Question about the SNES Super FX Chip

[Melf]

I'm finishing up an article on the Sega SVP chip for my site, and I plan to include a table comparing it to the FX chip. However, I can't seem to find any info on exactly how many MIPS the FX could handle or how many polygons it could push, roughly. I've searched dozens of sites (put in about 7 hours of research already) and have come up with little about the overall specs.

Anyone know where I can find this info? Emulation or Nintendo tech sites perhaps?

Thanks in advance. :)

[PC-Famicom64]

I'm finishing up an article on the Sega SVP chip for my site, and I plan to include a table comparing it to the FX chip. However, I can't seem to find any info on exactly how many MIPS the FX could handle or how many polygons it could push, roughly. I've searched dozens of sites (put in about 7 hours of research already) and have come up with little about the overall specs.

Anyone know where I can find this info? Emulation or Nintendo tech sites perhaps?

Thanks in advance. :)Super FX1=1000 Polygons per second & runing at 10.5 MHz.

Super FX2=50,000 Polygons per second & runing at 21 MHz (Per chip,ther were going to have games with 2 Super FX2 chips in side the cart but all od them got cansel,you can have a max of 4 chips) .

As for MIPS,I don't no about that,Hope this helps.

;)

[CosmicMonkey]

Do you have any info on the games that would have used 2 SFX chips, please?

I'd love to see what a SNES could do armed with 4 SFX chips. I assume that Mario 3D (what became Mario64) used multiple SFXs?

[Melf]

Super FX1=1000 Polygons per second & runing at 10.5 MHz.

Super FX2=50,000 Polygons per second & runing at 21 MHz (Per chip,ther were going to have games with 2 Super FX2 chips in side the cart but all od them got cansel,you can have a max of 4 chips) .

That many polygons? Not bad. Do you have a source I could link to, to include in the article as a reference?

[PC-Famicom64]

Do you have any info on the games that would have used 2 SFX chips, please?

I'd love to see what a SNES could do armed with 4 SFX chips. I assume that Mario 3D (what became Mario64) used multiple SFXs?Super Smash Bros (Became a N64 game becuse HAL Laboratory Inc. did not what to make a big game on a dieing system) ,and Banjo Kazooie (with a SA-1 & SDD-1 chip,but become a N64 game for the same reson as Super Smash Bros) ,as fare as I know,Mario 64 was never going to be a Super NES game,only a N64 game becuse of the controll stick.

Note:For both games,this is 2 Super FX-2 (not 1) chips,4 Super FX-2 chips are 50,000 more polygons then the N64's polygon count (150,000 polygons per second) .

[Poofta!]

i believe the FX chips could be engineered to meet custom MIPS needs.

this however couldve been only an FX-2 feature.
i know doom and starfox used 2 different values but thats probably because doom was FX2 and starfox FX.

if you compare the dumped rom code of mario world 2 and starfox 2, the MIPS needs vary greatly, which is what leads me to believe the chips varied.

[CaryMG]

Super FX2=50,000 Polygons per second & runing at 21 MHz
... can have a max of 4 chips ....
Jesus -- I had no idea about that ....

Could you guys just imagine the kind of software that would be made with that ?!?

*sigh* ....

Like I said -- the SNES was nowhere near used to it's full potential.

I think "FX2"x4 games would've been absolutely insane and have been done enmasse -- delaying the release of the "Nintendo64" release by, like, a year or so giving more time to "Nintendo64" development.
Gamers'd be more than happy with "FX2"x4 games since it'd be on par with the "PlayStations" initial wave of "Next Generation" graphics & sound-wise.

That way, the "Nintendo64" would have an absolute monster release line-up of "Super Mario64", "Shadows Of The Empire", "Turok" & "GoldenEye" -- thereby overly exceeding everyones expectations and blowing away "PlayStation".

Thoughts?


Later!
:) :) :)

[ProgrammingAce]

A 4 SFX chip game would be nearly impossible to program for. You'd need 5 threads all working together without a hickup. And it would all have to be written in assembly level code, as was the standard back then. The SFX2 was a monster to program for, 4 of them together would be nearly impossible.

[PC-Famicom64]

A 4 SFX chip game would be nearly impossible to program for. You'd need 5 threads all working together without a hickup. And it would all have to be written in assembly level code, as was the standard back then. The SFX2 was a monster to program for, 4 of them together would be nearly impossible.For a 3th party yes (see the Super NES's port of Doom) but thats becuse ther don't know what ther doing,Nintendo (as well as Nintendo's 2th partys at the time that were useing the chip) did know what ther were doing,but Nintendo not what to make big games on a dieing system,so Nintendo moved some of them to the N64,others got cansel.

[Ze_ro]

Like I said -- the SNES was nowhere near used to it's full potential.
... except that when you're tossing that much hardware into the cartridges, it's not really the potential of the SNES you're using anymore... I would say the fact that they had to design the SuperFX was basically admitting that they'd taken the stock SNES to it's limits and had no other choice.

Also, I wonder what kind of prices we'd have been looking at for a cartridge with FOUR SuperFX chips in there... That much tech doesn't come cheap...

--Zero

[Push Upstairs]

I'd have to agree with that statement.

I thought the SuperFX chip was the answer to the SNES's main flaw, its weak (slow) main processor.

[zerohero]

Me, and a few other fellow Dper's had a big discussion about this chip a while back ;)

[Melf]

Does anyone have any confirmed sources about the polygon rate and MIPS? That's specifically what I'm looking for.

[Poofta!]

Does anyone have any confirmed sources about the polygon rate and MIPS? That's specifically what I'm looking for.


the few people you find with knowledge about this, myself including, did not read it on a website. i learned the MIPS stuff through hacking through the ROMS, and it seems PC-Famicom64 is a foreign collector or programmer of sorts that would also know.

this stuff isnt readily documented was not made public knowledge, as far as i know.

[Jorpho]

Also, I wonder what kind of prices we'd have been looking at for a cartridge with FOUR SuperFX chips in there... That much tech doesn't come cheap...

Indeed. On the other hand, didn't Nintendo have way too many SuperFX2 chips left over at the end of the SNES's lifespan? (Not quite sure where I read that, but it would explain its largely superfluous presence in SMW2.)

[§ Gideon §]

Also, I wonder what kind of prices we'd have been looking at for a cartridge with FOUR SuperFX chips in there... That much tech doesn't come cheap...

Indeed. On the other hand, didn't Nintendo have way too many SuperFX2 chips left over at the end of the SNES's lifespan? (Not quite sure where I read that, but it would explain its largely superfluous presence in SMW2.)
I was under the impression that the use of SuperFX2 chips by SMW2 was due to pressure from Nintendo's president. He saw the success of Donkey Kong Country, due largely to its graphics, and wanted another blockbuster hit. The game's producer/supervisor disagreed with an executive infringing upon his creative process, but a compromise was reached in the abundance of 3d effects and whatnot.

[Ze_ro]

On the other hand, didn't Nintendo have way too many SuperFX2 chips left over at the end of the SNES's lifespan? (Not quite sure where I read that, but it would explain its largely superfluous presence in SMW2.)
Actually, I kinda liked the ways SMW2 used the SuperFX chip... it was very tasteful and subtle. A lot of the times, it seemed like companies put the technology first, and gameplay later, making games seem like more of a tech demo at times. I always felt this way about Pilotwings, like a bunch of guys at Nintendo just wanted to bugger around with Mode 7, and then wrapped a game around it later on.

--Zero