PS3: Purchasing a license, not the game.

[DeputyMoniker]

Well, it makes sense to me. I sure would hate it but if it's true, I can understand why.
Someone in the article mentions that this wouldnt work unless Sony used that PS3 registration method we discussed before. I say to that: It would sure as hell make a dent in it though. No more legal trade through EB Games, Gamestop, Game X Change, Game Crazy...



According to a UK news source, citing retail contacts, Sony is preparing to make it illegal for consumers to sell used PS3 games. The plan would involve Sony adopting a licensing system whereby gamers would agree that they are purchasing a license to play a game, rather than the game itself.

If true, such a move would be a massive boost for publishers and developers which do not profit from the lucrative and damaging retail trade in used games. In fact, many publishers are furious that they have to spend support money on consumers who have not actually contributed a dime to the company's coffers.

In turn, it would be a catastrophe for retailers, which make a significant proportion of margin from used games. Consumers would likely be less than overjoyed.

Sony, which is refusing to comment on the story, does have a patent on technology which would tie a piece of software to an individual piece of hardware. But technology and desire are not the only parts of the puzzle. Whether the company would be prepared to take on retail, consumer goodwill and, most likely, the U.S courts, is another matter.

One expert in retail law told Next-Gen.Biz, "Sony can theoretically sell a license to play the game, but the user would have to acknowledge acceptance of the license. You've seen this when you install software on a PC. I'm not sure that the license agreement is enforceable if the licensee doesn't agree to it.

"Also, even if the agreement is enforceable, it's hard to preclude subsequent sale of the disc. The consumer could theoretically agree that he doesn't own the right to transfer his license, but why couldn't he sell the medium that held the license (the disc)? Sony can't enforce the agreement against a third party, as it lacks privity with the third party.

"Stated differently, I don't believe Sony can keep someone from selling a disc, even if they create a license agreement. The only way that this can truly be effected is to require registration of the disc with a specific PS3 console. Sony has a patent on such a technology, and could render a disc unplayable once registered. That would accomplish their goal (if they really have such a goal). In summary, I don't believe this is real."

A senior games publishing source told us, "Sony and the rest of us would love to put an end to this damaging trade, but actually making it happen looks like a fight that's beyond even Sony. I can't see it happening, but i hope I'm wrong."

Another senior manager at a third party publisher said, "I know that Sony is very upset about the used games market. But this story seems a bit far-fetched."

[DeputyMoniker]

Well, it makes sense to me. I sure would hate it but if it's true, I can understand why.
Someone in the article mentions that this wouldnt work unless Sony used that PS3 registration method we discussed before. I say to that: It would sure as hell make a dent in it though. No more legal trade through EB Games, Gamestop, Game X Change, Game Crazy...



According to a UK news source, citing retail contacts, Sony is preparing to make it illegal for consumers to sell used PS3 games. The plan would involve Sony adopting a licensing system whereby gamers would agree that they are purchasing a license to play a game, rather than the game itself.

If true, such a move would be a massive boost for publishers and developers which do not profit from the lucrative and damaging retail trade in used games. In fact, many publishers are furious that they have to spend support money on consumers who have not actually contributed a dime to the company's coffers.

In turn, it would be a catastrophe for retailers, which make a significant proportion of margin from used games. Consumers would likely be less than overjoyed.

Sony, which is refusing to comment on the story, does have a patent on technology which would tie a piece of software to an individual piece of hardware. But technology and desire are not the only parts of the puzzle. Whether the company would be prepared to take on retail, consumer goodwill and, most likely, the U.S courts, is another matter.

One expert in retail law told Next-Gen.Biz, "Sony can theoretically sell a license to play the game, but the user would have to acknowledge acceptance of the license. You've seen this when you install software on a PC. I'm not sure that the license agreement is enforceable if the licensee doesn't agree to it.

"Also, even if the agreement is enforceable, it's hard to preclude subsequent sale of the disc. The consumer could theoretically agree that he doesn't own the right to transfer his license, but why couldn't he sell the medium that held the license (the disc)? Sony can't enforce the agreement against a third party, as it lacks privity with the third party.

"Stated differently, I don't believe Sony can keep someone from selling a disc, even if they create a license agreement. The only way that this can truly be effected is to require registration of the disc with a specific PS3 console. Sony has a patent on such a technology, and could render a disc unplayable once registered. That would accomplish their goal (if they really have such a goal). In summary, I don't believe this is real."

A senior games publishing source told us, "Sony and the rest of us would love to put an end to this damaging trade, but actually making it happen looks like a fight that's beyond even Sony. I can't see it happening, but i hope I'm wrong."

Another senior manager at a third party publisher said, "I know that Sony is very upset about the used games market. But this story seems a bit far-fetched."

[Muscelli]

that will seriously screw sony over big time right there if they decide to put that in there

[Muscelli]

that will seriously screw sony over big time right there if they decide to put that in there

[Mr.FoodMonster]

That would be the final nail in the coffin for Sony.

[Mr.FoodMonster]

That would be the final nail in the coffin for Sony.

[DeputyMoniker]

I'm trying to think of some ways this would possibly benefit a gamer.

Combined with in-game advertising, this could substantialy lower the price of games. Imagine if PS3 games ended up costing $20 new.
If the PS3 sells, 3rd party support could skyrocket.

[DeputyMoniker]

I'm trying to think of some ways this would possibly benefit a gamer.

Combined with in-game advertising, this could substantialy lower the price of games. Imagine if PS3 games ended up costing $20 new.
If the PS3 sells, 3rd party support could skyrocket.

[Bronty-2]

Don't be naive. People have shown a willingness to pay what they're paying now. Sony's not going to drop the price out of altruism... this would be a profit grab pure and simple.

I can't imagine they'll try it, but if they do they can say hello to being #3 in market share.

[Bronty-2]

Don't be naive. People have shown a willingness to pay what they're paying now. Sony's not going to drop the price out of altruism... this would be a profit grab pure and simple.

I can't imagine they'll try it, but if they do they can say hello to being #3 in market share.

[Muscelli]

the collectors market in the wayy future will be insane for some rare ps3 games, as there will be no ebay for the used PS3 games, the rare ones are going to be insane amounts of money, seeing as there will be nowhere to get them once they sell

[Muscelli]

the collectors market in the wayy future will be insane for some rare ps3 games, as there will be no ebay for the used PS3 games, the rare ones are going to be insane amounts of money, seeing as there will be nowhere to get them once they sell

[playgeneration]

So no ps3 games could be resold on ebay, or sony would just sue them. Will this result in people resorting to sinister dealings in back streets to get cheaper games?. I really dont think the shops that rely on `pre-owned` for their income will stand for this, prepare for xbox and wii to get a whole lot more shelf space. Sony are really making lots of seriously stupid decisions, and previous top dogs of the industry (atari, sega etc) have shown you only need to make one bad move to drop out of the race.

[playgeneration]

So no ps3 games could be resold on ebay, or sony would just sue them. Will this result in people resorting to sinister dealings in back streets to get cheaper games?. I really dont think the shops that rely on `pre-owned` for their income will stand for this, prepare for xbox and wii to get a whole lot more shelf space. Sony are really making lots of seriously stupid decisions, and previous top dogs of the industry (atari, sega etc) have shown you only need to make one bad move to drop out of the race.

[DeputyMoniker]

Don't be naive. People have shown a willingness to pay what they're paying now. Sony's not going to drop the price out of altruism... this would be a profit grab pure and simple.

I can't imagine they'll try it, but if they do they can say hello to being #3 in market share.

Well they better do something because this isn't going to sell consoles. Don't they know that? WTF is wrong with Sony these days? "Okay, this time were gonna do it bigger, better and at a much higher risk. Were puttin' it all on the line this time, boys. It's everything or nothing this time around."
Meh...it's just a rumor so far but I can't help but wonder how many ways this would effect me. Good and bad.

[DeputyMoniker]

Don't be naive. People have shown a willingness to pay what they're paying now. Sony's not going to drop the price out of altruism... this would be a profit grab pure and simple.

I can't imagine they'll try it, but if they do they can say hello to being #3 in market share.

Well they better do something because this isn't going to sell consoles. Don't they know that? WTF is wrong with Sony these days? "Okay, this time were gonna do it bigger, better and at a much higher risk. Were puttin' it all on the line this time, boys. It's everything or nothing this time around."
Meh...it's just a rumor so far but I can't help but wonder how many ways this would effect me. Good and bad.

[poe]

How old is that quote? In November (http://www.joystiq.com/2005/11/08/playstation-3-wont-play-used-games/), when Sony's patent was announced, the exact same rhetoric flew around. I think if these "retail contacts" were credible, we would have heard of something along the lines of litigation against Sony by now.

Furthermore, if this were true, it would render the software useless if extensive repairs were made to the console (probably a hard drive replacement would run afoul of this), a replacement console were purchased, or backward compatibility were desired with a hypothetical Playstation 4. Would Sony or any company want that much additional technical support to be required for those scenarios?

If anything, it's probably a preemptive strike against patent trolls (i.e. Immersion; I don't know anything they manufactured prior to their lawsuits, and only a couple phones since then). Sony or someone else will probably want an aggressive copy protection method available down the road, and now Sony doesn't run the risk of having to license it from someone else.

[poe]

How old is that quote? In November (http://www.joystiq.com/2005/11/08/playstation-3-wont-play-used-games/), when Sony's patent was announced, the exact same rhetoric flew around. I think if these "retail contacts" were credible, we would have heard of something along the lines of litigation against Sony by now.

Furthermore, if this were true, it would render the software useless if extensive repairs were made to the console (probably a hard drive replacement would run afoul of this), a replacement console were purchased, or backward compatibility were desired with a hypothetical Playstation 4. Would Sony or any company want that much additional technical support to be required for those scenarios?

If anything, it's probably a preemptive strike against patent trolls (i.e. Immersion; I don't know anything they manufactured prior to their lawsuits, and only a couple phones since then). Sony or someone else will probably want an aggressive copy protection method available down the road, and now Sony doesn't run the risk of having to license it from someone else.

[njiska]

How old is that quote? In November (http://www.joystiq.com/2005/11/08/playstation-3-wont-play-used-games/), when Sony's patent was announced, the exact same rhetoric flew around. I think if these "retail contacts" were credible, we would have heard of something along the lines of litigation against Sony by now.

Furthermore, if this were true, it would render the software useless if extensive repairs were made to the console (probably a hard drive replacement would run afoul of this), a replacement console were purchased, or backward compatibility were desired with a hypothetical Playstation 4. Would Sony or any company want that much additional technical support to be required for those scenarios?

If anything, it's probably a preemptive strike against patent trolls (i.e. Immersion; I don't know anything they manufactured prior to their lawsuits, and only a couple phones since then). Sony or someone else will probably want an aggressive copy protection method available down the road, and now Sony doesn't run the risk of having to license it from someone else.

Pretty much my thoughts. I remembered hearing this in november and thought it was stupid. Even so though i wouldn't but it past Sony. Between the companies fiscal shape and the Industries desire to make a profit off of Second hand sales, anything is possible.

[njiska]

How old is that quote? In November (http://www.joystiq.com/2005/11/08/playstation-3-wont-play-used-games/), when Sony's patent was announced, the exact same rhetoric flew around. I think if these "retail contacts" were credible, we would have heard of something along the lines of litigation against Sony by now.

Furthermore, if this were true, it would render the software useless if extensive repairs were made to the console (probably a hard drive replacement would run afoul of this), a replacement console were purchased, or backward compatibility were desired with a hypothetical Playstation 4. Would Sony or any company want that much additional technical support to be required for those scenarios?

If anything, it's probably a preemptive strike against patent trolls (i.e. Immersion; I don't know anything they manufactured prior to their lawsuits, and only a couple phones since then). Sony or someone else will probably want an aggressive copy protection method available down the road, and now Sony doesn't run the risk of having to license it from someone else.

Pretty much my thoughts. I remembered hearing this in november and thought it was stupid. Even so though i wouldn't but it past Sony. Between the companies fiscal shape and the Industries desire to make a profit off of Second hand sales, anything is possible.

[GrandAmChandler]

How old is that quote? In November (http://www.joystiq.com/2005/11/08/playstation-3-wont-play-used-games/), when Sony's patent was announced, the exact same rhetoric flew around. I think if these "retail contacts" were credible, we would have heard of something along the lines of litigation against Sony by now.

Furthermore, if this were true, it would render the software useless if extensive repairs were made to the console (probably a hard drive replacement would run afoul of this), a replacement console were purchased, or backward compatibility were desired with a hypothetical Playstation 4. Would Sony or any company want that much additional technical support to be required for those scenarios?

If anything, it's probably a preemptive strike against patent trolls (i.e. Immersion; I don't know anything they manufactured prior to their lawsuits, and only a couple phones since then). Sony or someone else will probably want an aggressive copy protection method available down the road, and now Sony doesn't run the risk of having to license it from someone else.

Pretty much my thoughts. I remembered hearing this in november and thought it was stupid. Even so though i wouldn't but it past Sony. Between the companies fiscal shape and the Industries desire to make a profit off of Second hand sales, anything is possible.

That you did. Lets continue this discussion in this giant thread here:

http://www.digitpress.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=73779

[GrandAmChandler]

How old is that quote? In November (http://www.joystiq.com/2005/11/08/playstation-3-wont-play-used-games/), when Sony's patent was announced, the exact same rhetoric flew around. I think if these "retail contacts" were credible, we would have heard of something along the lines of litigation against Sony by now.

Furthermore, if this were true, it would render the software useless if extensive repairs were made to the console (probably a hard drive replacement would run afoul of this), a replacement console were purchased, or backward compatibility were desired with a hypothetical Playstation 4. Would Sony or any company want that much additional technical support to be required for those scenarios?

If anything, it's probably a preemptive strike against patent trolls (i.e. Immersion; I don't know anything they manufactured prior to their lawsuits, and only a couple phones since then). Sony or someone else will probably want an aggressive copy protection method available down the road, and now Sony doesn't run the risk of having to license it from someone else.

Pretty much my thoughts. I remembered hearing this in november and thought it was stupid. Even so though i wouldn't but it past Sony. Between the companies fiscal shape and the Industries desire to make a profit off of Second hand sales, anything is possible.

That you did. Lets continue this discussion in this giant thread here:

http://www.digitpress.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=73779