Bye Bye DIGIPRESS
Bye Bye DIGIPRESS
Last edited by UnpluggedClone; 05-14-2010 at 08:59 PM.
I finished watching the last part of the Castlevania review. The only part I didn't care much for was complaining about load times in SOTN (It's not that long for an original PlayStation game), but it was still a good review.
This is true. I'll just stay away from his "LOOK AT HAW MUCH NINTENDUH SUX" posts that he feels the need to start every time there's anything that remotely resembles news.Originally Posted by ryborg
Actually, those have perverse entertainment value as well. He's like Family Guy to me...horribly annoying yet strangely entertaining.
Settle down, raise a family, join the PTA
Buy some sensible shoes and a Chevrolet
And party 'till you're broke and they drag you away
It's okay, you can dare to be stupid
Now that's just crazy talkIgnoring the really crappy graphics of Bloodlines (for christ's sake, it came out middle of 1994. It's barely even 16bit looking in some parts.. color wise and detail. Or just plain nasty color/palette clashing going on), the level design and such is a step back from the standards set by SCIV and PCE Rondo of Blood. The premise of Bloodlines is pretty cool and they could have done so much with the game. Instead, we get this really stripped down, ugly looking, game of the castlevania series. The music for the most part is forgettable (with the exception of a couple of songs). The instruments are often FM-y and stock sounding. Most sound FX don't seem to fit that castlevania style (generic FM created sound FX). Poor and/or no PCM samples. Some bosses are down right stupid/lame looking(and the last bosses form. What's up with that???), while *most* of the others are only about average in design. Some enemies are drawn poorly as well. The animation for the main character comes off as sloppy and loose. And the animation for the enemies seems minimal. I don't know how anyone who's played the series can't see this? I was really excited about this title BITD. I played it when it came out. It was a huge let down. There *are* a few exceptions in the game that are nice, but overall they don't make up for the rest of the majority.
SNES Dracula X might be a shell of what the PCE version was, but it edges out Bloodlines without a doubt. While it might have *some* of the flaws Bloodlines has, at least it's constant in its design and the graphics are nice. Despite what's been cut (and changed) and the slight tweaks to the gameplay controls (for the worse), it's still a solid game... through and through.
Bloodlines is a tragedy. It could have been something awesome and refined and.. whatever. The only reason I'm thankful that they game even exists, is for the sequel PoR on the DS. That game was fantastic (although a little too short :/ ). Second only to OoE.
How does SOTN compare to Harmony of Dissonance, really?
I must confess I have yet to play SOTN, but watching the video just now, it seemed like HoD was hardly that different.
"There is much pleasure to be gained from useless knowledge." --Bertrand Russel (attributed)
I've never played Bloodlines, but I just watched a speed run on YouTube. Overall, the graphics and animation seem pretty good...not as good as Super Castlevania IV or SNES Dracula X, but there are some impressive special effects at times, like water reflections, the swaying tower, the spinning pseudo-3D platforms in the sky, the rotating pseudo-3D rooftop and clouds during a boss fight, beams of light in the foreground, etc.
I saw nothing wrong with the character animation in Bloodlines, either. It reminded me of the NES Castlevania games, but in a good way.
However, I agree that most of the bosses are ugly and uninspired. I also agree that the audio is garbage. Super Castlevania IV was an SNES launch title in 1991 and the music is a hundred times better than Bloodlines' music, which was a 3rd+ generation Genesis game in 1994. (The music in SNES Dracula X is far better than Bloodlines, too.)
Despite some shortcomings though, Bloodlines seems like my kind of Castlevania game: straight-forward, linear, side-scrolling action. No characters to talk to, no hidden items to collect, no branching levels, and no RPG elements. I could tell that growing up, if I had owned a Genesis and Bloodlines instead of an SNES and SCIV, I would've really liked Bloodlines (partially because I wouldn't have known what I was missing).
Last edited by Rob2600; 11-30-2009 at 12:29 AM.
Sure, it could've looked better than it did but compared to SCIV, the animation overall is much better (I played them back to back just a few days ago - only the main characters seem sloppy compared to SCIV), the spritework is better (as in you can actually see what you're fighting and the sprites are bigger and more intimidating for the most part), and they managed to get rid of that 8-bit block-tiled look on the backgrounds that both SCIV and Rondo of Blood have in spades. The latter also has many pure black backgrounds.Now that's just crazy talk
SNES Dracula X might be a shell of what the PCE version was, but it edges out Bloodlines without a doubt. While it might have *some* of the flaws Bloodlines has, at least it's constant in its design and the graphics are nice. Despite what's been cut (and changed) and the slight tweaks to the gameplay controls (for the worse), it's still a solid game... through and through.
Bloodlines is a tragedy. It could have been something awesome and refined and.. whatever. The only reason I'm thankful that they game even exists, is for the sequel PoR on the DS. That game was fantastic (although a little too short :/ ). Second only to OoE.
Music wise, yes, it's pretty disappointing that they didn't use the full power of the hardware but the tunes themselves are memorable, catchy and fit the fast pace of the game. I don't see "FM-y" as a bad thing, it's up to the sound designer/composer to make it sound good and for the most part, Amane-something succeeded. Iron Blue Intention, Sinking Sanctuary and a few other tracks have earned their places in my MD playlist and will stay there for years to come
I don't mind most of the sound fx in Bloodlines, and neither of the games have very impressive effects to me. I do prefer the way bosses take damage in SCIV, it's more satisfying to land a hit when they flash and the screen shakes. IIRC some bosses in Bloodlines react the same way though such as that rock giant thingy.
The level design is a step back? SCIV has piss poor enemy AI and there are safespots everywhere. It doesn't become challenging until stage 6 or so. Bloodlines has skeletons jumping around (actually looking like they're jumping unlike in SCIV) and throwing bones at you, "bone head cannons" that shoot three rows of fireballs and "bone snakes" that are both bigger and faster. That's just the first stage and it's already more fun than half of SCIV. Then there's the additional character, bosses that are challenging whether or not you have the right weapons, the better balanced sub weapons and the new main weapon upgrade. Alternate paths also make a return (they weren't there in SCIV remember? Now that was a step back). The only thing I see as a step back in Bloodlines gameplay is the number of directions one can attack with each characters, Konami split them up between the two and it just feels odd when you've gotten accustomed to one or the other. I guess one could argue that the build up towards the final battle was a bit tame compared to SCIVs, but the same could be said of RoBs finale.
I recently beat Dracula X as well. Didn't like the primitive controls (nes-style button combo for sub weapons? come on), the slow walking speed, the cartoony graphics and how the cross was overpowered. The game just felt meh compared to all other 16-bit titles... The only memorable part was the final fight and only because it was so damn frustrating.
Last edited by PresidentLeever; 11-30-2009 at 12:01 AM.
You're right. SCIV animation is minimal compared to later games. But given the date the game came out, it was adequate for the time. But if one can over look some *serious* flaws in Bloodlines, one shouldn't put such emphasis on the lesser animation of SCIV. Given all things in the game, the animation is fine and doesn't detract from the game. Also, not to mention Bloodlines animation *really* isn't up for second half 1994 standards. Some enemies are no better animated than SCIV. But at least SCIV has some other things going for it that kinda distract/make up for it (like the graphics/music/atmosphere).
I beg to differ. The sprites overall are lacking in pixel art department. The minotaur (all versions of him), the 3 frame zombie with the funky/lame looking walk, the stationary skull heads that breath fire (they look pathetic). I don't remember any enemy off hand that looks intimidating in Bloodlines. More, rather generic.the spritework is better (as in you can actually see what you're fighting and the sprites are bigger and more intimidating for the most part),
You *can't* have played the game and then have made a statement like that. Bloodlines has lots of repetitive patterned tiles. Maybe not be as small as 8x8, but still just as easily identifiable/unnaturally placed patterns. And there aren't even much alternate versions of the same tiles, with decay or breakage or such - in a stage, if at all. They all look the same. There's no detail in them. They're plain and repetitive. A lot of solid areas mixed with low color count. The game has a lot of that. I dunno about you, but that comes off as 8bit to me. Maybe not NES (well some parts aren't *that* far off) but definitely SMS. If the Rondo has areas with black backgrounds, is sure as hell doesn't skimp on the details and more altered/non repetitive/unique tiles, and more unique details - to make up for it. Bloodlines has plenty of open blank/solid color areas/sections too, but nothing to offset this. *Some* levels have some type of accompanying effect(s), so it's not so bad for those levels.and they managed to get rid of that 8-bit block-tiled look on the backgrounds that both SCIV and Rondo of Blood have in spades. The latter also has many pure black backgrounds.
Sinking Sanctuary is definitely my favorite and it's on my play list (it's also my *favorite* stage in the game, minus the main boss. The mini bosses are much cooler looking than the main boss for that stage). The composition and instruments are *awesome*. It definitely takes *all* the strengths of the Genesis sound. So I'm not sure why none of the other tracks do this (there might be another one or two that has great instruments too, but the composition wasn't memorable for me). And yes, all things are relative. When a game comes out at the end of a systems life, there are certain expectations and standards that it should live up to. The sound wasn't just "FM-y" at the time, it was *genericly* FM-y. Like early title Genesis games. It might have mattered more then, but it still matters to *me* now. And there's nothing in the compositions that over comes this or makes you over look this aspect. Sometimes I think FM fans (and PSG fans too) are too blind to their beloved synth's sounds. If you played this game BITD, you'll know what I talking about (unless you were a one-console-sega-only fan). Maybe people that didn't play the game until more recently/ not BITD, or didn't really participate in the 16bit generation at the beginning to it's prime and end, really don't have a relative sense of such things? By the time this game out, that distinct FM sound was getting old - fast. (Not all FM from other sources, sounds like it comes from a Genesis game) The Genesis sound wasn't evolving much from the original days. Like I said, really good compositions will let you over look this. Well, that and some tunes are just *made* for 2612/2151 FM chipsMusic wise, yes, it's pretty disappointing that they didn't use the full power of the hardware but the tunes themselves are memorable, catchy and fit the fast pace of the game. I don't see "FM-y" as a bad thing, it's up to the sound designer/composer to make it sound good and for the most part, Amane-something succeeded. Iron Blue Intention, Sinking Sanctuary and a few other tracks have earned their places in my MD playlist and will stay there for years to comeBut this wasn't the case for Bloodlines. Far from it, with a few exceptions.
Well, it would have been better if most of the SFX were PSG based, instead of generic FM sounds with inharmonic setups or such. And minus the PCM side of things, the sound FX aren't supposed to stand out. They're supposed to compliment the game. The SFX in SCIV were fine and fit what you would expect from the evolution of the series to the 16bit era. Rondo SFX also fit the series just fine. And while it's been sometime since I played Dracula XX, it should be the same. But in Bloodlines, it's like they didn't even make an effort to try to better match the SFX to the corresponding action... for the most part. Not *all* of them are "off", and this is more of nitpicking since SFX *aren't* horrible on the ears, but definitely aren't great or in that castlevania (at the time) style. And those certain ones kinda stand out.I don't mind most of the sound fx in Bloodlines, and neither of the games have very impressive effects to me.
That rock giant boss is one example of how the some of the bosses/enemies look. He/it looks generic and somewhat stupid.. well lame/crappy/amateurish. Low production looking. Not what I expected to see in a 16bit castlevania game, let alone as a main boss.I do prefer the way bosses take damage in SCIV, it's more satisfying to land a hit when they flash and the screen shakes. IIRC some bosses in Bloodlines react the same way though such as that rock giant thingy.
You're lumping level design with difficulty. I'm only referring to the design of the level. How interesting it is. How it looks. What you do in it. Etc. None of the castlevania games were overly easy until you memorized/got your time in on them. Even the first NES castlevania, which is considered hard by most, is fairly easy until the last part right before the last boss - as long you memorized most of the game. I could give a rats ass about something being a bit on the easy side, if there's enough content and levels to the game. SCIV is just that.The level design is a step back? SCIV has piss poor enemy AI and there are safespots everywhere. It doesn't become challenging until stage 6 or so.
SCIV was the first 16bit title, remember? CV3 was the first game to experiment with choosing your path (albeit in a different way than the 16bit titles). This didn't become standard until after Rondo of Blood. So it's not something that can be taken away directly from SCIV, by comparison. Hell, I didn't even play CV3 when it came out. By then, I was already into the 16bit scene with my Genesis and TG16 - and wasn't looking back at the 8bit games.Alternate paths also make a return (they weren't there in SCIV remember? Now that was a step back).
I dunno about you, but when I got to the last boss in RoB BITD ('93/94) - it was badass. It must have counted for something to other people as well, 'cause it's also the very beginning of SOTN. Anyway, it was exciting/amazing all the way through RoB. Never letting down for a moment IMO. So many little secrets, big secrets, awesome regular and alternate looking bosses - with all kinds of attack moves and great animation/colors/etc.I guess one could argue that the build up towards the final battle was a bit tame compared to SCIVs, but the same could be said of RoBs finale.
Yeah, I don't understand why they slowed the walking speed in Dracula XX. Maybe they were artificially trying to make the game feel longer? I dunno. But I was definitely put off by that. And the last boss... fighting him on pillars. Yeah, really unnecessary lame move there. The combo controls didn't bother me though. Your thumbs already on the dpad and your other finger is already on the attack button. It's faster than having to reach over to another button (and trying to do both regular and sub weapon attack at the same time). But that's probably trivial.I recently beat Dracula X as well. Didn't like the primitive controls (nes-style button combo for sub weapons? come on), the slow walking speed, the cartoony graphics and how the cross was overpowered. The game just felt meh compared to all other 16-bit titles... The only memorable part was the final fight and only because it was so damn frustrating.
Funny you mention the graphics. That's one of its stronger points. I thought the graphics were fine to great, if not beautiful in places. Remains me of some of the DS CV graphics (which I'm a fan of the CV games for). That, and the music.
Note: Sorry for the derailing :/
Now at least this was entertaining! :O
The music does a lot for the atmosphere in the game and there are many subtle details here and there, as mentioned in the AVGN vid. On the other hand some things look extremely dated, downright tacky. For example the Mode 7 effects on the rock giant and the huge chandeliers, or how Dracula hands out chicken when you're fighting him.
"I beg to differ. The sprites overall are lacking in pixel art department. The minotaur (all versions of him), the 3 frame zombie with the funky/lame looking walk, the stationary skull heads that breath fire (they look pathetic). I don't remember any enemy off hand that looks intimidating in Bloodlines. More, rather generic. "
How is the minotaur lacking? He stamps the ground before attacking, can rip off pillars to use as a weapon and even gets stuck in the wall IIRC. The skull head canons are bigger and more defined than in SCIV and have more interesting behaviour. The enemies overall are bigger and move around a lot more, which is intimidating compared to the stiff SCIV enemies that behave mostly like in the 8-bit games. Bloodlines also has more frequent boss encounters, most of which are better than in SCIV.
"You *can't* have played the game and then have made a statement like that. Bloodlines has lots of repetitive patterned tiles. Maybe not be as small as 8x8, but still just as easily identifiable/unnaturally placed patterns. And there aren't even much alternate versions of the same tiles, with decay or breakage or such - in a stage, if at all. They all look the same. There's no detail in them. They're plain and repetitive. A lot of solid areas mixed with low color count. The game has a lot of that. I dunno about you, but that comes off as 8bit to me. Maybe not NES (well some parts aren't *that* far off) but definitely SMS. If the Rondo has areas with black backgrounds, is sure as hell doesn't skimp on the details and more altered/non repetitive/unique tiles, and more unique details - to make up for it. Bloodlines has plenty of open blank/solid color areas/sections too, but nothing to offset this. *Some* levels have some type of accompanying effect(s), so it's not so bad for those levels."
I only said they got rid of those (generic and flat looking) block patterns. I expect a 16-bit game to do better and Bloodlines does, for the most part. Some scenes look really simple (this one part in the sunken ruins, and most of the factory level) but there are nice touches like the destructible statues and crumbling bone bridge. The room with laser-shooting eyes on the walls, where the path splits looks pretty great to me.
Unnaturally placed, sure, but if it makes the game more fun to play then why not? You might as well complain about the candles hanging in mid-air.
There are several examples of 8-bit looking backgrounds in SCIV, one is the "moving floors" part in 6-2 or thereabouts where the background is a 2-color black/purple silhouette scene. The chandelier scene I mentioned before has a black background that switches to red and it looks ridiculous.
"The sound wasn't just "FM-y" at the time, it was *genericly* FM-y. Like early title Genesis games. It might have mattered more then, but it still matters to *me* now. And there's nothing in the compositions that over comes this or makes you over look this aspect. Sometimes I think FM fans (and PSG fans too) are too blind to their beloved synth's sounds. If you played this game BITD, you'll know what I talking about (unless you were a one-console-sega-only fan). Maybe people that didn't play the game until more recently/ not BITD, or didn't really participate in the 16bit generation at the beginning to it's prime and end, really don't have a relative sense of such things? By the time this game out, that distinct FM sound was getting old - fast. (Not all FM from other sources, sounds like it comes from a Genesis game) The Genesis sound wasn't evolving much from the original days. Like I said, really good compositions will let you over look this. Well, that and some tunes are just *made* for 2612/2151 FM chips
Yeah you're right about the instrumentation in Bloodlines. I think the FM-based organs that the soundtrack is full of sound pretty well on their own (certainly would sound better with some PSG in there), but the generic FM drums are obnoxious. The kick sounds like a loose thud, like someone hitting a wooden surface with their fist.
Having played hundreds of MD games over the years I find it a bit sad how many of them didn't use the chip to its fullest and just went with those basic sounds, even later on. If the default sound engine was something like the one for Thunder Force IV, Gauntlet IV or Golden Axe III, it probably wouldn't have the poor reputation it has today. SCIV would still be tough competition for any MD game as it is one of the best sounding SNES games.
"You're lumping level design with difficulty. I'm only referring to the design of the level. How interesting it is. How it looks. What you do in it. Etc. None of the castlevania games were overly easy until you memorized/got your time in on them."
I see the enemies and their behaviour as a major part of the level design in any action game, but I think the layouts and such are also very good in Bloodlines. Many 16-bit games were built around memorization, yes, but I hadn't played SCIV in years and still breezed through most of it. Hard mode is another game entirely though.
"I could give a rats ass about something being a bit on the easy side, if there's enough content and levels to the game. SCIV is just that. "
Well see I do care about the challenge level in a game, much more so than graphics or music. A long game is a waste of time if I'm not having fun playing it. BITD I loved every bit of SCIV because the changes in controls and the jump to 16-bit made simple movement in the game world exciting. But that sense of wonder I felt as a kid has long since worn off.
"SCIV was the first 16bit title, remember? CV3 was the first game to experiment with choosing your path (albeit in a different way than the 16bit titles). This didn't become standard until after Rondo of Blood. So it's not something that can be taken away directly from SCIV, by comparison. Hell, I didn't even play CV3 when it came out. By then, I was already into the 16bit scene with my Genesis and TG16 - and wasn't looking back at the 8bit games. "
Just because you missed out on CV3 doesn't mean that the rest of the world did, or that Konami didn't take it into consideration when making the sequel. And I've always seen CV2 as the experimental game, 3 took some elements from it and created a good balance between action and exploration.
RoB is another discussion, so I'll just say that it didn't "wow" me as much as the average Castlevania fan. I thought it was more flash, less substance.
I prefer Bloodlines over Super Castlevania IV while I prefer SNES above Genesis.
Great Castlevania series. Really wish Lament of Innocence was properly covered though.
Everything was properly covered. It was Castlevania as he personally remembers it, not a full review of every CV game ever. I don't know why people find that so hard to understand.
I understand that and wasn't criticizing him at all all. I loved the series of videos he did, and agree with him that Castlevania IV was a favorite of mine as well. I was just saying I wished he had covered LOI, but it's all good.
The sound effects sucked. Whenever you killed some enemies it had a sortof screeching sound that was irritating to listen to.
The level design definitely wasn't a step back, though the length of SCV4 and how all the levels were standard type level based rather than a bunch of unique effects. Bloodlines is amazing but it's not as good as most of the other level based titles because its levels are less of your standard platforming and is one of the shortest Castlevania games with just a couple levels with unique ideas.The level design is a step back?
You say that you like PoR and OoE are the best yet don't like Bloodlines and also talk about how bad the level designs on Bloodlines are? While PoR does have better levels than OoE, both have pretty crappy level designs overall.
The majority of PoR is in the paintings. Once you enter a painting it's honestly point A to point B. You're just walking down a path with absolutely no direction to change other than the small direction change to get an item and then back the way you were previously going. Also to mention that nearly every background and every room in PoR looked exactly the same. There were some paintings that had a little bit of exploration like SotN, AoS, HoD, and DoS, but almost none.
OoE was even worse. Half of the areas in OoE were straight lines. That's it. The graphics on OoE were amazing, I'll give you that, but the stages were again, nothing more than point A to B. Sure it had rooms that were off the beaten path but they were nothing more than a screen that had a save point in it and maybe a treasure box.
Both games are decent, PoR being much better, but far from being the best in the series. They'd be the worst exploration based CV games if not for Curse of Darkness.
Everything in the above post is opinion unless stated otherwise.
so wheres the new video?
New video, Little Red Hood, is up.
kupomogli getting butt hurt in 5, 4, 3, 2, 1.......
Was what, good? Bad? As I said earlier, length doesn't matter much if I'm not having fun. SCIV is only fun for half the game if played on normal difficulty. Bloodlines also has longer levels overall than the other classic style games.
I'm glad it's less "standard platforming" because with the 'vania controls, platforming isn't fun.
Ah man, I thought this video was great, his sarcasm was really top of the pops this episode. Props to the guy for reviewing a game that I think was only released where women glow and men plunder. It also looks like he's picked up a new camera or lighting kid, because the production quality is pretty slick.
Welcome to Macintosh.
At first I though it was a bad title edit by calling it little Red Hood, or they couldn't get the license to Little Red Riding Hood. I was wrong.
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