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Thread: EA Loses Case To Original Madden NFL Team Member

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    Cherry (Level 1)
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    Default EA Loses Case To Original Madden NFL Team Member

    I REALLY hope this guy eventually gets the 3 Billion. Itll make EA and other greedy companies stop being lazy with their long running franchises. And itll once and for all make it clear every game is the same besides some little tweaks and graphic updates.

    http://kotaku.com/jury-rules-for-ori...ium=Socialflow

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    11 million for using code he created but isn't credited for is a bit excessive considering he wouldn't have made that much even if he had been working there. This will just open up many more lawsuits for other people who worked on a game but didn't get credited, and yeah, it's got to suck that you're not credited on something you worked on, but do you deserve monetary reimbursement because your name isn't on there?
    Everything in the above post is opinion unless stated otherwise.

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    Cherry (Level 1)
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    Yeah its really weird, but they should have covered all their bases back then. Its something out of a fantasy novel, like theres the evil empire thats an unstoppable force, and waaaaay back in time they over looked something and now someone found it and it could topple the whole thing. They shouldn't have kept recycling the same game over and over and over and over again, or maybe not have released a game every single year.

    Quote Originally Posted by kupomogli View Post
    it's got to suck that you're not credited on something you worked on, but do you deserve monetary reimbursement because your name isn't on there?
    EA's been making huge money for years, wouldnt you want some money? Hes getting a ton more than what he should be given, but thats not for me to decide.
    Last edited by JakeM; 07-23-2013 at 10:21 PM.

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    Strawberry (Level 2) sloan's Avatar
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    Truth is it will be years before this guy sees any money due to the drawn-out appeals process that EA will surely take advantage of.

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    It's really crazy how many demands like this only proceed on the U.S.A., (Texan accent) "mah gosh, god bless america"(/Texan accent)
    Las calles no son basurero, POR FAVOR TIREN LA BASURA EN SU LUGAR !!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by kupomogli View Post
    11 million for using code he created but isn't credited for is a bit excessive considering he wouldn't have made that much even if he had been working there. This will just open up many more lawsuits for other people who worked on a game but didn't get credited, and yeah, it's got to suck that you're not credited on something you worked on, but do you deserve monetary reimbursement because your name isn't on there?
    It's not about credit. Where on Earth did you come up with that from? He apparently had a royalty provision in his contract with EA that provided payments for any subsequent games that used his code/game engine. EA purportedly told him that they had built the 16 bit versions of Madden from scratch, so they stopped paying him royalties on later games. Supposedly this guy only figured out that they continued to use his code/game engine a few years ago when he went to an EA party and Trip Hawkins made a speech about how the 16 bit versions of Madden were created in six months when the original version this guy created took four years. If his contract did provide for royalties and if they did use his code in later games without making payments, $11 million seems pretty low on a franchise that has generated billions.

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    This is awesome.
    <Sothy> its the internet <Sothy> who cares

    Quote Originally Posted by Daltone View Post
    This is a classic gaming site and the most active thread is a load of people wanking off to my little pony.

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    This is very awesome and bojay hit it right on the legal nose there too. The article was right too, it could open some floodgates. EA has been one of the most crooked and double dealing third party developers going back decades both in studio rape and pillaging but also employee shafting and abuses. EA Wife story, this one, shuttered studios and fired people for challenging their sports near monopoly, screwing the MOH team(which in turn brought us call of duty), etc.

    If anything I hope this brings more people out of the woodwork. Perhaps an early FIFA or PGA/Tiger Woods title will have some shared math code for ball or swing/kick physics they've not bothered to really revise in 20 years and they get what they got coming to them. This goes to show that EA really is the king of rehash, do little new, and only upgrade the engine eventually when it's required to get away with it longer.

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    Yet you can't come back and sue the publisher unless your old contract specifically stated that your work gets royalties. Not everyone's did, and this fellow's dates back to the 1980's when it was more common to see royalties paid out.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greg2600 View Post
    Yet you can't come back and sue the publisher unless your old contract specifically stated that your work gets royalties. Not everyone's did, and this fellow's dates back to the 1980's when it was more common to see royalties paid out.
    Correct. This is a very specific situation and frankly, EA probably thought they were getting a good deal at the time not having to pay this guy as much for the four years he spent developing the game which was pretty lengthy for those days and instead gave him a more substantial back end incentive. I would suspect very few programmers received this kind of lucrative deal at that time or since.

    I think it's interesting that a few people here are so excited about the verdict. First, this happened at a time when EA was considered a pretty creative and innovative company, not in more recent times. So, I'm confused as to why people are so gleeful that the "good EA" was actually capable of the same deceit that the modern EA purportedly is. Second, the only person that benefits from this in any way is Mr. Antonick. The employees of EA and consumers are going to bear the brunt of the pay-out, so unless you're related to Mr. Antonick, I'm not sure why you're celebrating.

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    Trip Hawkins, who has little to do with the current EA, was pretty vehement that Antonick deserved nothing. Many programmers got royalties back then (see Todd Frye - 2600 Pac-Man), but almost always on only the game they did. It's not like he designed the game for his own company, he was working for EA. If I design a game, and get no royalty agreement, they can sell that game and 10 sequels and legally I am entitled to nothing.

    I think he made out quite well, because the 1988 game is almost unrecognizable compared to the 16-bit 1990 game.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greg2600 View Post
    Trip Hawkins, who has little to do with the current EA, was pretty vehement that Antonick deserved nothing. Many programmers got royalties back then (see Todd Frye - 2600 Pac-Man), but almost always on only the game they did. It's not like he designed the game for his own company, he was working for EA. If I design a game, and get no royalty agreement, they can sell that game and 10 sequels and legally I am entitled to nothing.

    I think he made out quite well, because the 1988 game is almost unrecognizable compared to the 16-bit 1990 game.
    This was more than a basic royalty. He was entitled to a specific percentage royalty from derivative works as well. I also can't determine from the complaint if he was an EA employee or some form of independent contractor. I would suspect the latter based on the description of the contract. He also came to EA with at least some rudimentary form of the game engine prior to signing the contract. Here is the actual complaint as filed.

    http://www.scribd.com/doc/52129453/A...for-Jury-Trial

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bojay1997 View Post
    Second, the only person that benefits from this in any way is Mr. Antonick. The employees of EA and consumers are going to bear the brunt of the pay-out, so unless you're related to Mr. Antonick, I'm not sure why you're celebrating.
    I would not go that far. He has a legal team that is toasting the wine goblets about now. Payout to attorneys will be substantial with an award like this one.

    Again, and read my lips: Nothing will be paid out in this case for years, and only after the long appellate process plays out. This guy needs to keep his day job for quite a while longer.
    Last edited by sloan; 07-24-2013 at 07:37 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sloan View Post
    Truth is it will be years before this guy sees any money due to the drawn-out appeals process that EA will surely take advantage of.
    Quote Originally Posted by sloan View Post
    I would not go that far. He has a legal team that is toasting the wine goblets about now. Payout to attorneys will be substantial with an award like this one.

    Again, and read my lips: Nothing will be paid out in this case for years, and only after the long appellate process plays out. This guy needs to keep his day job for quite a while longer.
    The troof: you speak it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sloan View Post
    Truth is it will be years before this guy sees any money due to the drawn-out appeals process that EA will surely take advantage of.
    Truth is his lawyers will probably see more of the money than he ever will.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BlastProcessing402 View Post
    Truth is his lawyers will probably see more of the money than he ever will.
    Probably not. This wasn't a class action or a case where statutory attorney's fees applied. It was probably a straight contingency in which case the attorneys fees would be roughly 30-40% of whatever they recover depending on what the fee agreement says and any contingency caps that may apply to this particular type of case in Federal Court in California. If EA appeals and wins, the attorneys could literally end up with nothing. Generally attorney fee agreements only make the client responsible for the costs if the other side wins, but that is just an at-cost reimbursement for filing fees, court and deposition reporter costs, postage, photo copies, etc...The client wouldn't be responsible for paying anything to his attorneys if they lose.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bojay1997 View Post
    It was probably a straight contingency in which case the attorneys fees would be roughly 30-40% of whatever they recover..
    30-40% of 11 mil is no paltry sum though. But, yes, the plaintiff will collect more than his attorneys when it is all settled.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sloan View Post
    30-40% of 11 mil is no paltry sum though. But, yes, the plaintiff will collect more than his attorneys when it is all settled.
    I agree, but a case like this involves substantial time and a high likelihood of appeal and if at the end of it all the award is overturned, the lawyers end up with nothing. It's a gamble for the lawyers for sure but one that could pay off nicely.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sloan View Post
    I would not go that far. He has a legal team that is toasting the wine goblets about now. Payout to attorneys will be substantial with an award like this one.

    Again, and read my lips: Nothing will be paid out in this case for years, and only after the long appellate process plays out. This guy needs to keep his day job for quite a while longer.
    I'm thinking Bojay meant those here that are applauding of EA's loss. You know the kind of people I'm talking about. The ones that bash EA because they want to be part of the cool kids club. The ones that have probably never purchased or played a Bullfrog or Origins Systems game, etc, in their lives, yet use that as a reason they dislike the company, and this is alongside the Madden comments most people make, although let's not forget how many other developers push out similar yearly releases.

    Although, Nintendo fanboys who own the Wii U hate EA just for being honest and saying they're not supporting the console until more are sold since it's not making them money. Just another meaningless reason to hate the company when atleast a dozen other developers and publishers have openly stated they're not supporting the Wii U for now, either.
    Last edited by kupomogli; 08-08-2013 at 01:40 AM.
    Everything in the above post is opinion unless stated otherwise.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kupomogli View Post
    Although, Nintendo fanboys who own the Wii U hate EA just for being honest and saying they're not supporting the console until more are sold since it's not making them money. Just another meaningless reason to hate the company when atleast a dozen other developers and publishers have openly stated they're not supporting the Wii U for now, either.
    It's more thant EA hyped an "unprecedented partnership" with Nintendo pre-launch and then basically supplied nothing of value and completely 180'd at some point before the launch actually completed. This is a bit different than simply not supplying Wii U games; they set up expectations and refused to follow through on them.

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