which old systems that are most powerful and which arent

[Icarus Moonsight]

I thought the Z80 was in the Genny for backwards compatability with the SMS library. Since that was the SMS's CPU and all.

[blue lander]

In regards to the Genesis Z80;

The Genesis 3 is with out the Z80 this is correct? I am not notice issue with sound. How is Genesis 3 perform with out Z80 chip. Games are play fine I am not having problem as games are sounding fine :?

I believe the basic functions of the Z80 are integrated into one of the other chips designed for the Genesis 3. It's not a proper Z80, though, so no SMS games.

According to Eidolon's Sega Technical Overview, which is pretty much definitive:

Z80 @4 MHz
• controls PSG (Programmable Sound Generator) & FM Chips
• 8 KBytes of dedicated Sound Ram

- Z80 controls:
• PSG (TI 76489 chip)
• FM chip (Yamaha YM 2612)
- 6-channel stereo
• Z80 can access ROM data
• 8 KBytes RAM

[idrougge]

I believe the basic functions of the Z80 are integrated into one of the other chips designed for the Genesis 3.

The Genesis 3, at least the later units, was a system-on-a-chip, with everything integrated. That would also explain bad sound quality.

[idrougge]

Dumb question:

If the SNES is "barely 16 bit" and the Genesis using a 32-bit 68000, why does the SNES tend to have faster updates of the graphics?

Well, because bits don't mean anything if you're above the age of nine?


The Genesis always reminded me of an Amiga in the box. Same CPU, same speed, identical-looking graphics.... only the sound was inferior.

Quite coincidental. The Megadrive is a descendant of Sega's Texas Instruments lineage, with some arcade bits thrown in. The Amiga is a descendant of Atari's 8-bitters. They work very differently, but happen to use the same CPU.

[idrougge]

The Amiga CD32 (CPU: 68EC020) was developed in this way first, AGA and Akiko chips. Most coders didn't understand this, and just coded the 68K way.

Every CD32 programmer knew exactly how to use the resources at hand in the most efficient way. They had seven years of Amiga development experience to fall back on.

[idrougge]

The 65816 in the SNES is just barely 16 bit. It's got an 8 bit data bus, and it's basically just a 6502 with a few more instructions and 16 bit wide registers.

Blimey, I never knew it had an 8-bit data bus (I thought that was only the 65802). Then I agree that it's about as much 8-bit as the Megadrive is 16-bit.

[blue lander]

The real problem with the Jaguar is that Atari never released any libraries for developers. The Jaguar is one of the most complicated architectures ever seen in a consumer product, but Atari did nothing to help developers use it or even understand it. I'm sure some documentation was available, but I guess it was sort of assumed that developers would just write their Jag code in assembly or something, which is totally absurd looking back, but that's how things were don back then. It was Sony and that introduced the idea of C development libraries really, even though the Playstation wasn't nearly as complicated as the Jaguar.

I know that's the common wisdom on the Jaguar, but I used to know one of the guys who programmed Flip-Out! for the Jaguar, and he said they developed in in C. I don't know if they were using libraries provided by Atari or if they developed it themselves.

[tom]

Every CD32 programmer knew exactly how to use the resources at hand in the most efficient way. They had seven years of Amiga development experience to fall back on.

Yeah, but thats just 1000, 500 experience, not 1200 experience.

[Sweater Fish Deluxe]

I know that's the common wisdom on the Jaguar, but I used to know one of the guys who programmed Flip-Out! for the Jaguar, and he said they developed in in C. I don't know if they were using libraries provided by Atari or if they developed it themselves.
Probably stuff they developed themselves. A lot of European developers did that back in the old days. Although it's certainly possible that Atari did provide some stuff, I don't know. I think the graphics in Flip-Out sort of speak for themselves as far as how much of the system's potential is tapped, though, eh?



Every CD32 programmer knew exactly how to use the resources at hand in the most efficient way. They had seven years of Amiga development experience to fall back on.
I think tom was speaking of the Jaguar mostly, when he talked about coders programming for the 68k. I don't know much about the CD32 or its architecture, so I don't know if the same applies to it, but in the case of the Jaguar, programmers falling back on their Amiga dev experience is exactly why they didn't use the system efficiently.

In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if the C libraries blue lander mentioned were originally developed for the Amiga and later adpated for the Jaguar.


...word is bondage...

[j_factor]

Well, you have to figure, also, that Amiga CD32 died really quickly. Developers really didn't have any time to do anything with the system other than throw regular Amiga games on CD-ROMs. It's true that a lot of systems have had impressive games at launch, but CD32 was more rushed than most, and Amiga themselves didn't make games.

It's a similar situation with lots of other unsuccessful systems.

[idrougge]

Yeah, but thats just 1000, 500 experience, not 1200 experience.

Do you really think that matters?

[tom]

Do you really think that matters?

i suppose, because the 1200 has the AGA, just like the CD32. previous Amiga machines did not feature this Graphic chipset

[idrougge]

i suppose, because the 1200 has the AGA, just like the CD32. previous Amiga machines did not feature this Graphic chipset

AGA has more colours, but can you say that it was an alien experience to any experienced A500 coder?