A Paypal Problem (This is getting fun!)

[Jed]

(EDIT: To follow the story, read my scattered posts throughout this topic.)

Scenario: I'm selling a bunch of games on eBay, and I don't ship overseas for eBay people unless they go out of their way to request it. I get an email asking to buy 3 of the DS games that I had. I had extras of all 3 so I didn't have to end any auctions or anything, and we worked out a price of $64.

So he pays, I send it on 2/6. (He lives in Australia.)

I'm checking my email a few days ago, and I have a complaint charged against me, for those games (it's not even been 3 weeks at this point). I go in and see this:

Buyer's Comments:
Hi ! Over 3 weeks I am still not received the goods.

First off that's a lie, since I sent it on 2/6. Secondly, he never once emailed me, he went right to Paypal. So I respond using the Customs Label number in the 'tracking information' field, and email him on the side with that number, and a picture of the receipt.

A few days go by, and I log in today to see that Paypal granted him the refund. This made me quite pissed off. I can't appeal it correctly since I can't put any comments in, so I emailed support with the following friendly words:

"This is fucking ridiculous. I recently had a claim against me for games that I sold to someone in Australia. It's only been THREE WEEKS. He never once emailed me. He put a claim through and got his money, even though I've taken pictures of the receipts and provided tracking information. I can't be held responsible if Customs holds on to something for a couple weeks, and I can't trust the buyer to send my money back once the games do arrive, which I know they will, BECAUSE I SENT THEM. I want my fucking money back, and I want it now. This is COMPLETE BULLSHIT. I can't run a fucking business if I know that people can just screw me over this easily. I'm calling Customs tomorrow to see if I can get any information on the package, and if it's able to be retrieved, I'm keeping the games and refunding him. Until then, I want my money returned."

I then went on to link to the picture of the receipt and Customs number. I'm going to call Customs tomorrow to see if I can find info on it. If it didn't leave the country yet, then great, I'll get the box back and get the goods back. If it DID leave already, I'll tell Paypal to call Customs or find some other way to show them that it is on the way. I haven't emailed the buyer directly yet, I want to see what Paypal says. But so help me God, if I end up losing both the games AND the money, I'll have no qualms about flying to Australia and kicking the shit out of this guy and his family.

So yeah, this is the first real problem I've encountered in my years of selling. I've had to issue refunds before, but *I* did it because there was fairly good reason (it got lost/damaged/whatever). I've had flawless feedback for years. I'm a power seller. And they're gonna side with some asshole buyer instead of a reputable person? What the hell am I paying so much in fees for if I'm gonna get screwed over anyway?

Yeah, just letting off some steam. I'm considering closing my account, too. There's no point in me giving them hundreds of dollars a month and still getting fucked over.

[Princess-Isabela]

I'm sorry to hear this, thats really messed up that paypal always put up with buyer and that once again confirms it - sending overseas is risky, guy won games on ebay from you?
if so you can always leave negative feedback and issue complain through ebay, would be fair in this situation.
also - did you have money on your paypal balance?
or they took money from your bank?
well anyway, good luck and keep us informed, what happened.
regards.

[Jed]

Nah, it wasn't on eBay. The games I was selling were on eBay, but I had like 3 or 4 of each individual game. I have my eBay listings set up to not allow international buyers.

Yeah, I did have enough in my account. I always keep a few hundred in there in case I need to make a large purchase or something.

[GrandAmChandler]

Jed, this is when dealing with eBay I ship to the USA only. No offense to international posters here, as I would gladly deal with someone here overseas that I knew. But on eBay? Never. It's just not worth it. There are plenty of USA buyers.

I turned on the eBay option to only allow bidders from the US to bid. It's just less of a mess.

[GrandAmChandler]

Jed, this is when dealing with eBay I ship to the USA only. No offense to international posters here, as I would gladly deal with someone here overseas that I knew. But on eBay? Never. It's just not worth it. There are plenty of USA buyers.

I turned on the eBay option to only allow bidders from the US to bid. It's just less of a mess.

[scooby105]

Yeah. Shipping out of the country is a pain. I never list that I'll ship out of country and when I do I only use Express Mail and usually charge a markup. Most of the time I'd rather just let my item sell for less money and not deal with it.

[johno590]

I too only ship to the US for ebay... just too much of a hassle to ship it anywhere else.

I hope you get something figured out, because that would suck to be out the money and the game. Good luck.

[Kitsune Sniper]

That sucks. I get a lot of business from Germany, I'm always happy to accomodate buyers if they're willing to buy through Global Priority Mail.

I can't imagine not selling internationally, to be honest. :/

[Jed]

The plot thickens. I checked his eBay name (since he sent me a question through eBay when I had the listings up)

This guy's a FUCKING DEALER. He's a video game dealer. And a power seller. Like me. It would be one thing if he bought the games for little Johnny's birthday, and they didn't arrive on time, etc. But this guy bought them purely to re-sell. This pisses me off even more, and I'm thinking of fucking him over tenfold.

Sorry about all the recent language, I'm really pissed about this.

[badinsults]

You should buy the games back and chargeback just to spite him.

[Darth Sensei]

Jed, do you really think sending an e-mail like that is going to get you any cooperation whatsoever? You're a retard.

[kevin_psx]

You should buy the games back and chargeback just to spite him.
I like that idea. Of course, the guy in Australia will likely block Jed from buying.

JED:

1-866-515-3229, option 5 (i think) and talk to paypal about the dispute. They are VERY polite and VERY helpful. They'll let you file an appeal to the decision.



Everyone should close their PayPal account. They take your money as they please and with no good reason just because they can. Who's with me?
No. I'm happy because they recovered $210 of my money from dishonest sellers.

[Jed]

Let's not spin this out of control... >_>

Anyway, another update. The guy just listed one of the games that was in the box I sent him. You can say coincidence, but I'm not buying that. There's something fishy. He got over on me, got his money back, and then the very next day listed one of the games that was in the box that he didn't get. I emailed Paypal again with this information. We'll see what happens.

[Darth Sensei]

Let's not spin this out of control... >_>

Anyway, another update. The guy just listed one of the games that was in the box I sent him. You can say coincidence, but I'm not buying that. There's something fishy. He got over on me, got his money back, and then the very next day listed one of the games that was in the box that he didn't get. I emailed Paypal again with this information. We'll see what happens.

Ok, now that's great. You'd think that if he'd just stolen them from you, he'd wait at least a month to fence the stolen goods. :roll:

[XianXi]

This happend to me before, good thing is that Paypal enforces that the buyer can NOT have both the items and the money when filing for a item not recieved. If the customs tracking number can confirm it being delivered then Paypal will give you your money back.

I bought something from someone and it took 5 weeks to get to me. He refunded me at the 35 day mark and once it arrived with DC, the next day the funds were pulled from my account and back to the seller.

[Jed]

The problem with DC though, is that it's not always accurate. If people just neglect to scan something, it'll never show up as delivered. It works a little differently for overseas things, too. Once it leaves the country, it's no longer tracked. So technically, I'll never have solid proof that it was delivered.

[Bluteg]

Sorry about your loss Jed, your a good seller and I'm sad to see another victim of Paypal. I've called Paypal over bullshit disputes and they will politely say "we don't care".

[Rev. Link]

I feel for you, man. This is why I won't allow people to buy from me using PayPal. All it takes is an unscrupulous buyer and you totally get screwed.

It may be hypocritical, but I have no problem using PayPal to buy things. It's fast, convenient, and easy. But I absolutely will not accept it as a seller.

[Jed]

Thanks for the kind words. I know what you mean, I'd just never had such a problem in my years of using it. I always heard the stories and just figured they'd never happen to me. I do seriously believe I'm getting screwed over. I emailed Paypal with more information and they told me in so many words that I'm shit out of luck. I have to either provide solid proof of the delivery (which is impossible anyway), or have him say that he got the games. Don't think that's gonna happen, so I'm fucked. But it's alright. Because people will pay.

[XianXi]

Thanks for the kind words. I know what you mean, I'd just never had such a problem in my years of using it. I always heard the stories and just figured they'd never happen to me. I do seriously believe I'm getting screwed over. I emailed Paypal with more information and they told me in so many words that I'm shit out of luck. I have to either provide solid proof of the delivery (which is impossible anyway), or have him say that he got the games. Don't think that's gonna happen, so I'm fucked. But it's alright. Because people will pay.

Jed,

Call them man. I never got anything resolved by emailing them.

[MightySlacker]

Mind posting his ebay name to warn others?

And I understand the anger, having been in the same situation before, but it's all self inflicted. Paypal's Seller Protection Policy is pretty clear, and it says you have to have tracking. When you take paypal from international users, it's always a calculated risk.

Dave

[kevin_psx]

The guy just listed one of the games that was in the box I sent him. ....... He got over on me, got his money back, and then the very next day listed one of the games that was in the box that he didn't get.

Scam artist from Australia.

[kevin_psx]

1-866-515-3229

option 3 (i think?) to get paypal customer service. Be polite & they will help you find a solution.

[boozi2]

Ahhh man, I hear ya... Sucks ass when stuff like that happens. I had a similar issue, but I was the buyer. I filed a complaint against a seller who never sent the item for about three weeks. I got the money back and I got the item, but it wasn't the exact one that was described in the auction. Since I didn't know if it'll work with my cousin's 5th gen iPod, I've decided to send him back the item. I really hate to be an ass and I wouldn't have kept the item if I got my money back. It's just out of my nature. Anyways, I've sent him the item back and got a different item. Hope everything will turn out fine, but as it seems right now, it's kinda bad :/

[Kitsune Sniper]

I hope you got good pictures of the items you sold. If they're good enough, then you can use them as proof that the guy scammed you.

[kevin_psx]

"This is fucking ridiculous. I can't run a fucking business if I know that people can just screw me over this easily."

In retail it's called shrinkage. Loss of items through no fault of the store (mostly theft).

Ebay/paypal thinks you should just label it "shrinkage" and forget about it. They even say on their site that losing money is a normal part of business.

I've got $5.00 I can spare. You want it?

[Bluteg]

Ebay/Paypal, label themselves as safe and reliable. Therefore. we should not have to put up with this "shrinkage". It would be a different story if Paypal was free. Which it should be, a free service giving ebay the benefit of holding US$ and a garuntee that they will get there fees, but sellers having to pay fees just to get fucked over like this is rediculous.

[Jed]

but sellers having to pay fees just to get fucked over like this is rediculous.

Amen. Although, buyers do get fucked over too, so it's a lose/lose.

I've decided to stop accepting Paypal on eBay. I'll still use it for buying in some situations, and I'll use it for sales that I make here (since I figure you guys are like family and would actually let me know ahead of time if there were any problems, instead of going behind my back, heh). For eBay I'll just do MOs and maybe some kind of merchant account thing that lets me take credit cards.

I was checking out the various Anti-Paypal websites out there, and some of the stories I read were astonishing. I had gone to these sites years ago, before I started selling, and I kinda laughed it off like that stuff really couldn't happen. But when I read them now, I see it in a whole new light. I'm not gonna actively cry out against them as if they were the devil, but I'll just casually stop accepting it as payment. But damn, you should read some of the stories, makes my situation seem trivial...

[evil_genius]

How about some links jed? I wanna read the stories too.

[fishsandwich]

paypalsucks.com or paypalsux.com

[jerome]

As a seller for 8 years on ebay, over 5,000 total transactions I LOVE PAYPAL.

Let's be clear, Paypal WILL AWAYS side witht the buyer, not the seller. Once a buyer states he has not received goods, unless a seller can prove they were delivered (dc in US or EMS intl), they will refund the buyer's money- period.

I'm 1/2 seller and 1/2 buyer so I see both sides. Paypal can not be a detective, they don't have the resources to know what condition an item was sent in or proof that a buyer got the item. They are essentially a "buyers protection first" company. I don't know how they could do it any other way. If they had the resources to investigate more, they'd make some wrong decisions anyway and you'd always have somebody pissed off.

As a seller I LOVE getting paid within 48 hours and I HATE MONEY ORDERS. Most buyers don't even list what the damn money order is for and it slows transactions to a snail's pace.

I PERSONALLY WOULD LIKE TO START A "MONEYORDERSSUCK.COM" WEB SITE.

My Payment percentage with paypal only auctions (which is all I do) is about 99.5%. When I used to take money orders (mostly from kids probably), it was about 80%.

I'd like any improvments which can be made to Paypal to take place but totally support that way of business.

As to international sells, I don't know what to do. I currently have 25% of sales to certain countries and I don't want to lose that business BUT there are frequent problems. A very honest buyer didn't get 3 snes games I shiipped 7 weeks ago and now wants money back. I told him I'd split it with him. My feeling is if the seller ships and has the copy of the customs voucher and the buyer elected to accept airposte shipping which does not allow any tracking, then the buyer must assume all or some of the responsibility in the transaction. I now put a disclaimer in all auctions telling intl buyers to pick a different shipping method (EMS?) if they do not want to assume total responsiblity for the shipping. I'm hoping that will help a little
S

[kevin_psx]

(dc in US or EMS intl),


What's EMS? Is that the same as Global Express tracking?

[gepeto]

As a seller for 8 years on ebay, over 5,000 total transactions I LOVE PAYPAL.
Let's be clear, Paypal WILL AWAYS side witht the buyer
, not the seller. Once a buyer states he has not received goods, unless a seller can prove they were delivered (dc in US or EMS intl), they will refund the buyer's money- period.

I'm 1/2 seller and 1/2 buyer so I see both sides. Paypal can not be a detective, they don't have the resources to know what condition an item was sent in or proof that a buyer got the item. They are essentially a "buyers protection first" company. I don't know how they could do it any other way. If they had the resources to investigate more, they'd make some wrong decisions anyway and you'd always have somebody pissed off.

As a seller I LOVE getting paid within 48 hours and I HATE MONEY ORDERS. Most buyers don't even list what the damn money order is for and it slows transactions to a snail's pace.

I PERSONALLY WOULD LIKE TO START A "MONEYORDERSSUCK.COM" WEB SITE.

My Payment percentage with paypal only auctions (which is all I do) is about 99.5%. When I used to take money orders (mostly from kids probably), it was about 80%.

I'd like any improvments which can be made to Paypal to take place but totally support that way of business.

As to international sells, I don't know what to do. I currently have 25% of sales to certain countries and I don't want to lose that business BUT there are frequent problems. A very honest buyer didn't get 3 snes games I shiipped 7 weeks ago and now wants money back. I told him I'd split it with him. My feeling is if the seller ships and has the copy of the customs voucher and the buyer elected to accept airposte shipping which does not allow any tracking, then the buyer must assume all or some of the responsibility in the transaction. I now put a disclaimer in all auctions telling intl buyers to pick a different shipping method (EMS?) if they do not want to assume total responsiblity for the shipping. I'm hoping that will help a little
S

Oh Please:

Quote Let's be clear, Paypal WILL AWAYS side witht the buyer.

That is bull.

I bet if a law was passed stating that paypal would have to refund all the money if fraud was proven
pay pal would move there ass and start fully investigating and prosecuting fraudulant indiviuals.

Paypal accepts the money transfers the money and charges a fee therefore they should be held more accountable.

I think customers deserve more than vanilla replys. Stating

You have won your case but unfortunately there is no money in the account. Paypal is continuing try to get your money back.

Oh really, What secret investigating is paypal doing on my behalf?

Here is paypals reply
Paypal is unable to discuss what it is doing.

In the words of Judge Judy.
Don't pee on my leg and tell me it's raining

[Jed]

Let's be clear, Paypal WILL AWAYS side witht the buyer, not the seller. Once a buyer states he has not received goods, unless a seller can prove they were delivered (dc in US or EMS intl), they will refund the buyer's money- period.

My feeling is if the seller ships and has the copy of the customs voucher and the buyer elected to accept airposte shipping which does not allow any tracking, then the buyer must assume all or some of the responsibility in the transaction. I now put a disclaimer in all auctions telling intl buyers to pick a different shipping method (EMS?) if they do not want to assume total responsiblity for the shipping. I'm hoping that will help a little

Unfortunately, you're wrong on both counts.

I've read numerous stories of both buyers and sellers being screwed by Paypal. People have gotten screwed badly because of something like this:

Buyer buys something on eBay. Seller doesn't ship. Buyer tries to contact. Seller ignores. Buyer files claim with Paypal. Seller ships empty box (or something filled with junk) with delivery confirmation and uses that as the tracking. It shows up as delivered and Paypal will sometimes (depending on how they feel I guess, they're so screwed up they'll take two different sides in identical situations.) side with the seller. If they do, the buyer gets screwed. Buyer tries to file an 'item not as described claim', but they CAN'T, because you can't file two different types of claims for the same transaction. Buyer is screwed.

Like I said, that doesn't happen every time, since you can't predict what Paypal will do next. It seems like they flip a coin sometimes.

As for the second line I quoted, unfortunately, it doesn't work that way. You can put whatever you want to in your disclaimer, it really means nothing. It does not matter at all what the buyer chooses. If the item doesn't show up, it is the seller's responsibility, 100%. The ownership of the item does not change hands once you ship it, it changes hands once they receive it. And it's the seller's responsibility to make sure it gets there, and provide any kind of tracking or insurance. There's not a whole lot you can do about it, either.

[jerome]

Points well taken, altho I do humbly disagree with a seller being 100% responsible for delivery. What if the guy lives in an appartment and the neighors dog chews it up after it got there, but before the guy gets it?

At any rate, Pay is YOUR company now. You must provide a service for buyers and sellers and yeah you take a %. Now you are constantly flooded with complaints from buyers and sellers. HOW DO YOU HANDLE IT? I've yet to hear from PAYPAL KILLERS what constructive changes they would make (remember its your company, you've still got to make a profit or company folds) to improve decisions over disputes. Its just a couple humans reading emails and having to make a decision.

AT LEAST JUDGE JUDY CAN SEE AND QUESTION THE EMBECILES IN FRONT OF HER.

[Jed]

Points well taken, altho I do humbly disagree with a seller being 100% responsible for delivery. What if the guy lives in an appartment and the neighors dog chews it up after it got there, but before the guy gets it?

That's what insurance is for. If you have any doubt whatsoever as to the saftey of the item, insure it. Even if the buyer didn't pay for it, do it anyway. Apartments, college dorms, anything can happen to it before it gets to the buyer. It's the seller's responsibilty to make sure it's safely delivered. As long as you insure it, at least you're protected money-wise.

[Griking]

Points well taken, altho I do humbly disagree with a seller being 100% responsible for delivery. What if the guy lives in an appartment and the neighors dog chews it up after it got there, but before the guy gets it?

That's what insurance is for. If you have any doubt whatsoever as to the saftey of the item, insure it. Even if the buyer didn't pay for it, do it anyway. Apartments, college dorms, anything can happen to it before it gets to the buyer. It's the seller's responsibilty to make sure it's safely delivered. As long as you insure it, at least you're protected money-wise.

Actually I don't think that insurance would cover this kind of claim since the damage wasn't caused while it was in the post office's hands. I also feel that preventing this kind of damage is not the seller's responsibility. If the item was packaged well he did his job. How it he supposed to protect the package from the neighbor's dog? It's the buyer's fault for not having a large enough mailbox or a safe place for packages to be delivered.

[Jed]

Points well taken, altho I do humbly disagree with a seller being 100% responsible for delivery. What if the guy lives in an appartment and the neighors dog chews it up after it got there, but before the guy gets it?

That's what insurance is for. If you have any doubt whatsoever as to the saftey of the item, insure it. Even if the buyer didn't pay for it, do it anyway. Apartments, college dorms, anything can happen to it before it gets to the buyer. It's the seller's responsibilty to make sure it's safely delivered. As long as you insure it, at least you're protected money-wise.

Actually I don't think that insurance would cover this kind of claim since the damage wasn't caused while it was in the post office's hands. I also feel that preventing this kind of damage is not the seller's responsibility. If the item was packaged well he did his job. How it he supposed to protect the package from the neighbor's dog? It's the buyer's fault for not having a large enough mailbox or a safe place for packages to be delivered.

From what I've experienced having worked for a delivery company, it's the delivery person's responsibility to find a safe place to leave it. I used to work for FedEx, and if anything happened to it after we dropped it off, it was still our responsibility. I don't know if the post office works that way too, but it was our fault if anything happened. They always told us to find a safe place. Somewhere hidden or out of the way, or on the back porch, with a neighbor, anything to make sure it wouldn't be seen or susceptible to damage/theft. Sad part is, all this is still the responsibility of the seller. When you sell something, the delivery company you choose is the consignee of the sale. So, anything that happens while they have it is still your responsibility/liability as the seller. I believe all packages sent through FedEx Home Delivery had some kind of built in insurance. If anything happened to the box in transit, or if it got stolen off the porch, the driver would get blamed for it no matter what. FedEx would pay out the insurance claim, and take it from the driver.

Like I said, I don't know if the post office works in a similar fashion, but I believe you would still be able to file an insurance claim in that kind of situation.

[Steven]

To the guy who said he only accepts MO's for his eBay auctions -- thats fine and dandy but you probably know as well as anyone else, having an MO-only auction cuts out your potential bidder-base signficantly. A lot of buyers like to stick with paypal only, so you'll be losing out.

But I understand everyone floats to their own beat, or something like that.

[jerome]

I still absolutely disagree with the many who support the "seller's always at fault". Buyers undertand that a delivery system will be used and that a seller can't control that. A buyer has the option to pay for insurance, or any tracking or whatever he wants to get the "comfort level" he / she needs to make sure the item reaches them or can be tracked. The heck if I'm paying for insurance for every buyer, that's not my job. I can offer it, but everyone's not getting a free insurance "ride".

Is this just opinion about sellers being responsible for EVERYTHING or is it written somewhere in Ebay policy or where ever? Can't argue with policy, but as an 8 year seller with darn good feedback, I'm not taking responsiblity for factors I can not control.

I believe the transaction is a "partnership" between buyer and seller and that both should understand factors can come up which can not be controlled. Perhaps they should split the cost. The buyer has to take some responsibiliy in all this, in my opinion
S

[jerome]

I still haven't seen one person upset by Paypal pretend they were running the company for profit and how they would change how things are handled. Its easy to criticise Paypal but you have to have suggestions about how YOU would run the company for profit and satisfy everyone.
S

[kevin_psx]

I still absolutely disagree with the many who support the "seller's always at fault". A buyer has the option to pay for insurance..... The heck if I'm paying for insurance for every buyer, that's not my job.


If you offer insurance, and buyer does not buy, but does an "not received" through paypal, the buyer will win auomatically. Paypal considers it the seller's responsibility if packages go lost or damaged.

[XianXi]

Just read these and now I can say a lot of things make sense now. This may not help Jed but will help in future dealings.



How do I prove that I shipped an item?

Delivery companies that offer online tracking are recommended. If your delivery service does not offer online tracking, we will ask you to provide an online reference number and fax a copy of the receipt that you received when you shipped the item


How long does the seller have to ship my item?

We encourage sellers to ship items as soon as they receive an order. However, for sellers to be eligible for Seller Protection, we require shipment within 7 days of receiving a payment. Please allow more time for sellers who are shipping internationally. International shipments may be delayed due to customs.


What does the Buyer Complaint process mean to me as a seller?

If your buyer files a claim stating that the goods were never received, you may be eligible for liability protection if you have followed the rules of our Seller Protection Policy:
You must be Verified
You must not have accepted multiple payments for a single purchase from one or multiple PayPal accounts
You must not have shipped internationally outside the coverage area
You must provide us with reasonable proof-of-shipment that can be tracked online. This documentation must show that you shipped to the buyer's confirmed address which is displayed on the Transaction Details page. Many carrier companies offer this service, including the U.S. Postal Service and Royal Mail.
You must also provide PayPal with complete information within seven days of our request. However, if we are required by the credit card association to respond immediately to resolve a chargeback, you must provide the information within three days. We will indicate the response time required in the email message sent to the seller.
At this time, the Seller Protection Policy only covers U.S. or Canadian sellers when transacting with U.S. buyers, and U.K. sellers when transacting with U.K. or U.S. buyers. Please review our Seller Protection Policy, or view our Seller Protection Policy eligibility guidelines for more information.

[Jed]

Well, I just got an email from the buyer.

"Hi !
Sorry about that.
I just received them.
Only 2 games, no Zoo Tycoon.
So I will pay for you 2 games.
Please let me know. "

Uhh... right. One of the games just magically disappeared out of the box (which actually IS a possibility if Customs got their greedy hands on it, but still). Ironically, when I mentioned that he was selling the games that were in the box, he listed a Shamu and a Spyro, but not a Zoo Tycoon. I dunno what to make of that, but at least something arrived and we can hopefully close this whole thing out. At least now it's not a total loss, but still.

[Darth Sensei]

Don't ship outside the US.

[jajaja]

Don't ship outside the US.

This can happend within the US too. I've bought hundres of items from the US and theres been about 2-3 things i havnt recived.

[Darth Sensei]

I'm confused, aren't you a resident of the UK or somewhere?

[Jed]

The guy just changed his story.

First he said there was no Zoo Tycoon. I replied with my whole weight of the box thing proving that there were 3 in there, and I asked him if Customs had opened the box or if there was tampering, etc.

So I get this reply.

"Zoo Tycoon DS only have a case and manual and case of the game but not the chip for the game. It broken in half.. I mean the chip for the game.
Pleae let me know. "

So the game magically reappeared, but is now broken in half? How the hell do you break a DS game in half? Anyone that's bought something from me here on DP can vouch for my packing jobs. There's no possible way a DS game could break. Obviously, I can't prove that, but still. This is getting amusing.

And CueWarrior: You're right. I don't ship out of country anymore, except for DPers whom I've dealt with before. No more international sales on eBay, it's not worth it.

[loporjai2003]

Broken DS game inside the case ? I tend to call BS considering DS cases and games are indestructible (almost) ... what is this scammers EBAY user's ID so we can all block them off ?

[jajaja]

I'm confused, aren't you a resident of the UK or somewhere?

Not UK, but Europe :)

[Jed]

His eBay ID is love4ubb

He's a power seller in Australia, he seems to buy a lot of games that are cheap to get in the US, but not so cheap to get in Australia. As of now he's agreed to send me the money for the 2 games ($38 or so), plus to send back the broken game. He didn't seem too happy about having to send the game back, probably because he has to take a Zoo Tycoon and smash it with a hammer to prove his point. >_>

[Griking]

Don't ship outside the US.

This can happend within the US too.

You won't experience customs dept. problems if you don't ship outside the US

And I agree, it's impossible for a DS game to get broken in half during shipping if there's no sign of damage to the box itself.

[kevin_psx]

"Hi !
Sorry about that.
I just received them.
Only 2 games, no Zoo Tycoon.
So I will pay for you 2 games.
Please let me know. "





The guy just changed his story. "Zoo Tycoon DS only have a case and manual and case of the game but not the chip for the game. It broken in half.. I mean the chip for the game. Please let me know. "


What a LIAR. Send this guy a link to this thread-- he can watch all of us put him on our blocked bidder lists. Oh! Just 'cause he says he's going to pay you/send the game back? Does not mean he will.

[Jed]

I haven't heard from him since he said he would pay, which was a few days ago. I gave him the benefit of the doubt for the weekend, but if I don't hear from him by tomorrow I'm emailing him again. At this point I don't care about the Zoo Tycoon, I'll take the loss on that even though I know I'm getting screwed on it. I just want some money back so the whole thing can be put to rest.

[kevin_psx]

I haven't heard from him since he said he would pay, which was a few days ago.

Call Paypal by phone and say you want to appeal the Dispute verdict. Ask them for an email address so you can forward the emails from the Buyer saying he got the items.

Do the same with Ebay when you file a Non-payer Dispute.

[Jed]

Well, it wasn't on eBay, but that's a moot point. This part gets very interesting.

I emailed him after not hearing from him for days, I wrote the following:

"Hi, I'm just checking up. If you didn't send the game yet and you don't want to, then you don't have to. I just want to get this whole thing overwith, so if you just send the $38 over it would be appreciated.

Jed"

After a while, I get the following email:

"Hi Jed !
The game has been sent last few days.
I paid direct into your paypal account at the same time.
Also email to you a copy receipt from Paypal."

Uhh... no. I never got any money from this guy, my Paypal account is devoid of any activity from him. I dunno what kind of fantasy world this guy is living on, but this shit is over. I have all the evidence I need to appeal the Paypal dispute. I have emails from him saying he got them. Then changing his story in his attempt to rip me off. Then not sending me money and trying to claim that he did (I haven't received that 'receipt' email as of this post.). So, that's that. I'm contacting Paypal to get this garbage taken care of. And if Paypal fails to cooperate, I'll sue those fuckers (if I can, anyway. People have done it and won >_>). Their ineptitude is costing me money, costing me sales, (I had to turn away 3 international buyers yesterday) and pissing me off in a way that nothing really should.

So yeah, I'm kinda burned out from all this. I don't deal with stress very well, I get very frustrated and angry. And with the way this month has been going, I really, really don't need this shit.

[kevin_psx]

I wonder if you can file "mail fraud" via the Australian Post Office's website? You've got emails as proof that he received the package. Let the Austalian police arrest him.

Maybe contact the U.S. Embassy in Australia. Ask them for assistance with the local laws.
Call Paypal by phone and say you want to appeal the Dispute verdict. Ask them for an email address so you can forward the emails from the Buyer saying he got the items.