Sony is in shock

[Iron Draggon]

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Sony-s...-14043766.html

[mr obscure]

Sony is in trouble,big time

1. the economic crisis is not helping them.(not only playstations,but tv's and all electronics they make don't sell.)
2.they are losing the console war on all fronts,xbox is getting all of the hardcore gamers and online freaks. Nintendo is selling wii's to everybody and claiming the casual gamers market.Sony is a grey market,they need to do something fast.

[Oobgarm]

I thought we knew this already.

[roushimsx]

I guess people are just fed up with their overpriced and underperforming tvs and cameras finally!

[Trebuken]

I believe the PS3 is selling nearly as well asthe 360 did at the same point in its life-cycle. It's tough to tell if the software side is selling as well but it might be.

Despite the gloom and doom, Blu-Ray is thriving so Sony has that one thing going their way. Might not be enough...

[jajaja]

How does the "operating loss" work again, does it mean that they didnt have any profit when all the expences were payed?

EDIT: It wasnt like that it seems. From the article it says:

In October, Sony lowered its operating forecast for the fiscal year ending March 31 to 200 billion yen ($2.2 billion) profit from an earlier 470 billion yen ($5.3 billion) it gave in July. It is expecting 150 billion yen ($1.7 billion) net profit, which includes taxes and extraordinary items.

Seems that Sony will still make profit though

I guess people are just fed up with their overpriced and underperforming tvs and cameras finally!

Underpreforming TVs? Maybe some of the Sony models, but my parents have a Sony Bravia W4500 40" LCD TV, and i think the quality is great!

I believe the PS3 is selling nearly as well asthe 360 did at the same point in its life-cycle. It's tough to tell if the software side is selling as well but it might be.

Despite the gloom and doom, Blu-Ray is thriving so Sony has that one thing going their way. Might not be enough...

Ye, i think the PS3 is selling about the same as the Xbox 360 did at the same point in its life-cycle as you say

[carlcarlson]

Surprise! Wait, no it's not.

Either way Sony makes one heck of an HD tv.

[megasdkirby]

I guess people are just fed up with their overpriced and underperforming tvs and cameras finally!

True.

At the store, the only reason they sell is because of one important factor...cause it's Sony!

"If it's Sony, it has to be good."

Sure...then they end up returning the item unsatisfied and leave with a Canon or Nikon...then they come back saying how wonderful those said cameras are compared to the Sony they originally purchased...

[jajaja]

True.

At the store, the only reason they sell is because of one important factor...cause it's Sony!

"If it's Sony, it has to be good."

Sure...then they end up returning the item unsatisfied and leave with a Canon or Nikon...then they come back saying how wonderful those said cameras are compared to the Sony they originally purchased...

Why do people think that Sony is a good/important brand in the first place (i would assume they think so at least since people buy Sony products) if the Sony products arent good? Because of marketing? Wouldnt the word to mouth (through reviews and through people/friends that have bought a Sony product) have spread much faster on how that the Sony products arent good, which might have resulted in that Sony wouldnt have made an overall profit?

[heybtbm]

1. the economic crisis is not helping them.(not only playstations,but tv's and all electronics they make don't sell.)

I only buy Sony electronics. No complaints from me for the past 18 years. My LCD, surround sound, DVD player, digital cameras, camcorder, laptop...all Sony. They make excellent products IMO.

[kaedesdisciple]

If anything, companies that AREN'T having financial troubles these days should make the news. The crisis is hitting everyone worldwide. We live in a globally interdependent world, reports like this don't surprise me one bit. I just wait to see who will be next to post a loss.

Also, +1 for Sony's awesome quality TV's. I have a 46" Bravia W series and the thing is all kinds of awesome. For cameras, I'll stick with Canon & Nikon, but you can't deny the quality of Sony TV's.

[megasdkirby]

Why do people think that Sony is a good/important brand in the first place if the Sony products are crap? It cant all be because of the marketing? Wouldnt the word to mouth (through reviews and through people/friends that have bought a Sony product) have spread much faster on how that the Sony products arent good, which might have resulted in that Sony wouldnt have made an overall profit?

I see your point, but when you see the amount of returns received DAILY at the store, and in every other store, I've come to realize that something is wrong.

Out of all the cameras and TVs sold, the most returned this holiday season (for instance) were Sony products. Followed by Vizio products.

Camera wise, the mayority returned are Sony's, particularly certain models, like the W120, S750, and T77. Why? Almost all complaints are universal: quality bites. They choose another camera (I always recommend Canon or Nikon) and they NEVER return it.

Cybershot S730 cams were frequently returned because the flash would crap out after a few uses. Same as S650 and S700.

TV's are returned for similar reasons, and what do people choose? Samsung or Sharp TV's. And returns on those are slim.

I know I've mentioned this several times, but I work at retail and I see this every day. Playstation consoles don't fare much well either, as they are returned much frequently than Xbox 360 and Wii consoles! I would have though X360 would have a higher return rate, but still, it's very surprising.

From experience, I can say that although Sony products are ok overall, they simply aren't the best as many customers believe.

Also, about "word of mouth", remember that many are stubborn and only focus on one particular brand, most of the time being Sony. For example, a person comes in and wants an LCD TV. Cool right? You start showing different brands and the customer right away says "I want Sony BECAUSE ITS SONY." At this point I simply look in awe but oblige to the customers demands and I show them Sony. They start talking about how they are the best, and that nothing beats Sony (ha!). They purchase and leave...only to return a few days later complaining that their new product failed to meet their expectations.

This has happened many times, mostly in Div.57 (TVs).

This is also the reason why I refuse to sell TV's and only focus on cameras. Don't want to spend an hour catering to the customers needs for a Sony product only to have it returned later on...specially when it's a $4,000 TV. No thanks.

[Nebagram]

I used to think that Sony products were naturally superior, then I bought my LG DVD recorder and haven't looked back since.

Sony'll bounce back on the whole but the PS3 will be more of a burden than a help.

[geneshifter]

I've also had bad luck similar to your customers with Sony stuff. Their cameras and camcorders suck big time and I've tried a bunch. Also, I had a Sony laptop once and it was a loud piece of junk with a screen issue. Sony TV's seem to be pretty good except I had a bad one several years ago and my parents just had bad luck with one last year. The only Sony products I have ever had that worked was a Sony water resistant portable radio and a landline telephone both of which I still use.

I think that Sony used to be much better but these days they are slipping. Those still loyal to Sony are stuck in the 90s when they were better quality. Lots of better products are out there now.

Back to topic, Sony has been investing a lot of cash into things like OLEDs. They may have a temporary downturn but I expect them to be around for a long time with these technologies. I also think the PS3 will eventually help them IF they can carve a niche out for it, specifically a lot more exclusive games (duh!).

[jajaja]

I see your point, but when you see the amount of returns received DAILY at the store, and in every other store, I've come to realize that something is wrong.

Out of all the cameras and TVs sold, the most returned this holiday season (for instance) were Sony products. Followed by Vizio products.

Camera wise, the mayority returned are Sony's, particularly certain models, like the W120, S750, and T77. Why? Almost all complaints are universal: quality bites. They choose another camera (I always recommend Canon or Nikon) and they NEVER return it.

Cybershot S730 cams were frequently returned because the flash would crap out after a few uses. Same as S650 and S700.

TV's are returned for similar reasons, and what do people choose? Samsung or Sharp TV's. And returns on those are slim.

I know I've mentioned this several times, but I work at retail and I see this every day. Playstation consoles don't fare much well either, as they are returned much frequently than Xbox 360 and Wii consoles! I would have though X360 would have a higher return rate, but still, it's very surprising.

From experience, I can say that although Sony products are ok overall, they simply aren't the best as many customers believe.

What source are you taking this info from? How big is the return rate compared to how many people that have bought the products?

Also, about "word of mouth", remember that many are stubborn and only focus on one particular brand, most of the time being Sony. For example, a person comes in and wants an LCD TV. Cool right? You start showing different brands and the customer right away says "I want Sony BECAUSE ITS SONY." At this point I simply look in awe but oblige to the customers demands and I show them Sony. They start talking about how they are the best, and that nothing beats Sony (ha!). They purchase and leave...only to return a few days later complaining that their new product failed to meet their expectations.

This has happened many times, mostly in Div.57 (TVs).

This is also the reason why I refuse to sell TV's and only focus on cameras. Don't want to spend an hour catering to the customers needs for a Sony product only to have it returned later on...specially when it's a $4,000 TV. No thanks.

Sure, there are many stuborn people that only want a particlar brand like Sony as you mention, but why do they want a Sony TV in the first place? Where did they get this idea from that Sony is the best? If they think that Sony TVs are the best, and then they come home and see that the quality isnt good enough, at last compared to their expecations, is it then likely that they will still think that Sony is the best?

As you say, people return the TV and say their new product failed to meet their expectations, which makes me assume that after an experience like this they dont think that Sony is the best anymore. Wouldnt this translate to bad word to mouth?


EDIT: I added some text.

[carlcarlson]

Sure, there are many stuborn people that only want a particlar brand like Sony as you mention, but why do they want a Sony TV in the first place? Where did they get this idea from that Sony is the best?

Personally I got that idea by going to countless stores and staring at the walls of TVs. The best picture I saw was on a $3000+ Sony TV. The second best was on a $900 Samsung (which I bought). Overpriced? Yeah, probably, but in my opinion they make the best HD TVs.

[jajaja]

Personally I got that idea by going to countless stores and staring at the walls of TVs. The best picture I saw was on a $3000+ Sony TV. The second best was on a $900 Samsung (which I bought). Overpriced? Yeah, probably, but in my opinion they make the best HD TVs.

Was that the only Sony TV on display and was the price clearly shown? If this was the only Sony TV on display and if the $3000 price tag wasnt clearly shown, then i can understand that people think that Sony TVs in general are the best, and i then understand that people might be dissapointed with the picture quality if they buy a Sony TV for like $1000 and if they are expecting to get the exact same quality as that $3000 TV (a more expencive price doesnt necessarily means that the quality is so much better though just to underline that ).

[Deadman]

I only buy Sony electronics. No complaints from me for the past 18 years. My LCD, surround sound, DVD player, digital cameras, camcorder, laptop...all Sony. They make excellent products IMO.

I actually avoid buying Sony whenever possible. I've never gotten any Sony product that was so far superior to it's competitors that it's worth the extra 20% or so that Sonys tend to cost. Canon cameras, Pioneer audio and video, Toshiba/Mitsubishi/Panasonic TV's, and just about any computer manufacturer will give equal or better quality for a whole lot less. Some people like to pay more for a name they are familiar with (apple, sony) but I do my research and find the best price on the best product.

[carlcarlson]

No it wasn't the only Sony TV, and yes the price was clearly marked. This was definitely one of their high-end units.

And anyone buying a TV without seeing it in action is kind of shooting themselves in the foot. Even if Sony is the best their low-end TV isn't going to match a high-end Samsung or comparable brand. Don't buy for the brand, buy for the actual product.

Some people like to pay more for a name they are familiar with (apple, sony) but I do my research and find the best price on the best product.

Ha, like that! That's the way to do it.

[smork]

I think that Sony used to be much better but these days they are slipping. Those still loyal to Sony are stuck in the 90s when they were better quality. Lots of better products are out there now.

This.

Though my buddy recently bought a new F series laptop from Sony and it looked/felt great. Almost made me jealous, sort of.

When I demo'd TVs a year ago I found the Sony X series to be my second favorite TV (my favorite was the Toshiba Z series that I bought). The Sony looked great, but my Toshiba had better features (built in web browsing, built in PVR software, USB jacks for NAS and keyboard/mouse), a bit better picture quality (shockingly good), and it was 20% cheaper than the Sony.

I think Sony's prices are just too high for their current reputation. They probably should pick a few core businesses they do well and stick to those (no more cameras, no more stupid proprietary memory formats - music players, TVs, and the PS3, which is a well-built piece of work).