Turn base RPG’s are done…

[zerohero]

Yea, they are obsolete now. There are only a few old school titles that I would return back to , to play for 40 + hours. Games like “Final Fantasy Tactics”, “Final Fantasy II”, and “ Chrono Trigger” etc. By today’s standards they are just boring, and I’d go as far as to say 50% of gamers will not take that 40 + hour plunge into “Giaa”, to fight “insert enemy”, that stole that secret flower power of the ancients. It just won’t cut it any more.

Seriously who can enjoy click, click, (watch attack animation) for so long these days. I’m not bashing the old school nature of these games. But I’ve come to my senses, and a conclusion that they are done.

Comments?

[Richter Belmount]

I dont know I had fun playing the famicom final fantasy 3 the other day.

[zerohero]

I dont know I had fun playing the famicom final fantasy 3 the other day.

Well like I said the old school ones are still playable or enjoyable be it nostalgia or what ever. The new ones.....

[Richter Belmount]

final fantasy 10 ok for a little while , but I can see why I wouldnt have fun not quite as quick paced or as simple as the classics.

[calthaer]

What kind of post is this, and from which orifice are you pulling this 50% of gamers number? I'm not saying that Japanese "RPGs" shouldn't go the way of the dodo, but there are plenty of good western turn-based RPGs that will live, like Fallout.

Turn-based gameplay will ALWAYS survive.

[zerohero]

What kind of post is this, and from which orifice are you pulling this 50% of gamers number? I'm not saying that Japanese "RPGs" shouldn't go the way of the dodo, but there are plenty of good western turn-based RPGs that will live, like Fallout.

Turn-based gameplay will ALWAYS survive.


I dunno, the click click style is falling out of grace. And I didn't mean one or the other, I meant all in general. Sure , you'll have your good few, and even then, people will not sit through clicky, clicky for 50 hours like we used to.

As far as what kind of post this is, well the thead header says it all. Its a simple discussion.

[Beefy Hits]

Sorry dude, but I have to disagree with you on this. Then again, I am a biased JRPG and old school RPG whore. There are very few RPGs outside of maybe Grandia and Star Ocean that have decent battle systems. I don't play RPGs for the battles, I play them for the story and characters.

[zerohero]

Sorry dude, but I have to disagree with you on this. Then again, I am a biased JRPG and old school RPG whore. There are very few RPGs outside of maybe Grandia and Star Ocean that have decent battle systems. I don't play RPGs for the battles, I play them for the story and characters.

Same here, but lately, I've just seen more generic meh. I love the old school stuff too.

[FantasiaWHT]

Because some of us would rather use our brains to get our way through fights instead of twitching through them!

Have you played the Shadow Hearts games, tho? Great RPGs and you are intimately involved in every action in battle.

[kentuckyfried]

As much as I love traditional console RPG's, I'm inclined to agree with the OP. Turn-based RPG's are a 20 year old+ concept with very little modern innovation, gets a bit old after a while sometimes.

Now for the people to tell me I'm dead wrong ;)

[biscuitdough]

to make a turn based rpg alot of startagy would have to be added to make it in current times. a game like that would almost have to be like a card game or dnd. but there is quite an allure for developers to take a normal rpg-ish attack system, wipe it of half of it's possible strategical potential and add a time limit to spice it up for the bane that is the "general audience". it's a damn shame.

[Steve W]

I can't stand turn-based RPGs. That kind of gameplay was necessary way back when machines couldn't do real-time combat. But modern machines can handle it easily now. My favorite RPG is Phantasy Star Online, and i've gotten spoiled by it. I can't play any more turn-based games now. There's been several RPGs that look pretty interesting, but I put it back on the shelf if it looks turn-based. Boring.

[kentuckyfried]

Or that I'm dead right?

[roushimsx]

I'd go so far as to say that 95% of the people that I've talked to think that 100% of your statistics are about as worthwhile as 50% of this reply to your post.

[Half Japanese]

I can't stand turn-based RPGs. That kind of gameplay was necessary way back when machines couldn't do real-time combat. But modern machines can handle it easily now. My favorite RPG is Phantasy Star Online, and i've gotten spoiled by it. I can't play any more turn-based games now. There's been several RPGs that look pretty interesting, but I put it back on the shelf if it looks turn-based. Boring.

...and the hammer meets the head of the nail at last. Those are my exact sentiments. I don't mind saying that I don't have the time or patience for a 50-hour long game where I have to take turns swatting enemies. It bores the living shit out of me. If it's a card game, I don't mind so much, but if I have characters that I'm equipping with items and learning spells with, why the hell do I want to pick from a menu what I attack with? Give me games like Baldur's Gate, X-Men Legends, and anything else that lets me attack in real-time. My games may lack the big eyes, j-pop intros and implied superiority of being from Japan, but at least I care enough to not fall asleep.

[zerohero]

I'd go so far as to say that 95% of the people that I've talked to think that 100% of your statistics are about as worthwhile as 50% of this reply to your post.

I think your taking it too seriously, its just an opinion buddy.

[scorch56]

I dunno.. personally.. I just sat down with DQ VIII a couple of days ago, and I've barely put it down; but I LOVE turn-based anything (Especially strategies.. but they fell out of grace with the PC crowd years ago, and we all know that on consoles they're almost non-existent anyways). It's just a matter of opinion.. and "generation" in my opinion.

I was on a Mechwarrior forum a few days ago and we were all discussing how we feel we'll never see another true "mech simulation" on the PC again. Lot of things falling by the wayside.

[zerohero]

You see turn based tactical games like FF tactics ETC are fine. It's when you get into basic role playing games that I'm starting to have a prob with. They are to generic , and been there done that now. I love good stories in games just like anyone else, but not many turn base games warrent a 40+ hour sit down.

[Anthony1]

I can't speak to whether Turn-Based RPG's are done or not, although personally I doubt very much that they are done, but I can say that I've always been turned off by them. I remember way back to the days of the Super Nintendo launch. Back at the Super Nintendo launch, I had rented Final Fantasy 2. While I was playing that game, I thought that the story of the game was really cool, and I liked the "vibe" of the game and all, but when I first discovered the whole random battle generation and the turn based battles, it was an immediate turn off for me. As much as I enjoyed the story and the vibe of the game, I came to a very quick conclusion that turn based battles aren't for me.


So from that point forward, I've had basically zero interest in any turn-based rpg's, which is kinda sad in a way, cause there are so many great games in that particular genre. Being a hardcore fan of videogames in general, and reading virtually every video game magazine known to man, over the years you get bombarded with how great various rpgs are, and you would like to join in on the fun, but again, I just can't hang with turn based battle systems. It might be kinda childish for me to not be willing to give them a try, but for whatever reason it's a turnoff for me. I can enjoy some action/rpg's, but I just can't really hang with the hardcore japanese style rpgs that most rpg fans are in love with.


I'm not sure what it is that turns me off from turn-based games so damn much. I absolutely love Military Madness for TG-16, and you can kinda consider that to be a turn-based game. But when it comes to RPG type games, I like the action/RPG's that are very heavy on the action and very light on the RPG. I want to be able to fight the monsters or whoever in real time, I want to be able to control my sword with my controller, and be able to block or swing my sword in real time, and I also really don't like controlling other people in my "party". The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past will always be considered by me to be one of the greatest RPG's ever made, and it's a game I can totally get into, because it's a action/RPG. Dungeon Explorer for the TG-16 is also a action/RPG, but with Dungeon Explorer, it's about 90 percent action/shooter, and 10 percent RPG. Slayer for 3DO was a first person type RPG, heavy on action that I also enjoyed. And of course, the current RPG that I enjoy is Oblivion, and I've heard many people talk about Oblivion as being a FPS type RPG, and not really a true RPG, because the lack of any turn-based battle system.


Still, just because I can't really deal with turn-based RPG's doesn't mean other people can't. There are tons of people that are very much into that style of game, and I don't see developers abandoning those customers. I subscribe to Play Magazine, and that Magazine covers alot of those games, and there very much seems to be a passion for those type of games still, so I don't see them ending anytime soon, but at the same time, I do see companies like Square trying a few more RPG's that aren't strictly turn-based, as the need to expand your target base grows along with the incredible budgets that are required to make state of the art next-gen games.

[The Manimal]

I like turn based RPGs. They are good games to play while you're doing something else, like eating. You only need one finger. The other ones are pretty much action/adventure games.

[Promophile]

I donno, I really enjoyed DQ8. I think that too much of anything is a bad thing. If for the next 10 years the only type of RPG that gets released is action RPGs I'd be bored to death of them. I'm already bored to death with FPS and any type of WWII/Military squad based game.

[Necrosaro420]

I still like turn based ones. Ill play them before ill play most of todays type of games.

[suckerpunch5]

I really like turn based rpg's I greatly prefer them to real time rpgs, or whatever they are called. final fantasy tactics advanced is cool.

[Mr.FoodMonster]

I HAAAATE turn based gameplay. It's terrible. I'm not much into action RPG's either, but there are quite a few that I own and have fun with. I tried to play turn based, I really did. But after 20 minutes of going through menus and watching the charaters attack, I realized how terribly BORING it all was.

[The Great Dane]

As long as Konami continues to release Suikoden games as a turn-based rpg I will continue buying them. If they decide to change the series to an action-rpg I just might stop playing them. The turn-based action is what I love about that series.

[zerohero]

I dunno, I"m not saying I hate them. I mean some of my favorite games of all time are turn based rpg's. Like Grandia 1- 2, FF classic series, tactics etc. But as of recently, what game REALLY warrents the 40 - 50 + hours of gameplay? Yes, back in the day you could do that, it was understandable, and fun to waste that much time pointing, clicking, and leveling up. Now it seems to much of a burden. Maybe the new FF game comming out will be a new refreshing way to play them, but personally, I think Grandia had the best battle system for a turned based RPG. I couldn't get bored playing it.

Off subject: The FPS genre is full of awsome games with good idea's. Its just being over saturated with WWII stuff ATM. All thanks to MOH, and COD heh.

[Mangar]

By today’s standards they are just boring, and I’d go as far as to say 50% of gamers will not take that 40 + hour plunge into “Giaa”, to fight “insert enemy”, that stole that secret flower power of the ancients. It just won’t cut it any more.

I'd go as far to say that 67% of gamers think you are completely out of your fucking mind. Of those 67%, 11.37% think that you pull statistics out of your ass, and lack the needed credibility to pronounce any single genre of gaming "dead." Much less one which such a pre-existing and rabid fan-base.

[zerohero]

By today’s standards they are just boring, and I’d go as far as to say 50% of gamers will not take that 40 + hour plunge into “Giaa”, to fight “insert enemy”, that stole that secret flower power of the ancients. It just won’t cut it any more.

I'd go as far to say that 67% of gamers think you are completely out of your fucking mind. Of those 67%, 11.37% think that you pull statistics out of your ass, and lack the needed credibility to pronounce any single genre of gaming "dead." Much less one which such a pre-existing and rabid fan-base.

I'd go as far as to say 90% of people think you can't read.

[j_factor]

I can't stand turn-based RPGs. That kind of gameplay was necessary way back when machines couldn't do real-time combat. But modern machines can handle it easily now.

This is silly. Old machines did real-time combat just fine; action-RPGs are almost as old as turn-based ones. There are real-time RPGs on NES and Master System. Unless you were strictly talking about the really old computers that Ultima 1 ran on, this argument doesn't make any sense.

In any case, I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with turn-based gameplay. Can you imagine playing a game of Risk in real-time? Or D&D? Or chess? Also, spellcasting almost invariably takes a back seat in real-time combat, and a spell like Haste would be almost completely worthless.

[zerohero]

I can't stand turn-based RPGs. That kind of gameplay was necessary way back when machines couldn't do real-time combat. But modern machines can handle it easily now.

This is silly. Old machines did real-time combat just fine; action-RPGs are almost as old as turn-based ones. There are real-time RPGs on NES and Master System. Unless you were strictly talking about the really old computers that Ultima 1 ran on, this argument doesn't make any sense.

In any case, I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with turn-based gameplay. Can you imagine playing a game of Risk in real-time? Or D&D? Or chess? Also, spellcasting almost invariably takes a back seat in real-time combat, and a spell like Haste would be almost completely worthless.


Oblivion, and a few new games comming out actually have done it, and done it well as far as real time RPG gameplay wise.

Games like Chess are fine, thats just how you play them. Chess would fall under the "tactical gameplay" section of what I was talking about. I'm talking about turn based gameplay like Final Fantasy 1.

[heybtbm]

But as of recently, what game REALLY warrents the 40 - 50 + hours of gameplay?

Are you serious? Do you mean 40 - 50 hours of just leveling up...or actual game time?

I can understand if you get bored doing the typical RPG level-up "grinding" for hours on end...but if you mean a 40-50 hour long game is too long, your nuts.

As far as the original topic goes, I think you're right that we're going to see less and less traditional turn-based RPG's in the future. Final Fantasy has turned the corner and so has the next Shin Megami Tensei (a shame IMO). If Dragon Quest 9 has real time battles, I think I'll vomit.

[zerohero]

But as of recently, what game REALLY warrents the 40 - 50 + hours of gameplay?

Are you serious? Do you mean 40 - 50 hours of just leveling up...or actual game time?

I can understand if you get bored doing the typical RPG level-up "grinding" for hours on end...but if you mean a 40-50 hour long game is too long, your nuts.

As far as the original topic goes, I think you're right that we're going to see less and less traditional turn-based RPG's in the future. Final Fantasy has turned the corner and so has the next Shin Megami Tensei (a shame IMO). If Dragon Quest 9 has real time battles, I think I'll vomit.


Average rpg's take around 40 - 50 hours to complete. This takes into account leveling up. And if your like me, you usualy like to level up alot before a boss battle, so that adds more time to it.

[heybtbm]

Average rpg's take around 40 - 50 hours to complete. This takes into account leveling up. And if your like me, you usualy like to level up alot before a boss battle, so that adds more time to it.

That's why I like the (few) RPG's that have enemies leveling up as you level up. It eliminates the necessity to level-grind for hours. FFVIII anyone?

[zerohero]

Average rpg's take around 40 - 50 hours to complete. This takes into account leveling up. And if your like me, you usualy like to level up alot before a boss battle, so that adds more time to it.

That's why I like the (few) RPG's that have enemies leveling up as you level up. It eliminates the necessity to level-grind for hours. FFVIII anyone?

That game still takes around 40+ hours though 0.o.

[Anthony1]

Can you imagine playing a game of Risk in real-time?



Trip on this..... Risk, is my all-time favorite board game. Such a fucking classic board game, I can play that all damn day. I can play the new way with the specific mission cards, and I can play the old style. Plus I can play all the other crazy versions that people have come up with. (Do a google on "Nuclear Risk") I absolutely love Risk, the board game. But again, for whatever reason, I can't fucking stand turn based rpgs. Does that make any sense? Not really, but it's true. I do enjoy Military Madness alot, but it's a very simple game, not extremely deep and complicated, and I don't consider it a RPG, but it is a Turn-Based type game. I also remember playing Eastern Front on the Atari 800XL. I'm pretty sure that was turn-based. But that's about it. Just never have gotten into any of the turn based stuff on the consoles. I must admit that I've only tried a few, and just basically totally gave up on the Genre. I'm not into anime or all the Japanese stuff, so it doesn't have that romaticism for me that it does for many of you other dorks. LOL

[Lady Jaye]

I used to really like turn-based RPGs, but to be frank, after spending so many hours playing Neverwinter Nights and even hack n slash games like Dark Alliance, turn-based RPGs kinda bore me.

I'll still play the early turn-based RPGs like the first Dragon Warriors, but their slow pace tends to put me to sleep, like my mind starts wandering after a bit.

[Bronty-2]

I don't know if they are done or not, but they should be. What a played out concept and boring style of gameplay. I'd rather shove a fork into my forehead than sit through 50hrs of a title like that

[j_factor]

Can you imagine playing a game of Risk in real-time?


Trip on this..... Risk, is my all-time favorite board game.

Have you played Dragon Force?

[Jimmy Yakapucci]

I personally prefer the turn-based RPGs. I do not have the cat-like reflexes of a 10 year old on a major sugar rush required for some of the newer games, or the 15 fingers required to do some of the button combinations. I am no spring chicken. In fact, while I am typing this, I am holding my grandson on my knee.

[Raedon]

did someone say turn-based action? :D

[BydoEmpire]

I recently picked up Gladius (cube) for ten bucks used at Gamestop. It's basically a turn-based RPG revolving around arena combat. It's pretty well done, and I'm enjoying it. Better production values and more story than I was expecting (though, to be fair, I'm only about 5-6 hours into it). If anyone is looking for a newer turn-based RPG, give it a shot.

I actually don't mind more actiony RPGs (it does help keep things moving), but I do really miss turn-based strategy games. Thank God for Civ and Advance Wars. I just don't get into RTS games. I want to plan my moves and take my time surveying the battlefield.

[AMG]

Turn based RPGs seem to be a love or hate thing among gamers. People either love them and can't get enough of them, or hate them with a passion.

While most of the story lines in Japanese RPGs have grown tired and have been done a thousand times before (young man finds his destiny to save the world from an evil tyrant etc.), I still love them. But I can understand how some people could be tired of the whole thing.

[poloplayr]

Yes and books are dead too...

[mailman187666]

turn based rpgs i think are my favorite genre. Its kinda like reading a book before bed for me. I can sit there and relax while playing it and get into a sweet deep story, like Nocturne and Valkyrie Profile. Valkyrie is basically a turned based RPG/side scroller. I love to play all sorts of games except sports games, but turned based is my favorite. They helps me relax after a crappy day if i have one, or if its too hot outside (anything over 97 degrees) if i'm not at the beach, I'll pop in some old school turn based games. I'm looking foward to Enchanted Arms for the 360 right now. I don't think turn based will actually die, but they could form it into something completely different but still stick to the roots. There are too many TBRPG fans out there to kill off the genre. Go on ebay and see how much saturn rpgs go for. Try giving Panzer Dragoon Saga a try (its different but expensive). But whoever says they aren't really into them, I can see the reasoning for why some people don't like them, but me personally, I'll always play them.

[googlefest1]

i think that style of game is on its way out also.

i dont think ill ever grow tired of those games but i think the general notion in the industry is that the general gamer does not have the patience to play those games.

although i do belive the niche market will exist and hopefully there will be someone catering to it.

(this is my notion about the US market not japanese)

PS: some one mentioned those rpgs being kind of like a book -- thats just the way ive looked at them myself - kind of like an interactive book

[zerohero]

Yes and books are dead too...

No, books have lots of storys with different idea's and concepts. They will never be old. I'm writing three currently right now.

[DDCecil]

I have 2 turn based RPGs I need to remake (Doomsday Dream Legend: The Zordanian Chronicles and DDL2: Behold! Rise of the True Evil - I still need to finsh the series with DDL3: Last Tears of Toja), and they stay turn-based, since I have no idea how to do something ala Star Ocean or Baulder's Gate with Megazeux.

BTW, it's the 9th anniversary of the DDL series today! I finished making Part 2 on August 7th, 1997. :bday:

http://www.webspawner.com/users/ddcecil/dd.html

[YoshiM]

Turn based RPGs dead? Nah. They've just evolved. Look at Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic 1 & 2 along with Jade Empire. Solid RPGs but instead of actual turns, you "slow time down" so you can make your commands for your group. Turn the clock back and look at the PC Baldur's Gate series and Freedom Force: you can play in real time OR pause between attacks so you can issue commands.

If the 40+ hour leveling slog is so boring why are people forking over $15 a month to play games like World of Warcraft? You still have to fight a bunch of little vermins so you can level up and fight the next higher level vermin and so on. While the game's not exactly turn based, everyone still has to wait in order to attack and such again (though I could be wrong-I'm an ex-Asheron's Call player and it was essentially whack...wait...possibly get whacked...whack...move away...refocus...whack....wait...).

The old blind random encounters may be going away but in some way shape or form the "turn based" RPG will live on.

[Stark]

Disgaea 2

This month

Nuff said

[PentiumMMX]

Turn-Based RPGs (Depending on the game) aren't that bad.

I like the FF\CT\WA\PS\DQ (Final Fantasy, Chrono Trigger, Wild Arms, Phantasy Star, & Dragon Quest) games for great storylines amd decent gameplay.

Super Mario RPGs (Except for the Mario & Luigi crap) are fun while they last.

EarthBound was cool (And it's humorus, another reason to love it!)

Pokémon is quite addictive, but could be improved.

However, I can't stand Turn-Based Stratigy games (*coughFinalFantasyTacticscough*).
If I wanted to play something so slow, it makes Chrono Trigger look like an action game (Like Zelda), then I'd be playing a card battle game!

[Raedon]

Text adventures were thought to be a dead art form in 1988-1990 comared to graphic adventures like Kings Quest or Day of the Tenticle but as it turned out Text Adventures are still around outside of the game publishing industry as fan projects and even have an annual award for the best for a year voted on by fans. Same with Dungeon crawlers like EOB.

Turn based will live on as long as there is one fan out there. Debate it until your fingers are blue if you want.

[Frankie23]

Turn based RPGs dead? Nah. They've just evolved. Look at Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic 1 & 2 along with Jade Empire.

Sorry to be overtly anal, but Jade Empire isn't turn-based. It's all real-time action, more of a beat-em-up with experience points. You're quite correct about KotOR though; the engine would also make for a really good D&D game, especially considering that it's already based on the d20 system.

[ubersaurus]

I'll take turn based over the confusion that was FFX-2's battles.

DQ8 has fantastic turn based fights. KOTOR has fantastic real time fights. You can do a shitty job either way, so I fail to see how quoting phony statistics as fact before saying that it's just opinion suddenly makes all turn based battles in modern games suck.

[Ed Oscuro]

Modern game consoles can make turn based games better, not worse! You could set up a system so that you plan out what your characters are going to do, where they're going to go, at the very beginning of a map. Sort of a stop-animation real time strategy game if you will.