What is a "Mint" game?

[JerseyDevil65]

What makes a game in mint condition?

Does it have to be pristine, like the first time time it was opened?

Can a mint game have minor/very minor surface marks on the label that most used games seem to have?

Does a game have to work to be mint?

Does a game have to be complete to be considered mint?

[Sniderman]

Here is my opinion - simple and sweet:

"Mint = Unopened, complete in box, still sealed. (Whether shrinkwrapped, glued end flaps, etc.) If anyone has ever touched the contents, even if you just opened the box "to make sure it's all there," it is no longer mint. Period."

It drives me NUTS to see loose, disc-only PSX games or loose 2600 carts advertised on eBay as "mint." Bullcrap. A coin is considered "mint" only if there is "Absolutely no trace of wear." And the only way for this to occur is to keep it out of circulation. Take a mint coin, run it through a vending machine ONCE, and it's no longer mint. Therefore, if a game is placed in any console and "tested," it is no longer mint.

Ergo, rant aside, the second you open it, "mint" is no longer guaranteed or valid, no matter how pretty the label looks.

[Jorpho]

But can you not say a disc-only game is in "mint condition" if the disc is otherwise undistingushiable from one you would find in an unopened box?

[Griking]

I've always felt that mint ment that the game was flawless. As for the question about "Very minor" surface wear, if it's there then it's not mint.

There's just too many individual opinions of what's what when it comes to grading games. It's to the point where the grade really doesn't mean anything because it's not based on any real standard. One person like Sniderman above may consider mint to mean unopened and flawless. For others it may just mean that the game disk or cartridge is in mint condition even though the manual is destroyed.

There needs to be a universal standard.

[Sniderman]

But can you not say a disc-only game is in "mint condition" if the disc is otherwise undistingushiable from one you would find in an unopened box?
No. The only way I would consider it mint is if it was GUARANTEED to never have been touched, played with, or otherwise open to any kind of marring, scuffing, or scratching. And since few people handle their CDs with felt gloves on, the only way to guarantee that it truly is mint is to have been never touched at all.

In other words, in the box, unopened, still sealed.

By your definition of "appearing flawless, but used," a car can look "mint," but have 200,000 miles on it. The car would be mint only if it just rolled off the showroom floor and was never driven.

[GillianSeed]

By your definition of "appearing flawless, but used," a car can look "mint," but have 200,000 miles on it. The car would be mint only if it just rolled off the showroom floor and was never driven.

Not sure that's the best analogy. A car with 200,000 miles on it will have sustained a significant amount of wear and tear, under the hood if nowhere else.

But if someone's anal about taking care of their games, they could still be in like-new condition even after several plays. (especially if you've ever bought any used games from Japan) Its performance isn't degraded by the sheer act of playing it.

[scorch56]

Here is my opinion - simple and sweet:

"Mint = Unopened, complete in box, still sealed. (Whether shrinkwrapped, glued end flaps, etc.) If anyone has ever touched the contents, even if you just opened the box "to make sure it's all there," it is no longer mint. Period."

It drives me NUTS to see loose, disc-only PSX games or loose 2600 carts advertised on eBay as "mint." Bullcrap. A coin is considered "mint" only if there is "Absolutely no trace of wear." And the only way for this to occur is to keep it out of circulation. Take a mint coin, run it through a vending machine ONCE, and it's no longer mint. Therefore, if a game is placed in any console and "tested," it is no longer mint.

Ergo, rant aside, the second you open it, "mint" is no longer guaranteed or valid, no matter how pretty the label looks.

Amen. That has always been my definition of "mint" as well; and for the same reasoning. The ONLY games of mine I've EVER described as mint are my factory sealed ones (see my B&S thread right now). Having said that.. I DO have a factory sealed 3DO Gunslinger's Collection that I bought on eBay 3 years ago.. described as mint.. in the same fashion. Half-wit reseller sent it to me in a bubble envelope and by the time it reached me.. it was crushed. I still have it.. unopened.. but it is no longer "mint" in my eyes as well.

BTW.. this question has been asked SO many times here before.. it's no longer amusing.

[Jorpho]

By your definition of "appearing flawless, but used," a car can look "mint," but have 200,000 miles on it. The car would be mint only if it just rolled off the showroom floor and was never driven.

But there are very few cars with 200,000 miles on them that can still be expected to continue working reliably for an extended period of time. Surely this analogy does not hold for discs?

[scorch56]

I have used the "coin collecting" analogy for years as an example. The first time I EVER heard the term "mint" was when I was a kid some 40 odd years ago.. and it was being used in the context of a collectible coin's quality. It stuck in my mind and it's ONLY meant "uncirculated" to me ever since. You REALLY can't equate the term with ANY other item or goods (except maybe stamps).. sure.. nowdays.. maybe a few other collectible hobbies use the term.. but the phrase was "coined" by coin collectors. Mint means uncirculated.. plain & simple. The only way to be uncirculated.. is to be in the same form as when something rolls off the assembly line and has not been touched by human hands.

The US Mint takes brand-new coins off the line (and yes.. with gloves on) and seals them for collectors.. that's mint.

Perhaps another better argument would be to compare it to "vinyl record" collecting. Ask a REAL record collector what he considers "mint" (If they even use the term). Ask him if someone were to remove a sealed LP out of it's cover and play it once on a record player.. would it then be mint.. chances are they'd say no 95% of the time.

Also.. granted.. game manufacturers probably don't have their employees use gloves when they package games.. but then again.. maybe it's done by machines. So the analogy of "as brand-new" is more accurate.

I'm not going to get into another "semantics" discussion here because every time this subject comes up "ad nauseum" there's ALWAYS going to be the devil's advocates around who want to argue simply for the sake of arguing.. or because they THINK they can actually change my mind.. for whatever reason.. it's pointless.. and yes.. it by it's very nature.. is a subjective call to each and everyone.

Word.

[cyberfluxor]

You certainly can't just use "mint" as a particular condition of video games because it's defined a certain way in another hobby. If a game has never been used then it's "new", so why use another term such as "mint" unless it's a describing the condition of "new"? This is basically how I look at it anyhow. Now if you pick up a cartridge can it be mint? Yes, it can be a mint condition cartridge, or one with no wear, tear or defects from use (although a battery will never be "mint" :p). Is it complete? Hell no, it's just a cart but if you find the box and manual in a "mint" condition now you have a complete, used mint copy! Of course you have conditions that follow like great, good, fair, junk, shit, wtf.

[goemon]

The idea of a mint, sealed game creates a paradox -- you can only know if a game is mint by opening it and examining the contents. The disc could have been scratched while being put in the case, for example, or it could have been dislodged during transit. However, if you were to find this out, you would have to open the game and it would cease being sealed. It's possible for a mint, sealed game to exist, but you couldn't know because finding out would make it cease being a mint, sealed game.

[scorch56]

You certainly can't just use "mint" as a particular condition of video games because it's defined a certain way in another hobby. If a game has never been used then it's "new", so why use another term such as "mint" unless it's a describing the condition of "new"? This is basically how I look at it anyhow. Now if you pick up a cartridge can it be mint? Yes, it can be a mint condition cartridge, or one with no wear, tear or defects from use (although a battery will never be "mint" :p). Is it complete? Hell no, it's just a cart but if you find the box and manual in a "mint" condition now you have a complete, used mint copy! Of course you have conditions that follow like great, good, fair, junk, shit, wtf.

Now we're getting into semantics again.. and yes.. I certainly CAN define a particular term based on another hobby.. especially when said hobby is the one who created it.

In my eyes.. if a cart IS out of a box.. but never has even been plugged in.. is it "new"? No.. it isn't.. not to me. It became "not new" when it was removed from the box.. plain & simple.

We can go on and on and on and o.. you get the picture.. about this. The problem is as Griking said.. by the very nature of what our hobby entails.. there is NO standardization when it comes to grading video games. No board or comittee to appoint standards.. and it might shock you to find out.. I don't think it would be possible since most games are resold by people who aren't a bona-fide "business" per se and not obligated to follow ANY rules. I think it's a pipe-dream, unnecessary, and just plain stupid to even suppose it could happen. I've said it before.. it's just f*ckin" video games fer chrissake.. we're not talking about works on canvas by the masters.

If I had my druthers.. I'd simply ban the word "MINT' from ALL commercial ventures trying to make monetary profit selling and describing video games.. it's totally inappropritae to this particular hobby. But since I'm not the king of Marioland.. I realize that also is just as unlikely. ALL I can do.. is offer up my opinion.. and try to explain and validate it if someone asks. Having said that it DOES annoy me extremely when I see some frickin' dealer on evilBay describing a bare cart as mint.. or a box with the slightest amount of shelfwear.. as such.. but "otherwise" mint.

When I sell on eBay.. I adhere to my own standards. Oh sure.. if I put "MINT!!!!" in each and every one of my auctions where the game shows no outwardly visible signs of wear (95% of them) maybe I COULD attract more attention.. but I wouldn't feel right doing it. Taken right out of my current B&S thread: "Mint" only means factory sealed to me.. "brand new" means it was sealed.. but I took it out of the wrapping. My "excellent" is what most dorks call mint. Likewise.. if you see ANY of my auctions on eBay for a cart, case & box.. I DON"t call it complete.. because technically.. it isn't.. unless it has the original warning leaflets, reg card and poster.. it originally came with.. never, and when a game does.. I call it 100% complete.. without guilt.. so no.. I guess I never use the term complete.. by itself.. either.

But.. to each his own. When I used to hunt for games (no longer collecting them) a dealer describing his crap as mint in the header.. means "move along" for me. I'd even go so far as to call it a matter of deceit.. in my eyes.. especially if said seller IS a dealer or reseller and NOT just your average everday ignoramus.

eBay is SO full of people who know how to tell white lies, twist words or simply.. leave something out, nowdays.. it's no longer funny. I've heard every excuse in the book.. after I've been sent something misrepresented.. whether it was intentional or not.

Here's an example.. last night I was looking for an older PC game that when released.. originally came in a box with a printed manual. Said game was later rereleased in a jewel case without a hardcopy manual.. the game was also bundled with some PCs as well.. with nothing. Seller simply states.. "game is in !!MINT!! condition with everything it had when I got it." WTF.. does THAT mean? IS he just a lazy-assed illiterate? Or.. is he hoping he'll impress someone into buying his loose CD? These are the kind of half-wits I'd rather not even deal with.. and yes.. I COULD ask him.. but someone who has that little regard for the obvious.. doesn't deserve my attention.. once again.. I move on.

So should we all actually.. because like I said.. everytime this question is asked.. all it leads to is pointless arguing because we're ALL talking of persoanl opinions and judgements.. so much so that I propose we simply label such subjects as troll bait. I reralize that's getting a little heavy-handed.. but seriously.. if one simply knows how to use the search function.. they'll find this exact same question answerd a thousand times over by a thousand different people.

JD65.. you should no better.. especially being here as long as you have. ;)

[scorch56]

The idea of a mint, sealed game creates a paradox -- you can only know if a game is mint by opening it and examining the contents. The disc could have been scratched while being put in the case, for example, or it could have been dislodged during transit. However, if you were to find this out, you would have to open the game and it would cease being sealed. It's possible for a mint, sealed game to exist, but you couldn't know because finding out would make it cease being a mint, sealed game.

This is called arguing for the sake of arguing.. gimme' a break. :roll:

No matter what anyone says.. along will come one more person with a "what if" proposal or something so far out there in reasoning.. it borders on obsessive/compulsive nit-picking.

The ONLY paradox here is born out of someone's need to prolong each point with a counterpoint.. no matter how far out it may be. Unless you're one of those anal sealed game collectors with a tendency to believe in the inherent overall unscrupulousness (sic) of the human race.. I'd take it on faith.. my own ability to spot a fake.. and at worst.. close outside inspection that a game that's sold as sealed.. IS.

Sniderman and I simply said that a game should be sealed, unopened and uncirculated.. but yes.. you ARE right that once you open it.. it's no longer mint.

If you personally want to be that sure.. be my guest. I guess it's a good thing Howard Hughes was never a video game collector.

[Poofta!]

wow so many people are kinda anal about 'mint'

i always considered 'mint' to mean indistinguishable from a new copy. if its still new, its just that: new; a different level of condition alltogether.

whether you believe someone who calls their games mint or not is up to you, but if i tell you i have a game that is absolutely mint, you will not be able to tell it apart from a just opened copy. granted i dont have many of these... most are a step below... you know they have some very very minor signs of touching or use etc. but still can be considered mint/perfect by other people.

i understand your worry though with carts, once you play a cart, you can see its used. especially true with gameboy games, as they slide and scratch themselves, but whatever, if youre buying to play it as well as collect, then it doesnt matter. CD games dont carry a visible change in them after a play. considering of course the owner doesnt throw it or leave it on the table face down etc.

what pisses me off about coniditions, is when people call it 'new' when its not.
its opened? fuck you its not new. new means factory sealed. if you opened it, it aint new. i dont care if you ever played it or if everything is still there. its aint new! if the shrinkwrap fell off, its no longer new.

[Poofta!]

"Mint" only means factory sealed to me.. "brand new" means it was sealed.. but I took it out of the wrapping. My "excellent" is what most dorks call mint.

i would reverse your 'mint' and 'brand new' tags. once its open, its not new, but it can still be mint =]

[walrusmonger]

I think if a game looks the same as it would if it is brand new (no scratches, blemishes, smudges, marks, dirt) then it is mint.

I say: sealed= new,
everything flawless (like I opened a game but never actually played it)= gem mint,
i opened a game and played it= mint,
light scratch you can't see unless certain lights hit it=awesome,
scratches you can see that are very light= very good,
many light scratches hard to see= good
many scratches= fair

I don't sell anything worse than that.
My "grading scale" has been going on for 4 ebay years now and I have yet to have a complaint, granted I only have 327 feedback, but still.

[Griking]

I always felt that there was a difference between a new, unopened game and a mint game. I assume that this discussion relates to eBay descriptions. If a game is unopened then it would be advertised as "unopened", NOS or "new".

how would you describe a game that's been opened but is otherwise in brand new, mint condition?

[scorch56]

i would reverse your 'mint' and 'brand new' tags. once its open, its not new, but it can still be mint =]

Nope.. once again though.. we'll use analogies, and I'll bring up coins and cars.

Go into a coin shop.. and ask for a mint coin. What will you get? A coin sealed up in a little plastic container/holder that can't be opened unless you break it.. or it's seals.

Go to your local car dealer and buy a "new" car off the showroom. Of course.. cars don't come sealed in plastic.. or in a big giant box.. but if you drive the car directly home and your wife gets into it.. she might say it has that "new car" smell.

I rest my case ;).

[walrusmonger]

But coins are not games. I know when I play any one of my games, they look exactly the same as when they were first new- any buyer of a game from my collection can vouch for that.

A coin will get smudges, finger oils etc. Yes- a game can get that on the disc spindle area or edges too, but not if you're careful like I am.

and if by some freak chance there is a smudge on that area, i just clean it off with a microfiber cloth- it's all good.

[scorch56]

I always felt that there was a difference between a new, unopened game and a mint game. I assume that this discussion relates to eBay descriptions. If a game is unopened then it would be advertised as "unopened", NOS or "new".

how would you describe a game that's been opened but is otherwise in brand new, mint condition?

In MY grading system.. a factory sealed game in perfect physical shape.. is "mint".

If I open.. for instance.. my sealed copy of Family Dog and looked it over perhaps, but DIDN'T plug it in or play.. or save to it.. it's "brand new".

If I played it once or 100 times.. but it still physically LOOKED brand-new.. with NO visible signs of wear (or scratches in the case of a CD).. it's "excellent".

What I have called excellent for the last 11 years of my collecting binge.. are what most people call mint.

Once again though.. it's a subjective personal call.

[Sniderman]

Ok, then if someone looks like they've never had sex, that automatically means that they can safely be classified as a "virgin," right?

\\^_^/

The point is that looks are deceiving. I don't care how pristine it looks. If it's been manhandled, used, plugged in, or otherwise fondled, it ain't "mint."

[walrusmonger]

A cartridge yes... those show wear marks. With discs, especially on the new slot loading sysetms, it's nearly impossible to tell if a game has been played or not.

I will agree with anyone who says "if you play it, it aint mint" if they are able to look at two copies of the same game, one being played and one not, and sucessfully tell which is the played one 3 times in a row after someone switches them around.

[Mr_Elimin8]

The guy does have a point on the "how can you know if it's mint if it's sealed?"



I bought Motorstorm for the PS3 from wal-mart, got home, opened it, and the disc was scratched to hell and back because it had become dislodged. Obviously that's not mint. How bout brand new games that people open, and they don't even work? The game's sealed, it doesn't work (you don't know this ofcourse) and it's considered mint?

My definition of mint has always been, "if the condition of the item is, it looks like it's brand spankin' new", it's in mint condition. Which is rare in itself. But when you're describin' the condition of somethin' you're sellin' on eBay, the buyer would rather hear the word "mint" than "great".

There are arguements for both sides, but saying EITHER side is the true way to define mint, is just idiocy.

[Griking]

If I open.. for instance.. my sealed copy of Family Dog and looked it over perhaps, but DIDN'T plug it in or play.. or save to it.. it's "brand new".

If I played it once or 100 times.. but it still physically LOOKED brand-new.. with NO visible signs of wear (or scratches in the case of a CD).. it's "excellent".


The only problem that I have with this is that it's unenforceable. Who other than yourself really knows if you put that copy of Family Dog into your console and played it 20 times but kept it in pristine condition or just looked at it? If you really can't tell the difference then how can you argue that the game isn't in brand new condition?

[scorch56]

But coins are not games. I know when I play any one of my games, they look exactly the same as when they were first new- any buyer of a game from my collection can vouch for that.

A coin will get smudges, finger oils etc. Yes- a game can get that on the disc spindle area or edges too, but not if you're careful like I am.

and if by some freak chance there is a smudge on that area, i just clean it off with a microfiber cloth- it's all good.

ALL I'm saying is that if we are to use a term originated by a certain industry (In this case coins. After all.. "mint" in coin terms wouldn't even exist were there NOT "mints" to have made them.. hence the term.) then we should apply that grade.. with the same standards. It's simple.. concise.. and makes for a more understandable and comprehendable meaning then.

You're also speaking of coins with smudges and such. In order to smudge a mint coin.. you'd have to take it out of it's display/storage packaging. Then it wouldn't be "mint".. would it? ;)

It's a very simple concept to grasp.. I think the reason SO many people don't want to admit or adopt it though is because if they did.. it would mean they would have to downgrade their descriptions and that might hinder sales in the case of a reseller.. or simply devalue or fail to impress.. in the case of a collector.

Yes.. in my eyes [paradoxically speaking.. ;)] then the ONLy people with impressive and meaningfully "mint" posessions.. WOULD be.. those who collect sealed games. Something I can't really comprehend or relate to.. but respect nevertheless.

It would be interesting to get a few of our resident exclusive sealed game collectors to give their opinion on this as well.. but I suspect many of them already have before.

[walrusmonger]

[QUOTE=Mr_Elimin8;1161449]
I bought Motorstorm for the PS3 from wal-mart, got home, opened it, and the disc was scratched to hell and back because it had become dislodged. Obviously that's not mint.QUOTE]


Wow- I would never have thought blu ray discs could get scratched that way! They must have been throwing that copy around in the back warehouse before putting it on the shelf :)

Blu ray discs can be rubbed on counter tops without getting scratched- I did a stress test at the store I worked at before I quit. With untold legends, I rubbed it all over the counter- no marks. I pushed very hard and jerked it very quickly, and then I got some light scratches on it that didn't do crap to gameplay. Try that with a CD or DVD and you'd have scratch city.

[cyberfluxor]

I bought Motorstorm for the PS3 from wal-mart, got home, opened it, and the disc was scratched to hell and back because it had become dislodged. Obviously that's not mint.
So it wasn't a virgin then?

"mint" is a condition, just like "good", "fair", "bad", "poor", "excellent", "new" and so forth. I just believe it's a step below "new", which if it is new, it better be 100% complete or so help me god someone is going to die.


what pisses me off about coniditions, is when people call it 'new' when its not.
its opened? fuck you its not new. new means factory sealed. if you opened it, it aint new. i dont care if you ever played it or if everything is still there. its aint new! if the shrinkwrap fell off, its no longer new.
And this is what pisses me off about Game Stop and EB Games. Don't you dare give me a disc that's been put in a drawer when I want "new" and paying at a "new" price. I go medieval on them suckers when this happens.

[scorch56]

I bought Motorstorm for the PS3 from wal-mart, got home, opened it, and the disc was scratched to hell and back because it had become dislodged. Obviously that's not mint. How bout brand new games that people open, and they don't even work? The game's sealed, it doesn't work (you don't know this ofcourse) and it's considered mint?

No.. but I already brought up an example of the same kind of thing. My 3DO Gunslinger's Collection is factory sealed, but the box is crushed. Is it mint? No.

Now somebody's gonna' ask me.. "but are the CDs inside "mint" to you?" My answer is no still.. but that's irrelevant to me because I would NEVER even attempt to describe a "component" of a complete game (in this case.. a single CD) in the term of 'mint" either. It's simply a term that is meaningless and inappropriate to me.. in such a case.

Like I said.. I have NEVER sold a "mint" loose cart on eBay.. ever.. because to me.. no such thing exists.

[Poofta!]

Nope.. once again though.. we'll use analogies, and I'll bring up coins and cars.

Go into a coin shop.. and ask for a mint coin. What will you get? A coin sealed up in a little plastic container/holder that can't be opened unless you break it.. or it's seals.

Go to your local car dealer and buy a "new" car off the showroom. Of course.. cars don't come sealed in plastic.. or in a big giant box.. but if you drive the car directly home and your wife gets into it.. she might say it has that "new car" smell.

I rest my case ;).



nah man sorry i just dont agree, its apples and oranges. games arent coins nor cars.

its new if it hasnt been touched by human hands since leaving the factory sealed and perfect. if its been opened and used or wahtever the hell has been done to it, it loses its 'perfect' status, but if its still in amazing condition and is indistriguishable from a copy that has just been unsealed, then its 'mint'.

but again, grading scales are really different person to person, and i guess using verbal grading scales is even worse. thats why all grading scales are based on a numerical system, so people dont argue on the meaning of the words 'new' and 'mint' and which is nicer. 10/10 is better than 9/10 and theres no argument there. and im sure we all agree that 10/10 would only go to games that are factory sealed, and absolutely pristine, no dents or bumps or smudges anywhere on the shrinkwrap etc. and everything else would go down in points after that.

[Sniderman]

And this is what pisses me off about Game Stop and EB Games. Don't you dare give me a disc that's been put in a drawer when I want "new" and paying at a "new" price. I go medieval on them suckers when this happens.Ah, but as long as it was never played and it "looks new," several folks on here will defend that EB is indeedy selling you a "mint" game.

Which brings me (again) to my point. Sealed, unopened, never used = Mint. Nothing else will do.

[Poofta!]

Ah, but as long as it was never played and it "looks new," several folks on here will defend that EB is indeedy selling you a "mint" game.

Which brings me (again) to my point. Sealed, unopened, never used = Mint. Nothing else will do.

yeah they are selling a mint game, i agree, but its not new, and new is better =]

ive bought used games from gamestop in the same condition as those that are new but opened and put into drawers, likewise ive also bought used games from gamestop that look as if they have never been played, just like someone opened a new copy, checked to see if theres a disc, and sold it back to gamestop.

like i mentioned before though, we should be using a numerical scale anyway, woudl be cool to establish a DP number grading system that everyone on these forums adheres to, and hopefully spread it out -- like at our stores and ebay auctions. if anyone can do it, DPers can, this community consists of enough collectors and classic games collecting leaders for the momentum it needs. i think ill actually draft up a scale later if no one else does =]

[scorch56]

The only problem that I have with this is that it's unenforceable. Who other than yourself really knows if you put that copy of Family Dog into your console and played it 20 times but kept it in pristine condition or just looked at it? If you really can't tell the difference then how can you argue that the game isn't in brand new condition?

I can't.. unless it was mine to begin with. Yes Griking.. you are correct.. it's unenforceable and as such.. only a standard I apply to myself, but I've been told by my family, my ex-wife, my co-workers and my friends that I'm honest to a fault.

Once again.. an example.. several years back.. and I believe it was on the Sega Xtreme forum and not here.. I bought a (what I call) 100% complete copy of Super Mario RPG for the SNES off another member. That member described it as "mint", but I was pleasantly surprised when I recieved the game from him.. to observe that the game may not have even been taken out of the box. Everything was that crisp & clean. The cart had no fingerprints.. likewise the manual.. baggies were in the right place.. nothing I saw could even "hint" that the game had EVER been played. Curiosity got the best of me and I plugged in the cart.. sure enough.. ALL of the save slots were totally empty.. indicating to me that PERHAPS.. my assumption was correct. Now I KNOW that some save slots in some games can be "emptied" and some cannot.. but must be "written-over" so could I be sure? Of course not.. was I pleased with the condition? You bet. I DID play the game for less than a minute.. then back the cart went into the box.. never again seeing the light of day for years.

Until last year.. when I decided to list the game on eBay. Could or did I list the game as mint? Not by my standards. Then I was faced with a dilemna.. could i list it as "brand-new".. well no.. because I HAD played it for a moment.. and besides.. I wasnt the original owner either and I had no idea of what he had done with the game.

So I went ahead and listed it as 100% complete and in excellent condition throughout.. and someone snatched it up within 24 hours into the auction for an $85 BIN.. and they were ecstatic when they recieved it.

When I say a game is brand-new.. as explained in any of my B&S threads where I've had to.. it means the game was originally bought by me and unwrapped, and perhaps even looked at for awhile.. but not played. Could I get away with selling a played CD-based game as brand-new? Probably.. but not without bothering my own conscience.. so I don't.

So.. can I buy a mint game from someone? Only if it's sealed.

Can I buy a brand-new game from someone? Probably not.

Can I sell either? Yes.. but only by those same standards.. if I know for sure.

I don't expect the world to behave like I do either.. and I'm far from a saint.. I don't even believe in gods.

[tom]

Here's Wiki:

Mint condition is an expression used in the description of pre-owned goods. Originally, the phrase comes from the way collectors describe the condition of coins. As the name given to a coin factory is a 'mint', then mint condition is the condition a coin is in as it leaves the mint. Over time, the term "mint" began to be used to describe many different items having excellent, like-new quality.

When describing trading cards, perfect condition is used to describe the condition as it is when pulled from a pack, mint would be new but opened.

Mint condition is often used to describe a collectible item such as a model figure, doll, or toy that has never been removed from its box, or in some cases is as good as new without any scratches or other. The term is also very widely used in record collecting amd comic books.

[tom]

Here's the Record Collectors Guild:

# Mint (M) Absolutely perfect in every way. Certainly never been played, possibly even still sealed.(More on still sealed under "Other Considerations"). Should be used sparingly as a grade, If at all.

# Near Mint (NM or M-) A nearly perfect record. Many dealers won't give a grade higher than this implying (perhaps correctly)that no record is ever truly perfect.
The record should show no obvious signs of wear. A 45 RPM or EP sleeve should have no more than the most minor defects, such as almost invisible ring wear or other signs of slight handling.
An LP cover should have no creases, folds, seam splits or other noticeable similar defects. No cut-out holes, either. And of course, the same should be true of any other inserts, such as posters, lyric sleeves and the like.
Basically, an LP in near mint condition looks as if you just got it home from a new record store and removed the shrink wrap.
Near Mint is the highest price listed in all Goldmine price guides. Anything that exceeds this grade, in the opinion of both buyer and seller, is worth significantly more than the highest Goldmine book value.

[Sniderman]

Perfect tom. Thanks. I think most of us would agree that opened, but still in perfect condition could be safely classified as "near mint." I'd be perfectly happy with that, as it's "close, but not perfect."

"Near mint" has my stamp for anything that has been opened or is loose, but is in like-new condition. The "near" clinches that there is a flaw of sorts to be considered.

[rbudrick]

You know it's mint when you grind it into a jelly and it goes well with lamb.

-Rob

[cyberfluxor]

Ah, but as long as it was never played and it "looks new," several folks on here will defend that EB is indeedy selling you a "mint" game.

Which brings me (again) to my point. Sealed, unopened, never used = Mint. Nothing else will do.
When I bought Worms 3D (over 3yrs ago) for the GC it was $30 brand new. The used was $20/25 (can't remember) and when they pulled my game out of the drawer, I look at disc and that thing was scratched to hell. I requested to look at the others and they claimed that was the "new" copy so I had to settle with it. This isn't my only screwed up occurrence (once I got a game without a manual!) so I rarely buy new from them anymore.

Whenever I purchase new and sealed DVDs/games that are in disc-format I shake the case around a bit to check if it's loose for obvious reasons. There have been times though where it didn't make a noise because it was wedged in the case! What luck huh. So now you need to make a trip back and get a replacement or refund. This is also why I generally open the product when I get to my car, just to check.

[JerseyDevil65]

The reason I started this thread was because I sold a game recently to someone and they responded back that the game was mint. I didn't describe it as mint (I hate the word) and it was the cart only.

I was surprised someone thought a cart only game was mint.

[Bratwurst]

The most I would ever describe a loose game would be 'excellent', but there theoretically could be a 'perfect' condition example of a loose game. Mint really does imply that it's untouched, never circulated, etc. etc.

To be honest, it's not really applicable to call a sealed video game's contents (or the entirety of the thing) 'mint' because game publishing is nowhere near the standards and regulations of stamp and money creation. I've opened up brand new old stock and found 'bumps' on a game where some debris wound up underneath the cartridge label somewhere along its assembly line adventures. To say the least of a manual shifting around inside the package and getting its corners worn.

But then, that's just really getting into semantics, isn't it?

And the bottom line is, there are way too many people out there who are ready to imply something is perfect when there could be a flaw they don't notice, or couldn't even imagine looking for. How many of you have a serious jewelry grade loupe?

[ubikuberalles]

For me to consider something in mint condition it has to taste minty when I lick it (I lick all my gaming acquisitions).

If licking carts, consoles and discs is not your thing then go with Sniderman's definition.

[8-bitNesMan]

Sealed, unopened, never used = Mint. Nothing else will do.

What if the box is damaged or flawed? I have a sealed, unopened, never used Paper Mario 64, but I couldn't honestly call it mint.

[scorch56]

Here's Wiki:

Mint condition is an expression used in the description of pre-owned goods. Originally, the phrase comes from the way collectors describe the condition of coins. As the name given to a coin factory is a 'mint', then mint condition is the condition a coin is in as it leaves the mint. Over time, the term "mint" began to be used to describe many different items having excellent, like-new quality.

When describing trading cards, perfect condition is used to describe the condition as it is when pulled from a pack, mint would be new but opened.

Mint condition is often used to describe a collectible item such as a model figure, doll, or toy that has never been removed from its box, or in some cases is as good as new without any scratches or other. The term is also very widely used in record collecting amd comic books.


Oh boy! Well if Wiki says it.. it MUST be right! While I agree with their description.. I STILL hate them; but a dictionary (anybody remember those?) would probably tell you the same thing.

I'm sure someone will "enlighten" me ;).

[scorch56]

What if the box is damaged or flawed? I have a sealed, unopened, never used Paper Mario 64, but I couldn't honestly call it mint.

Geez.. are some of you guys even reading this thread? We already discussed your "example".

[arfin]

Scorch56, you should reverse your definitions of mint, and brand new like someone previously stated. If i was searching for a game and the title stated "brand new" then i expect a brand new game, meaning unopened and sealed. Since when does new mean opened and never played?

[8-bitNesMan]

I've read every post... Why do you have to be an ass about it? When was my example discussed? The game I mentioned meets all of Sniderman's requirements: new, sealed, unopened; but as I readily admit, it's not mint. Why the hostility?

[scorch56]

Scorch56, you should reverse your definitions of mint, and brand new like someone previously stated. If i was searching for a game and the title stated "brand new" then i expect a brand new game, meaning unopened and sealed. Since when does new mean opened and never played?

Well.. "brand-new" is also not a term I use in the subject line of my auctions. I always quote that term within it.. so that point is moot anyways. When I sell my games on eat-me-Bay the ONLY thing I'll put in a title regarding condition is usually "CIB" (which all of my games are). If you look at my past auctions on eBay.. you'll occasionally see descriptitory terms like "fine cond", "HTF" and "Nice!". The ONLY time I feel justified putting "MINT" in the title is when the game is indeed facory-sealed, but I usually mention that term too in it. The ONLY time I put the term "complete" in a title.. is when I can say "100% complete" which is NOT very often.. since with a used game.. I rarely can be certain of what ALL of the original components were.

Look.. my point IS <sigh> again.. we're ALL going to argue and re-argue this point over and over gain, and we're ALl going to use anologies because that's ALL we CAN do. Yes.. we may be comparing apples to oranges.. but can anyone here make a direct analogy? I think not. In the case of YOUR example.. i'll go back to cars again. If you bought a brand-new car off the showroom floor and drove it home and parked it in your driveway 30 minutes later. If your best friend came over and asked you "Did you get a new car?".. would you tell him, "Well no.. actually it's not brand-new.. but it was when I bought it an hour ago!"? I think not.. unless of course one WERE an absolute Mortimer (et al.. geek, nerd, obsessive-compulsive.. etc.).

Now that I think of it.. I had friends when I was in high school 40 years ago who DID talk like that.. and might have answered like that.. God rest their souls.. (if they're not running a software company now).


I've read every post... Why do you have to be an ass about it? When was my example discussed? The game I mentioned meets all of Sniderman's requirements: new, sealed, unopened; but as I readily admit, it's not mint. Why the hostility?

Nobody's getting "hostile" I think you may be a LITTLE overly-sensitive. I was simply wondering if you read ALL of the posts. If you DID.. you would see that I use an example of my 3DO Gunslinger's Collection title (twice in fact.. I believe) to already answer that question. That game I have is STILL factory sealed, but the box was crushed in transit. Is it "mint"? No. I think Sniderman would agree as well. I don't think neither he, nor I.. are trying to come acrossed as the "condition Nazis".. nor are we out to convince anyone else to adopt our "standards". An opinion was asked (because that's ALL this board can ever elicit) and we gave it. But then.. someone ALWAYS has to come up with a "what if.." scenario that has to take an explanation one step further. When in fact.. the answer isn't even called for because it SHOULD be "common sense".

No need to get upset because I simply suggested that you may have not taken that route.. because if you did.. the answer was already there.

[Lothars]

IMO

Brand New = Game that has never been opened

Mint = Game that has been opened but disc is flawless and is just like new.

But Like everyone else has said, everyone has a different view on which is mint and which is Brand new,

it's just one of those things.

[cyberfluxor]

...Yes.. we may be comparing apples to oranges.. but can anyone here make a direct analogy? I think not. In the case of YOUR example.. i'll go back to cars again. If you bought a brand-new car off the showroom floor and drove it home and parked it in your driveway 30 minutes later. If your best friend came over and asked you "Did you get a new car?".. would you tell him, "Well no.. actually it's not brand-new.. but it was when I bought it an hour ago!"? I think not.. unless of course one WERE an absolute Mortimer (et al.. geek, nerd, obsessive-compulsive.. etc.)....
You bought a new car because they don't arrive on the lot "sealed", which once again starts it off as a bad comparison to to new video games. Maybe if your comparing classic cars (rebuilt or kit cars could resemble Neo-Geo carts :p) and their collecting community it'd be more just. But if you buy a new car off the lot, sure it's used the second you sign the papers because there's a owner other than the dealership. In addition you ask "did you get a new car?" and yes, you did. Just like if I bought a sealed PS2 game right now and played it I got a new game, not used.

I'm not saying your practice is horrible or incorrect rather we all have agreed to disagree on certain conditions of games.

[arfin]

Scorth good comparison. Yeah you can call the car new, but can you sell it at the price you bought it just an hour ago? No, just like if you buy a new game, and open it, you can't sell it at the same price because it ISN'T new.

[nebrazca78]

My 2...

Technically speaking you can't call a game mint if it has been opened. The term "mint condition" means the condition of a coin when it comes out of the mint, new, untouched.

If a video game has been opened it is not in mint condition.

I personally never use the term "mint" to describe my auctions. Really it is only proper to use the term mint for coins and nothing else. Reason being is that nothing else is made in a mint besides coins (as far as I know). I have been tempted to use the term "minty" which I have seen used before but I never have.

I am guilty of calling every game with the cart, case and manual complete. This is the eBay standard and I've never had a problem with it. If you were only allowed to use the term complete on 100% complete games, 99% or more of the games listed as complete would not qualify.

From what I've seen the most common way of describing video games is this:

Excellent
Very Good
Good
Fair
Poor

And this is what I use.

[TurboGenesis]

Does anyone deal in sports cards?

Go on ebay and put in 'PSA 10' in the search.

Graded sports cards are graded as such:
PSA 10 = Gem mint
PSA 9 = Mint
PSA 8 = Near Mint/Mint
etc.

When you send your sports cards to Professional Sports Authenticators, you don't know what it will be graded. They do some crazy processes to determine the grade. It is a pretty extreme process. A finger print can make a possible PSA 10 go down to a PSA 9.

Sports cards is an area where condition is paramount to what it is worth. Maybe video game Collectors could learn a thing or two from sports card collectors.

[scorch56]

Then there are people like THIS (http://cgi.ebay.com/Snes-RPG-Secret-Of-Mana-Mint-WITH-GUIDE_W0QQitemZ270106577345QQihZ017QQcategoryZ6205 3QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem) . WTF.. is this! "mint?" "PARTIALLY factory-sealed?" LOL

[bennyleeiowa]

I agree with sports cards logic!!! You have to touch these there is no way around it so and it can still be MINT!!!!! Maybe even a Gem Mint!!! So Nintendo games well kept can be mint!!! No rattle, no scuff on the sticker, and plays!!!

[Griking]

Then there are people like THIS (http://cgi.ebay.com/Snes-RPG-Secret-Of-Mana-Mint-WITH-GUIDE_W0QQitemZ270106577345QQihZ017QQcategoryZ6205 3QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem) . WTF.. is this! "mint?" "PARTIALLY factory-sealed?" LOL

What was that? sorry, I wasn't paying attention. I was too distracted by the $24.00 shipping fee. O_O

[scorch56]

What was that? sorry, I wasn't paying attention. I was too distracted by the $24.00 shipping fee. O_O

But it's EXPEDITED shipping! Actually.. I didn't even notice that. I see he also took out the "partially factory-sealed" reference once he probably realized how silly it sounded.. but HEY! It's MINT! LOL