Last edited by Tanooki; 11-04-2016 at 11:15 AM.
Thanks, it has been corrected.
Thanks, saved the pics of the map. If I ever find a copy of the game I can make some use of them.
Plenty of people liked the idea of scans being made available, some were against it completely but most were in favour of having either pictures of the map or scans of the map with watermarks on it, so it's clear enough to see and be useful but not clear enough for counterfeits to be made and sold for profit. Plenty of people offered to scan the map for others but didn't have the map themselves, and others had the map but either didn't have a scanner themselves or didn't know how to scan it as the poster was too large for them to handle. You were only called cheap because you kept insisting that someone else should make a high resolution scan of the map and post it publically because the existing scans and pictures others posted weren't good enough for you. Someone else said if you wanted it better just buy it yourself, scan it yourself, and sell it off again to get your money back instead of demanding others to scan it for you. You did end up doing this so thanks for that.
I'm not a big fan of that site, but I don't think it's fair to blame everyone there as being against you when most were more than willing to help post a scan or pictures of this in some way. I do appreciate the scans you've posted for everyone here.
Rather you not link that, it's why I kept the site name out of things not wanting to start some whiny site vs site battle as has happened with stuff before. There was more behind closed doors (PMs) not in the threads that were public. I think the article is fair, it's just that part of that story wasn't publicly shown and since I erased messages and I have no access to the account anyway even if I did, they're gone.
Yes one side was offered, and that was some help, no doubt. I'm into archiving stuff and have been for years, in good high quality format, like the cover project does with boxes and things. My plan and desire was to get a front and back of that thing in high quality as I ended up making myself done, and I just kept hitting a wall about wrecking the value, being cheap, ruining the hobby, and other weak arguments all geared around protecting an investment which I found aggravating so I made it a point to get the thing and follow through. You're right that many were willing, but either wanted it do as they didn't have it, or there was no good scanner around to do it and that's fair enough. It was the public and private stuff that went on with those who had the map and the scanner who played games and said stuff.
Also to set it straight, I hate watermarking. I put it on the level of tagging graffiti on someone else's work you have no right to claim as your own so I won't do it, not on one damn thing, and that's why the scans I have don't even have my name in teeny print in a corner.
Thanks for sharing!
Awesome scan! thanks for sharing (especially as a PDF)!
Edit: Just read this thread, and can't believe someone there actually said this: "Trust me, we do not want a better scan of this floating around. Highly-desirable, highly-collectible paper shouldn't have digital copies readily available for the morally bankrupt to reproduce and sell. If that happened to the Faria map, it would destory the market for it forever."
I hope they realize how ridiculous, selfish and pretentious they sound.
Last edited by old_skoolin_jim; 02-11-2015 at 01:26 PM.
They don't. That was one my biggest beef there was the collector arrogance that always won out. Fall in or f'off is basically how it is, and if you don't agree with that sentiment on anything with old gaming stuff, go away. Again I had my motives for finding and making that one out there for them all and that post was a huge motivator.
I'm on the verge of wishing that everything retro is counterfeited on a huge scale to crash the market into ruins.
I'm right there with you on that. If honest sharing of information without hoarding, lording over people, and waggling big dollar figures around get crushed so people can experience things like it had been for so long I'm right with you. It wasn't so strange even in 2010 to buy a game and if the other 'garbage' as someone on this site called it was there still, it was included in the cost or for a meager pittance (like $5-10) more. I miss that, it was like like in the 90s and the 00s, yet in the last 4-ish years it's cool to now go high, break everything into the component parts and charge a premium for each piece. I can't begrudge someone wanting to make a dollar, everyone does it, this isn't communism after all, but I do have a problem with crooked capitalism. It's a fool to expect you'll get anything for free anymore, but it has gone beyond the beyond so when I can throw a wrench into it if possible I do, and I know others do as well. A great person over at NA called wizard would rile up people buying VGA sealed or just normally sealed games at trade shows and then break that stuff open on the spot, on camera, at the show or once he got home. He didn't give a damn about some grubby people getting butt hurt over it, he relished in it, not just because they'd get pissed over that, but they'd get mad he'd dare actually open up his property and USE it. I know it was done with the likes of Stinger and Panic Restaurant among a few others and the reactions were amusing and interesting to say the least. I've done similar but with GBA era stuff as I just don't have the funding or will to do that with the older stuff. My next tear open will be Final Fantasy 5 Advance once I get some honest open time to really dedicate to it.
It's on the site here, Satoshi called some old NES/SNES (forget which) boxes garbage that were meant to be thrown out and that set off a few people just a little.
Counterfeits won't lower the price of originals, it'll just make them more expensive and difficult to purchase. Just look at all those grading places available now because people faked sealed games, those got started up because people wanted to avoid purchasing any fakes. Now people have to send their games off to be verified as legitimate and pay extra for the service, and graded games are selling for more than non-graded games. People are paying for them so they're selling, games that used to sell for $50-$100 new now are selling for $500 graded. It's not just the original cost of the game but the cost of mailing the items for grading, the cost of the grading services, and the return shipping now being added to the cost to the buyer(plus more for all the hassle the seller went through). Just wait until paper products and other game collectibles end up the same way, nobody will be able to afford them except the elite collectors. The issue of how trustworthy these grading services are isn't relevant to this counterfeiting issue, that's another problem.
Just think of old concert posters. There are plenty of reproductions out there, but originals are still extremely valuable for rare posters. It's just to sell them they have to be seen by an expert, certified as authentic, and sold at reputable spots like trusted auction houses or with trusted established dealers. How much do you think that all adds to the cost? It won't be the seller losing a cut, those costs are passed on to buyers. With anything rare, the seller will just be patient and wait for someone who'll buy it at a higher price. Private direct sales just don't happen anymore because it's too easy for a buyer to be screwed.
Good points and I think considering they don't post their standards and aren't consistent it is a big secondary issue that frauds like VGA can have such a ripple effect on the value of those desperate to verify their goods because they're not confident in themselves. I have no pity on people wanting original stuff. They aren't entitled to have it easy and handed to them with a fee, do some work and figure it out yourself and don't go punishing people who are less uptight for personal needs. Anything that's collectible should be able to be self verified or verified by an expert and sure that should bring a cost, I'd call it expected. But to punish those who want a facsimile like they're the anti-christ of the hobby is just childish and overly defensive/protective. Either way it's a good thing that map is out there, the feedback I got for awhile off it was proof enough to me the good it did.
Seriously, thanks so much for posting this. Finally being able to see the map in person and appreciate it's contents fills a void that I've had ever since I purchased the game in the mid 90's.
When I purchased the game from a now defunct video rental store, though it came with box and manual (still have it, pretty pristine), I have always longed to see and obtain the map. I always knew that it would be beyond my grasp to ever own one...I just wanted to at least see it in one shape or another. Same as with the Dungeons and Dragons Strategy Guide for the Sega Genesis.
I admit, I had higher expectations for the map, but that was because of my age when I purchased it (15-16). It's still a wonderful piece of collectors item to finally view and appreciate.
Again, thanks so much for the wonderful gesture in offering the map for all to see.
You are awesome.
Game Wants: http://www.digitpress.com/forum/showthread.php?t=121467
Completed US CIB Collections: Atari 7800, Neo Geo Pocket Color
This is cool, thanks Tanooki. Wish I'd been paying attention when the maps were $30, I have the game CIB otherwise.