What Kaz Hirai had to say to PS magazine

[Drunk Billionaire]

This is that Kaz Hirai said in an interview with PLaystation magazine.

"Kaz Hirai: We seem to. Every time we go down a path, we look behind and they're right there - we just can't shake these guys. I wish that they [microsoft] would come up with some strategies of their own, but they seem to be going down the path of everything we do. If you look at their strategy in other business areas as well, they tend to do that.

Kaz Hirai: And the other thing is, you take a look at, for example, the fact that we incorporate the Blu-ray drive from day one. You're not going to be asking me, 'So, talk to me about this Blu-ray add-on that you have. Does it work for games? Is it just for movies?' That's exactly the kind of pitfall you fall into if you launch something that's too early, too premature... "

I can't believe that loser said this. Sony can't come up with thier own ideas so they blame people for stealing them.

[Richter Belmount]

yeah that damn microsoft with their guide button on the controller! and their xbox live market place! sony came up with them firs.... oh yeah second

[lordnikon]

Sony had been doing marketplace sales with their PC mmo's before Microsoft.

It is a widespread opinion that in general Microsoft does not innovate. They just see what other people are doing, and try to do it better. MS has a long history of this in computer software.

MS hasn't innovated anything with their Xbox brand. They have just taken what has already been done before and tried to do it better.

Kaz Hirai's comments come off a bit slanted because of their motion sensing controller being announced after Nintendo's wiimote was publically known. But, regardless it is sort of hard to fault sony on innovation, because they did come out with that EyeToy PS3 interactive card game demo at E3, which was very impressive.

Kaz is expressing frustration, and that most likely has to do with MS's propoganda campaign, which works very well. Microsoft might not have been the innovator of something, but if they can convince people that they were, then they can gain an edge.

However, for those who think MS is an innovator, sorry, it is not the case.

[Drunk Billionaire]

Sony had been doing marketplace sales with their PC mmo's before Microsoft.

It is a widespread opinion that in general Microsoft does not innovate. They just see what other people are doing, and try to do it better. MS has a long history of this in computer software.

MS hasn't innovated anything with their Xbox brand. They have just taken what has already been done before and tried to do it better.

Sony never had a market like Xbox Live does. I know what you are talking about with SOE but it didn't even tap the idea. Microsoft created an awesome online playing area thats cheap and easy to use for maximum enjoyment. With videos demos all that stuff sony didn't have that they had... "Let's play everquest for $15 a month and we'll let you download some new expansions for more money once in a while" Microsoft's xbox live is a huge innovation

[lordnikon]

Sony had been doing marketplace sales with their PC mmo's before Microsoft.

It is a widespread opinion that in general Microsoft does not innovate. They just see what other people are doing, and try to do it better. MS has a long history of this in computer software.

MS hasn't innovated anything with their Xbox brand. They have just taken what has already been done before and tried to do it better.

Sony never had a market like Xbox Live does. I know what you are talking about with SOE but it didn't even tap the idea. Microsoft created an awesome online playing area thats cheap and easy to use for maximum enjoyment. With videos demos all that stuff sony didn't have that they had... "Let's play everquest for $15 a month and we'll let you download some new expansions for more money once in a while" Microsoft's xbox live is a huge innovation

Well, in terms of "market" some of Sony's MMO's have more active players than all of Xbox Live. Not that many people are currently playing online with their consoles. The recent numbers reflect about 2 million users on Playstation 2 or Xbox actually play games online. Sony actually has more just because of their installer base. In November of 2003 GameSpot reported Socom II alone was averaging almost as much activity as all of Xbox Live.

If you are talking about bringing content to the console via the internet, Sony has been doing this in Japan long before Microsoft started doing it with the Xbox. On Sony's BB Navigator software you can get hooked into content from various publishers.

As for Xbox Live, nothing about Live is innovative. Everything about Live has already been done before. Years before the Xbox even existed, GameSpy had started their software for PC online games. GameSpy supports many features such as an integrated friends list, voice chat, demo's, game media, chat rooms, and more. Xbox Live is nothing more than GameSpy Arcade.

(GameSpy is currently a huge force in online console gaming. Roughly 40-50% of PS2 Online titles in North America & Europe run on GameSpy network kits.)

Also, much of the online console innovations were taking place years before xbox...

The Sega Dreamcast featured a full suite of online and community functions. For instance the Dreamcast pioneered downloadable content for a home game console. This wasn't just for a game or two. Tons of games featured downloadable content that expanded the game experience. For Sonic Adventure 2 you can get new cart files, menu themes, as well as holiday themes. By visiting game homepages from your Dreamcast you could upload your saves, which would then get parsed into worldwide internet rankings. Chu-Chu Rocket had a database where users could upload & download their own created chuchu puzzles. Sega even released an official puzzle expansion pack. All of this could be downloaded right to the VMU. (Free of Charge by the way)

4x4 Evolution allows users to download lite maps created on the PC. This game is also cross platform compatible, allowing Dreamcast, PC, and MAC users to play together.

So, like I said, Xbox Live and Xbox Marketplace are not innovative. The features MS integrated into their network have all been done before, and not just on a small scale, but in most cases on a larger scale than that of xbox live. The only thing that Microsoft has innovated on is the Achievement Point feature. However, it is difficult to praise this function since the name itself is an OXYMORON.

[njiska]

Well, in terms of "market" some of Sony's MMO's have more active players than all of Xbox Live. Not that many people are currently playing online with their consoles. The recent numbers reflect about 2 million users on Playstation 2 or Xbox actually play games online. Sony actually has more just because of their installer base. In November of 2003 GameSpot reported Socom II alone was averaging almost as much activity as all of Xbox Live.

If you are talking about bringing content to the console via the internet, Sony has been doing this in Japan long before Microsoft started doing it with the Xbox. On Sony's BB Navigator software you can get hooked into content from various publishers.

As for Xbox Live, nothing about Live is innovative. Everything about Live has already been done before. Years before the Xbox even existed, GameSpy had started their software for PC online games. GameSpy supports many features such as an integrated friends list, voice chat, demo's, game media, chat rooms, and more. Xbox Live is nothing more than GameSpy Arcade.

(GameSpy is currently a huge force in online console gaming. Roughly 40-50% of PS2 Online titles in North America & Europe run on GameSpy network kits.)

Also, much of the online console innovations were taking place years before xbox...

The Sega Dreamcast featured a full suite of online and community functions. For instance the Dreamcast pioneered downloadable content for a home game console. This wasn't just for a game or two. Tons of games featured downloadable content that expanded the game experience. For Sonic Adventure 2 you can get new cart files, menu themes, as well as holiday themes. By visiting game homepages from your Dreamcast you could upload your saves, which would then get parsed into worldwide internet rankings. Chu-Chu Rocket had a database where users could upload & download their own created chuchu puzzles. Sega even released an official puzzle expansion pack. All of this could be downloaded right to the VMU. (Free of Charge by the way)

4x4 Evolution allows users to download lite maps created on the PC. This game is also cross platform compatible, allowing Dreamcast, PC, and MAC users to play together.

So, like I said, Xbox Live and Xbox Marketplace are not innovative. The features MS integrated into their network have all been done before, and not just on a small scale, but in most cases on a larger scale than that of xbox live. The only thing that Microsoft has innovated on is the Achievement Point feature. However, it is difficult to praise this function since the name itself is an OXYMORON.

Innovation is an over used word. In business innovative idea's are rarely new and almost never truely innoative. Everyone steals everyones ideas from everyone else.

What needs to be looked at in this debate is not who came up with what first, but what exactly the strategies were.

Kaz Hirai said, "I wish that they [microsoft] would come up with some strategies of their own." Not i wish Microsoft would stop stealing our innovations.

When it comes to Startegies in the last console generation MS and Sony were drastically different.

Microsoft preached a Hard drive to cut down on load times and to store media, downloadable content to expand gameplay and an interconnected online gaming service that transcended the games themselves allowing you to have a profile that carried accross all games. MS also preached broadband internet being mandatory because it was the only way to acheive their vision.

Sony's strategy out of the gate was to create a games system with a cheap DVD player inorder to grab both gamers and cinephiles. Later Sony decided to develope an online strategy. A startegy that basically said, matching making on the PC is great, lets bring that to the PS2. Eventually Sony released the HDD (which they were considering since day one) but they're strategynever really fit the HDD. Even first party sony titles didn't take advantage of it. The lack of updatable firmware to allow for HDD gamesaves also shows that the HDD wasn't part of Sony's core strategy.

Now that the Next-Gen is here Microsoft is staying the course but expanding their strategy to including an online marketplace and achievements. Sony is playing catch up. If you look at the PS3 strategy it's the same as the 360s with the exception of Blu-Ray.

Sony has followed in MS's footsteps not the other way around. Even if Sony claims to have had the idea first the bottomline is that he who does it first recieves credit. MS did everything they set out to and what they did worked and now Sony is essentially being force to follow their lead.

Everything you said is true, but it's not actually relevant to Kaz's statement.

[Push Upstairs]

"Kaz Hirai: And the other thing is, you take a look at, for example, the fact that we incorporate the Blu-ray drive from day one. You're not going to be asking me, 'So, talk to me about this Blu-ray add-on that you have. Does it work for games? Is it just for movies?' That's exactly the kind of pitfall you fall into if you launch something that's too early, too premature... "


I'm sorry, but i cannot fault a company that decides to take a "wait and see" approach when it comes to seeing what will be the dominant format in the HD format wars.

Of course he's going to go on about Blu-Ray because thats the format Sony is pushing, but if HD-DVD wins (which i hope it doesn't) he'll be eating those words.

[lordnikon]

"Kaz Hirai: And the other thing is, you take a look at, for example, the fact that we incorporate the Blu-ray drive from day one. You're not going to be asking me, 'So, talk to me about this Blu-ray add-on that you have. Does it work for games? Is it just for movies?' That's exactly the kind of pitfall you fall into if you launch something that's too early, too premature... "


I'm sorry, but i cannot fault a company that decides to take a "wait and see" approach when it comes to seeing what will be the dominant format in the HD format wars.

Of course he's going to go on about Blu-Ray because thats the format Sony is pushing, but if HD-DVD wins (which i hope it doesn't) he'll be eating those words.

Yea but, his comments are still on point. We all know how well "add-on" hardware has done in the past. It can be dangerious (32X? 64DD?). It is a safe assumption to think that MS could be in trouble by having an addon HD setup.

There is always a flipside though. By having an external drive they afford themselves the ability to adapt to market conditions. If BlueRay becomes the dominant format, MS can switch over to an external BlueRay player if necessary.

It will be interesting to see how it all unfolds.

[Haoie]

The SFC had it's Satellaview.

Online console gaming in Japan has existed for a long, long time, not just since Sony days.

[Ed Oscuro]

We all know how much game players love being saddled with irrelevant hardware.

Imagine if the Super NES had originally been sold AS A CD-i - and furthermore as the Sony CD-i, with a broken stereo sound implementation

Kaz is certainly on-point, but in a twisted way. I really can't believe they're letting him say this. I would like to just refuse he's said these things and believe he can't have said that "can't shake them" line; it's giving a very bad impression of Sony's belief in their own system's capabilities.

We'll see how well the HD-DVD drive does, but I don't see how it's hurting Microsoft. It's certainly going to be an extra reason for people to buy it - people primarily interested in movies but who might want to dabble in a few XBox games will see it as a way to subsidize their costs into the system.

That said, Microsoft will want to keep the game feature the primary one. People buying a 360 with that reasoning will definitely want to buy a few 360 games (thus making Microsoft money, in theory).

Thinking along these lines one reason becomes apparent why Microsoft shouldn't make an HD-DVD integrated 360: they don't want people buying the 360 just as a cheaper HD-DVD player now, or in the future. The manufacturing price would have to fall radically for Microsoft to actually make a profit on systems (the only way selling 360s as an alternative HD-DVD player would make them money).

In that light, it'll be interesting to see how fast Microsoft will let pricing fall. I don't forsee them letting the HD-DVD drive fall in price, for example, for a while.

But then again, they probably are betting (it seems a relatively safe bet) that there will be only a few people who would buy a 360 if it were a cheaper HD-DVD player, and the window of time where a 360 will be less expensive than high-range HD-DVD players should be relatively short (by the time the PS2 launched, there were already DVD players available for $179).

Em. Sorry for a confused blab session; that could use some tidying up, certainly. Regardless, I think I've covered the bases there.

[Ed Oscuro]

The SFC had it's Satellaview.

Online console gaming in Japan has existed for a long, long time, not just since Sony days.

That wasn't online console gaming. Neither was the Nintendo Power system. Neither was the Famicom modem (unless it had some horse racing feature, I guess). Until relatively recently, Japan's internet infrastructure was notoriously bad.

The early online gaming attempts were all based in the US (as far as I know), from the early (never-released) modem service targeting Atari VCS owners to the XBand.

[zerohero]

Sony had been doing marketplace sales with their PC mmo's before Microsoft.

It is a widespread opinion that in general Microsoft does not innovate. They just see what other people are doing, and try to do it better. MS has a long history of this in computer software.

MS hasn't innovated anything with their Xbox brand. They have just taken what has already been done before and tried to do it better.

Kaz Hirai's comments come off a bit slanted because of their motion sensing controller being announced after Nintendo's wiimote was publically known. But, regardless it is sort of hard to fault sony on innovation, because they did come out with that EyeToy PS3 interactive card game demo at E3, which was very impressive.

Kaz is expressing frustration, and that most likely has to do with MS's propoganda campaign, which works very well. Microsoft might not have been the innovator of something, but if they can convince people that they were, then they can gain an edge.

However, for those who think MS is an innovator, sorry, it is not the case.

Amen

[NE146]

It is a widespread opinion that in general Microsoft does not innovate. They just see what other people are doing, and try to do it better.

Wasn't that the whole criticism of the Japanese throughout the 70's and 80's?

[Sothy]

Charging 600$ is pretty innovative.

[njiska]

Charging 600$ is pretty innovative.

Innovative like an electrified ball clamp.

[odyeiop]

Charging 600$ is pretty innovative.

Innovative like an electrified ball clamp.

BMEzine o_O

[unwinddesign]

Since when did innovative = good? Microsoft has innovated, a lot in fact. Besides, the fact of the matter is that it's a buzz word (and one bandied about way too much these days). It holds little water. And Sony complaining about others "copying" them. Rofl. Just rofl. It seems that MS has their dumbass PR people (Peter Moore, anyone) and Sony has theirs. And they're trying to one-up each other in a contest of stupidity. x_x

[Crazycarl]

Sony had been doing marketplace sales with their PC mmo's before Microsoft.

It is a widespread opinion that in general Microsoft does not innovate. They just see what other people are doing, and try to do it better. MS has a long history of this in computer software.

MS hasn't innovated anything with their Xbox brand. They have just taken what has already been done before and tried to do it better.

Sony never had a market like Xbox Live does. I know what you are talking about with SOE but it didn't even tap the idea. Microsoft created an awesome online playing area thats cheap and easy to use for maximum enjoyment. With videos demos all that stuff sony didn't have that they had... "Let's play everquest for $15 a month and we'll let you download some new expansions for more money once in a while" Microsoft's xbox live is a huge innovation

Isn't it funny this time around Japanese Company invented something, and an American company made it better. Just gave me a laugh.

[s1lence]

Is it me or is Sony's constant claims that they are better then everyone else just a ploy for media coverage?

[njiska]

Is it me or is Sony's constant claims that they are better then everyone else just a ploy for media coverage?

Bingo