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Thread: The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly.

  1. #21
    Crono (Level 14) Kroogah's Avatar
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    il buono: THE PEOPLE! The vendors! The sheer amount of video game stuff I've never seen before! The party! The everything!

    il brutto: The fact I didn't bring enough money along to buy everything there! And I forgot my Bear Hugger balloon.

    il cativo: No Samurai Shodown 2 set up on Sunday. Boooooo.


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    Quote Originally Posted by gavv
    Don Daglow and Matt Hubbard no-shows
    Matt Hubbard was definitely there... I spoke to him Saturday morning within the main area.

    Okay as for my list...

    GOOD

    Even more people speaking
    Todd Frye doing a sneaky and appearing without being on the alumni list
    Gradius V on freeplay!
    Meeting all you lovely people once more
    The DP Party
    Having PapaStu guide a bunch of us to Santa Cruz Friday night and hang out on the Boardwalk with lots of retro arcade games and watching several of the women go for a paddle (did you piss yourself Jamie? :P )

    BAD

    Tom Sloper and David Levine pulling out
    The coin-ops selection being not that very good
    Vendor prices lacking in many bargains

    UGLY

    Me after the DP Party (nuff said, bloody Centipede piss!)

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    The comments regarding the sad coin-op situation (legit) are especially frustrating considering the money and effort put into it.

    Scott did a super human job transporting a tuckload of purchased games from Wisconsin, stopping in Vegas, only to discover too late that they were in sad shape. Vegas based operator Tim Arnold usually provided the arcade games but could not be expected to make such a trip. With California extreme 2 weeks prior it was difficult to get other people to lug their games down.

    I'm certain things will be better next year, this was the one area that took a serious negative "hit" in the move to SJ.

    JJ

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    Quote Originally Posted by jjessop
    Scott did a super human job transporting a tuckload of purchased games from Wisconsin, stopping in Vegas, only to discover too late that they were in sad shape.
    Agreed! (And methinks Scott is way beyond super-human. He's super-DUPER-human!)

    Kudos and a hearty "THANK YOU" to Scott, Jerry, Larry, Danny and all the rest who were able to get those games to the show. You guys ROCK.

    Game ON!
    Selling collection, Atari through XBox. Send a PM with whatever games you're looking for.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jibbajaba

    Pretty much everything you just said is exactly how I feel. I use the Acclaim wireless controller for my nes, because it has the exact same feel as a first party controller, except that it is thicker to accomodate the batteries. I didn't like messiah's D-pads, and picking them up I just thought that they had a cheap feel to them. I am definitely looking forward to seeing thier wireless Atari controller, since the standard atari joystick has such a short cord, but I dont have my hopes up. Didn't someone make a wireless Atari joystick already, anyway?

    Chris
    The problem with the IR based wireless pads is not just directionality, but also range and reliability and speed of the data transmission. IR can have lag, input loss, as well as crappy effective range. Line of sight is also a big minus for those that like to recline back when we play.

    As far as I know, Nintendo has patents on their controller shape, especially the D-Pad. However, the Atari devices most likely have no restrictions, so you could make something that is exactly like an Atari joystick or Atari paddle, but 2.4Ghz wireless. The joystick should have plenty of room to fit batteries and such without changing the size. Of course it will be slightly heavier.

    I would love to see a wireless lightgun for the NES. Duckhunt and Hogan's Alley are great, but the cord destroys the feel.

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    Bell (Level 8) 98PaceCar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jjessop
    The comments regarding the sad coin-op situation (legit) are especially frustrating considering the money and effort put into it.
    I'm definately not trying to slam the guys that brought the machines. As I mentioned before, I know how hard it is to move games, let alone move them in such a way that they stay working and I applaud the effort they made. I just can't remember seeing anybody in the back of any of the games, other than the Computer Space. I'm sure a couple of those could have been made working with a little bit of effort and maybe having some common parts (power supplies and what not).

    How about this.. Next year, I will volunteer my services to work on the coin ops and help keep them running. I would have been willing to do it this year, but not having permission to be in the backs of games that aren't mine kept me from even considering it. If I know up front, I can even bring the necessary tools (provided TSA doesn't throw a fit about them!! )

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    kuduos to the guys who brought the arcade machines. I won't even began to complain about them. I mean com'n guys, free play on all the arcade games. The show was well worth my 35 weekend pass. Can't wait until next year.

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    Just a quick thanks for a well-done convention. I knew that I would enjoy most everything, but three things specifically surprised me. 1) The museum was fantastic. One could spend hours on there. I just hope in the future there is a videocamera or something to prevent theft. 2) The speeches were outstanding. All that I went to were interesting and the q + a times went to the time limit with questions still being asked. The panels seemed to enjoy interacting with the audience. 3) The auction - the only thing better than the auction antics was knowing that a lot of money was being raised for a greart cause (Special Olympics). I could have watched another two hours of the auction. The coin-ops were a slight negative in that many of the ones that were working you had to know how to flip free play or next coin and many are apprehensive about sticking their hand into a plugged in arcade machine for safety reasons and/or they don't want to mess up someone's classic machine. However, this issue has been addressed and should not take away from a thumb's up job. Again - thank you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 98PaceCar
    Quote Originally Posted by jjessop
    The comments regarding the sad coin-op situation (legit) are especially frustrating considering the money and effort put into it.
    I'm definately not trying to slam the guys that brought the machines. As I mentioned before, I know how hard it is to move games, let alone move them in such a way that they stay working and I applaud the effort they made. I just can't remember seeing anybody in the back of any of the games, other than the Computer Space. I'm sure a couple of those could have been made working with a little bit of effort and maybe having some common parts (power supplies and what not).

    How about this.. Next year, I will volunteer my services to work on the coin ops and help keep them running. I would have been willing to do it this year, but not having permission to be in the backs of games that aren't mine kept me from even considering it. If I know up front, I can even bring the necessary tools (provided TSA doesn't throw a fit about them!! )
    Well I can shed some light on the arcades. There were 5 that were bought with some problems, but the price was right so they were bought. (Cosmetically the machines were beautiful) Another factor into this was set up time. Normally for CGE there is 2 days for setup, but this year it was one. (The cost to rent the room for an additional day was astronomical) This really cut into the time anyone could devote to the machines, but there was still a very nice selection of machines working for the event. With any luck, all will be in full force for CGE2K5. Knowing John, Joe and Sean you can bet next year the arcade will be even bigger and better.

    Danny

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    Although the arcade was lacking it was still a god job. I don't know if anyone noticed but by the end of sunday alot of the machines were becoming broken. Dont know if people were to rough with the insides or it was little kids but I feel bad for the people who lent them out and got non-working ones back.
    Somebody make me a "CGE 2k7 Attendee banner" so I don't have to use this lame text

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    Quote Originally Posted by jjessop
    The comments regarding the sad coin-op situation (legit) are especially frustrating considering the money and effort put into it.

    Scott did a super human job transporting a tuckload of purchased games from Wisconsin, stopping in Vegas, only to discover too late that they were in sad shape. Vegas based operator Tim Arnold usually provided the arcade games but could not be expected to make such a trip. With California extreme 2 weeks prior it was difficult to get other people to lug their games down.

    I'm certain things will be better next year, this was the one area that took a serious negative "hit" in the move to SJ.

    JJ
    When I found out from Joe and John what superhuman lengths were taken to acquire and provide games for the arcade this year, given the normal LV people ditched on driving out to provide them, I was hella impressed. So honestly I give a THUMBS UP for having so many working games to begin with! The only one I was bummed to not play was Q*Bert's Qubes. Forget free plays, I would have happily PAID and plunked dollars worth of quarters in that baby! Was still great to see one complete in cab even if it wasn't turned on. I very much enjoyed the ones that were working and I think that having so many tables set up on the opposite side of the room with consoles on big TV's to play also helped make up for the smaller arcade.

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    Great Puma (Level 12) slapdash's Avatar
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    Short list since it's past my bedtime (still exhausted from the weekend)...

    Good
    - meeting (or seeing again) lots of people I knew from the forums or prior to that
    - catching most of the panels this time

    Bad
    - the music could be heard in the room where the alumni were talking; maybe in the future there should just be a party room, WITH the bands there, after hours?
    - less arcade games than the past (though as others have pointed out, understandable); I also wasn't sure if they were free, but I was too busy running around to try to find the credit switch on that Stratovox anyway...

    Ugly
    - the false fire alarm going off just as Jerry Lawson (who recently lost a leg to diabetes) got up on the podium/stage for his talk
    Russ Perry Jr, 2175 S Tonne Dr #114, Arlington Hts IL 60005
    Got any obscure game stuff?

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    Cherry (Level 1) TNTPLUST's Avatar
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    A few notes to clear things up. I'm the one who started this thread and thus I'm the one who named it. Of course almost everyone over 30 understands my title but it is possible that younger people might not. It is a reference of course to a Clint Eastwood movie (of the same name) where at the end the three main characters are lableled and judged. The thread is intended as constructive criticism. I'm a k-8 teacher...trust me I know criticism...it is meant to help improve not to blame or hurt. It's intent was not to say that someone did not work hard, or that next year someone should not attend, but to simply give an impression on what can be improved. That being said I feel I've been somewhat slammed for giving a honest criticism. Could be wrong that is the difficulty with typed formats so much is lost in translation.

    most of this is covered in the first post...but..since at least some of my stuff has been taken out of context I want to clear it up.

    Soooo...for the record I gave 2k4 an excellent rating...quite enjoyed it

    While I now understand the reasons for the problems on the Free Arcade that does not alter my observation of said arcade. It wasn't as good as in years past. It was a let down for me. Being respectful of others opinions My wife and 6 year daughter spent most of the day over there and had problems with starting them. There was a lot of confusion from attendees that did not know how to start machines. Maybe next time a dedicated volunteer attendant could be available? I saw many Attendees doing what they could for other attendees to get games running or help others start games. But overall I witnessed some confusion.

    As for Demolition Derby...That was a joke...levity...a way to make a criticism seem less harsh. Seems it backfired on me. The games selected were a nice cross section on the history of games. More is better though! Who here does can not say they want more games, more speakers, more vendors, more blah blah! Human nature I guess.

    Other topics are being brought up of course too Vendors, Sound Issues, Security, Convention Location, Swap Meet, etc, etc. I implore that CGE and Digital Press staff listen too them with consideration and understanding and not get too defensive. Something I learned when I worked retail was that when a customer complains that means THEY CARE. When they just walk away and say nothing is when you have a REAL problem.

    This is my third year and I think the show has gotten better every year. Good job! I hope to attend more. Take these comments with a grain of salt and make this motha' the biggest con on the planet
    Aha! Now we see the violence inherent in the system!

  14. #34
    classicus carnivorous
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    Quote Originally Posted by TNTPLUST
    Other topics are being brought up of course too Vendors, Sound Issues, Security, Convention Location, Swap Meet, etc, etc. I implore that CGE and Digital Press staff listen too them with consideration and understanding and not get too defensive. Something I learned when I worked retail was that when a customer complains that means THEY CARE. When they just walk away and say nothing is when you have a REAL problem.
    While I have not had time to review this thread (or the various other CGE-related threads) just yet, trust that I plan to go through each one with a fine-tooth (digital) comb.

    Your feedback IS appreciated. Good, bad, ugly.... these things are all VERY important to us and anyone who has run a successful show for this many years could not proceed without taking it all in and making adjustments.

    And if you know *US* then you know that we know that we can take the criticism. If other attendees or forum members are giving you trouble for your views, realize that the organizers are not - and that we're thankful that you'd step forward and give your honest opinion. Without them, we would not be able to grow or improve in 2005.

    Thanks again! My own personal report card on the show (I *am* CGE's greatest critic) is forthcoming.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TNTPLUST

    While I now understand the reasons for the problems on the Free Arcade that does not alter my observation of said arcade. It wasn't as good as in years past. It was a let down for me. Being respectful of others opinions My wife and 6 year daughter spent most of the day over there and had problems with starting them. There was a lot of confusion from attendees that did not know how to start machines. Maybe next time a dedicated volunteer attendant could be available? I saw many Attendees doing what they could for other attendees to get games running or help others start games. But overall I witnessed some confusion.
    that's exactly what i meant in my disappointment in the arcade. (ie it just wasn't up to where i had seen it 2 yrs ago) My biggest regret because of that however is my talking a couple local friends of mine out of going to CA Extreme because of what i felt would have been a better arcade to go along with everything else (and they being the unemployed student types couldn't really afford to attend both). For some reason, i had figured that bigger sources of classic cabs would have been more plentiful in silicon valley/norcal than would be in Vegas...

    gavv

    where were the Daphne/LD games peeps based out of?

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    Quote Originally Posted by slapdash

    Bad
    - the music could be heard in the room where the alumni were talking; maybe in the future there should just be a party room, WITH the bands there, after hours?
    I will say though that it was much MUCH MUCH better than the same was at the Plaza....It was painful how many times on every panel when the panelists literally had to stop for a minute everytime john or walter made an announcement on the p.a. in the dealer's room in that complex.

    gavv

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    The Good:

    Meeting almost EVERYONE! Hell, I even ran into a friend from college I hadn't seen in years that happened to have a booth! Everyone was so nice!

    The Swap room - some GREAT stuff, very fun!

    Konami + Gradius V = I can die happy now!

    The MUSEUM!



    The Bad:

    The painful prices on some of the vendor stuff. $75 for loose Coleco handhelds? NUTSO prices on NES stuff....some of the dealers were spendy as hell.

    8-Bit Weapon was distractingly loud. Wasn't so pleased about that.




    The Ugly:

    Someone yanking the fire alarm in the middle of a great conversation with the Konami people! Booooooooooo!

    Only one cosplayer! I was hoping for more *sniff*
    scooterb: "I once shot a man in Catan, just to watch him die."

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    As far as I know, Nintendo has patents on their controller shape, especially the D-Pad. However, the Atari devices most likely have no restrictions, so you could make something that is exactly like an Atari joystick or Atari paddle, but 2.4Ghz wireless. The joystick should have plenty of room to fit batteries and such without changing the size. Of course it will be slightly heavier.
    Jagasian you are correct. Nintendo does have many patents in place around their product, and the D-pad is the big one. That is why every company has had a different D-pad style. SMS, Genesis, Saturn, PlayStation, Xbox... they all have a slightly different design because of this.

    The idea behind our D-pad was an arcade cabinet. The D-pad in the Wireless controllers is actually a miniature arcade stick with a rotating thumb pad instead of a stick. Like people have said, it does take a little getting used to, but I think most people who tried it liked it after playing with. The other thing to remember is that the D-pad on the controllers we showed at CGE still had lots of mechanical issues to fix so it was only about 70% correct. So those of you who thought it was good... it is only going to get better

    Also I am sure some of you noticed that the buttons felt a little different. This also because they are miniaturized version of what is in an arcade cabinet. The buttons don't use a rubber key under the button but a micro switch and spring... this makes them much faster and more sensitive. This is another fix we are working on because we felt that the key force was too strong and that the buttons should be a little easier to press.

    Anyway, I would be more than happy to answer any questions you have about the product. You can reach me at contactus@playmessiah.com

    The idea about the light guns is great. If anyone else things this is good, please let us know... IF we moved forward we would probably try to make the gun universal so that it would work with SNES as well....

    If anyone is interested about Messiah's 2.4 GHz Wireless Controllers, you can check out this forum... http://www.digitpress.com/forum/view...=400045#400045 or our web site www.playmessiah.com

    2.4 GHz Wireless NES Controller
    2.4 GHz Wireless SNES Controller


    Don't forget to checkout www.playmessiah.com

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    Quote Originally Posted by superstonic
    Quote Originally Posted by gavv
    that's exactly what i meant in my disappointment in the arcade. (ie it just wasn't up to where i had seen it 2 yrs ago) My biggest regret because of that however is my talking a couple local friends of mine out of going to CA Extreme because of what i felt would have been a better arcade to go along with everything else (and they being the unemployed student types couldn't really afford to attend both).
    Honestly, there's *no way* the arcade selection will compare to CA Extreme (they have hundreds of games!), now or ever. Not unless the shows can combine forces.
    i wasn't meant to compare this year to CA Extreme per se, just based on my 2 yr old recollection of how the arcade was, at that previous level i thought it would have been enough to be worth it, with everything else included.

    gavv

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    Quote Originally Posted by gavv
    i wasn't meant to compare this year to CA Extreme per se, just based on my 2 yr old recollection of how the arcade was, at that previous level i thought it would have been enough to be worth it, with everything else included.

    gavv
    Fear not, gavv. We'll have the arcade bigger than ever next year. The logistics of getting everything running in San Jose as well as running an E3 exhibit (which actually had MORE arcade games than we could pull together for CGE) was a one-year anomaly. Believe me, we all went into the show this year knowing that was our one weakness on the floor. Now it's going to be our primary focal point.

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