Videogame shelf life

[ghostangelofcky]

I was wondering how long games last?

as in how long the information stays on a :

2600 cart or a 5.25 floppy for a C64, or a fami disc, or a CD game for that matter, is there a specific amout of time all of our toys live?

Is there a solution to fix them when the roms have gone or a way to prolong there life?

[DeputyMoniker]

Correct me if I'm wrong but...

CDs should last about 20-30 years before they become unreadable. Perhaps they're being made better right now...IDK. CDs are polycarbonate plastic on the clear side, then an aluminum layer (thats the silvery shine of a CD), then a protective acrylic, then the label on top of that. When the water in the polycarbonate starts to evaporate, the CD becomes unreadable because the laser can no longer pass through it unobstructed. That should take 20+ years. CDRs are slightly different because the data isnt physically pressed. Its "burned" into an ink layer between the poly and aluminum layers...when the ink loses its moisture due to evaporation it becomes unreadable. That should take 20+ years too.

[CosmicMonkey]

Well, I'd certainly be worried if I had any PC Engine Super LD-Rom2 or Mega-LD Laserdisks kicking around (or any Arcade LD systems). Many LDs have started oxidizing already.

Oh and Fami Disks aren't the longest lasting storage medium ever either, apparently.

[ryborg]

CDRs are slightly different because the data isnt physically pressed. Its "burned" into an ink layer between the poly and aluminum layers...when the ink loses its moisture due to evaporation it becomes unreadable. That should take 20+ years too.

Do you or anyone else know if very-early-gen 1X CD-Rs were made especially cheaper than later models? Some of my early '90s CD-Rs are already starting to deteriorate to the point of being unplayable in any drive. I take immaculate care of my CDs, and it looks like the process is starting earlier than it should. I've since backed up the important stuff, obviously, so it's not a pressing issue, but I was just curious.
________
Rolls-royce silver ghost (http://www.bmw-tech.org/wiki/Rolls-Royce_Silver_Ghost)

[DeputyMoniker]

CDRs are slightly different because the data isnt physically pressed. Its "burned" into an ink layer between the poly and aluminum layers...when the ink loses its moisture due to evaporation it becomes unreadable. That should take 20+ years too.

Do you or anyone else know if very-early-gen 1X CD-Rs were made especially cheaper than later models? Some of my early '90s CD-Rs are already starting to deteriorate to the point of being unplayable in any drive. I take immaculate care of my CDs, and it looks like the process is starting earlier than it should. I've since backed up the important stuff, obviously, so it's not a pressing issue, but I was just curious.

I really dont know but if you think about it what product doesnt have its cheap ass manufacturers.

[Niku-Sama]

these are all on average too, depending on the conditions and what not they could last alot shorter or alot longer than this.

i have yet to come across any thing with bit rot or any cd's that were oxodized

[gepeto]

This is an interesting topic. If I recall when cd's first came out they always touted the Longevity of cd life. The lifespan was a whole lot alot longer than thirty years. What happened to cd's invincibility?

I think we need an official response from those in the know. Ps1 games are approaching the 10 year mark.

[Kid Ice]

I rarely come across a C64 floppy that doesn't work. Those are pretty darn old, and I wouldn't think floppies would be the most resilient media in the world.

Yeah, when CDs first came out the hype was that you could do pretty much anything to them and they would still work. Anyway, I play my 3DO games frequently with no problems, and those are some of the oldest CD based games around.

[Carey85]

Your best bet right now for a 5.25 floppy disk at this point is to put it into a drive and load it up. After that, transfer it onto a digital medium :P. I backed up all of my C64 programs using a XE1541 interface cable. At this point, almost all C64 software has been digitally preserved. I recently took all of my Sinclair software that was on cassette and transferred it to CD, I did it just in the nick of time it seems.

[GarrettCRW]

Like Kid Ice, I have yet to encounter bad games, be it on CD (Duo, Sega CD, PS1/2, etc.) or floppy (Famicom Disk System). Generally speaking (and presuming that manufacturing standards involved were of a generally high quality), such media should last at least until we're old men and women.

Oh, BTW, laser rot on a grand scale was the result of piss-poor disc-pressing methods. Laserdiscs saw it happen quicker because the format was physically larger and less-than-popular in the US (being an analog format probably didn't help either).

[Kitsune Sniper]

I have a few CDRs which don't work anymore. They're spotless.

I burned them a year ago.

DAMN YOU, MAXELL!

[dj_spryte]

how long do snes and nes cartridge last for??? If there factory sealed could they possibly last forever??

[kiun]

how long do snes and nes cartridge last for??? If there factory sealed could they possibly last forever??

LOL

[Niku-Sama]

I have a few CDRs which don't work anymore. They're spotless.

I burned them a year ago.

DAMN YOU, MAXELL!

if you leave them in the sun it can kill them, something about melting holes or something

[Kitsune Sniper]

I have a few CDRs which don't work anymore. They're spotless.

I burned them a year ago.

DAMN YOU, MAXELL!

if you leave them in the sun it can kill them, something about melting holes or something

They've been stored inside a CD binder since I burned them. :\

[Synergy]

If I recall when cd's first came out they always touted the Longevity of cd life. The lifespan was a whole lot alot longer than thirty years. What happened to cd's invincibility?

I remember reading in the booklets of first generation audio cds that if proper care was given to a CD, they would last a "lifetime". Since lifetimes vary, it still makes me wonder.

It gets under my skin that one day I'll have Radiant Silvergun, go to play it, and it's "worn out". I mean, I know some things don't last forever and all, but still...scary. :eek 2:

[s1lence]

Carts have the problem with the eproms failing. I've never seen it but I've heard of it happening. The copper pins corrode as well which can kill them too.

I look at it this way, NES carts are 20 years old now. Atari 2600 carts are pushing 30 and all of mine still work. Its like collecting anything if you care for it it will probably last your lifetime.

[Carey85]

Laserdiscs aren't going to last that long. I have 4 or 5 LDs that have already begun to suffer from laser-rot. Most of them are "MCA Discovision" discs that are known to fail, and another is my copy of "The Boys in Company C," which unfortunately is a quite rare disc...

[Slate]

How long do they last, Well, it all depends on how well they are manufactured.

I got a copy of Cliffhanger for Sega CD and it didn't work when i tried to play it. (The disc was not scratched up) I also have a SNES game, a genesis game, and two atari 2600 games, All these ones listed are in very good condition (Except for chiffhanger, that's in "Good" condition) And none of them work.

I realise that the cartridge format games could have been wiped out by a power surge while they were being played, but i don't know if they were or not.

[Kid Ice]

I have a few CDRs which don't work anymore. They're spotless.

I burned them a year ago.

DAMN YOU, MAXELL!

if you leave them in the sun it can kill them, something about melting holes or something

They've been stored inside a CD binder since I burned them. :\

I'm uncertain why CD-Rs come into the conversation anyway. I thought the question was about commercially mass produced games. I say if you must keep something on CD-R (like say Propeller Arena or Thrill Kill), just burn a whole bunch of copies of it.

Like I said, in my personal experience as a collector I rarely come across a game in any format that I cannot get to work. I have a VCS Kool Aid Man, a NES Spy Hunter, and a VCS Steeplechase that don't work. That's 3 carts out of thousands that have passed through my hands. As for CD games, the only ones I've ever had problems with are Dreamcast games, but those were brand new, store bought games. I have a small C64 collection of 50 or so commercial disks, and I can't recall any of them not working.

EDIT: I should add that when I talk about CDs I'm talking about brand new, or at least in good condition. If a disc is scratched up I don't take it.

[coreycorey2000]

I also have a Dreamcast game that will not work. Soul Calibur. It's in flawless condition but will not boot up whatsoever. My friend also has opened a few factory sealed Genesis games that did not work. Out of my thousands of games these are the only ones that haven't worked.

[Carey85]

I've had very few cartridge games not to work... Battletoads for Genesis, Time Lord for NES, Burgertime for 2600, among a few others. That's still not too horrible, considering the hundreds of 2600 carts among other systems I have/had.

[telengard]

I was wondering how long games last?

as in how long the information stays on a :

2600 cart or a 5.25 floppy for a C64, or a fami disc, or a CD game for that matter, is there a specific amout of time all of our toys live?

Is there a solution to fix them when the roms have gone or a way to prolong there life?

This topic concerns me a lot. I haven't been bit too much by "bit rot" but I suspect it will start to happen on a bigger scale eventually. I'm even more worried about HW so I've been buying backups of systems and power supplies.

~telengard

[Niku-Sama]

I'm uncertain why CD-Rs come into the conversation anyway. I thought the question was about commercially mass produced games. I say if you must keep something on CD-R (like say Propeller Arena or Thrill Kill), just burn a whole bunch of copies of it....

acually the game i had go bad from the sun was Age of Empires for PC...not a burned version either....i was using it to reflect the sun to blind people in class....


i was in high school at the time

[Xizer]

Early runs of some Dreamcast games had bad burns, so they were literally unreadable by the laser. I have two defective games, Jet Grind Radio, which refuses to boot up, and Mortal Kombat Gold (sound issues). Thank the new GD-ROM format and Sega's inexperience for that.

As for Genesis games, meh, well. They've always felt cheaper made than SNES cartridges and the like.


I also have a Dreamcast game that will not work. Soul Calibur. It's in flawless condition but will not boot up whatsoever. My friend also has opened a few factory sealed Genesis games that did not work. Out of my thousands of games these are the only ones that haven't worked.

[GarrettCRW]

acually the game i had go bad from the sun was Age of Empires for PC...not a burned version either....i was using it to reflect the sun to blind people in class....

And that's why your disc died. CDs and DVDs are like Zartan-they hate direct sunlight (especially the type of exposure you gave your Age of Empires disc).