Sega Pico Variants

[Zthun]

Forget the term license. It has nothing to do with copyright law, in the context we are talking about. It implies an overarching level of control by the copyright holder that doesn't exist.

Copyright fundamentally means you cannot create a copy of a work without authorization of the copyright owner (the widely accepted exception is back up copies of software for your own use only).

If the person is question is on a crusade over the copyright of prototypes, and was openly seeking ISOs or trading, he's not worth taking seriously on this matter in any way.

This was my point. You just said it better than I did.

That said, the purpose of intellectual property law is to encourage innovations in the arts and sciences to flow into the public domain. The current copyright term under law is a grotesque perversion of this concept. Copying and distributing software for long depreciated hardware platforms is perfectly ethical, in my opinion, and most of those works should already by in the public domian by the original term (14 years, or 28 years on extension).

Yes you are correct. 28 years was in 1790 and that lasted until about 1830 when a series of extensions kept popping up; the last one was 1998 which brought it up to....indefinitely (you have Disney to thank for that one - they wanted to keep sucking off Mickey Mouse). As far as opinion goes, I agree with you that there is nothing wrong with copying and distributing software for depreciated hardware. I was just pointing out that just because no money changed hands doesn't mean that copyright laws don't apply.

[badinsults]

The auction is currently troll bid (I assume it was troll bid) to $500,000. The reserve is not met, even though that puts it to $45 per game. What exactly is in this collection that makes such a high reserve justifiable?

Considering the laughably high reserve, I still maintain this auction is 90% seeking attention, and 10% actually seeking a buyer.

[GarrettCRW]

I'd love to know how this isn't a shill for Game Gavel, or that magazine of SoCalMike's. But, honestly, it's nowhere near as skeezy as GameGavel glomming onto the fundraiser for SegaAges' funeral, which would have pissed Kevin off to no end.

Who is the founder? As far as I know it's only been SoCal Mike, I had no idea he bought it from someone else.

Mike is the founder of ChasetheChuckwagon.com

Jaesun is the founder of GameGavel.com. Always has been and always will be. It has been awhile, so I forgot the dude's last name, but SoCalMike is just a dude who bought GameGavel and then started calling himself the founder of GameGavel, which he is not.

I called him on this years ago and then he changed it up on the very next e-mail chain. It looks like he switched it back.

I know it sounds petty, but this was all going down while I was working on something on the side with Jaesun, so I used to keep in contact with him (I have not talked to the dude in years, but we did get a ton of work done on a project).

That would be like Microsoft buying Apple, then Bill Gates calling himself the founder of Apple. No, it does not work that way.

[portnoyd]

Port, sometimes I forget how awesome your rare posts here these days are. Then you remind me.

<3 <3 <3

This auction is 100% bullshit now. $500k and reserve not met? Yeah. Time for the Which Is More Likely Test.

Which is more likely?

Thomasson actually thinks his collection is worth $500,000+ and won't sell it for anything less?

OR

Thomasson posted this auction for attention for himself and SoCalMike's benefit with no intention to sell?

We all know Michael had turned a blind eye to the neverending calls of 'YOU KNOW MANY PEOPLE HAVE MORE GAMES, RIGHT?' so it is possible he is just as delusional in regards to value. However, delusion has a limit when you are a functioning adult with a career. Take a look at this:

http://www.nintendoage.com/forum/mes...hreadid=128589

DreamTR, you know, the guy with upwards of 20,000 games, is only insuring his collection for south of $1 million. Keep in mind, he has EVERY RARE GAME RELEASED IN THE US. PERIOD. And you're trying to tell me that Michael really really believes his collection, which, in numerous places, has been discussed as being filler heavy, is worth even close to what DTR wants to insure his collection for?

Yeah, right. If you believe this is real and an honest attempt to sell this collection, you are out of your goddamn mind.

This is all moot, of course. Thomasson and SoCalMike will never address these claims. Turning a blind eye, akin to how Thomasson did when questioned about other collectors with more games, is their only option to save face. We know them both to be full of shit, but sadly the mainstream media won't dig that deep. Just remember what kind of people they are when dealing with them in the future.

[Double Ugly]

<3 <3 <3

This auction is 100% bullshit now. $500k and reserve not met? Yeah. Time for the Which Is More Likely Test.

Which is more likely?

Thomasson actually thinks his collection is worth $500,000+ and won't sell it for anything less?

OR

Thomasson posted this auction for attention for himself and SoCalMike's benefit with no intention to sell?

We all know Michael had turned a blind eye to the neverending calls of 'YOU KNOW MANY PEOPLE HAVE MORE GAMES, RIGHT?' so it is possible he is just as delusional in regards to value. However, delusion has a limit when you are a functioning adult with a career. Take a look at this:

http://www.nintendoage.com/forum/mes...hreadid=128589

DreamTR, you know, the guy with upwards of 20,000 games, is only insuring his collection for south of $1 million. Keep in mind, he has EVERY RARE GAME RELEASED IN THE US. PERIOD. And you're trying to tell me that Michael really really believes his collection, which, in numerous places, has been discussed as being filler heavy, is worth even close to what DTR wants to insure his collection for?

Yeah, right. If you believe this is real and an honest attempt to sell this collection, you are out of your goddamn mind.

This is all moot, of course. Thomasson and SoCalMike will never address these claims. Turning a blind eye, akin to how Thomasson did when questioned about other collectors with more games, is their only option to save face. We know them both to be full of shit, but sadly the mainstream media won't dig that deep. Just remember what kind of people they are when dealing with them in the future.

You should consider seeking therapy for your obsession with how someone else lives their life (based on your assumptions about said person who you know next to nothing about). If these people were doing something that would hurt someone else then yes, bring attention to it but I don't see why it matters what their motives are.

Why are you so determined to try to make everyone see this the way you see it? Will you be able to die happy when you see these people shunned by the community?

The seller said he had his collection valued at 750k-850k, why do you assume he is lying? It will sell for what its worth.

[GarrettCRW]

This is his collection.

I've glanced over it, and I'm certain that portnoyd, PapaStu, GrandAmChandler, badinsults, and Dangerboy have, as well, and there's a distinct lack of rarities beyond his complete US sets, especially in the realm of big-value RPGs. There are, however, a metric fuckton of sports games and low-value commons.

[badinsults]

You should consider seeking therapy for your obsession with how someone else lives their life (based on your assumptions about said person who you know next to nothing about). If these people were doing something that would hurt someone else then yes, bring attention to it but I don't see why it matters what their motives are.

Why are you so determined to try to make everyone see this the way you see it? Will you be able to die happy when you see these people shunned by the community?

The seller said he had his collection valued at 750k-850k, why do you assume he is lying? It will sell for what its worth.

This forum was founded on the basis of gathering together people who collected library sized collections of video games. Why are you so surprised that people who spend their time doing this are commenting about how overvalued this guy thinks his collection is? The only people who think this collection is worth more than $100,000 are the seller, and people who know absolutely nothing about collecting classic video games.

If the seller were truly looking to sell the collection, he would accept the $90,000 the Occulus Rift guy was offering. Because this collection is not worth more than that.

[portnoyd]

You should consider seeking therapy for your obsession with how someone else lives their life (based on your assumptions about said person who you know next to nothing about). If these people were doing something that would hurt someone else then yes, bring attention to it but I don't see why it matters what their motives are.

That is not the first time someone here has told that to me. Funny. Anywho, wouldn't you want to know the driving force behind someone's actions? Critical thinking is a useful skill, you know. It can help you a great deal and help you make the right decisions. Like, say, not pledging money to someone who mismanaged a gaming auction site so badly, it's been on perpetual life support, so he can make a video game magazine. Or not pledging money to someone who can't even hold a game show annually, so he can build a museum. Or not forking over said game show to said idiot with a failing auction site. Yikes!

Why are you so determined to try to make everyone see this the way you see it?

If you want my motivation, it's simply this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UecRfBJ2LBM

Will you be able to die happy when you see these people shunned by the community?

Well, yes. An ounce of humility for Thomasson and a metric fuckton of go the fuck away for SoCalMike would be awesome. Hell, if you want a reason, I am doing this because that's what SegaAges would have wanted.

The seller said he had his collection valued at 750k-850k, why do you assume he is lying? It will sell for what its worth.

Because I know it's not worth more than $100k! Many people have said it's not worth $100k! There is a ton of filler, missing information (what's complete, what's not) and previous gen front loaded. If you have any familiarity with current prices, you'd know he's full of shit.

It's funny, I was going to end my last post with what I am about to say: Don't give me that 'sell what it's worth' nonsense. The point I was trying to make is it's not going to sell. There is no sell what it's worth because it's not going to sell. It's a fucking show for attention, period.

[Double Ugly]

This forum was founded on the basis of gathering together people who collected library sized collections of video games. Why are you so surprised that people who spend their time doing this are commenting about how overvalued this guy thinks his collection is? The only people who think this collection is worth more than $100,000 are the seller, and people who know absolutely nothing about collecting classic video games.

If the seller were truly looking to sell the collection, he would accept the $90,000 the Occulus Rift guy was offering. Because this collection is not worth more than that.

I am not surprised people think it is overvalued. I do not think it is worth $500k but if the seller had someone take the time to value his collection why should we blame the seller for what that person concluded. If someone estimates the value of 2500 sealed games who can say that estimate is wrong? It is an estimate of something that is incredibly hard to quantify.

I don't have a problem with people stating their opinion. I have a problem with people complaining about something so utterly meaningless as if it is a crime against humanity. People are basically saying: "In my opinion this guy is wrong. What a dick!".

This is his collection.

I've glanced over it, and I'm certain that portnoyd, PapaStu, GrandAmChandler, badinsults, and Dangerboy have, as well, and there's a distinct lack of rarities beyond his complete US sets, especially in the realm of big-value RPGs. There are, however, a metric fuckton of sports games and low-value commons.

I looked over it too & I agree. Don't forget though that the seller said that almost all of the games are mint/complete & around 25% are sealed. How long do you think it would take to estimate the value of 11000 games based on values from a particular source? 80 hours seems like it would be a quick estimate, yet people look at the list for 15 minutes, don't see any rarez & can say with confidence what the collection is worth.

Also, for the people who are saying that most of the collection is filler; do you know anyone who has 11000 unique games that are all rare/uncommon without any sports titles?

[Double Ugly]

That is not the first time someone here has told that to me. Funny. Anywho, wouldn't you want to know the driving force behind someone's actions? Critical thinking is a useful skill, you know. It can help you a great deal and help you make the right decisions. Like, say, not pledging money to someone who mismanaged a gaming auction site so badly, it's been on perpetual life support, so he can make a video game magazine. Or not pledging money to someone who can't even hold a game show annually, so he can build a museum. Or not forking over said game show to said idiot with a failing auction site. Yikes!

Their motive only matters if the action effects me. If the action does not effect you then your interest in the motive is more than likely a desire for drama which has nothing to do with critical thinking.

Do you consider it mismanaged because it has not been successful compared to ebay? Is the magazine youre reffering to the one that was kickstarted last year? If so I have only heard positive things thus far. I don't know anything about the game show you're referring to.

If you want my motivation, it's simply this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UecRfBJ2LBM

Maybe he is but I still don't understand the need for all of the negativity. I can't imagine you know the seller well enough to know what his motives are, you are merely assuming. If you had proof than what you say might be worth listening too but you just come off as an angry person with no logical reason for your hatred.

Well, yes. An ounce of humility for Thomasson and a metric fuckton of go the fuck away for SoCalMike would be awesome. Hell, if you want a reason, I am doing this because that's what SegaAges would have wanted.

No comment.

Because I know it's not worth more than $100k! Many people have said it's not worth $100k! There is a ton of filler, missing information (what's complete, what's not) and previous gen front loaded. If you have any familiarity with current prices, you'd know he's full of shit.

It's funny, I was going to end my last post with what I am about to say: Don't give me that 'sell what it's worth' nonsense. The point I was trying to make is it's not going to sell. There is no sell what it's worth because it's not going to sell. It's a fucking show for attention, period.

I stated my opinion on the value in my above post. No need to re-state it.

Both these men that you have a problem with may be terrible people but coming on here to commune with other enthusiasts about something I really enjoy & seeing all of this pointless hatred is a big downer. This thread could have been really fun if people were giving their honest opinions (along with their reasons for them) about the collection (the games) but some of you made it about the people involved. Can there be a seperate place to talk about people? This board is for video games.

,,,,,,

[bb_hood]

This is his collection.

I've glanced over it, and I'm certain that portnoyd, PapaStu, GrandAmChandler, badinsults, and Dangerboy have, as well, and there's a distinct lack of rarities beyond his complete US sets, especially in the realm of big-value RPGs. There are, however, a metric fuckton of sports games and low-value commons.

Yeah, I just glanced over it and it is chock full of filler. If I had to guess, I would say he pulled mostly all of the good/rare nes and snes games before starting the auction. No boxed nes/snes games? I diddnt see any in the pictures and the collection seems to be missing many uncommons like adventure island 2, mega man 6. Like seriously, how can you have a collection of that magnitude and not have adventure island 2? How can you not have any boxed nes games?

[JeremiahJT]

I'm curious if the game lists are complete. I saw pictures of BattleSphere Gold and Zero 5, but neither were in the Jaguar list. He has the collections for the 7800, the 5200, and the Lynx as complete, but I found holes in the lists. Mean 18 Ultimate Golf for the 7800. Joust, along with Telegames releases Hyperdrome and Krazy Ace Miniature Golf for the Lynx. Now if you do not want to consider the last two for a complete collection I do not have a problem with that, although he has the rest of the Telegames releases I believe. For the 5200 he is missing quite a bit: Bounty Bob Strikes Back, Meteorites, Zaxxon, Star Wars: Return of the Jedi: Death Star Battle, and Pitfall!

Those are just the ones I noticed looking through the lists, there could be plenty of others.

[Zthun]

<3 <3 <3
We all know Michael had turned a blind eye to the neverending calls of 'YOU KNOW MANY PEOPLE HAVE MORE GAMES, RIGHT?' so it is possible he is just as delusional in regards to value. However, delusion has a limit when you are a functioning adult with a career. Take a look at this:

While i personally agree that the auction isn't worth what it is stated to be, I wanted to address the part in bold.

It doesn't matter that someone else has more games than him. He has the documentation that he has the largest game collection known - thus he can make the claim. Whether that is accurate or not doesn't matter. Until someone else comes along and proves with notarized documentation that their collection is bigger (key word, notarized - you can't just state 'my collection is bigger' and post a bunch of pictures online - you have to have some authorized personal verify it), then Michael officially has the biggest collection to date.

[YoshiM]

The auction's reserve has been met and I looked at the bidding history. It looks a little odd- one person with the handle "peeps[with a long number]" started rapidly ratcheting it up after beating "offshorecz" (or something like that). Then another user, "catch123" was in a bidding war with peeps but the bids were literally 5-20 seconds apart to bring it over $750K.

Could it be shill? Possibly as it looks like sniping attempts with a few of the bids being rather "small" increments but with a few days left.

However, does it really matter? So it hits the headlines that this site sold a collection at X amount of dollars. While some collectors will call (ahem....are calling) foul due to what is considered amongst their peers to be overvalued, it will have not much of an effect on the landscape. People will go to GG. Maybe buy something they didn't see elsewhere, maybe try and sell something. If they get results they are happy with, good for them. If not, they will go to eBay or elsewhere.

Attention grabbing or not, the site is only as good as its sellers and will sell itself on those merits. There's no need to get personal.

[Kaboomer]

The auction's reserve has been met and I looked at the bidding history. It looks a little odd- one person with the handle "peeps[with a long number]" started rapidly ratcheting it up after beating "offshorecz" (or something like that). Then another user, "catch123" was in a bidding war with peeps but the bids were literally 5-20 seconds apart to bring it over $750K.

Could it be shill? Possibly as it looks like sniping attempts with a few of the bids being rather "small" increments but with a few days left.

However, does it really matter? So it hits the headlines that this site sold a collection at X amount of dollars. While some collectors will call (ahem....are calling) foul due to what is considered amongst their peers to be overvalued, it will have not much of an effect on the landscape. People will go to GG. Maybe buy something they didn't see elsewhere, maybe try and sell something. If they get results they are happy with, good for them. If not, they will go to eBay or elsewhere.

Attention grabbing or not, the site is only as good as its sellers and will sell itself on those merits. There's no need to get personal.

Just some insights on the auction. We are phone verifying bidders at least making sure they are real people and have registered with real information and the two highest bidders are real people using their real phone #'s and what appears to be legit addresses. The reason for the quick back and fourth bidding is that the current high bidder has a higher maximum bid and the system continued to bid on their behalf with every counter bid. This is the first time we've had anything grab this much attention so were prepared to verify bidders. It's easy to delete bids by people who register with obviously fake contact info but never really thought people would shill bid and actually use their real contact info. I guess time will tell how this will play out.

[badinsults]

I think it goes without saying that my original assumption is turning out to be true.

He probably set the reserve somewhere in the range of "too high for legit bidders" and "low enough that troll bids will get over that amount", to give it the appearance of "being sold". Lots of lazy news media have bit on such auctions in the past.

Although, I thought the reserve would be around $200,000, not something around $700,000. Regardless, if you think any of these bids are legit, you are dreaming. At the current auction bid, it puts the price at about $70 per game, which is crazy except by Neo Geo standards (and I only see 2 Neo Geo games on there). This collection could have a gold NWC and sealed Stadium Events, and it would not even be worth that much.

If you are serious about selling something at such a price, you should be forcing the buyer to put a certain amount (say 20% of the purchase price) in escrow, to show they are serious. Anyone can give out fake phone and address details.

[ProjectCamaro]

Agreed, at the price it's at it's obviously not real bidders. No one in their right mind would pay anywhere near that.

[YoshiM]

Just some insights on the auction. We are phone verifying bidders at least making sure they are real people and have registered with real information and the two highest bidders are real people using their real phone #'s and what appears to be legit addresses. The reason for the quick back and fourth bidding is that the current high bidder has a higher maximum bid and the system continued to bid on their behalf with every counter bid. This is the first time we've had anything grab this much attention so were prepared to verify bidders. It's easy to delete bids by people who register with obviously fake contact info but never really thought people would shill bid and actually use their real contact info. I guess time will tell how this will play out.

Ok....that makes sense. It looked odd but didn't know how your site worked.

Folks, nothing wrong with giving the benefit of doubt. If the bidders really want to spend that money no matter what it's really worth, that's the bidder's choice. While on a completely smaller scale, it'd be like your non-collecting buddy questioning you why you spent XXX amount of cash on Dracula X for the PC Engine when it could be purchased on the Wii for maybe $10.

Whatever it ends at, I just hope the winning bidder pays up.

[Double Ugly]

Like I said, I can't estimate the value with any confidence but I am happy for the seller if these bids are legit. I doubt anyone with a lot of knowledge of video game collecting would (have enough money) value this at $750,000 but it isn't hard to believe some rich person sees "World Record Collection For Sale" & suddenly fancies themselves owning it. I'm sure it happens with other collectibles too. Most people like to spend money & on things they don't need, wealthy people are no different.

[ProjectCamaro]

Like I said, I can't estimate the value with any confidence but I am happy for the seller if these bids are legit.

Agreed, I hope they are legit bids and that they actually will follow through with payment. I still doubt it but I hope I'm wrong and am simply being cynical.