Someone finally said it: Factor 5 on the Wii...

[dethink]

Yeah, yeah...I'm not a "graphics are everything" person either, but I've been having that niggling feeling so far the Wii seems to be "coasting" so far as far as pushing the hardware at all goes...

Full article here: http://wii.ign.com/articles/762/762984p1.html

5. Resident Evil 4 was a beautiful GCN title. Rogue Squadron was doing things at launch that developers still haven't done on Wii. Why do you think that is? Are studios getting sloppy on Wii?

Julian: Yes. I'm so disappointed knowing exactly what the Wii can do -- and I still think nobody knows it better than we (no pun intended) [laughs]. I really have to say, boy, am I disappointed! They all have finally figured out, five years into the hardware's life cycle, how to do at least basic shaders and a rim light, but that's what everybody does. But I still don't see enough bump and normal-mapping, if any. I still don't see enough post effects, although you would have insane fill-rates with Wii. I don't see any of that. I was digging out Rebel Strike the other day and was looking at it, and we had some people who were visiting ask, "Why isn't anybody else doing this on Wii?" And I am at a loss. I really am.

[crazyjackcsa]

Didn't really enjoy that read at all. Why would he point to a Gamecube games to show what the Wii can do? And then to reference his own game, multiple times? I found it to be to much "Look at how great we are"

[sisko]

Didn't really enjoy that read at all. Why would he point to a Gamecube games to show what the Wii can do? And then to reference his own game, multiple times? I found it to be to much "Look at how great we are"

The point was that that stuff was being done in GameCube games, but it isn't being done in Wii games: which is entirely backwards. On of those two steps forward, three steps back kind of deals.

As for referencing his own game, the interviewer referenced it first O_o

[dethink]

Didn't really enjoy that read at all. Why would he point to a Gamecube games to show what the Wii can do? And then to reference his own game, multiple times? I found it to be to much "Look at how great we are"

Fair enough. I too think he's a little heavy handed in his wording, especially for someone who hasn't put out a game in...forever...but it's kind of sad that on hardware that's supposedly more powerful than an Xbox, we're seeing games that don't even compare visually to 6 year old previous generation launch titles.

I want to see Nintendo do well, but they can't just coast on the merits of a controller who's strengths truly have yet to be proven outside Wii Sports. It seems a lot of this generation so far is built on the hype/excuses of "untapped potential."

"Oh, the devs haven't really tapped the power of The Cell yet," or "Oh they haven't come to grips with the innovative new control scheme yet, so it's OK if everything looks like a sub-PS2 port," or "It's OK if my console melts down, look at GoW!"

[swlovinist]

I think that Rebel Strike got alot of bad press, and it was one of my favorites. The two player of Rogue Squadron is one of my all time favs. As for graphics for the Wii, I am not worried. The first party stuff will be great, as well as the bizarre Wii exclusives such as Cooking Mama(which dont require good graphics). In time they will ultimately utililize what is under the hood. If anyone is worried, then buy a PS3 or 360 as well to have your bases covered. I see having two consoles out of the three being alot of gamers options...I see the Wii being bought as one of those.

[crazyjackcsa]

Hey Don't get me wrong, I agree with what he's saying, I think as most people do. Just not the way he said it. Furthermore, he REALLY pushes his bias and backs his current "employer" (Being Sony) I think at this stage of the game the Wii+360 is looking far better than the Wii+PS3.

[swlovinist]

Only time will tell, it is still way too early to determine. After the next holiday, that is when you will see a clear winner. The system wars have just begun. The new consoles have not been out 3 months. If we were to judge the 360 on the first three months, we would be foolish. Look at what is coming out this year for the 360. I think that this next 11 months are critical for all three systems. 1. Xbox 360 needs to come down in price OR offer a system version 1.5 for the same price(bigger hard drive). 2. Nintendo needs to make more Wiis, more controllers, and have software support this year to fuel their "positive word of mouth". 3. Sony needs to either have some killer games come out or reduce the price of their system to compete. Nintendo is riding on value and fun. As funny as it sounds, the price is really doing it for many. I still think the target price for a console is $299 and until either Sony and Xbox can offer a system at that price Nintendo is going to outsell them.

[Wolfrider31]

I get where the man's coming from, and there's no denying how underpowered the Wii is, but I'm not lying when I say I really really don't care.

Graphics matter.. kind of. There's a threshold for me, that once reached turns looks into a non-issue. For me, that threshold was reached in the 128 bit generation.

[swlovinist]

I agree with what you have said wolfrider31. I still think that Soul Calibur can compete with some of what we are seeing today. Sure 8 years later it looks better, but not that much better. The graphics improvements are very subtle this generation. This generation will be all about HD gaming and widescreen support, not to mention online gaming. Graphics do matter, but fun and easy gameplay will be a factor as well. The last couple of generations have built upon the previous gameplay aspects and have really become stagnant. Any innovation in gameplay gets noticed. The DS and Wii are examples of this. Sony and Microsoft also know that this is next evolution of gaming is HOW we play. It is kind of wierd that the Dualshock is 10 years old this year. While the controller design has obviously worked for a long time, I am open to change and see some new gameplay styles. I think there will be always a market for classic contoller setups, I think that there is a market for new innovative gameplay that gets people off of their ass and more interactive with games. The Wii is a big experiment, just like the DS was. If Nintnedo can deliver on software, then it will succeed. If not, it will just be another Gamecube.

[lendelin]

This is a very good answer and observation by Eggebrecht. No exaggeration, not too harsh words, and certainly not biased.

The reason why there is a discrepancy between the GC in 2001/02 and the Wii in 2006/07 when it comes to make full use of the graphics potential is a simple one. The GC was a top-notch machine, the Wii is two steps behind its competitors when it comes to processing power and graphical abilities. The GC tried to compete (and successfully did) with the best machines in the compartment for the best tools for graphics, the Wii is intentionally a toned down machine composed around the new control scheme for shorter games attractive for the casual gamer.

Should we really be surprised that developers do not emphasize graphics for such a machine and even fall behind GC-efforts? Nah.

I think that Eggebrecht as a developer assumes a certain basic minimal level in 2006 and expresssed his surprise that such a garphics level wasn't kept for a system which has more potential than the GC.

One thing I find surprising and a bit sad: I read around 15 interviews with developers before and after the Wii launched, and in almost everyone it was said that the Wii is a great innovative machine, but there is no intention to develop a game for it in the short run. Some time, later. It sounds like lip service.

The biggest challenge for the Wii will be to keep the software sales up at the level of the hardware sales. Casual gamers buy systems but spend less money for games and play less than the hardcore guys. Developers only follow suit when there is money to be earned, and N has to convince lots of developers that game sales won't be second rate. Dvelopment costs for Wii games will be very attractive, but I doubt that the price for Wii games can be kept at the $50 level.

[Anthony1]

For some reason, I keep hearing people say that the Wii is supposed to be a bit more powerfull than the first Xbox, but personally, I find that hard to believe. Far Cry on the Xbox is actually a very good looking game, but Far Cry on the Wii is an absolute joke. I'm just wondering where this whole "Wii is a bit more powerful than Xbox 1" stuff has come from. I mean, could the Wii do Doom 3 like the Xbox did? Or Half-Life 2? I just don't see it.

I'm happy playing Elebits and Wii Sports and Zelda, but make no mistake about it, the Wii is a GameCube 1.0, not even a 1.5. Anybody hoping Wii games are going to make a huge leap forward with their graphical quality in the near future is wishing upon a star.

[swlovinist]

The Wii has not been programmed for yet. Everything we have seen so far is either a cancelled gamecube game, tech demo, or launch title which are known to be rushed. I'll wait to judge the graphics when a game like Metroid 3 or Mario Galaxy come out. If I was to judge the 360 on graphics when it came out(using a launch title), I would say that it was no better than the Xbox in terms of graphics.

[dethink]

This is a very good answer and observation by Eggebrecht. No exaggeration, not too harsh words, and certainly not biased.

The reason why there is a discrepancy between the GC in 2001/02 and the Wii in 2006/07 when it comes to make full use of the graphics potential is a simple one. The GC was a top-notch machine, the Wii is two steps behind its competitors when it comes to processing power and graphical abilities. The GC tried to compete (and successfully did) with the best machines in the compartment for the best tools for graphics, the Wii is intentionally a toned down machine composed around the new control scheme for shorter games attractive for the casual gamer.

Agreed. I'm still amazed that even the most graphically intense GC games have almost zero loading time, or that it was covered up VERY well.

[j_factor]

The Wii has not been programmed for yet. Everything we have seen so far is either a cancelled gamecube game, tech demo, or launch title which are known to be rushed. I'll wait to judge the graphics when a game like Metroid 3 or Mario Galaxy come out. If I was to judge the 360 on graphics when it came out(using a launch title), I would say that it was no better than the Xbox in terms of graphics.

Gamecube had Rogue Leader, and Xbox had Halo. Why couldn't the new systems have equivalents?

[heybtbm]

When I read the title for this thread, I thought Rogue Squadron was coming to the Wii VC. I guess not.

[§ Gideon §]

When I read the title for this thread, I thought Rogue Squadron was coming to the Wii VC. I guess not.

The first thing that came to my mind was: "Finally. I'll be able to control a Tie Fighter with my wrist."

[MegaDrive20XX]

When I read the title for this thread, I thought Rogue Squadron was coming to the Wii VC. I guess not.

I thought that as well or maybe a "Factor 5" game was coming to Wii

[MonoTekETeA]

I figure this would be a good time for me to say in most cases, Video games age like a fine wine, both to be said for classic games, but to tie into modern times, the development of games.

As time goes on, developers will decided which road to take for the Wii, inivative ideas for the controller, or going taking the standard configuration and sticking to pushing out the best graphics the system has to offer. The final product will show, and the ones that offer the best of both worlds will be the most sought after, or at least under rated.
-Also pointing out the fact they will learn to code for the system, producing better quality products while using their time more effiecently.

[Anthony1]

If I was to judge the 360 on graphics when it came out(using a launch title), I would say that it was no better than the Xbox in terms of graphics.

That would depend 100 percent on which Xbox 360 launch title you were judging that on. If you had Kameo, Project Gotham Racing 3 and Call of Duty 2, then you would know that the 360 was a true next gen machine. On the other hand if you had Tony Hawk's American Wasteland, Gun and NHL2K6 you would think it was merely Xbox 1 games in 720p. Looking at all the launch titles for the Nintendo Wii, everyone is hoping against hope that all these games were coded 100 percent to GameCube spec, and that the true power of the Wii lies within and has yet to be tapped. I'm hoping the same thing, but I think that what we have seen so far, is pretty much what we are going to get. I'm sure there will be some programing trickery that will make the Wii games look a bit better, but it's obvious to me right now that the Wii is nowhere even close to the level of the original Xbox, much less slightly more powerful than it. Again, I will bring up Doom 3 or Chronicles of Riddick for Xbox 1. If you put either of those games on the Nintendo Wii they would look absolutely horrid, yet the Wii is supposedly slighlty more powerful than the Xbox 1. Yeah, right.

This is one situation where I hope to be proved completely and utterly wrong.

[Steve W]

To me, all the games in the Wii's line-up are GameCube games that got shoveled onto the new hardware. The only thing being developed by third-party publishers by the end of the GameCube's life were kid's movie/TV show tie-ins, and it looks like they got ported over to the Wii. I'm sure they weren't really upgraded too much, just for a kid's game that children won't be too concerned with the graphics quality of. The Wii still has a ways to go graphically, Nintendo just needs to stop porting GC titles and get their developers to stop being so lazy.