Little Nemo The Dream Master (NES) Alternate Versions?

[InsaneDavid]

Okay, we all know and enjoy this NES masterpiece loosely based on a combination of Winsor McCay's original "Little Nemo in Slumberland" works as well as the TMS animated feature "Little Nemo Adventures in Slumberland." The NES game is a port of "Nemo - Pajama Hero" that was on the Famicom but some changes were made.

Along with the title screen and English translations, any references to smoking were removed. While it's strange to see Flip the Clown withou a cigar (for me anyway, as a long time fan of Winsor McCay's works) that's not what this post is about. Beginning on the second level (Dream 2 - Flower Garden) you can use a gorilla to assist you in climbing to high places. In the Japanese version of the game the gorilla has a cigar, this was removed from the US release. HOWEVER...

I swear that years ago when I first played this game at a friends house the gorilla had the cigar. It was an official US copy, not a bootleg or anything, and it was just after the game was released. I played the crap out of that copy and completed it so I saw a lot of the cigar smoking gorilla. This sticks out in my mind vividly as it's before I knew of the Japanese version or even really of the Famicom for that matter.

Those people moved away a long time ago, long before I realized the changes. If you read around online you'll see that NOA wanted the smoking references removed from the US release and that's that. According to all the sources I could find the cigars were removed from the sprites and the original version never made it onto the NES. Now every copy of the game I've had since has the "REV-A" back label which makes me think I wasn't completely nuts and did play a US version of the game where the gorilla had the cigar. I don't recall if Flip had a cigar on that first copy I played but I know for certain the gorilla did and it was the US release.

So I'm asking anyone with a copy of this game, to give it a play up through the start of the second level. Check to see if Flip at the start has a cigar and if the gorilla that first appears at the start of the second level has a cigar as well. Those that have huge NES collections or have been documenting the revisions may be able to answer this question off the top of their heads.

Honestly I just want to know if there was an earlier release with the cigars left in and if so it has yet to be dumped for emulation. Thanks.

[Truffle]

Hmmm...Rev-A here. Sorry I couldnt help.

[InsaneDavid]

Hmmm...Rev-A here. Sorry I couldnt help.

Thank you for taking a look. :) If at all possible could you play up until the Gorilla first appears in Dream 2 - Flower Garden to see if the cigar is there? There's always a chance that all the labels were the same.

[jajaja]

When you say it, i can also remember something about the cigar. I'll check my PAL copy when i get home from work.

[ShinobiMan]

Hmm, this is very interesting. Got a REV-A here. I'm tired tonight and won't be playing any Nemo, will give it a shot tomorrow.

As a kid I don't remember seeing the cigar. This copy I have now is different from the one I had as a kid, so it might be different.

[jajaja]

Tested it now, the gorilla doesnt have a cigar. I know you mentioned the US version, but i confirmed that my PAL version didnt have it atleast :)

[Xexyz]

Hrm, I have two copies of this game. I'll check them out and give you my results in a day or two (I suck at this game :()

[evildead2099]

Although I no longer own the game (so I can't check it as you requested), I did own the North American edition, and I do remember that the gorilla DID have a cigar in my copy.

[ShinobiMan]

No cigar on mine. Sorry man. I am very interested in this though so lets see if someone can nab a screen shot.

[jajaja]

http://www.filibustercartoons.com/nemo.gif

[InsaneDavid]

Thank you to everyone so far. :) Glad someone other than me remembers this. LOL

[jajaja]

The pic i posted doesnt work now, maybe the server is down. It shows a pic where the gorilla had it cigar in its mouth and when he didnt. So its confirmed that a version really did have a cigar :)

[InsaneDavid]

The pic i posted doesnt work now, maybe the server is down. It shows a pic where the gorilla had it cigar in its mouth and when he didnt. So its confirmed that a version really did have a cigar :)

Yes, the Japanese version (Nemo - Pajama Hero) which is exactly the same except for the translation, title screen, and the cigar removed from Flip the clown and the Gorilla. Every copy of Nemo - Pajama Hero for the Famicom had it in there. However every retrogaming site I've come across mentions it as something Nintendo removed for US localization, and shows a Famicom screenshot compared to a NES screenshot. And according to them the story ends there.

As I hope to prove in this thread, there was a release of the game (probably the earlier copies) that had the Gorilla still with his cigar. Looks as if some people remember this as well. :) After all, there were two versions of Super Mario Bros. 3 released in North America, slight grammatical changes between them.

[Xexyz]

Sorry man, both my copies had REV-A printed on the back label. As I suspected, the gorilla in Stage 2 on both carts had no cigar.

[n8littlefield]

Mine is Rev-A as well. If I have a chance I'll play tonight and let you know. I'm 90% certain I don't have a cigar, but I'll double check.

[InsaneDavid]

Sorry man, both my copies had REV-A printed on the back label. As I suspected, the gorilla in Stage 2 on both carts had no cigar.

Thanks for taking a look just the same.

[MichaeltheGreat]

actually "rev-a" printed on the back of the cart has nothing to do with a software revision. "A" imprinted on the back means a software revision (like the numbers that are often embossed on the back).

Therefore, they all may have "rev-a", but are there copies with the "A" embossed or imprinted on the back in addition to the "rev-a"?

[stonecutter]

Mine has Rev-A as well. I wonder if that REv-A means anything, I pulled out a random sampling of about a dozen LICENSED games and the all had that Rev-A on the back..... maybe someone can verify what the Rev-A is for.

[InsaneDavid]

actually "rev-a" printed on the back of the cart has nothing to do with a software revision. "A" imprinted on the back means a software revision (like the numbers that are often embossed on the back).

Therefore, they all may have "rev-a", but are there copies with the "A" embossed or imprinted on the back in addition to the "rev-a"?

I've seen other cartridges that were the exception to the rule so the only way to really check is to play ALL cartridges up until that point to see. I have edited my original post however.

Of course if you want to skip ahead to Dream 2...

At the title screen, press:

Up, Select, Left, Right, A, A, B

A ''Dream Select'' message will pop up. However many levels you want to skip, press A that many times, then press Start.

[evildead2099]

Y'know what? I have an old, old issue of Nintendo Power that features Little Nemo for the NES. I'll pull that issue out of the archives and check what it shows for the gorilla. If there's no cigar, I'll scan the page. Whaddya say?

[InsaneDavid]

Y'know what? I have an old, old issue of Nintendo Power that features Little Nemo for the NES. I'll pull that issue out of the archives and check what it shows for the gorilla. If there's no cigar, I'll scan the page. Whaddya say?

Already found it, Volume 18 and YES the cigar is there, here are some pictures...

http://www.startoursinfo.com/junk/DP-NemoGorilla01.jpg
Look at that, even one of the Nintendo Power illustrations has it.

http://www.startoursinfo.com/junk/DP-NemoGorilla02.jpg
And a close up. Now of course they could have been using the Famicom version for the strategy guide and review, which was the case sometimes. However, the illustration plus English text at the begining of the review in the scene when one of King Morpheus' subjects first brings Nemo to Slumberland - as well as Princess Camille at the end stacks up more proof that the North American version was used for the review.

This means that there WAS an earlier version of the game, legally licensed and released in North America, that at the very least had the Gorilla with the cigar. (not sure if Flip had his cigar, I don't remember that) Now to find a cartridge that is the older version and figure out the discrepancies between it and the version with the cigar removed. Then to get one of them dumped of course. ;)

[evildead2099]

There was also a (pretty good) Little Nemo arcade game, which of course features Flip smoking a cigar. The coin-op keeps the cigar intact since it wasn't subject to Nintendo of America's censorship policies.

[InsaneDavid]

There was also a (pretty good) Little Nemo arcade game, which of course features Flip smoking a cigar. The coin-op keeps the cigar intact since it wasn't subject to Nintendo of America's censorship policies.

The arcade game, Nemo, was also more strictly based on the TMS animated film Little Nemo Adventures in Slumberland. Speaking of which, here's a three layer cel and background from Little Nemo Adventures in Slumberland that I gave my girlfriend a couple years ago for Christmas (http://www.classicplastic.net/anime/cels-Nemo01.jpg). I like the NES game a better as it mixes up some of Winsor McCay's original Little Nemo in Slumberland strips. House of Toys and the Cloud Ruins (yes I know, both are the some of the hardest parts of the game) are my favorite stages. :) The arcade game is still a good quarter muncher though.

[n8littlefield]

Sorry - I too had a tobacco free monkey.

[jajaja]

I tried some ROMs now, one even seemed to be the prototype, but it still didnt have the cigar. Are you sure you dont remember the cigar from the magazine only? I checked the official Nintendo magazine that got out here in Scandinavia and the illustration of the gorilla shows he have a cigar, so does the screenshots. I have the Scandinavian version of this game and the gorilla doesnt have the cigar.

[InsaneDavid]

I tried some ROMs now, one even seemed to be the prototype, but it still didnt have the cigar. Are you sure you dont remember the cigar from the magazine only?

I'm positive, I really didn't give the magazine a second thought when I was playing the game - in fact I just kind of glazed over that part and didn't even use it when I was playing back then. I just remembered thinking "oh, the gorilla has a cigar like old time circus acts" and then a few years ago realizing that it wasn't any copies of the game I'd come across recently.

In my NES emulation tests (for emulators on the Dreamcast) I went through dozens of different romdumps and none of them had it either. This of course spills into the retrogaming and pop culture sites that download the (U) rom, download the (J) rom, notice the difference of those two specific romdumps from whatever emulation site they got them from - and write it off as fact. I'm pretty sure it hasn't be dumped - just like a good dump of the US version of Super Sprint. :)

[whoisKeel]

Just tried, no luck (Mine is Rev-A). I think that's the furthest I've ever gotten in the game :)

Haven't really played too much Nemo.

[Bratwurst]

Hey David, don't give up on this. I want to say I remember the gorilla cigar as well from when I rented the game back in 1990 but I don't know how much of that is reliable. Unfortunately my current cartridge is a REV-A but I'll try it sometime this week all the same.

[InsaneDavid]

Hey David, don't give up on this. I want to say I remember the gorilla cigar as well from when I rented the game back in 1990 but I don't know how much of that is reliable. Unfortunately my current cartridge is a REV-A but I'll try it sometime this week all the same.

Thanks. :) I'm going to keep at it, I'm assuming that eventually they'll be quite a few copies of this game for sale in my Buying and Selling thread. LOL

[Dr. Morbis]

Doesn't Rev-A denote 3 screw carts? (as opposed to early 5 screw carts). In which case, every copy of Nemo will say Rev-A, so you'll have to just play your carts to find out about the cigar.

[InsaneDavid]

Doesn't Rev-A denote 3 screw carts? (as opposed to early 5 screw carts). In which case, every copy of Nemo will say Rev-A, so you'll have to just play your carts to find out about the cigar.

Yeah, my mind wasn't working at first, I changed my original post to revise that information.

[Truffle]

Poop - no cigar here either. :)

Im really hoping you find out there ARE 2 versions of little nemo.
If its true, i want to make it my mission to track down a copy-I mean I find this game all the time in the wild.

[Bratwurst]

Negatory with my copy.

[MichaeltheGreat]

I don't have a copy of little nemo but I asked a friend to check his copy. His did not have a cigar. I asked him if the back had an imprinted "A" on the back. An imprinted "A" means that there has been a software revision. He also said no. I asked him to open the cart and double check the roms just in case the cart might not have been marked but was a revised game (all the revised games I've seen have been marked on the outside). The roms were also first version. If there was no revision, there was no US version with a cigar. Hopefully a proto will be found with the cigar!

For those of you who want to know what I'm talking about, here's double dragon II as an example. My copy of Double Dragon II had a software revision. NES games that had software revisions were marked with an imprinted "A" on the back. The rev-A does not stand for revised game. Here is a picture of what I mean:

Double Dragon II revised with A imprint (http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/5512/ddiiback7uz.jpg)

When you open the cartridge and look at the roms, the roms are also marked for software revisions. We could explain things on the circuit board for a while, but it's enough to say that every nes game has a PRG rom and most have a CHR rom.

On this game the PRG rom is marked "NES-W2-1 PRG". Note that W2 is Double Dragon II's game code (on the front of my game "NES-W2-USA" is printed). The "1" stands for a software revision. If there was no revision, there would be a "0".

In fact, the CHR says "NES-W2-0 CHR". This means that the CHR has not been updated. When there is a software revision, it does not mean that all the chips have to be revised.

Double Dragon II circuit board picture (http://img238.imageshack.us/img238/6969/ddiiinside8qx.jpg)

If there is a second revision, there will be an imprinted "B" on the back of the cart and there will be a "2" on one of the chips. I've personally never seen a revision past "B".

[InsaneDavid]

NES games that had software revisions were marked with an imprinted "A" on the back. The rev-A does not stand for revised game.

Okay, again, I have changed my original post to reflect this. We all make posting errors, I made one in my original couple posts. This does happen, like last night I was trying to explain to someone how current is represented with l - when I meant inductance.

...it's been a long couple weeks. LOL

I'm not trying to turn this into the NES version of the Roswell investigation, but I saw what I saw and will continue to search it out.

[Speedy_NES]

I just tested my NTSC copy, also no cigar.

Good luck with the search!

[Oobgarm]

I just tested my NTSC copy, also no cigar.

Good luck with the search!

Same here. I hope something turns up thoguh. Nemo is one of my favorite NES titles!