this is ridiculous...

[hydr0x]

http://www.digitpress.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=84488

ok, seriously, what the f***???

you're killing this guys great effort to compile a top100 nes games (which is currently at 90 and damn close to completion) because there's a 3 year old top50 list based on a totally different system that was done by a user who's not active here anymore?

that's just ridiculous, and i know i'm not the only one with that opinion... fine, let him to his topic again on a different board, DP apparently doesn't have any interest in classic games discussion anymore....

and no, i'm not doing this because my snes list was also closed, it's a f**** punch in the face of this guy who put a lot of effort into compiling his list!!

and no, this should not be handled per pm, it's of public concern

[digitalpress]

I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with you, but what would you propose we do? How long is an acceptable time to wait before starting a duplicate poll?

[Simply Dave]

I agree. This is a cool site, but everytime you get into an interesting topic, it ends up closed and a topic from 2003 is drug up.

Crazy.

[hydr0x]

I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with you, but what would you propose we do? How long is an acceptable time to wait before starting a duplicate poll?

the point is, it's not even duplicate, it significantly differs from the old one (voting system, top100 instead of 50), PLUS the old one is completely dead and in all honesty not quite a nice effort overall

[Blackjax]

This is insane, that topic should NOT have been locked.

There's things in the past that can be added to, but there's things people like to talk about.

If you were gonna lock the thing and make people look at the old list, why the hell didn't you do it back when he started it?

I understand the fact that you don't want duplication, but the "search" function is sketchy at best.

This thread should NOT have been locked, and should be unlocked.

This pisses me off almost as much as when i compiled a complete - at the time - JP DC list on the EZboard and was completely ignored.

UNLOCK THE THREAD AND LET HIM FINISH

[digitalpress]

Chill out, folks. Give us some time to come up with a plan for handling this. Upon deliberation we can always unlock it again, but as a moderation team we need to come up with a rule for handling these going forward.

[hydr0x]

Chill out, folks. Give us some time to come up with a plan for handling this. Upon deliberation we can always unlock it again, but as a moderation team we need to come up with a rule for handling these going forward.

thx for actually taking this serious and thinking about it, hope you find a good way to handle it. and thanks for not closing this topic LOL

[Jibbajaba]

Sorry but I have to jump in and agree here. The topic in question (HardcoreGamer's) was open and pretty active for almost an entire month. The mods didn't catch it when it was started, and it grew to be 3 pages long. At that point, closing it seems like a serious disservice to the people participating in it.

I also have to agree that if the user who was originally maintaining a "Top 50" list for any system ceases to be an active member, it would seem that a new thread would be warranted. If the original thread that was linked to was either still being actively maintained, or the OP in that thread was interested in keeping up his or her list, then I would understand.

My solution to something like this might be to have top 50 lists for every system be board-run instead of user-run, so that if whoever was in charge of maintaining it left, someone else could simply take over.

Chris

[Blackjax]

Thanks Joe....

It just doesn't seem right that this topic has been on Page 1 since it was created, and suddenly is locked.

The basic problem is this - a 'classic' topic pops up, most people pass over it without ever reading it, so there's almost no point in adding any discussion to it.

Yet, when new topics are started, lockorama happens, referring people to a topic from five years ago... which most people ignore...

There's no reason not to keep old topics around, but there really should be a "death age" on an old topic and let people talk about it again.

[Garry Silljo]

I abide by whatever decision is made here, and I wasnt even participating in this thread, however I don't see this as a duplicate topic. It shares common traits of another topic, but is indeed different. In my opinion, the lock should be removed.

[Steven]

Hydrox, thanks for posting that. It took some balls to speak up for "injustice" which I agree that this case is.

I also give credit to the mods for talking this over among themselves and letting us know in advance an UNLOCK is feasible, once they sort the matters out within their moderating circles.

It's like the baseball umpire who makes a bad call, and refuses to change the call, even if the other ump's knew it was the other way around. Sometimes they will actually get together on the field and reverse the decision. It happens more often in NBA than MLB.

But nice to see it on DP too.

[Flack]

http://www.digitpress.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=84488

ok, seriously, what the f***???

you're killing this guys great effort to compile a top100 nes games (which is currently at 90 and damn close to completion) because there's a 3 year old top50 list based on a totally different system that was done by a user who's not active here anymore?

that's just ridiculous, and i know i'm not the only one with that opinion... fine, let him to his topic again on a different board, DP apparently doesn't have any interest in classic games discussion anymore....

and no, i'm not doing this because my snes list was also closed, it's a f**** punch in the face of this guy who put a lot of effort into compiling his list!!

and no, this should not be handled per pm, it's of public concern
So what did the mod who locked it say when you PM'ed him and asked him about it?

[hydr0x]

i never said there were pm's, nor was there a question to ask the mod

[Kid Ice]

I also give credit to the mods for talking this over among themselves and letting us know in advance an UNLOCK is feasible, once they sort the matters out within their moderating circles.


Sure.

After doing the classic discussions index, I became painfully familiar with all the threads in there. So much so, that everytime I saw a repeat in classic gaming (where I'm not a mod), I pulled my hair a little bit.

I saw the top NES thread when it was pretty well along (a couple of pages). I don't recall if I posted in that thread at all, but my thinking was it was pretty far along, let it go.

Then today I saw a top whatever SNES thread and a top NEOGEO thread, so I got in touch with Chandler and asked "What's going on with all these Top XX threads". So don't blame him, blame me.

In the past Joe has directed these threads to the existing topics in classic discussions, so I thought I was following along with tradition. I didn't intend for GAC to lock the NES thread which was pretty far along, but I didn't express that so that's my fault. I apologize.

[Matt-El]

At least you fessed up.


Truthfully, the site's been around for ages. Things will be talked about many times over. A week, or at most a month, you see many that fall into the same category, it may be necessary. But to lock successfull posts like that one is unnecessary. Worrying about other posts similar to it referring to other consoles is unnecessary. Locking In the last few months has sucked. No new blood to discuss with. Too many "Chain that" posts may get on some people's nerves, but seriously, If you aren't interested or annoyed by it. Go out and talk with your friends, do something or bring something up to communicate what you want to. Bitching about it or just "locking it up" Is stupid.

Regardless of what people think, just shut up and let people talk about stuff. If you don't like it, move on. If you hate someone for [insert retarded Nerd-like grievance here], PM the Fuck out of them.


People hate their job and paying taxes, get bored and have nothing to do, get problems with their significant other. It still doesn't change the fact that people will still bring up the same ideas and conversations that we all come familiar with.


In the end, just relax. If Counting posts is your life, get a new one. And quit irritating everybody.


Damn, I should be a moderator!

[drewbrim]

As long as the new thread is moving along I would vote to let it continue. Even if it is similar to an older thread, many of us weren't around to contribute to it. Also, people almost get as upset for bumping an old thread as they do for starting one that's just like the one that was done back in 03.

[Phosphor Dot Fossils]

In the end, just relax.
After reading your post, I could throw this line right back atcha. LOL Can we check the vitriol at the door? Joe's already said it's under discussion. Flaming certainly isn't going to help change minds.

Just a thought.

[Garry Silljo]

As long as the new thread is moving along I would vote to let it continue. Even if it is similar to an older thread, many of us weren't around to contribute to it. Also, people almost get as upset for bumping an old thread as they do for starting one that's just like the one that was done back in 03.

That's right. I always see an old thread get bumped by a new post and people immediately post "why are posting in this old thread?", or "Hey thanks for bumping a 2 year old topic!?"

The fact is there is no right move. It's the main reason I dont start a lot of topics.

[kentuckyfried]

Could the older threads, say pre 2004 without recent posts be added to an archive?
Lots of other websites do this, and while it wouldn't work for some forums, it might work for Classic.

[Kid Ice]

Regardless of what people think, just shut up and let people talk about stuff.
.....Damn, I should be a moderator!

By this logic, why even have moderators? Let everyone post whatever they want, let classic gaming get bogged down with twenty top XX lists that have already been done, let people bitch about everything under the sun in OT, let spammers spam (hey Flack have you been counting all the thank you notes for shutting down the spammers?), let everyone who buys SOTN for a dollar at the local flea start a new thread, let everyone who posts in B+S bump their threads every ten minutes, let everyone who doesn't know the difference between AES and MVS ask the question, let everyone ask for ROMS, let everyone ask for the Konami code, let everyone call each other dicks and motherfuckers, etc.

I thought we already had the discussion about locked threads in OT. Yeah, we did.

http://www.digitpress.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=84852

As I said before, Hyrox's grievance is valid and I apologize. There have been instances where I locked a thread and was persuaded to unlock it or move it through PM. I'm sure the same is true for GAC and other mods. But there are those who would project whatever authority issues they happen to have on the the DP mods, who will not even be satisfied by an open discussion of moderation issues. They view this forum not as an opportunity for discussion, but an opportunity to avenge the bosses/teachers/girlfriends/mothers/fathers/policemen they have been "victimized" by. In their own defense it is the moderators who are the "little people with a lot of power" in this context, who get off on locking threads and putting noobs in their place. Supposedly the mods are behind the scenes, rubbing their left and right palms together over the opporunity to criticize/silence/ban all those very important people who they obsess over every waking hour. In reality, the mods are carrying out a game plan mapped out by our leader, Joe, who for some reason is always above criticism. In reality, mods are just doing their jobs. It is the invention of the chronic losers in life and other mental midgets that any mod can give two shits what they say, what they post, or what they do. Who were the last ten people banned from DP? I can name two (zmweasel and Dr. Brinn)? Just imagine how important those other eight people are to me or anyone else.

[ghsqb]

I gotta agree with PDF here, we've all got a great opportunity here to have a discussion with the mod/admin team of this community concerning how to handle things like this going forward.

Let's get past the perceived injustices and hurt feelings and try to offer something constructive about what guidelines should be used when dealing with topics/subjects that have been dicussed previously.

@Mods/Admins: I do think that it's a great idea to have a dialogue on this issue.
Obviously with retro gaming riding a wave of popularity, our community here has seen some increases in numbers notwithstanding that with all hobbies you will have people who will naturally come and go as interests/priorities change.
A quick look at the original top 50 NES project thread shows that many of the posters (not just the op) in that thread aren't that active in the community any more, and that there are very few instances where the same people are participating in the old/new thread.

Part of the problem in reviving/adding to classic discussions is that in many cases, the original post cannot be amended/edited to reflect new/changing views of the community.

In this case, any new discussion would have commenced on page 4 of the original thread, and results/comparisons of new discussions mired within the text of the original thread.

That doesn't lend well to having people participate, nor towards allowing room for new members to weigh in on older discussions in a way which allows their input to be given the same weight when it comes to ranking/adding/removing titles from within the existing list.

At some point, particularly with classic gaming we'll have gotten to the point where anything we discuss will have been discussed before, it's inevitable, as there just aren't new products being released that often to stimulate new discussion...only changing perspectives of existing members, or new input from new memebers, not around during the original discussion.
I think we can find a way to allow for fresh input and ideas without stifling community interest by locking topics.

Heres an idea:

What if we could stay within the spirit of the original discussion/thread and still allow for new ideas/input via something like this.
Let's say a member wants to revive or re-examine a classic discussion or list.
What if we setup a guideline where such topics could be reopened every (insert time frame here).

We could make it fun and DP-centric by requiring some kind of purchase from a DP shop of a token/item costing meseta that could be used to revive a classic discussion.

Upon use of said token, the classic thread or a variant (split) of said topic could be opened within the appropriate board (in this case, Classic Gaming).

The original results of the old discussion could be used as a jumping off point, and new discussion could take place, with results of the new discussion either inserted just under the original discussion (the second post of the thread, for ease of comparison) or the results updated within the first topic/original list of the old discussion.

This would require hands on efforts of the mod team to manipulate/integrate the new discussion with the old, which is why I suggested the use of time buffers and meseta purchases to avoid these discussions being revived every 6 months or so.

Thats just one idea which could be fun, and could be used to integrate new ideas with classic input from the community.

Personally I prefer the new stuff being inserted as second post in the original thread rather than modifying the original, as many of the original contributors might not be around anymore, and we shouldn't invalidate their work by erasing a snapshot of the DP community from that timeframe.

Sorry about writing a novel here, hopefully it wasn't too cumbersome to get through.

[Julio III]

I think pretty much everyone in this thread has made valid points and it is a really hard issue to work around. Topics like top 100 which exist but the old thread doesn't work do somehow need a way to be kept current.

About locking threads, I feel it does seem bad to shut down good discussion if it has been going for a while. Maybe a simple rule like if a thread has already spread over a page then it should not be locked as it is proving a popular discussion. Obviously this would not count for threads where flaming has begun.

[HardcoreGamer]

Maybe stickying the top 100 platform-specific games lists?

[nate1749]

Every message board I've ever been on has this exact problem. I have yet to see a working solution for it.

In my personal opinion, let the topic repeat itself. My top 10 (don't know enough for 100) is not the same as it was in 2002, and won't be the same in 2010 (when I know more titles).

Nate

[Arcade Antics]

I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with you, but what would you propose we do? How long is an acceptable time to wait before starting a duplicate poll?

the point is, it's not even duplicate, it significantly differs from the old one (voting system, top100 instead of 50), PLUS the old one is completely dead and in all honesty not quite a nice effort overall
Two questions:

1) Why have you ignored the question above? If you want to come in here and make constructive suggestions, we're listening. If your plan instead is to say "the mods suck," you're part of the problem, not part of the solution.

2) What makes the old thread "not quite a nice effort"?

As for the title of this thread, I'm finding your attitude toward the whole thing ridiculous. And tiresome. Bashing everyone here who is trying their damndest to keep things running smoothly is not helping. Seems to me (and I could be wrong) that you won't be happy until you've goaded the mod staff into retirement in the hopes that somehow, you'll be given their position.

[ShinobiMan]

I do agree that locking this thread was a big mistake. A useless end to a great discussion.

I remember the discussion of the top 50 from long ago very well. Personally, I would rather read and participate in a discussion created a month ago than do the same in a discussion that started 3 years ago. Sure it's been done before, but really, there are new members with new opinions on the subject at hand. Don't they have a voice?

I don't think It's fare to force people into dropping their discussion and starting it again in a 3 year old post.

Sure everything needs rules and regulations, but sometimes we got to use common sense. And that common sense tells me that if I was in the position, I would not have locked such a popular and relevant topic. Based on the voices I read in this topic right now, I think it's safe to say that locking it might have not been the best idea.

Hydrox, I commend you for voicing your opinion. I agree with you 100%.

[vintagegamecrazy]

That old thread is pretty stagnant and doesn't have too much organization, the new one has more organization and will probably pan out like the top 100 of all time thread. I don't see why it's locked, the old is top 50 this one is 100, the old one includes whole series in the list this one is individual games only, it would be impossible to redo the old topic to fit the wants and opinions of the current members. The old topic can't be changed and certain games will inevitably be stuck where no one wants them to be. I think the top XX lists should have their own area on teh boards and maybe a new list for each system could be generated like once a year at the most, that way it would give people a chance to voice their opinions on their favorite games without dredging through an old top XX thread. Mods, and Joe too, I am not saying this in anger or to be a jerk, but I think you are stepping on a lot of heals if you keep this topic locked. Like I said before I would suggest maybe having a top list section on the boards that is moderated, that way they could be enjoyed to the full extent and not push every other well intended thread out of the way in the classic discussions board.

I hop I am making sense of what I just said. Feel free to have me clarify if I'm not.

[jajaja]

Its not unusal to make a Top XX list every year or so. I dont see a top 100 list either, only top 50 and it was started in 2002.

[tom]

I agree with it being locked, after all we just having the TOP 100 Countdown.

And anyway, for SNES and NES, it's always Mario or Zelda. The Nintendo fanboys have no imagination.
Snes:
on the list:
Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past
Super Mario World

[Phosphor Dot Fossils]

While we mods are discussing this over wine and cigars on the company yacht, I'd be remiss if I didn't point out this three-year-old thread for folks who feel the need to demand changes from the mods (http://www.digitpress.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=10291&highlight=martial+arts). ;)

[tom]

Nice pussy!!!

[Phosphor Dot Fossils]

Why...thank you.

[hydr0x]

I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with you, but what would you propose we do? How long is an acceptable time to wait before starting a duplicate poll?

the point is, it's not even duplicate, it significantly differs from the old one (voting system, top100 instead of 50), PLUS the old one is completely dead and in all honesty not quite a nice effort overall
Two questions:

1) Why have you ignored the question above? If you want to come in here and make constructive suggestions, we're listening.

first let me say i'm quite pissed by the fact that you are allowed to attack me personally once again on the public board without any authority in here interfering, that's the kind of mod behaviour noone wants to see. I know you can't stand me at all, no secret there, but keep it to yourself, ok?

i did not ignore the question at all. The question adressed duplicate topics and i pointed out that these two topics have nothing in common other than trying to find the X best games for a system. The whole systems differs and especially with nes and snes it makes a huge difference if 50 or 100 games.

Yeah, i could have made a suggestion on how to handle this stuff, but truth to be told, i'm NOT a mod here and i do not have to come up with a solution to be allowed to complain about something. Users can point out things going wrong without having the perfect solution at hand, you know?



If your plan instead is to say "the mods suck," you're part of the problem, not part of the solution.


thanks for another attack

why do you think i wanted to say "the mods suck". Even if that would be how i think, i did definately not say that. And after all i'm free to feel how i want, or did DP become a communist community? i guess not. No, seriously, please do confuse criticism on one point with a general bash.



2) What makes the old thread "not quite a nice effort"?


well, several aspects. Not to mention the fact that the user who did it is not active at all anymore it just wasn't the best way to start such a list.

1) Top50? for SNES? you gotta be kidding, there's way too much good games on that system to reduce it to 50.

2) Handling series as one game (not everyone might agree with this). While that's a good idea for sports games and similar i can't think of any other snes game series where games are just an update of it's prequel, except maybe Donkey Kong Country. So for a system like SNES i think every game should be counted for itself (similar could be said for the NES)

3) there were absolutely no rules, check the first post in those lists by theaveng, all he's saying is "post your favs and i'll compile a list", this leaves WAY too much room for his personal influence, if he doesn't like a game he doesn't have to include it, if he wants his favourite to be in there, it's in there. Also people have no idea when a game qualified for the list and why

4) the list allows games to be dropped without giving a reason, GREAT

5) hardcoregamer's list will get a ranking vote (if i understood it), so it's a ranked list, not just an alphabetical. huge difference, and might even make it worth doing write-ups (like the top 100 overall currently running)



As for the title of this thread, I'm finding your attitude toward the whole thing ridiculous.


no, actually you find it ridiculous that people openly critizise mod behaviour. Well, as long as there's a valid reason for this you should not find that ridiculous but ask yourself why it's happening. And if you think THIS is criticism you should witness some discussion about DP (i'm not participating in those usually, mind you) on various internet boards and even in our own vbender.



And tiresome. Bashing everyone here who is trying their damndest to keep things running smoothly is not helping.


where did i attack mod work in general? i could have, but i didn't, please check your facts



Seems to me (and I could be wrong) that you won't be happy until you've goaded the mod staff into retirement in the hopes that somehow, you'll be given their position.

that's just utter nonsense, and you know it. (and btw, the whole topic just the community is on my side here, you might think about that before making it sound like i'm the lonely fighter attacking something here)

seems to me that you won't be happy until the day the community shuts up and just accepts whatever you want to do

[daynum]

I also think it's a shame the NES thread was locked, especially under the circumstances. When that thread was first created I actually expected it to get locked very soon so refrained from posting. When it had been up for a few days I thought it must have been mod approved so got involved. For it to be locked when it was nearly complete at 90/100 games... well I don't really see the point.

On the subject of the classic discussions thread that we're being told we should post in, I'd been there before but didn't add my nominations because I saw that other posters that had done so had been ignored. In fact the last time the original poster updated the list was in August 2002 so he obviously doesn't care about it anymore.

[Atma Shiro]

Why not allow a seperate group to take a look at a different angle? We all have different opinions and they vary. Sometimes quick locking and linking to previous threads is neccessay (ex. how to play imports on xxxx for example). All im saying is create a seperate set of random members (5 to 10) to review locked posts over one page and determine if they are justified. Btw, I don't read top xxx posts but, I does bring up a need for a system of checks and balances for the board.
:rocker:

[tom]

exactly, difference.

My fave SNES game is Mr.Do!, an excellent version of the coin-up classic, a title which SNES users would probably never put in their Top 100 list

[Kid Ice]

And if you think THIS is criticism you should witness some discussion about DP (i'm not participating in those usually, mind you) on various internet boards and even in our own vbender.

Conversation on "various internet boards" doesn't make things better HERE, does it? Funny how these conversations take place in vbender and don't involve the people who are equipped to make positive changes, isn't it?

I acknowledged that locking the thread was a mistake....not a "big mistake", let's put things in perspective here. None of us are curing cancer.

[digitalpress]

The thread that has caused such an uproar is open again.

Before blasting this site or its moderators, a simple PM asking us to reconsider would be a polite way to get your point across. No one likes a crybaby, and trust me when you post a complaint without any possible solution, you're a crybaby in my eyes.

Our mods work very hard to maintain order and organization here. If you're on the outside crying about locked topics you just don't understand what it takes to manage a million threads. Respect this free site by messaging those who run it instead of chastising them, and you'll find that you often get the same results without damaging reputations.

Thank you for your consideration.

[CosmicMonkey]

It would seem though that the other two 'Top' lists are still locked. The fact I started the Neo list has nothing to do with this.

I looked at the link that was provided in the Neo thread. It seems that no-one has posted in ages and 25 games were never actually setteled upon. Also, my thread was to allow voting etc, much like the NES thread. Again, I don't understand why the SNES list is still locked either?

I understand there's a Top 100 games, but that list is covering every game for every platform. It would be useful to have Top lists for every console too, with the links to the individual threads contained in one stickyed 'Top 100 Games - General & Platform Specific' thread.

That way, we could have it as a yearly event even? Gives us something to talk about and look forward too.

I'm more than happy to maintain the Top 25 Neo list. And I'm sure the guys who started the other threads will be happy to see theirs through to completion.

[ShinobiMan]

The thread that has caused such an uproar is open again.

Before blasting this site or its moderators, a simple PM asking us to reconsider would be a polite way to get your point across. No one likes a crybaby, and trust me when you post a complaint without any possible solution, you're a crybaby in my eyes.

Our mods work very hard to maintain order and organization here. If you're on the outside crying about locked topics you just don't understand what it takes to manage a million threads. Respect this free site by messaging those who run it instead of chastising them, and you'll find that you often get the same results without damaging reputations.

Thank you for your consideration.

But Joe, had he PMed a mod, would that one mod make things better? Hydrox has chosen to voice his opinion, one that many DP members happen to agree with.

Hydrox has provided us a way to share some of our thoughts openly. If you consider your forum a democracy, what is wrong with freedom of speech? I don't recall him BLASTING the moderators, but rather, bringing to attention a very important matter.

I find it interesting that the only ones on the defensive side of this thread happen to be the mods. As if humanity is incapable of making mistakes.

[Kid Ice]

But Joe, had he PMed a mod, would that one mod make things better? Hydrox has chosen to voice his opinion, one that many DP members happen to agree with.

I'm confused. I thought Hydrox's issue was that this specific thread was locked.


Hydrox has provided us a way to share some of our thoughts openly. If you consider your forum a democracy, what is wrong with freedom of speech? I don't recall him BLASTING the moderators, but rather, bringing to attention a very important matter.

Didn't we alread do this in OT? In a thread *you* posted in?

Oh, and posting a thread called "this is ridiculous" is blasting.


I find it interesting that the only ones on the defensive side of this thread happen to be the mods. As if humanity is incapable of making mistakes.

Confused, me, again.

[ShinobiMan]

But Joe, had he PMed a mod, would that one mod make things better? Hydrox has chosen to voice his opinion, one that many DP members happen to agree with.


I'm confused. I thought Hydrox's issue was that this specific thread was locked.

Yeah it was, and for him to merely tell one mod that he ALONE is upset with it being locked, I find it hard to believe that anything would be done about it. I know this based on experience, not theory.


Hydrox has provided us a way to share some of our thoughts openly. If you consider your forum a democracy, what is wrong with freedom of speech? I don't recall him BLASTING the moderators, but rather, bringing to attention a very important matter.


Didn't we alread do this in OT? In a thread *you* posted in?

Oh, and posting a thread called "this is ridiculous" is blasting.

Oh yes, we did this already in another thread, maybe you should lock this one now and redirect us.


I find it interesting that the only ones on the defensive side of this thread happen to be the mods. As if humanity is incapable of making mistakes.


Confused, me, again.

I'm sorry you're so confused. What exactly are you confused about?
[/quote]

[Kid Ice]

Yeah it was, and for him to merely tell one mod that he ALONE is upset with it being locked, I find it hard to believe that anything would be done about it. I know this based on experience, not theory.

My experience is that typically when I lock something if there's a good reason to unlock it I do it, or at least run it by the other mods. I'd say out of roughly ten requests I've had to unlock threads, 8 of them ended up unlocked. Being Chandler, who happens to be one of the nicest, friendliest people I know, is the one who locked it, I'm pretty sure he would have reconsidered if someone PMd him (especially given that locking it in the first place wasn't his idea).

Also, given the scenario that about a million people can't sleep at night because these threads were locked, you would think he'd get more than one PM.

Here's (http://www.digitpress.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=84852&start=0) the link to the OT discussion about locked threads.

I was confused by your last comment about the mods being on the defense...I didn't know if your statement was supporting the mods or putting them down.

[s1lence]

Maybe I'm confused now, because my understanding now is that the problem has been resolved.

[ShinobiMan]

I was confused by your last comment about the mods being on the defense...I didn't know if your statement was supporting the mods or putting them down.

Well, neither really. I was just pointing out that most of the mods are defending themselves rather than agreeing that they might have done something wrong.

Regardless of the way you think things should be handled, I (and many others) are happy that these issues are brought to the forefront. The thing is, we care to much about this forum and this community to stand by idle and let these things happen.

This is obviously a big issue with many different opinions involved. I am just one voice. I hope I have not offended anyone with my support for Hydrox and other like-minded individuals.

[smork]

C'mon, folks -- the thread is reopened, nobody's out to get anybody, nobody's done anything wrong. A thread was closed, people thought it should be reopened, it was, what's to complain about???

It's a free board, and the mods are volunteers doing this in their free time -- and the problem was fixed. Let's not pile on about it, OK?

[Kid Ice]

I was confused by your last comment about the mods being on the defense...I didn't know if your statement was supporting the mods or putting them down.

Well, neither really. I was just pointing out that most of the mods are defending themselves rather than agreeing that they might have done something wrong.

The only ones that had anything to do with locking the threads were me and Chandler.

[Arcade Antics]

I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with you, but what would you propose we do? How long is an acceptable time to wait before starting a duplicate poll?

the point is, it's not even duplicate, it significantly differs from the old one (voting system, top100 instead of 50), PLUS the old one is completely dead and in all honesty not quite a nice effort overall
Two questions:

1) Why have you ignored the question above? If you want to come in here and make constructive suggestions, we're listening.

first let me say i'm quite pissed by the fact that you are allowed to attack me personally once again on the public board without any authority in here interfering, that's the kind of mod behaviour noone wants to see. I know you can't stand me at all, no secret there, but keep it to yourself, ok?
WHAT IN THE HELL ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT? How is me asking you a question an "attack" ? I don't even know you, I don't recall ever having a problem with you until this very minute.


i did not ignore the question at all.
You most certainly did.


The question adressed duplicate topics and i pointed out that these two topics have nothing in common other than trying to find the X best games for a system. The whole systems differs and especially with nes and snes it makes a huge difference if 50 or 100 games.
Wrong, the question asked was HOW WOULD YOU PROPOSE TO MAKE THINGS BETTER?


Yeah, i could have made a suggestion on how to handle this stuff, but truth to be told, i'm NOT a mod here and i do not have to come up with a solution to be allowed to complain about something. Users can point out things going wrong without having the perfect solution at hand, you know?
No, I don't. If you want to say something sucks, then you ought to be able to back it up with why you think it sucks and how you would improve it.



If your plan instead is to say "the mods suck," you're part of the problem, not part of the solution.

[quote]thanks for another attack
Please explain to me how that is an attack?

Frankly, at this point, I don't have the energy to make any sense of the rest of your ramblings. You're way off base on everything.

[ShinobiMan]

I was confused by your last comment about the mods being on the defense...I didn't know if your statement was supporting the mods or putting them down.

Well, neither really. I was just pointing out that most of the mods are defending themselves rather than agreeing that they might have done something wrong.

The only ones that had anything to do with locking the threads were me and Chandler.

My mistake Kid Ice. I was under the impression that more mods were involved.

[digitalpress]

I was confused by your last comment about the mods being on the defense...I didn't know if your statement was supporting the mods or putting them down.

Well, neither really. I was just pointing out that most of the mods are defending themselves rather than agreeing that they might have done something wrong.

The only ones that had anything to do with locking the threads were me and Chandler.

My mistake Kid Ice. I was under the impression that more mods were involved.

Dude, we DO make mistakes. I would think that unlocking a topic that we previously locked speaks volumes to that, and that clearly we admit it.

And a single PM to a single mod DOES make a difference. The moderating team discusses this kind of thing ALL THE TIME. Just because you can't see it doesn't mean it's not there.

We CARE about the community. Believe me, it would be a lot easier NOT locking topics, NOT moderating, NOT organizing. That kind of chaos might be fun for some visitors but not me, and as long as I pay the bills here, moderating is what moderators will do.

Now, let it go.

[Blackjax]

I know I made this comment earlier in the thread, but can I suggest a "Topic Experation Date" to avoid this kind of thing in the future?

I mean, I've been coming around here a long, long time (well, internet-wise) and yes, topics do repeat. 280 "THE PS3 WILL COST 10 BILLION DOLLARS!!!!" threads would destroy this place. However, say I started a "Lee Furie isn't Ariel Andrews!!" thread, yeah, it might be a little out of date - but it also hasn't been talked about in half a decade.

Can we at least say anything that hasn't been added to in say, 2 years is open for new discussion?

In general, I think all of you mods do a good job, and mistakes are made, hell, we're all human. But you may want to consider this.

[Blackjax]

By the way, I do want to apologize.

I don't think I've ever lashed out at the mods on the board like that before

[Moo Cow]

Maybe old threads can lock themselves after a year since someone has posted. That way, you can't point and say, "It was done two years ago, continue the discussion here."
Or maybe a different period of time then a year, I was just throwing it out there.

[Matt-El]

By the way, I do want to apologize.

I don't think I've ever lashed out at the mods on the board like that before
_________________



I don't think that a lot of people are, It's just coming out that way.

[ghsqb]

To be honest, I'm not sure the issue is locking old topics.

The whole point of the Classic Discussions board is to preserve "timeless" type discussions so they can be added to and evolve.

I think the difficulty is finding a way to marry those old discussions with new opinions in a way that allows new input to be weighed, and allows it to affect the original discussion in the same way the input was when the topic was created.

Took a stab at a system on page 1 in my novella.

I don't know what the answer is, that's for people higher up the foodchain than I.

[HotGear4GreatDeals]

Ya I'm gonna have to go with hydr0x its a spit in this guys face :L

[HotGear4GreatDeals]

Ya I'm gonna have to go with hydr0x its a spit in this guys face :L 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-)

[hydr0x]

How is me asking you a question an "attack" ?

how is "you're part of the problem" not an attack?




i did not ignore the question at all.
You most certainly did.
Wrong, the question asked was HOW WOULD YOU PROPOSE TO MAKE THINGS BETTER?


no, it wasn't. the question was "what would you propose we do? How long is an acceptable time to wait before starting a duplicate poll?". The 2nd question describes what case Joe asked me to propose a solution for. Now, i did point out that that's not even what this case is about, which means i never complained about locking duplicate polls. If i didn't complain about that, why am i supposed to come up with a solution for that?



Frankly, at this point, I don't have the energy to make any sense of the rest of your ramblings. You're way off base on everything.

yeah, thanks for ignoring the fact that i described in detail why the old thread had nothing to do with this list.

[hydr0x]

And a single PM to a single mod DOES make a difference. The moderating team discusses this kind of thing ALL THE TIME. Just because you can't see it doesn't mean it's not there.

Joe, i know it does indeed make a difference and it would probably have lead to unlocking his topic but i explained several times already why i think a pm wasn't the right solution in this case.

And with all respect, if you do not want anyone ever to critisize a mod decision on the public board, make a rule like that. It wouldn't really help as the public is not limited to the DP board itself, but if that's how you feel on this topic, make it a rule. Cause the only problem you all seem to have with this topic is that it's public. I did neither attack a single mod personally (i didn't even mention a name) nor did i attack general mod behaviour. All i did was (publically) complain about a single mod decision you later on admitted was a fault. I just don't see how that's against any unwritten rules on the internet or whatever.

[digitalpress]

You didn't break any rules. It's called "common courtesy".

If you don't get it by now, you never will. I'm certainly done trying to explain it to you.



And a single PM to a single mod DOES make a difference. The moderating team discusses this kind of thing ALL THE TIME. Just because you can't see it doesn't mean it's not there.

Joe, i know it does indeed make a difference and it would probably have lead to unlocking his topic but i explained several times already why i think a pm wasn't the right solution in this case.

And with all respect, if you do not want anyone ever to critisize a mod decision on the public board, make a rule like that. It wouldn't really help as the public is not limited to the DP board itself, but if that's how you feel on this topic, make it a rule. Cause the only problem you all seem to have with this topic is that it's public. I did neither attack a single mod personally (i didn't even mention a name) nor did i attack general mod behaviour. All i did was (publically) complain about a single mod decision you later on admitted was a fault. I just don't see how that's against any unwritten rules on the internet or whatever.

[ShinobiMan]

You didn't break any rules. It's called "common courtesy".

If you don't get it by now, you never will. I'm certainly done trying to explain it to you.

I don't believe Hydrox has done anything wrong. It pains me to see such strong one-sided minds in this debate. Frankly, when a member of any group or society speaks his mind about a problem he's having, it IS made public. He would be doing his fellow board members an injustice if he had not said something.

Joe, if you don't get it by now, you never will. We are only trying to help. If voicing our minds in order to make the forum better is a part of the problem, than things really have changed here.

[ghsqb]

Guys, why not drop it huh?

We're way past anything productive coming from this, you've all said your piece, you've been heard.

You guys have to understand that behind these usernames and mod decisions, there are real people.
Real people who donate their time to try and make this a better community for all of us.
When they make decisions, they don't do it out of malice or spite, and sometimes, they make mistakes.

When that happens (which isn't often) making it right is about the best you can hope for isn't it?
And thats been done here.

It would be no different than walking into a place you volonteer at in RL and posting a notice on the door about a mistake you've made.
They don't deserve the public browbeating, and whether or not that's what you've intended, that's what it's become.

So please, let it go. If you MUST have the last word, do it via PM where it belongs.

[digitalpress]

You didn't
break any rules. It's called "common courtesy".

If you don't get it by now, you never will. I'm certainly done trying to explain it to you.

I don't believe Hydrox has done anything wrong. It pains me to see such strong one-sided minds in this debate. Frankly, when a member of any group or society speaks his mind about a problem he's having, it IS made public. He would be doing his fellow board members an injustice if he had not said something.

Joe, if you don't get it by now, you never will. We are only trying to help. If voicing our minds in order to make the forum better is a part of the problem, than things really have changed here.

I'm sorry you feel that way. Nothing has changed here but the attitude of some of our site's guests. There's a big difference between voicing your mind and "calling out" the staff. Any polite visitor would have simply requested the locking mod to reconsider his decision rather than rally up a crowd in public.

Apply this to your real life. When you're confronted with a problem at the supermarket, at school, at church... do you deal with the problem face-to-face or do you rally up a crowd of people to fight your cause for you? Why does the approach have to change in an online community?

I'll tell you why. It's because some people rely on others to come up with the solutions. They make a lot of noise with the hopes that someone else can articulate this for them. It doesn't have to be that way here, it never HAS been that way. PM a staff member, we deal with user complaints very well and as a team.

This issue has already been resolved. I will ask one more time. Let it go.