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Thread: help me decide a DOS pc motherboard

  1. #21
    Pear (Level 6) Soviet Conscript's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jorpho View Post
    Oh, but that would be an impure, unauthentic experience!!! We can't have that, can we?

    Yes, I'm sure you'll be able to get them running on an older machine just perfectly and without any effort at all!

    You're really, really not supposed to run these things without some kind of fan/heatsink.
    i'm really not sure what to say jorpho, i don't have problems when people use dosbox i think its a great tool but to eatch his own.

    its just a matter of taste. i used to emulate all the time, consoles other computers, basicly everything i could, it was just so much easier and convient but after awhile it just didn't feel right. thats my own personnal thing. this was especially wierd for me with the PC because unlike consoles a pc is a pc wether its useing DOS or windows. i didn't really heavily get into retro pc's till maybe 2 years ago and since then i've just sort of had to make a comprimise with myself about emulation, its not a perfect one but i like it.

    i've had fun putting together old machines, hunting down parts messing with old OS's i never really delt with before, yes i do make comprimises at times for convience. if a game runs fine under windows XP i'll play it there. if not i'll run it under win98SE or DOS. basicly the game is just to try to not use emulation tools such as dosbox. its not for everyone but its fun for me.

    as for the CPU i have a fan and heatsink but i'm just testing the thing right now and switching cpu's and jumpers to check out settings. i don't want to fiddle with the heatsink/fan every 5 minutes so they stay off till i get the setup i want.

    Quote Originally Posted by Arkhan View Post
    overclocking a 200mhz cpu is like dropping a V8 in a go-kart and wondering why you're a quadriplegic.
    i don't acually want it overclocked, i think it may be to fast for my purposes as it is i just don't know how to unoverclock it. my concern is that the extra stress will damage the cpu or anything else even with a heatsink/fan. i never overclocked anything before and i don't know if certain cpus can be safely overclocked like mine is. lets just pretend this is 1997 for a minute and you want to overclock the newes cpus avalible. is it ok to leave the cpu overclocked or should i keep trying to adjust it if i can because its liable to cause damage?
    Last edited by Soviet Conscript; 12-08-2009 at 12:08 PM. Reason: fixing spelling

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    Red (Level 21) Jorpho's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soviet Conscript View Post
    i've had fun putting together old machines, hunting down parts messing with old OS's i never really delt with before, yes i do make comprimises at times for convience.
    Then it seems that the only one who can answer the questions about "convenience" described in your first post is you, and you alone.

    i don't acually want it overclocked, i think it may be to fast for my purposes as it is i just don't know how to unoverclock it. my concern is that the extra stress will damage the cpu or anything else even with a heatsink/fan. i never overclocked anything before and i don't know if certain cpus can be safely overclocked like mine is. lets just pretend this is 1997 for a minute and you want to overclock the newes cpus avalible. is it ok to leave the cpu overclocked or should i keep trying to adjust it if i can because its liable to cause damage?
    If you're concerned about damage, stop running stuff without a heatsink! Right now! Unless of course your need for convenience outweighs your concerns about potential damage.

    And what are these questions about overclocking anyway? If you want a faster CPU, you have a K6-2 400 sitting right there!

    Anyway, I really like the Red Hill CPU guide for questions like these:
    http://redhill.net.au/iu.html
    "There is much pleasure to be gained from useless knowledge." --Bertrand Russel (attributed)

  3. #23
    Pear (Level 6) Soviet Conscript's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jorpho View Post
    Then it seems that the only one who can answer the questions about "convenience" described in your first post is you, and you alone.

    If you're concerned about damage, stop running stuff without a heatsink! Right now! Unless of course your need for convenience outweighs your concerns about potential damage.

    And what are these questions about overclocking anyway? If you want a faster CPU, you have a K6-2 400 sitting right there!

    Anyway, I really like the Red Hill CPU guide for questions like these:
    http://redhill.net.au/iu.html
    *sigh* ok, i'll blame myself since i suppose i was being unclear.

    i don't like to make comprimises for convience but i do if i have to. so i ask questions here to get information so i decide what comprimises i don't have to make or to see how other people would go about these situations.

    now, for the cpu. when i'm testing the machine its usually just to see what the startup is saying about the cpu speed or if the the cpu is running. its usually under a minute acually about 30 seconds. in this small time frame i notice the cpu heats up alot. i was anaware that damage can be cause in such a short time. if thats the case i'll make sure i have it cooled even dureing these quick test periods.

    my questions is in the long run (putting a heatsink/fan on, closeing case playing a game for an hour or more time) will this damage anything. i do not want the overclock i'm just unable to remove it because of my lack of skill.i acually would prefer it slower. my origional goal was to get a pent 100 or 133 but couldn't source one locally and havn't felt like ebay. if i get a general feeling from people it will be fine i'll leave as is, if not i'll just wait till i either figure it out or get a slower cpu.

    Jorpho, i do appriciate the help and comments (most of them). i'm not trying to come off jerkish or anything, i apolagize if i am. just trying to get some info.
    Last edited by Soviet Conscript; 12-08-2009 at 12:41 PM.

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    Red (Level 21) Jorpho's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soviet Conscript View Post
    i do not want the overclock i'm just unable to remove it because of my lack of skill.
    Then it would seem your best option by far is to get more skilled. :P

    In what way is the jumper layout from the manual different from your motherboard? If you need to find the motherboard revision, you should try to look at the numbers that appear at the bottom of the screen when you first start up the computer (i.e. during the POST test).

    Often jumper settings are also silk-screened onto the motherboard somewhere, but they can be easy to miss.
    "There is much pleasure to be gained from useless knowledge." --Bertrand Russel (attributed)

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    Kirby (Level 13) SegaAges's Avatar
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    If you need the manual, just get the mb type and revision and google it.

    that is how i get schematics when i need them

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    Pear (Level 6) Soviet Conscript's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jorpho View Post
    Then it would seem your best option by far is to get more skilled. :P

    In what way is the jumper layout from the manual different from your motherboard? If you need to find the motherboard revision, you should try to look at the numbers that appear at the bottom of the screen when you first start up the computer (i.e. during the POST test).

    Often jumper settings are also silk-screened onto the motherboard somewhere, but they can be easy to miss.

    heh, yhea i'm working on the skill part.

    in the manual i'm looking at they are located in the same area but its in two rows. its hard to explane. this is how the setup looks in the manual ..:: on my board it looks like this :::

    i tried the trial and error approch and either got the same results or it didn't work at all. i'll give the board anouther look when i go at it again.

    the thing with overclocking i was wondering was. is it pretty much ok to overclock any cpu or are only certain ones built for overclocking. if the overclock on this cpu isn't fundimentally damageing to it i suppose i don't have an issue with it as is.

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    Red (Level 21) Jorpho's Avatar
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    You could take some pictures and post them, you know. And if you have a digital copy of the manual, you can post that too.

    Quote Originally Posted by Soviet Conscript View Post
    the thing with overclocking i was wondering was. is it pretty much ok to overclock any cpu or are only certain ones built for overclocking. if the overclock on this cpu isn't fundimentally damageing to it i suppose i don't have an issue with it as is.
    Did you not look at http://redhill.net.au/iu.html ?! Also, you've already said repeatedly that 250 MHz was too fast (for some reason) ! Why not do a proper job of this?

    I would say unless you have a nice hefty heatsink on hand, you're taking a risk with overclocking, period.
    "There is much pleasure to be gained from useless knowledge." --Bertrand Russel (attributed)

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    Pear (Level 6) Soviet Conscript's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jorpho View Post
    You could take some pictures and post them, you know. And if you have a digital copy of the manual, you can post that too.

    Did you not look at http://redhill.net.au/iu.html ?! Also, you've already said repeatedly that 250 MHz was too fast (for some reason) ! Why not do a proper job of this?

    I would say unless you have a nice hefty heatsink on hand, you're taking a risk with overclocking, period.
    found some other jumpers and played with them. got the mhz down to 210 which is fine for my purposes. cpu runs way cooler now.

    only issue now is i get a floppy drive error (40). tried 2 diffrent drives and 2 diffrent cables and same thing. oh well

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    going to sound like a prick here but do you got the cables on backwards?

    The red stripe goes on the side closest to the power connector.
    Aetherbyte: PC-Engine and more homebrew

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    Pear (Level 6) Soviet Conscript's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arkhan View Post
    going to sound like a prick here but do you got the cables on backwards?

    The red stripe goes on the side closest to the power connector.
    na, you don't. sometimes its the simpleist things you don't realize

    but no. i got it working, i think it was a bad drive and cable.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Soviet Conscript View Post
    na, you don't. sometimes its the simpleist things you don't realize

    but no. i got it working, i think it was a bad drive and cable.



    whats the scoop on 486ing it up and crap?
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    ServBot (Level 11) BHvrd's Avatar
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    Two hundred and thirty bucks? Sure, I suppose if you're in a hurry and just want something that works. But odds are pretty much anyone anywhere in the US can do better than that, given enough time.

    I'd be inclined to look for something with PCI slots, myself, and there are boards with turbo buttons that can go a lot faster than 33 MHz.
    "There is much pleasure to be gained from useless knowledge." --Bertrand Russel (attributed)

  14. #34
    Pear (Level 6) Soviet Conscript's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jorpho View Post
    Two hundred and thirty bucks? Sure, I suppose if you're in a hurry and just want something that works. But odds are pretty much anyone anywhere in the US can do better than that, given enough time.

    I'd be inclined to look for something with PCI slots, myself, and there are boards with turbo buttons that can go a lot faster than 33 MHz.
    i agree with jorpho on this one. if i had the money to throw around, yhea i may go for it just for sheer convience but i can spend a fraction of that amount and just build it myself.

    my local area seems pretty dried up of anything console and old pc related. as much as i would love a pre built system i'm probibly just going to snag the parts piece by piece on ebay and build it that way. i have most of the drives i need, 1.44mb floppy, cd drive, 5 1/2 inch drive. the prices for a decent 486 + MB/AT PSU don't look that bad either as well as a pci or isa vga card. i have a SB-16 card already. i think the annoying part is just finding a proper case unless i can finangel an AT board into one of the newer towers i have here
    Last edited by Soviet Conscript; 12-15-2009 at 12:24 AM.

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    use LEGO bricks.
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    Pear (Level 6) Soviet Conscript's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jorpho View Post
    And yes, a PCI video card will work just fine from DOS, and so will an AGP card! The only thing you really have to worry about as far as DOS programs are concerned is VESA compatibility, which isn't much of an issue.
    most of the boards i've looked at either have PCI slots or ISA VESA slots but i don't think i've come accross any with both. which is better to have in your opinion if were talking 486 dos only?

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    Sir, there is no such thing as a VESA slot. You are thinking of a VLB slot. (Yes, VLB stands for VESA Local Bus, but it means something different in that case.)
    "There is much pleasure to be gained from useless knowledge." --Bertrand Russel (attributed)

  18. #38
    Pear (Level 6) Oldskool's Avatar
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    I had a CPU I built back in the day with a Vesa Local Bus Video Card (Hercules 64), a Sound Blaster 16 ISA, and a 486DX4-100 with 24MB ram (that was a lot back then) and the thing ran any DOS game I threw at it very well I might add. (dunno about games like need for speed however). You'll have to learn some config.sys trickery to free up some of your memory. It's best to be 600k+ if I recall. I remember some of the tricks still as well. Some DOS games will refuse to run if the memory is too low. Also, a cheap double speed cdrom should work just fine. Only the oldest of dos games ran too fast for me, but like mentioned earlier, if you get a CPU with a turbo button that will work wonders.

    If you get your DOS BOX running good, I recommend a little game called STUNTS!

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    Pear (Level 6) Soviet Conscript's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jorpho View Post
    Sir, there is no such thing as a VESA slot. You are thinking of a VLB slot. (Yes, VLB stands for VESA Local Bus, but it means something different in that case.)
    what VESA incompatibilities were you refering to? were there certain games that required a video card used in a VLB slot then? is it more important to get a board with a VLB slot or a PCI slot? i did find a few MB's with both though.

    Quote Originally Posted by Oldskool View Post
    if you get a CPU with a turbo button that will work wonders.
    your old pc is exactlly the kinda setup i'm aiming for now. how do you know if a cpu can be used with a turbo button? is it something one can setup with any cpu?
    Last edited by Soviet Conscript; 12-16-2009 at 12:12 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Soviet Conscript View Post
    what VESA incompatibilities were you refering to? were there certain games that required a video card used in a VLB slot then?
    Did you miss the part where I said it "isn't much of an issue"?

    Some really old video cards are not compatible with the VESA BIOS Extensions 2.0 standard, and some games may have problems with that. Even in those rare cases there's usually some TSR provided by the manufacturer to remedy the problem, and failing that there's always the famous UniVBE driver.

    This issue is entirely independent of whether the card is PCI or VLB or AGP!!!

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VESA_BIOS_Extensions

    how do you know if a cpu can be used with a turbo button? is it something one can setup with any cpu?
    It depends much more on the motherboard than it does on the CPU.
    "There is much pleasure to be gained from useless knowledge." --Bertrand Russel (attributed)

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