Sell Expensive Items Internationally?

[Tritoch]

A recent auction of mine has just completed, with a final price tag of slightly over $150. The problem is that I clearly stated "Will ship to United States only", and yet the winning bidder is from ITALY. I also stated that I would only accept payment via money order or PayPal from verified and confirmed users (so I'm protected by their Seller Protection Policy), and of course it's impossible for an international user to confirm their mailing address with PayPal. They want to pay with PayPal.

What would you do in this situation? While this person has an excellent feedback reputation (760 positives versus 1 neutral and 2 negatives), only 223 of those positives are from unique users. On the other hand, all of these positives are from transactions in which this user was the buyer (thus they buy a lot), so it's not unusual for them to drop that kind of money on a game.

My fear of course is that I'll ship the game to them, and then they'll promptly do a chargeback for which I have no defense against. It's not that I don't trust people from other countries...I just don't trust ANYONE when there's a loophole like that and so much money is involved. Am I being paranoid here, or do I have a legitimate concern? What would you all do in this situation?

[jonjandran]

Do you NEED the $150.00 . Or would you be fine re-listing it ?
If so just contact the people and say there has been a misunderstanding and you can't sell to them , as clearly stated in your auction. Then give positive not negative feedback because most likely it was just a misunderstanding. Then re-list and tack on a few dollars on shipping/handling to cover the re-list fee.
If you need the money , e-mail them letting them know there is a higher shipping charge. I also say U.S. only and have had this happen to me over 20 times. And it was never a problem.
I hope it works out.

[Achika]

If you feel comfortable selling with that kind of feedback, you can probably ship EMS so you have a proof that you sent it plus insurance. I sell internationally and have had a few high ticket items, with never a problem. I find usually even my bidders with '0' feedback from other countries are easier to deal with than '0' f/b bidders from this country. Not as many NPB's.

[Darth Vader]

Send the item via Registered Post at the post office. Since the buyer did not read the instructions, explain to them your auction rules about international bidders. If they don't agree to this, that is their problem not yours. Let them know this would be the only way you will ship it (since they did not read, you have to be careful) I do many auctions with international bidders (mostly Canada and UK) and have not had any problems.

Danny

[Chunky]

I had the same problem, i convinced the guy i would only go Western union, if he's pay the fee(7% or something). We agreed on whats what, i went down to the curency exchange, got my cash in hand.

[neschampion]

Last time I sold internationally it was to a guy in Sweden who promptly did a chargeback on a $100 item after I told him it shipped. Good thing for me that when I typed "your item has been shipped" I really meant "your item is ready to be shipped".

[Tritoch]

^That's exactly what I fear.

I appreciate the advice everyone. I emailed the high bidder back and indicated that I would not bend on my PayPal rule, and that if he still wanted the game it'd have to be via some form of international money order (I mentioned Western Union). I'm waiting to hear back from him now.

[Marco]

In my experience, Europeans are much easier to deal with than Americans...

... oh wait, that was international politics :P

Cheers,
Marco

[Tritoch]

Actually, in the few international transactions I've done I've found them very easy to deal with too. There are some though that KNOW there are loopholes and won't hesitate to exploit them.

[kattkatt]

@neschampion; Who was the guy from Sweden? I'm from Sweden too and really want to know.

/CC

[mcgrail0007@netzero.net]

All of my auctions state that I will only ship to the U.S. I have had a couple of people buy still buy my items from other contries. The last one was for a cheap Sega Master System game. Three weeks after I shiped it the guy claimed that he still did not have it. He lives in Canada so I figured he should have had it. He threatened a chargeback, but a few days later he emailed me to say that he got it. I personally will not deal with any international shipping again unless it is someone that I know from Digital Press or Atari Age. This is especially true since the war with Irag will start soon. There are going to be a lot of people from other countries who aren't too happy with the U.S. and I for one will not allow their revenge to be a chargeback to me.

[Bojay1997]

First, shipping from the US to Canada or vice versa has to be the slowest process known to man. I have shipped items to Japan and Europe in under seven days using regular air mail. Canada routinely takes three weeks no matter what the size of the item. The only exception to this seems to be if you use UPS or Fed Ex in which case it takes less than a week, but at a significant cost difference.

As for selling to international bidders, it's not the payment that should be your biggest concern. You can always ask for cash via registered mail or Western Union. The problem is with confirmation of shipping. I have had excellent experiences selling to European buyers, but I have several friends who have gotten screwed on big ticket items. I typically use UPS or USPS Express Mail International because they have receipt confirmation via Internet and insurance. Sending regular air mail is a problem because you never know when the buyer is going to claim they never got the item. My advice is to require the buyer to make payment via Western Union or cash and insist that they pay for the more expensive shipping for your protection. If they won't agree, relist the item.

[Buyatari]

Well there is ONE small loophole you can use.

You can only do a chargeback 1 month after you send the paypal funds so if you wait 32 days before you ship it you are safe.

Adam

[mcgrail0007@netzero.net]

Well there is ONE small loophole you can use.

You can only do a chargeback 1 month after you send the paypal funds so if you wait 32 days before you ship it you are safe.

Paypal only allows you to file a dispute for one month, but the credit card company typically allows a dispute to be filed anywhere from 60-90 days after the purchase.

[Buyatari]

Paypal only allows you to file a dispute for one month, but the credit card company typically allows a dispute to be filed anywhere from 60-90 days after the purchase.

How would that work?

Is the credit card company as easy going as Paypal to just give buyers the money back no questions asked?

If the buyer does go through their credit card how exactly does that affect you? I wouldn't think a credit card company would care about things like a "confirmed address". If you have a recept saying it was mailed that may be good enough for a CC company.

How does Paypal handle that? Has anyone EVER had it happen this way?

If so looks like they have to wait 91 days........ OUCH !!!!!

Does Paypal even see this as a problem? Someone could make a living just doing this over and over.

Adam

[Darth Vader]

Paypal only allows you to file a dispute for one month, but the credit card company typically allows a dispute to be filed anywhere from 60-90 days after the purchase.

How would that work?

Is the credit card company as easy going as Paypal to just give buyers the money back no questions asked?

If the buyer does go through their credit card how exactly does that affect you? I wouldn't think a credit card company would care about things like a "confirmed address". If you have a recept saying it was mailed that may be good enough for a CC company.

How does Paypal handle that? Has anyone EVER had it happen this way?

If so looks like they have to wait 91 days........ OUCH !!!!!

Does Paypal even see this as a problem? Someone could make a living just doing this over and over.

Adam

Using a credit card DOES NOT give you the right to contest a paypal charge with your credit card company. Go ahead and try it once, I guarantee you will lose. The reason is you are not dealing directly with a merchant, you are dealing with a third party payment service which eliminates your chance to contest the charge (I heard this on the radio when I was at work). There is a consumer advocate that is on the radio by the name of Clark Howard.

Website address is : www.clarkhoward.com

He had this as a topic one day on his show. The credit card company will side with paypal nearly 100 percent of the time. If you need any other information on this, check his website out for help.

Danny

[neschampion]

I used Bidpay once and the seller I bought from turned out to be a frand and I contacted Bidpay before they even sent the $$$ out and they told me they couldn't stop it. So, I did a chargeback on my Credit Card and they credited the money back to me so Bidpay was the one that took the hit. I am not seeing any reason why it wouldn't work with PayPal to.

@kattkatt - That deal with the guy in Sweden happened last August so I don't have his info anymore.

[Darth Vader]

There is a big difference between bidpay and paypal. Bidpay is guaranteeing the transaction, Paypal is not (see their new BS insurance when you pay for an auction now). Go ahead and try a chargeback on paypal is all that I am saying, it won't work, or it would be the last time they would ever let you use it. Check out the website I mentioned above, I believe he cites paypal at his site.

Danny

[SoulBlazer]

DV -- Looks like a nice site but HUGE. Can you provide a direct link to where he talks about PayPal? I've had charges reversed once before but on money that was allready IN my account, not taken from a credit card, and it was like two years ago. I still use PayPal to pay my credit card bills, though.

[Darth Vader]

Do a search on the site using the keyword PAYPAL. That should work, last time I checked out the site it had its own search engine.

Danny