Xenogears: Awesome, or Awesome? also questions

[Edmond Dantes]

So I just started playing Xenogears again for the first time in a decade and even if I hadn't forgotten a lot of things, I seem to be finding stuff I never noticed before.

Jumping into the well in Lahan gets you items.

Jumping into the trees on the path to Citan's place can cause stuff to happen... one tree holds a nest which you can steal an egg from, but its mom comes after you (I opted to give the egg back, I'm not sure what happens if you keep it or what use it has), another tree has a spider you can pick up (again, not sure what to do with this).

I got a Mermaid Tear in the bar, and won the RPS Badge (surprisingly without much hassle--I just trusted my sixth sense). And I have no idea what these items are for.

So then Fei Fong Shinji decides he must indeed run away and meets Lisa Hayes in the forest (how fitting that this game began with the SDF-1 being destroyed) and... okay, what is with all the Hobgobs in the forest that you can chase around? Is there any point to fighting them all? I did so and nothing seemed to come of it.

And in Dazil I somehow saw a cutscene I never saw before where Fei sees and comments on a dig site.

....

So yeah, what are the Mermaid Tear and RPS Badge for? And does anything come of the Spider and the bird's egg?

And on non-game-related-question, should I pick up the Xenosaga games? How do they stack up?

Also, I think I might pick up Xenoblade Chronicles, but the DS version apparently only works on certain models. So is the Wii version better?

Thanks in advance.

[Tanooki]

Xenoblade only works on NEW 3DS, it needs the added RAM, processing power and other improvements over the normal 3DS. The game I think had a few small refinements but it's just basically the Wii game with the different resolution of the 3DS at hand. The bonus is not being stuck tied to one TV for a very long game and using the Wii controller too if that's an issue for someone.

[eskobar]

I am currently playing Xenogears and my experience today is much different than it was almost 17 years ago when I first played it.

I am playing the game on RGB video in a Sony PVM and the detail that the developers put in almost any location is impressive. I have seen very few times that attention to detail and the script is really complex and easily has become my favorite lore on any video game.

The music could have more variety but Mitsuda made a really great work and listening the CREID album is really something apart.

I have few complaints, like the platforming sections the control feels a bit off. If you have the Xenogears Perfect Works you can jerk off your brain for a while .

[kupomogli]

This is one of the few legendary games that deserve the praise, and when I say legendary games, I'm talking about games like Vagrant Story, Legend of Dragoon, Valkyrie Profile, etc, that have their fanbases ignore any and all flaws within them that make them practically unplayable. Some of the most overrated games in the genre that have good concepts, but are fundamentally broken, making them some of the worst in the genre imo.

Xenogears only flaw imo is that the combat is a bit weak. It's like Legend of Legaia where it's combo based, but you'll do nothing but use your strongest attack each turn with the rare event of using just your weakest attack to build up points against an enemy that has a counter attackor an enemy that heals after being hit. Other than healing, magic is practically worthless except for the very very very rare enemy at the end of the game, and even then it makes no difference as you'll have elemental attacks as your final attacks. Gear combat consists of using a sinle attack combo until building up to the desired level and then using a two hit combo or

[LaughingMAN.S9]

Am I the only person in the world that thinks xenogears is overrated as fuck?

Disc 2 is basically a visual novel, 75 percent of disc 1 is generic jrpg bullshit except for the combat. I remember really disliking this game until you find out about the church and the whole conspiracy thing (it's been a while, don't remember Most of the details) and while at that point the game went from super dull to super interesting, it just wasn't enough to justify the hype.

I remember posting about this here a few years ago on another xenogears thread just as I finished the game, I don't know, maybe it would have had a bigger impact had I played it at the time of release but in my eyes, most of that game was wack

[FieryReign]

Am I the only person in the world that thinks xenogears is overrated as fuck?

No. It's boring and convoluted. If you like WATCHING your videogames, it may be good for you.

[PizzaKat]

That game has been in my PS1 for the last 2 plus years. It just hasn't been exciting for me to go back. But I do gotta finish it. It isn't bad but it hasn't blown me away.

[eskobar]

Am I the only person in the world that thinks xenogears is overrated as fuck?

Disc 2 is basically a visual novel, 75 percent of disc 1 is generic jrpg bullshit except for the combat. I remember really disliking this game until you find out about the church and the whole conspiracy thing (it's been a while, don't remember Most of the details) and while at that point the game went from super dull to super interesting, it just wasn't enough to justify the hype.

I remember posting about this here a few years ago on another xenogears thread just as I finished the game, I don't know, maybe it would have had a bigger impact had I played it at the time of release but in my eyes, most of that game was wack

I think it's just a matter of how you appreciate a video game. Your personal taste is inclined to other details that are more important for you.

For me and very few persons this is considered the best RPG ... not the just the best PS1 RPG but the best overall. There are better games for PS1 on another genres, for example, Castlevania SotN is the best PS1 for me.

When you say "j-rpg bullshit" is redundant because being a japanese RPG you can expect that kind of "bullshit".

The game is not boring at all if you get it, of course is not for everyone, like FF7 that was created for a mainstream audience and its a great RPG but very simple.

[Edmond Dantes]

Yeah honestly even my own feelings on Xenogears flip-flopped. As a teen I was absolutely amazed at it, but at the time I cared more about story than anything else. Then later on in my life when gameplay became my priority and I liked 8-Bit RPGs more, I pretty much agreed with Kupomogli that it was more like a visual novel than a game.

Right now though, I'm actually having little patience for games, but I wanted a story that's remniscient of Evangelion (which I just finished re-watching) but didn't want to wait a week for Serial Experiments Lain to arrive from Amazon, and the closest thing I had happened to be this PS1 game... and in that mindset, its perfect... kind of. I hate the platforming, especially since LOADING A BATTLE CAN INTERRUPT THE JUMP COMMAND causing you to miss jumps you otherwise would have made through no fault of your own. That's just shit. I also absolutely hate how you learn Deathblows as it essentially becomes another thing you have to grind. If only those two things were fixed, that would be awesome.

And I suppose nobody knows the answers to the questions I posed in the OP?

[FoxNtd]

I wanted to see a few posts here before adding one myself. Damn I'm definitely surprised to see all this that's for sure.

I never knew what Xenogears was really until just a few years ago. I got a copy for a cent wondering why nobody had any interest to bid on it. It was definitely an interesting experience. It was enjoyable to play, it felt quite different though it's hard to say why. My friend told me Square reassigned resources internally to focus more heavily on developing FF8 despite Xenogears being unfinished, and as an end result Disc 2 is butchered using those "visual novel" segments to fill in what should have been entirely new material to be actually played. Never did research on it but given how Disc 2 played out, sure seems like quite the plausible explanation. One thing is for sure, I've never played an RPG with more complex and hard to understand Japanese than Xenogears. I'd venture to say even native readers would find a handful of dialog in that game obscure.

Seeing the combat described in a poor light is understandable. I never thought of it that way though I had a sense for how the combat system can be considered a little weak. I think the combat concepts in the Xenosaga games made better use of the button options to select the combination of manuevers you would perform.

Would have been nice to experience Disc 2 to the fullest extent as originally intended by the designers. One thing I did like about Xenogears was it never felt childish. A lot of RPGs can sometimes feel childish with their sense of humour or character behaviours, but not Xenogears really unless I'm not recalling things well.

[vultar]

I love Xenogears, but I've had a hard time finishing it after my first play through because of how the second disk is handled. Since nobody else has answered, the badges (RPS, Hide and Seek, and the one from Billy's orphanage (i think), get you a treasure in Shevat. I don't remember what that is though. I believe the Tear is traded for a stat boosting item late game (but i'm not 100% sure on that).

I'll admit that maybe my feelings toward Xenogears makes me pretty harsh to the other Xeno games, but anyway, as far as the other Xeno games go...

Personally I hate the Xenosaga games (I've only played part of the 1st one however). I want to like it, and maybe the story gets better, but there are so many weird presentation things that just ruins the game for me. The character models are ugly. The women in particular look like plastic anime fetish dolls. The voice acting is really sub par (one of Jr's bimbos keeps dropping her accent if I'm remembering correctly). There's long stretches of no sound except for Shion stomping around. All I really remember about the game is delivering curry to the other characters, Jr's harem, and waiting for story the opening promised to actually start. Overall, I have this feeling of something trying to be Xenogears and failing.

Xenoblade Chronicles is a decent game. If you like JRPGs and wandering around and looking at pretty stuff, you'll probably like it. The cast is likable and the setting is different. They did stuff to remove traditional RPG tedium (fast travel, telling you when an item is needed, etc). My main gripe with it is that it doesn't have enough story to support it's length. Without being too spoilery, Blade and Gears sort of share story plot points (they aren't related, but there are strong similarities), but where Gears was a novel, Blade is Cliff Notes. I don't know what, if any, the differences are between the Wii and N3DS versions.

Finally, I also hate Chronicles X. X takes everything the Chronicles did to improve the genre threw it out and added more bull time wasters. It also, as far as I've seen, has less story than your average Mario title. What dialogue it does have is weirdly written and presented as the other characters don't act like your character is in the room most of the time. There are technical issues with the game as well (terrible sound mix, no sound controls, and ittty bitty font sizes). The only thing it has going is that the environment is pretty. If what you liked about Chronicles was the scenery and it's billions of fetch quests, Chronicles X is probably your thing.

[kainemaxwell]

So then Fei Fong Shinji decides he must indeed run away and meets Lisa Hayes in the forest (how fitting that this game began with the SDF-1 being destroyed) and... okay, what is with all the Hobgobs in the forest that you can chase around? Is there any point to fighting them all? I did so and nothing seemed to come of it.

Yeah then your airship becomes the SDF-1 and you get a couple giant mecha fights in disc 2. XD

[celerystalker]

Xenogears rules. I know a few of these answers.

The bird's egg can be cooked for you by Yui if you keep it.

The badges can be traded to Chu Chu for Power Ring S and Chargers.

The Mermaid's Tear can be made into the Mermaid Ring in the Snowfield Hideout.

Xenosaga does not feel like Xenogears at all.

I also loved Bart and the Yggdrasill, which is loosely translated as "Odin's Horse" from the myth where he hanged himself in order to learn runes on the world tree Yggdrasill. Then Bart is missing one eye like Odin, and Yggdrasill is his means of transport... not a big deal, but a fun interpretation of Norse mythology in the game that makes a little sense and isn't just using the names to sound cool.

[kainemaxwell]

I also loved Bart and the Yggdrasill, which is loosely translated as "Odin's Horse" from the myth where he hanged himself in order to learn runes on the world tree Yggdrasill. Then Bart is missing one eye like Odin, and Yggdrasill is his means of transport... not a big deal, but a fun interpretation of Norse mythology in the game that makes a little sense and isn't just using the names to sound cool.

and bart's brother had a eyepatch over the opposite eye too.

[Edmond Dantes]

Hey, something I've been wondering for awhile...

What exactly does "output" do? Like right now Rico has an engine that has 13 output but 1700 fuel, and I'm not sure if that's better or worse than an engine that has 12 output 2000 fuel.

My best guess is it has something to do with how much fuel you get back when you use the "charge" command, but any confirmation?

Also do you necessarily NEED to equip Extra Armor/Light Armor/whatever for your gear to improve defense? It seems like the game often forces you to choose between defense and having a relic-light item.

[fahlim003]

Xenogears was an interesting game. Unfortunately, the ambitions of the development team were too much and the game suffers from the disjointed nature as a result of disc 2. First you're reading for 30 minutes then back into a battle and a couple rooms for 15 minutes, rinse and repeat for 6 hours. I quite enjoyed disc 1 and overall it has some of the best Yasunori Mitsuda composed music outside of Chrono Trigger but disc 2 killed it for me.

[Edmond Dantes]

Well, I think I ran into a genuine translation error... okay, there are many obvious ones, but this one actually affected the gameplay: At one point, Gear shops start selling engines labeled "V15-2000" and "V18-2000"... indicating indicating 15/18 "Output" (I still have no idea what that is or what it affects) and 2000 units of fuel, which seemed stupid as my current engines already had a max of 2000 fuel.

But I took a chance and bought one of each anyway, equipping Elly with the V15 and Citan with the V18.

.... And then I noticed that Citan actually had 2500 max fuel and Elly had 3000....

So clearly, these were accidentally mis-labeled in the translation (or, to be fair, maybe they were mislabeld in the original Japanese too?) I still don't know what "Output" does, but its good to know that these actually do give you more fuel capacity.

.... on the note about music, I remember playing this way back when and honestly thinking "this feels like it should be the sequel to Chrono Trigger" because of the music and some things about the aesthetics, but mostly the music. I swear there was one piece of music that actually used parts of Chrono Trigger's music (I forget which scene exactly, but it was in the space after Fei and Elly stop the Hecht but before they go to the Ethos headquarters, IE somewhere around the Thames segment).

Yeah.... I'd rather Xenogears be the sequel to Chrono Trigger rather than that blasphemy that was pegged as an official sequel.

[BlastProcessing402]

I also loved Bart and the Yggdrasill, which is loosely translated as "Odin's Horse" from the myth where he hanged himself in order to learn runes on the world tree Yggdrasill. Then Bart is missing one eye like Odin, and Yggdrasill is his means of transport... not a big deal, but a fun interpretation of Norse mythology in the game that makes a little sense and isn't just using the names to sound cool.

Weird, I was all like Odin's horse was Sleipnir, but thanks to your comment I google some stuff and apparently that is the transliteration of Yggdrasil. A tree for a a horse? You crazy norsemen.