes from Game Genie or others?

When it comes to turbo controllers, I'm a little torn. On one hand, they make some games alot easier to play. On the other hand, I'm sure the game designers didn't have them in mind.



I never use cheating devices or button codes as it would just ruin the fun for me. I can't imagine what fun somebody would find in plowing through a game with invincibility turned on, but I know people who do it. The risk and challenge is part of the experience and stripping that away is sort of like reading the cliff notes instead of the novel.

Your mention of using turbo buttons as cheating gives me pause (or slo-mo) for thought. I haven't used a turbo controller since the NES days, but I never really considered it cheating. I suppose it would be cheating if the point of the game was to hammer buttons quickly, like Track and Field, but I just considered it a finger saver for shumps. If a first-party controller supports turbo, then it can't be cheating. That would give the green light to turbo for NES and Turbografx. But even on other systems, I personally wouldn't consider using a turbo button to be cheating on any system.

[ProgrammingAce]

One of the reasons i sometimes cheat in my games is due to time. I just plain don't have time to play every single game i own, at least not through to completion. A lot of the racing games i own take a long time to unlock all of the cars. I know for some of them, i just used the "all cars" cheats straight out of the gate. I just don't have time to unlock all of the cars one by one.

[Jumpman Jr.]

I don't really like cheating in any games that I'm playing to beat. However, if it's a game that I'm just dinking around with for fun, I may throw some cheat codes in there just to make it easier or more fun.
I also feel the need to look up FAQ's or walkthroughs on games, but only if I've been stuck for a really long time and can't figure out how to proceed.

[Nukie]

I consider anything you do that is not start it up and play cheating. If you use a turbo controller or built in cheat, less of a form, but still cheating. That said, I cheat on games when I want to do something stupid like kill the cyber-demon with a chainsaw.

[DeputyMoniker]

If you aren't beating the game by the rules set by the people who made it, then you aren't actually beating the game. You're just cheating it. Turbo controllers, codes, game genie, strategy guides...they're all cheating. I never cheat a game the first time through but after that, I've already beat it so cheating is fine. I will use strat guides for fighters though. As long as I'm only using it to learn fighting techniques and learning combo's.

It's like playing tic-tac-toe but going three times before your oponent has an opportunity to go...did you beat him? I don't think so.

[Chrome]

If you aren't beating the game by the rules set by the people who made it, then you aren't actually beating the game.

Yes, but here's the question. You've got a first party turbo controller, like the NES Advantage. Nintendo made some games and Liscensed many more of them. Is that part of the rules? What about the Konami code? Konami must have but it in the game, is it part of the rules. These are the questions I'm debating over.

Later,
Chrome...

[DeputyMoniker]

If you aren't beating the game by the rules set by the people who made it, then you aren't actually beating the game.

Yes, but here's the question. You've got a first party turbo controller, like the NES Advantage. Nintendo made some games and Liscensed many more of them. Is that part of the rules? What about the Konami code? Konami must have but it in the game, is it part of the rules. These are the questions I'm debating over.

Later,
Chrome...

In my opinion, tweaking is bad when it makes the game easier. Even if the game maker has given you the opportunity to do it. Take Namco museum for instance, they may give you the opportunity to begin Galaga with 5 lives but I wont be impressed with your score unless you started with the default 3 lives. Same thing with turbo, you have that option in the game but you wont impress me unless you use the default 2 shots at once. Thats my opinion so you very well may impress other people with your score no matter what you do.

[Berserker]

If you feel like cheating then just do it, if you're sure that's the way you'd get the most enjoyment out of a game. I doubt you're going to find much vindication here though.

There's really nothing like facing what seems like an impossibly hard game, full of seemingly insermountable obstacles, and finally conquering it by virtue of fingers and thumbs alone. Cheating is less epic in nature, and more like a short-term amusing distraction.

It's your call.

[Slimedog]

For those who think a turbo button is cheating, would it be cheating on the Turbografx? Its my understanding that the default controller has a turbo switch, so you would be hard pressed to say the developers weren't expecting players to use turbo. I think it goes back to the intent of the developer. Using turbo on Galaga is cheating because in the arcade, that wasn't an option and thats how it was designed.