Groundbreaking 16-bit titles

[Arkaign]

Some cool games mentioned here .. omg I can't believe someone mentioned Military Madness .. I just replayed that the other day, truly a fun turn-based-strategy game for a console!

[Blanka789]

Both of the Lunar games for the Sega CD featured great music, gameplay, and movies. Oh, and who can forget Donkey Kong Country?

[tritium]

Revolutionary? Sonic & Knuckles.

Its an upgrade and a game all in one!

De-evolutionary? 32x.

I do have to say the one game that made me go WOW in the 16-bit era that wasn't an upgraded genre from another time prior (platformer, run&gun, etc). Sim Ant.

Yes I'm an odd person, I know....

[Ed Oscuro]

Altered Beast had voices, and it was the first Genesis game. Did the T-16 have a game with voices before that one?

I know an old, old Sunsoft RPG from '85 had NES-voice in it (sorta sounded like a Japanese guy yelling, rather incredible to hear it coming from the NES - I think they "composed" it, as it's not recorded sound)...

[Arkaign]

I agree about the post on SF2 to SNES ports. They were really solid, amazingly complete for an arcade game that was still red-hot .. I imported the Super Famicom version and was initially confused when I saw Balrog and M. Bison's names switched

[Apossum]

Definitely SF2. that game was a freaking religion in my town. the Snes version made it even more popular and paved the way for a ton of knock offs. Kids in my grade were ditching school just to play it, which was a big deal at 11 years old.

and from the "depending on the way you look at it" dept.:

MK2 (snes)-- first Nintendo game to contain excessive amounts of gore and violence. that was kind of a big deal at the time.

MK1 (Genesis)-- made a huge splash in the media, made it okay for games to be extremely violent, thanks to the rating system.

[zerohero]

Super Metriod

Contra III

SF2/turbo

Lttp

[XxMe2NiKxX]

Sonic the Hedgehog. Provided a mascot that was actually cool (ie not an ugly midget named Alex or an overweight plumber), and reinvented the platforming genre by injecting a lot of speed into it, not to mention the fact that it looks goregous.

[segarocks30]

Streets of Rage 2. This game defined the genre of Beat Em Ups. Yuzo Koshiro made one of the best soundtracks ever for this game. Now forget all the Final Fantasies, this game is groundbreaking, and to me, it has aged well.

[Graham Mitchell]

Streets of Rage 2. This game defined the genre of Beat Em Ups. Yuzo Koshiro made one of the best soundtracks ever for this game. Now forget all the Final Fantasies, this game is groundbreaking, and to me, it has aged well.

I played through SOR2 on Friday night, and I agree that the soundtrack is absolutely incredible, and it has aged very well. It's always been one of my favorite Genesis games.

However, I feel that the groundbreaking beat-em-up from the 16-bit era is probably Final Fight, which was released a few years before SOR2. In fact, SOR1 was sort of Sega's answer to Final Fight. The reason I felt it was groundbreaking is that it reduced all the attacks down to one button, essentially. You could just mash the one button for hours and still be getting the full experience of the game, whereas Double Dragon and Renegade had more buttons and required (only slightly) more brainpower, and in some ways the earlier games weren't as fun. Most beat-em-ups that came after FF were shameless clones. The SOR series is great because they did more with it than just follow the leader, but it was not the first of its kind.

[CaryMG]

"Donkey Kong Country" - SNES
Ray-Traced Graphics On A 16-Bit Console ?
WHOA ....

"StuntRace FX" - SNES
The Worlds First -- It Beat "Virtua Racing" To Market By A Few Months -- Freely Explorable Polygonal Game On A 16-Bit Console.

"DOOM" - SNES
Did What Was Said Couldn't Be Done On A 16-Bit Console.


Later!

[Mr_Elimin8]

Sonic for the genesis.

[Arkaign]

I bought Sonic the day it came out, there was a lot of hype about it. I couldn't really get into it. I had already been spoiled by Super Mario World and it's incredible depth of play and gargantuan size (in comparison).

The only thing I could discern that was fresh about Sonic was the speed. I *hated* that all three buttons did the same thing, and there were little to no techniques to use or alternate paths along the way.

To me it just felt linear, repetitive, and bland. And I was a genesis fan, I loved Forgotten Worlds, Ghouls n Ghosts, Phantasy Star II, Herzog Zwei, Target Earth, etc.

Nothing against anyone who loved Sonic, but it just didn't gel for me. I never bought another Sonic game again, though I rented them to see how they progressed.

[Graham Mitchell]

"Donkey Kong Country" - SNES
Ray-Traced Graphics On A 16-Bit Console ?
WHOA ....

That was a trick, though. The SNES didn't really process the rendered images. They were little digitized sprites made on an SGI workstation that somebody arranged into animation sequences. The imagery is truly only slightly more evolved that Super Mario World, and the gameplay isn't nearly as interesting.

I bought Sonic the day it came out, there was a lot of hype about it. I couldn't really get into it. I had already been spoiled by Super Mario World and it's incredible depth of play and gargantuan size (in comparison).

The only thing I could discern that was fresh about Sonic was the speed. I *hated* that all three buttons did the same thing, and there were little to no techniques to use or alternate paths along the way.

To me it just felt linear, repetitive, and bland. And I was a genesis fan, I loved Forgotten Worlds, Ghouls n Ghosts, Phantasy Star II, Herzog Zwei, Target Earth, etc.

Nothing against anyone who loved Sonic, but it just didn't gel for me. I never bought another Sonic game again, though I rented them to see how they progressed.

I'm in complete agreement. I never found Sonic to be that fascinating, and I loved all the Genesis games you mentioned. To me, games like Target Earth, Burning Force, Thunder Force II and the Valis games were the meat of that system.

[Arkaign]

Oh, sweet, I forgot about Thunder Force II, that had some AMAZING graphics for the era, and moved smoothly, had good variety, all in all a great shooter. I played Thunder Force III as well, was also pretty good.

A relief to find someone that also didn't think Sonic was all that hot.

[Push Upstairs]

However, I feel that the groundbreaking beat-em-up from the 16-bit era is probably Final Fight, which was released a few years before SOR2. In fact, SOR1 was sort of Sega's answer to Final Fight. The reason I felt it was groundbreaking is that it reduced all the attacks down to one button, essentially. You could just mash the one button for hours and still be getting the full experience of the game, whereas Double Dragon and Renegade had more buttons and required (only slightly) more brainpower, and in some ways the earlier games weren't as fun. Most beat-em-ups that came after FF were shameless clones. The SOR series is great because they did more with it than just follow the leader, but it was not the first of its kind.

Double Dragon has some (IMO) terrible controls and "Final Fight" feels very stiff...even 2 & 3.

I tend to feel that SOR2 is where everything came together. The control was smooth and spot on & the moves were great. Which is probably the reason why any other game thats similar gets compared to SOR2.

FF came first but SOR2 did it right.

[Ed Oscuro]

"Donkey Kong Country" - SNES
Ray-Traced Graphics On A 16-Bit Console ?
WHOA ....

That was a trick, though. The SNES didn't really process the rendered images. They were little digitized sprites made on an SGI workstation that somebody arranged into animation sequences. The imagery is truly only slightly more evolved that Super Mario World, and the gameplay isn't nearly as interesting.

Way to destroy all our cherished memories man!

Of course, NO system has sported true ray-traced graphics in realtime...the next generation of consoles probably won't, either...

[Arkaign]

Oh I remember something that was really unique for a 16-bit system, the Super Game Boy thing to play Gameboy games on the Snes. I guess it doesn't qualify as a game though. I still have fond memories of replaying Gargoyles Quest on it tho.

[Graham Mitchell]

"Donkey Kong Country" - SNES
Ray-Traced Graphics On A 16-Bit Console ?
WHOA ....

That was a trick, though. The SNES didn't really process the rendered images. They were little digitized sprites made on an SGI workstation that somebody arranged into animation sequences. The imagery is truly only slightly more evolved that Super Mario World, and the gameplay isn't nearly as interesting.

Way to destroy all our cherished memories man!

Of course, NO system has sported true ray-traced graphics in realtime...the next generation of consoles probably won't, either...

Just doing my part!

I think even Shigeru agrees with me on that, though.

As for the whole Streets of Rage thing, I don't want anybody to think I was knocking SOR2, because it's my favorite beat-em-up. But I've also noticed that if I try to talk about that game with people who aren't DP members, they have no idea what I'm talking about. But I think Final Fight, Double Dragon, etc., are the games that broke through and got attention from the mainstream because they were available in arcades. SOR did have somewhat of a niche audience, despite it's grandeur (are you really surprised, though? How many of your peers have played Snatcher?)

Speaking of which, there's another groundbreaking 16-bit game; Snatcher! Unfortunately, it's ground that will probably never be covered again, but it's still pretty cool.

[prismra]

Hmmm, I think we're forgetting something important...


OH YEAH!

Super Mario World. That game was mind-blowing when it came out. The huge world, multi-layered backgrounds, Mode-7 effects on the enemies, ALL the secrets, the transparencies...the music (I bet all of you could hum the title theme right now!)