Does your "ideal" game exist?

[calthaer]

So recently I started playing on Project 1999's "classic" EverQuest server. I realized how much fun that game was, and yet how flawed it was, too. This got me to thinking: what's my ideal game? Or, what are some elements of games that you consider to be "ideal?" I wanted to come on here and ask the DPers the same question. Most of us have played a lot of the games throughout the 30-40-year history of the medium, and I figured you'd have the best thoughts on...

• Interface: WASD+mouse, controller, holographic glasses, Wii "wand," etc.
• Perspective: Isometric, 2D (top-down or side-scrolling), 3D (first- or third-person), or it doesn't matter?
• Length: 10 hours, 25 hours, 40 hours, 100 hours...?
• Replayability: does it matter that you might have a different experience every time?
• Story: does it have to be there; does it have to be good?
• "RPG": this is applied these days to anything where your character(s) improve(s) over time.
• Options / play-styles: this could be different character "classes", or different weapons, or different equipment, or whatever
• Maybe other things I haven't thought about

I've been realizing that I really enjoy a game that takes 10-20 hours, full of content (maybe story, maybe not), big bonus if it's procedurally generated and different every time, agnostic on inputs and perspective. I was looking last night for a real RPG - EverQuest had me hankering for something where you could choose a party with a bard, warrior, cleric, etc. - but most of the "RPG" games on Steam were nothing like that at all; they've stuck that tag on almost everything.

What's your "ideal game"? Or, if you have a few types of ideals, what are some of them - and your favorite features in a particular genre?

[Emperor Megas]

This is a really good question. I'm sitting on a plane now though, so I can't answer it at the moment, but I'm interested in reading what others have to offer.

[celerystalker]

It's a provocative thought. I definitively have a favorite game, Earthbound on SNES. I have a greater attachment to that game than any other, and have had for over 20 years. That said, I only play through it about once a year or so during a week of vacation, and mechanically, I play and enjoy far more action games than JRPGs. I think I might be able to identify a few styles of game, control, and length that are ideal for me, but I don't know that one style suits me best... I'll keep thinking on it, but I prize variety and uniqueness in gaming, and don't want to always repeat a particular experience. Great question, though.

[kupomogli]

I'm going to say yes, and not because my ideal game has to be a specific genre of game, but because there are a few games that have released that imo would fit. The game's that would fit most would be Brigandine Legend of Forsena or its remake Brigandine Grand Edition.

With storyline, while I like games with a lot of storyline, the ideal amount would be little to no story, depending on the gen. If it's an RPG, something like many games on the PSX and prior, along the lines of Final Fantasy 4. There's enough story there to do a great job pushing the point across, but not too much storyline that will make repeated playthroughs without a substantial amount of time in between burn me out on the game. Brigandine has a similar amount of storyline and it does a great job of pushing it across.

Replay value is definitely something key. I enjoy platformers, strategy games, and action games a lot because of the replay value. Brigandine has a take over the area/world style gameplay where you start with one of six kingdoms and the goal of the game is to unify the continent. The original Brigandine may or may not have been an unfinished game as the final boss of the remake is included in the storyline, but isn't in the game. His class and data is on the disc, but there's no battle/s. Without a final boss though, it really takes away nothing from the game, just makes it different. It's like playing a game of Risk, Romance of the Three Kingdoms, etc.

I'm pretty picky about balance on video games regardless of genres. As for RPGs, there are many developers that have been able to make a difficult RPG without excessive grinding, so excessive grinding is honestly a mark off imo. Brigandine just so happens to be the most balanced RPG I've ever played. The gameplay with Brigandine has your characters with different rune knights, which is a term in the game any character that has rune power and can control monsters. More powerful monsters will take more rune power, so a dragon who takes 75 rune power is more powerful than a lizard knight and has acid breath, but the lizard knight only costs 30 rune power(I'll explain this below.) Your characters rune area is how many hexes away the monsters can be in around their leader without taking a significant loss in statistics and the greater the chance that that monster is captured when their leader is killed. Now in this game, the max level is 30, and every five levels in a class, rune knight will master a class, while level 10 and 20, the rune knight and monsters can class up to a different tier of classes. There's cross classing available with rune knights though, as only each type class type is locked out when you level to a new class, so with magic using rune knights, you can level five levels with the class and master the clerical class to keep the spells and the same with the mage class to keep those spells, and then rank up to both one of the next clerical classes and one of the next mage classes, but only one each as the others are locked out. Monsters can't cross class, but some can level up to one of two monster paths. Additionally, while the max level is 30, just because it's a level 30 enemy versus a level 1 character doesn't mean that the character will be ohko'd. Higher level characters much more powerful, but you start the game with several lower level characters and several higher level characters, and any monster that dies is gone permanently. Character stats start in the hundreds and levels increase all stats but HP between one and five points depending on the class, with class upgrades increase attack(or int) and defense by the amount of a few levels(will also go in detail about levels below.)

Characters and monsters are tied to elements depending on their class, opposite elements damage more, so red and blue would damage each other more while white and black would damage each other more. Green has no weakness and nothing is weak against it. If damaged by the same element damage is reduced. The damage calculation is based on how many elemental orbs the attacker has for the opposite element or how many orbs the defender has for the same element. Being attacked by the same element, damage will be reduced by 25% for one, 33% for two, and 44% for three, while when attacking, damage dealt additional will be 25% for one, 33% for two, and 41% for three. If the attacker and defender have one of the same and one of the opposite, it'll result in a normal attack.

The game is an RPG so getting levels does make a difference, but even with that the game is still really well balanced. A level one lizard man for instance has 200 attack power and 125 defense, while at level 30, the same lizard man upgraded to a lizard guard will have around 288 attack and 143 defense. The amount of damage dealt is attack minus defense, so for a level one lizard man who has 450 HP, with 25% damage resistance since both are blue, a level one lizard man would have to attack the lizard man eight times to kill it, while a level 30 lizard guard would have to attack that lizard man five times to kill it. So there's a difference but it's still well balanced. Another example. Monsters like the lizard man might not be as good as a dragon on the same level, but a dragon costs 75 rune power while the lizard man only costs 30, 45 for a lizard guard once they reach level 10. A level one dragon has 640 HP, 240 attack, and 113 defense. With the lizard man and dragon attacking, the dragon would kill the lizard man in a one on one fight. With 25% extra damage, the dragon would kill the lizard man in four hits, while the lizard man would kill the dragon in six hits. The dragon also gets acid breath which uses MP and deals physical damage, but like I said above, for as good as a level one character the dragon is, it costs 75 rune power and costs a decent amount of mana to purchase(your resource in this game.) The same level one dragon in the above example would actually be going toe to toe with a level 10 lizard guard that only costs 45 rune power. With the lizard guard having 540 HP, 228 attack, and 133 defense the dragon would still be just a bit better. Lizard men do level up faster though so it's easier to get a higher level lizard guard. Both characters would take five hits to kill each other and take around the same damage. While I used an equation for damage, the fifth hit from the dragon is only .03% of the damage dealt to kill off the lizard guard, so if not the dragon, anyhthing else, even being touched by a feather could kill the lizard guard The lizard guard's last hit would have been .13% of the damage to kill the dragon, so really anything else, although maybe not a feather, would have been able to kill the dragon. At level 10 though the lizard guard gains poison breath, so they become more effective than they were as a lizard man in that aspect as well.

As for Brigandine Grand Edition, the remake of Brigandine Legend of Forsena, the way elements are handled make the game play completely different despite looking and playing like the same game for the most part. The elements now work in a rotation, sort of like Fire Emblem and Vandal Hearts. The black and white elements as well as defending against the same element still follow the same structure of Brigandine Legend of Forsena where opposite does more damage and the same element does less. The damage modifier though is now changed where red deals more damage to green, green deals more to blue, and blue deals more to red, and I don't think there's a defense bonus when the weaker element deals damage towards the stronger element. There are other changes in Grand Edition like the changes of spells, the Samurai's Iai Slash is a weaker missable long range attack instead of a more powerful spell, paladin's have a passive ability to parry some of the damage, Dinadin now has a special class instead of paladin, the lizard guard can now be upgraded to lizard king and can attack twice per turn, and power gets nerfed from increasing double the attack power to only adding an extra 50 power(they should have just made it not work with breaths.)

Both Brigandine and Brigandine Grand Edition. I can play and enjoy a new game at anytime, even if coming from just finishing the game. I think because of all this then I'd consider this my ideal game. I've recorded a playthrough of New Almekia that I've posted on Youtube, the longest part is three hours. I was recording a Norgard playthrough as well, but the recording crashed halfway into the game so I just recorded the last city I had to take over. Upload date was only three days after my New Almekaia Playthrough.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=27mGpGG3NmI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W1MiDVvX4Lg

[celerystalker]

Brigandine is pretty great. It's my sister's favorite game. Definitely an awesome one.