who owns any unreleased undumped games [Archive] - Page 2

TRM

05-22-2009, 10:09 PM

I hope you mean selling the physical copies, because I really hope to not see another tragedy like mike tyson again. =\

I am really not sure how this is tragic? Members of the community decided to provide donations to receive a rom image of an unreleased game, the owner (DreamTR) made the terms, and the game was released for all. I personally have not tried the game out, nor did I donate to the cause, as I really have no interest for the game (or the original MTPO for that matter), and see no reason to donate to something I am not interested in. However, still a cool effort, that anyone who wanted to play the game can download and play it.

DreamTR has the original, unedited rom, so it is not as if that was unpreserved. So what is the big deal with this?

hellfire

05-22-2009, 10:10 PM

Because you ASKED me a for a list. Unreleased games are not cheap. So if you aren't looking for something expensive, what are you expecting me to say?

You aren't browsing, you're not even window shopping. It's more of a curiosity. If you don't have any money, but want to look at stuff in an expensive store with no money to buy, that is not the definition of browsing.

There's no need to give you a list if you have no money to purchase anything and are looking for "cheap" unreleased games.

ok can you give me a list of cheap betas/protos?

PACHUKA

05-22-2009, 10:13 PM

I am really not sure how this is tragic? Members of the community decided to provide donations to receive a rom image of an unreleased game, the owner (DreamTR) made the terms, and the game was released for all. I personally have not tried the game out, nor did I donate to the cause, as I really have no interest for the game (or the original MTPO for that matter), and see no reason to donate to something I am not interested in. However, still a cool effort, that anyone who wanted to play the game can download and play it.

DreamTR has the original, unedited rom, so it is not as if that was unpreserved. So what is the big deal with this?

Nothing. If they want to pay through the nose for a corrupted version of bad game, without actually obtaining a physical copy, then by all means. I'll spare the p.t. barnum reference.

DreamTR

05-22-2009, 10:15 PM

And?

I'm aware. Still find it unethical.

Well good. I'm not sure at what point I used the term "crappy," but releasing under the RULES you suggest leaves a mass flux of corrupted data. Your RULES are shady to me, and I will speak my mind as such. I could give a fuck less if you release them publicly, as I've stated previously. But you charged a community of people a massive amount of cash for a corrupted rom image, and I still find it unethical.

As long as you have them backed up from bitrotting, I consider that issue closed. I find it a shame, but I'm really not concerned with having a copy, I'm just concerned with seeing that they don't disappear forever.

I hope you mean selling the physical copies, because I really hope to not see another tragedy like mike tyson again. =\

I'm not really sure what "ethics" have to do with anything. Anyone asking/thinking I should give away a game for free? That's unethical. If Nintendo Age PAID the money for the game to BRING it out so YOU can play it for FREE, I think it's great they put their name in it. I asked for the text to be removed. That's it. They can add whatever they want. If you did not donate, not sure what kind of say you can have in it. Not sure what "corrupted" data it is. People just can't pass off that game as a proto. That's all I care about. No part of the gameplay is affected. There is really no other reason why anyone would be upset just because some information was changed/tweaked on a legal screen.

I don't think $1500 is a large amount when I was offered $5000 for it UNDUMPED. SO you see, I LOST $3500 to bring that game to people. What thanks do I get for that? All I hear really is whining. See my point?

As far as me being open with protos, it's for dumping. I don't have problems with certain stuff being dumped without anything changed, but no one has the money for most of the items anyway on dumps. I would not sell one of a kinds cheap, which is probably why I have this massive unreleased Mega Drive collection no one wants to touch because of my prices on them. I sold something just a couple of weeks ago unchanged. I'm sure people are going to eventually try and pass one off as the real thing, and I just don't want the "only" way to tell is to check for a watermark invisibly added as opposed to just plugging the game in.

hellfire

05-22-2009, 10:17 PM

I'm not really sure what "ethics" have to do with anything. Anyone asking/thinking I should give away a game for free? That's unethical. If Nintendo Age PAID the money for the game to BRING it out so YOU can play it for FREE, I think it's great they put their name in it. I asked for the text to be removed. That's it. They can add whatever they want. If you did not donate, not sure what kind of say you can have in it. Not sure what "corrupted" data it is. People just can't pass off that game as a proto. That's all I care about. No part of the gameplay is affected. There is really no other reason why anyone would be upset just because some information was changed/tweaked on a legal screen.

I don't think $1500 is a large amount when I was offered $5000 for it UNDUMPED. SO you see, I LOST $3500 to bring that game to people. What thanks do I get for that? All I hear really is whining. See my point?

As far as me being open with protos, it's for dumping. I don't have problems with certain stuff being dumped without anything changed, but no one has the money for most of the items anyway on dumps. I would not sell one of a kinds cheap, which is probably why I have this massive unreleased Mega Drive collection no one wants to touch because of my prices on them. I sold something just a couple of weeks ago unchanged. I'm sure people are going to eventually try and pass one off as the real thing, and I just don't want the "only" way to tell is to check for a watermark invisibly added as opposed to just plugging the game in.

Im not here to make you dump expensive protos, you own them and you can do whatever you want with them, all I want to do is buy one with little changes for my collection

DreamTR

05-22-2009, 10:18 PM

THE LEGAL SCREEN HAS 10 words REMOVED ! OMGITISCORRUPT!

Yeah. I am sure that is going to cause the game to be corrupt and no one to want it. Wow.

Unreleased games are normally bad. Some people think MTIPP is great, so can't use that argument.

Hellfire, did you not read where I said I have NOTHING cheap? Why would I sell unreleased protos cheap? If you have no money, I have no idea where this is going with you.

hellfire

05-22-2009, 10:23 PM

DreamTR

05-22-2009, 10:37 PM

Nope, I sold almost all of my disk protos.

TRM

05-22-2009, 10:58 PM

Damn DreamTR, I really do not know how you can take all of this bullshit, after so many long years of doing so. Props to ya.

Buyatari

05-22-2009, 10:59 PM

I ment protos of something that was accualy released, Im really interested in buying a jet moto prototype or beta, do you have any jet moto protos?

Perhaps if you start a new topic as the title is a bit misleading. It is clear you aren't in the market for unreleased undumped prototypes. Before you ask for any more titles...Sniderman wants to know How much do you have to spend? $5 ? $10 ? more ? less ?

Pachuka - You talk about Dream and how he should not care what happens to the ROM after he releases it. Why should he care if someone were to take the rom and sell copies. Yet the other settences you post all have to do with YOU caring a whole heck of a lot about the way Dream released a crappy game you have no intention of playing anyway. If it is indeed a "who cares" case then really WHO CARES ??

What is the core to this beef as I don't get it.

If someone bids on a $300 repo on eBay who cares as they should have done their homework but if forum members want to chip in and release a ROM THEN it is a probelm? Shouldn't they have done their homework? At least they aren't being lied to where on ebay it is often a lie. The forum members may have bought swampland in your eyes but they were told exactly what they were getting. What is worse is that NONE of them are complaining it is the people who didn't chip in that are complaining about the people who did !

Makes no sense.

DreamTR

05-22-2009, 11:09 PM

TRM: I think it's just a bunch of naive people over the years. Their age usually stays around the same, but as they get older, they start to realize how silly they are being. What I really don't understand is why my name is the one in the middle of this mostly. I don't even have a website saying what I have with pics or anything, and when a lot of stuff is released through lost levels, drx, and others, somehow I am still a horder or bad guy, which turns into profiteer now. It's not like I am making money from these games..I should just leave everything in a box and really horde everything like people say I do, but it's simple economics here as to why I'm not going to give away something for nothing.

There's a ton of hypocrisy about these games when repros show up too. If someone makes copies of a proto (20 or 30 of them in a limited run) and one of the repro site makers release their own, somehow the person who originally made repros thinks he has a right to the exclusivity of that game even if it is someone else's work!

Once it is out of my hands, it's out of my hands, but at the very least, I'm more against pirating than anything else and seriously, the Atari 2600 prototype market and even regular market can be out of hand for high end stuff, whereas the NES one is not like that, but the more repro stuff that gets put out there WILL confuse people. You can do your research all you want, but someone is going to get burned.

Baloo

05-22-2009, 11:24 PM

My 2 cents:
(I've made a similar connection before...)

Let's say I have a game, cost me $1,000 or so, and I give away a ROM image. Let's say you have a game that cost you $800 and you would like to keep it to yourself, but you share pictures and knowledge or whatever. The first is simply philanthropy and the 2nd is an item in a private collection.

The same goes for art, I buy a painting for let say, $12,000 dollars, and I give it to a local university or museum collection. Let's now say you bought a painting for $1,000,000 dollars and hang it in your home. The first is simply philanthropy and the 2nd is an item in a private collection.

Then...

The museum sells tickets to see the painting and what do I get? $0. Why would I do that and not sell it to them? Personal decision, mine being I wanted my name on a little bronze plaque quietly placed under the work. They sell prints, the image is used in countless books, magazines, etc. I got: $0.

You kept you painting in your home, and perhaps had it digitized and sold its use to textbooks, magazines, who ever might want it. Why would I do that and not sell it to them? Personal decision, this time being motivated by the need to donate a new building to a local free health center. What do you get? $$$$$$ for your health center, your house payments, to put your child through college, to buy a whore or get high. It's your money.

Yeah, but if you're planning on donating something just to get recognition, it better be one hell of a ROM image. The only person I can think of who achieved said fame off a ROM was Simon Wai for the Sonic 2 Prototype. And that was some serious groundbreaking shit for a really popular game. If someone found a prototype of FF7 with totally different levels and shit and leaked a ROM of it onto the internet, they would become famous. But if someone found a copy of Shaq-Fu or Sword of Sodon that had totally different levels in it, nobody would give a flying fuck about it.

Really, I wouldn't call donating Philanthropy all the time...

ProgrammingAce

05-22-2009, 11:33 PM

I don't really care if some text is changed or not, it's a non issue to me. But you're fooling yourself if you think it's going to stop anybody from making repros and selling them as legit betas.

Look at the Bio Force Ape thread, people were offing thousands of dollars for a cart that never existed. It's human nature, and like Buyatari said, people are selfish.

I used to watermark the images on my website so people couldn't steal them and put them on ebay as their own. Then people like pachuka came buy and wiped the watermarks anyway. If someone is determined to scam a collector, the sad reality is that there's nothing you can do to stop it. Hell, there are already 4 different versions of the punch out 2 rom with your titlescreen mod removed.

If you're having nintendo age change the title screen to help advertise their site, there's nothing wrong with that. They paid $1,500, why not advertise?

I was saying the other day, you should ride that gravy train as long as you can. I can't imagine the community at nintendo age can afford to spend $500-1500 dollars on too many proto games only to find out they're mostly garbage.One thing i've learned over the years, unreleased games are unreleased for a reason. And betas weren't released as-is for a reason

PACHUKA

05-22-2009, 11:34 PM

Well shit, if we're all dollah dollah bill yo, let's go all out! =P

Where is a good place to have PCBs made?

DreamTR

05-22-2009, 11:34 PM

ProgrammingAce

05-22-2009, 11:52 PM

There's been more than one Sonic 2 proto dumped, too.. The last one on drx's site came through me....

Also, that watermark...they would need to reinsert the info 100% as opposed to just removing it....it at least acts as a deterrent, and it's the only thing I have.

If i were selling it on ebay, why would i even need to show that screen? Maybe that screen isn't included in this "fake" proto.

Hell, i can build an NES game in about a week at this point, i already have the engine setup. I could easily make a couple of "incomplete" games in a few weeks. All i have to do is say i bought them from a friend who used to work for some magazine and nobody would question me. Make a couple grand each that way.

Imagine i weren't honest about the Bio Force Ape game Brat and I are making. Imagine we were trying to scam someone (even you). We could easily have made the game in secret, presented it as a prototype and sold it for $8,000-10,000. All i'd have to do is say i've been searching for the game for years and finally tracked down one of the programmers who still had a copy. Hell, i could even claim i wasn't taking any of the profit but was selling it for him.

Nobody would ever know...

DreamTR

05-23-2009, 12:14 AM

ProgAce: I know people cancome up with elaborate hoaxes but I'm not one of the big players anymore, I would just sit back and watch...people at that point can say anything about anything that can be scammed. I am just doing it as one style of deterrent. Regardless, nothing was changed on the gameplay on Tyson...

tubeway

05-23-2009, 11:27 AM

you can have this one for $1250.oo

Shadowhawk for SNES comes with a letter from an Image Comics employee

Woah, Shadowhawk exists as a game? Does the character also have AIDS in the game, with a slowly decreasing lifebar?

mrmark0673

05-23-2009, 11:39 AM

Glad to see this thread finally spiral out of control into another hoarder thread. I'm going to continue buying protos and doing whatever I want with them, most others should just do the same. Either spend the money or shut the fuck up, it's as simple as that. If you don't pony up the cash for the protos, you are still more than entitled to your own opinion, and I'm still not going to give a shit. People are going to give dream shit for as long as people are interested in protos and its a damn shame. If you want him to do something different with his protos, that's great, just buy the game off of him and do whatever you want with it. I bought 2 unreleased games from him recently and I couldn't be happier, he is one of the easiest people to deal with and follows through very quickly with deals.

Buyatari

05-23-2009, 08:48 PM

If i were selling it on ebay, why would i even need to show that screen? Maybe that screen isn't included in this "fake" proto.

Hell, i can build an NES game in about a week at this point, i already have the engine setup. I could easily make a couple of "incomplete" games in a few weeks. All i have to do is say i bought them from a friend who used to work for some magazine and nobody would question me. Make a couple grand each that way.

Imagine i weren't honest about the Bio Force Ape game Brat and I are making. Imagine we were trying to scam someone (even you). We could easily have made the game in secret, presented it as a prototype and sold it for $8,000-10,000. All i'd have to do is say i've been searching for the game for years and finally tracked down one of the programmers who still had a copy. Hell, i could even claim i wasn't taking any of the profit but was selling it for him.

Nobody would ever know...

Sure it CAN be done. A right click disable can be circumvented on your ebay photos and so can watermarks on your photos. BUT it makes it harder. It will stop SOME of the people. If someone really wants to break into my house at night they can but I'm still locking the doors !!

I think those that can't see it has to come from not collecting the physcial carts. To you all of the goodness is in the ROM and the cart a vessel to collectors most of the value but not all of it is in the ROM. The cart still has some dollar value. Being the greedy hording type we hold on to that value if we can ;)

DreamTR

05-23-2009, 10:24 PM

Evil Horde Evil Horde Gobble Gobble Horde

ProgrammingAce

05-24-2009, 12:53 AM

PapaStu said something that i think hits the nail on the head here. We have an entire generation of people who have grown up able to get any song, movie or video game for free. For the last 10 years, you've been able to grab a set of roms that includes ever game in the SNES library. You can play them on your PC, on any one of a number of portables or on you TV. There are even flash carts you can get to play them into the original consoles.

So you have a generation of people who can play whatever game they want, whenever they want for free. And now they've found that people actually own games that they can't play. They don't know how to handle it. They can have every other game on the planet, why can't they play these? They don't own carts for all the other roms they have, so why should the fact they don't own these betas prevent them from playing those?

It's only going to get worse as time goes on...

DreamTR

05-24-2009, 01:03 AM

PA: I used to refer to them as "ROM kiddies" because in all honestly, they don't collect. If you really think about it, how many of the people always asking for ROMS and expecting free shit collect games like I do. Even at the smallest of levels? Most of the bigger proto collectors just want one of a kinds, but to be chastised by people that don't understand is way funny.

ProgrammingAce

05-24-2009, 01:13 AM

Honestly, i've given up on collecting software unless it's something really out of the ordinary. I'll stick with hardware, nobody expects me to dump hardware. Well, at least nobody sane...

PACHUKA

05-24-2009, 03:01 AM

Well, you know what, I feel like i learned a lot about the collector mind, and I think the collector's got a bit closer to seeing things through the eyes of the more digitally minded folks. This thread got a bit rude now and again, but to a much smaller degree, and I'm really happy about that. So, since this stalemate is a bit stale and cliche, how about we let it get back on track as the creator of it wished, and take what we learned about each other and relax. This crap gets a bit exhausting. I'll just state I respect the collector aspect, and the people who have that mentality. We just have different opinions, and opinions make people hostile. But when we meet in the middle, we find much less irritating communications. Wtf, pretending to be all profound and shit. I'm getting too old to argue on the internet, what to do with my life now?

tubeway

05-24-2009, 08:10 AM

And that's....

ONE TO GROW ON!

*catchy jingle*

PACHUKA

05-24-2009, 03:38 PM

And that's....

ONE TO GROW ON!

*catchy jingle*

http://x-cult.org/!trash/the_more_you_know2.jpg

Buyatari

05-24-2009, 06:16 PM

Guy Bramsworth

05-24-2009, 06:22 PM

What games did you bring? Maybe they weren't interesting enough :p

Or you needed a huge sign that said UNRELEASED GAMES YOU'LL NEVER SEE THESE ANYWHERE ELSE :)

ProgrammingAce

05-24-2009, 07:01 PM

Back from the show. Check out www.ccagshow.com for pics if you were not there.

Almost forgot to bring the unreleased games. Almost. But I did bring them. Showed them off and again no one cared. No one wanted to play them. However there was some good news a ripped label mystery sega cart saw some love this year and was sold. I don't think I'll bring them anymore. People just don't care.

I brought a bunch of prototype hardware and dev kits to MGC this year. Some people cared, but there really wasn't much interest. Considering some stuff got banged up on the way, there's no way i'm doing that again.

Hawanja

05-24-2009, 07:50 PM

Interesting discussion here. Honestly I don't even see why this is such a hot subject. I agree with DreamTR, if you own the proto it's yours to do whatever the hell you want with it, and it's perfectly acceptable to watermark any release to protect your own investment.

Don't know why people think it's selfish to want to do this.

TRM

05-24-2009, 08:14 PM

Back from the show. Check out www.ccagshow.com for pics if you were not there.

Almost forgot to bring the unreleased games. Almost. But I did bring them. Showed them off and again no one cared. No one wanted to play them. However there was some good news a ripped label mystery sega cart saw some love this year and was sold. I don't think I'll bring them anymore. People just don't care.

That surprises me, as I was always under the impression that this sort of convention was targeted primarily at collectors, who might be interested in checking out some of the unreleased games. Oh well, probably a misconception on my part.

DreamTR

05-24-2009, 08:20 PM

You can seriously count the "prototype" collectors as less than 10 or so. People really do not care much (collectors) and the ones who do want the ROM because if it's not available anywhere else, that's where the basic supply/demand cause comes about raising the price of said item.

There is a possibility I "should" be getting a pile more stuff soon, but said parties usually take awhile to ship, so we'll see how that goes.

Buyatari

05-24-2009, 09:28 PM

That surprises me, as I was always under the impression that this sort of convention was targeted primarily at collectors, who might be interested in checking out some of the unreleased games. Oh well, probably a misconception on my part.

No I think you are right. I think it was mostly collectors. I just think that collectors were looking for a deal on Chrono Trigger etc.

skaar

05-25-2009, 10:50 AM

Wow, this is the first I heard of that whole Mike Tyson Power Punch thing. That's hilarious - I think I have an old copy myself - and I can say for sure I played it first ;)

TheRedEye

05-25-2009, 11:32 AM

Back from the show. Check out www.ccagshow.com for pics if you were not there.

Almost forgot to bring the unreleased games. Almost. But I did bring them. Showed them off and again no one cared. No one wanted to play them. However there was some good news a ripped label mystery sega cart saw some love this year and was sold. I don't think I'll bring them anymore. People just don't care.

Yeah, I had a similar experience at CGE 2003. I bought a booth just to show off unreleased games and promote my lost levels site, and while there was SOME interest, it was a lot smaller than I thought it would be.

Buyatari

05-25-2009, 04:47 PM

Yeah, I had a similar experience at CGE 2003. I bought a booth just to show off unreleased games and promote my lost levels site, and while there was SOME interest, it was a lot smaller than I thought it would be.

I had some interest on AA after the show (see the CCAG thread). We might get a table for the fall set up with just unreleased games and obscure systems to play. If you have something you want us to pass out to promote your site we can have these there as well.

badinsults

05-25-2009, 05:53 PM

Yeah, I had a similar experience at CGE 2003. I bought a booth just to show off unreleased games and promote my lost levels site, and while there was SOME interest, it was a lot smaller than I thought it would be.

It surprises me too.

On my website, the unreleased section probably accounts for 50% of my traffic. A couple of weeks ago, one of the developers of the game Eurit emailed me thanking me for making the binary available and for covering the game. Even if a binary is not available, I think there is a large amount of people who do appreciate reading information about these games that never were meant to be.

Borman

05-25-2009, 06:12 PM

The problem with most of those shows for me is A. Location and B. Not finding out about them until after they happen.

Buyatari

05-25-2009, 06:20 PM

It surprises me too.

On my website, the unreleased section probably accounts for 50% of my traffic. A couple of weeks ago, one of the developers of the game Eurit emailed me thanking me for making the binary available and for covering the game. Even if a binary is not available, I think there is a large amount of people who do appreciate reading information about these games that never were meant to be.

I really think that in general the people who amass ROMs and those who horde the physical carts are two different people. So at a show for physical cart collectors few might care but if some ROM collectors found out prior to the show they might come out and see them. I dunno. Just a guess.

badinsults

05-25-2009, 06:57 PM

I really think that in general the people who amass ROMs and those who horde the physical carts are two different people. So at a show for physical cart collectors few might care but if some ROM collectors found out prior to the show they might come out and see them. I dunno. Just a guess.

Of course, if I had the time and money, I would come out to see your games in order to take pictures and get impressions. I don't have the money, which is why I have decided not to really get involved in this conversation. I've gone through about 20 different prototype ROM images for my site, and I appreciate those people who have let me document them for my website, and I hope others enjoyed it.

hellfire

06-19-2009, 04:23 PM

can we have this locked please, I will go proto hunting when I have the money and complete seriousness to do so

hellfire

06-20-2009, 12:44 PM

Mods please lock this, I dont want to cause any trouble and I would appreciate it if this thread was locked

Sniderman

06-20-2009, 01:17 PM

I don't have Mod powers in this forum, so I can't lock it. However, the thread had been kind of forgotten and was moving off the main page - until you bumped it to the top with this request. If I were you, I would have sent a private message to a mod asking that it be closed rather than shooting it right back to the top of the forum with a public post in the thread.

http://x-cult.org/!trash/the_more_you_know2.jpg

PingvinBlueJeans

06-20-2009, 05:27 PM

If I were you, I would have sent a private message to a mod...
Not necessary. If you want a thread that you started locked...

Click on the thread in question and click on Thread Tools. You should see an option for "Close Thread" underneath 'Moderation Tools'. Click the button that says 'Perform Action'.

The more you know indeed. ;)

ProgrammingAce

06-20-2009, 05:39 PM

** Bump **

Lady Jaye

06-20-2009, 06:30 PM

Not necessary. If you want a thread that you started locked...

Click on the thread in question and click on Thread Tools. You should see an option for "Close Thread" underneath 'Moderation Tools'. Click the button that says 'Perform Action'.

The more you know indeed. ;)

Hmm, he doesn't have mod powers in that forum, as noted above. ;)

PingvinBlueJeans

06-20-2009, 09:22 PM

Hmm, he doesn't have mod powers in that forum, as noted above. ;)
I was giving hellfire (or anyone else) directions on how to close his own thread. Sniderman's lack of mod powers is irrelevant. Anyone can lock their own threads.

Watch...I'll lock one of my old threads.

http://www.digitpress.com/forum/showthread.php?t=128411

Done. ;)

TheDomesticInstitution

06-20-2009, 09:49 PM

I was giving hellfire (or anyone else) directions on how to close his own thread. Sniderman's lack of mod powers is irrelevant. Anyone can lock their own threads.

Watch...I'll lock one of my old threads.

http://www.digitpress.com/forum/showthread.php?t=128411

Done. ;)

Mr. Pingvin you're only partially right. Only in certain forums on here, can you lock your own threads. Like buying and selling and everything auctions. Most other forums on here you can't lock your own threads. Try it.

Lady Jay's and Sniderman's advice is correct for the most part, and yours (as it pertains here) is mostly not. I would trust a mod before a regular member.

PingvinBlueJeans

06-20-2009, 10:12 PM

Only in certain forums on here, can you lock your own threads. Like buying and selling and everything auctions.
Ha...who knew?

I think I've only started threads in Buying and Selling, that's why. I also was thinking this was a wanted thread, but it's actually in the Prototype forum.

I guess I'm pwned!

TheDomesticInstitution

06-20-2009, 10:53 PM

I guess I'm pwned!

I'm not pwning, just educating

ProgrammingAce

06-25-2009, 10:56 PM

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tubeway

06-26-2009, 07:59 AM

stonic

06-28-2009, 12:50 AM

I was giving hellfire (or anyone else) directions on how to close his own thread. Sniderman's lack of mod powers is irrelevant.

I believe mods (both current and former) here are quite capable of educating others on the finer points of navigating the forums.

I would trust a mod before a regular member.

Exactly, plus I should mention that Sniderman was a mod here not that long ago.

PingvinBlueJeans

06-28-2009, 03:03 PM

I believe mods (both current and former) here are quite capable of educating others on the finer points of navigating the forums.
Capable as they are, the thread is still open 10 days after the OP asked to have it closed.

More importantly, I believe Sniderman or other mods are "capable" of responding to my earlier (apparently erroneous) comments themselves if they really felt the need, but obviously you can't resist jumping in (as usual). Small wonder.

Buyatari

06-28-2009, 10:45 PM

Capable as they are, the thread is still open 10 days after the OP asked to have it closed.

Pandora

stonic

06-29-2009, 12:35 AM

More importantly, I believe Sniderman or other mods are "capable" of responding to my earlier (apparently erroneous) comments themselves if they really felt the need, but obviously you can't resist jumping in (as usual). Small wonder.

The only thing obvious here is you have quite the habit of getting your 2c in, and with your typical attitude. You've also taken it upon yourself to be the unofficial spokesperson for DP. For example:

http://www.atariage.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=146010

Now, why Michael Rideout would start a thread about a credit typo (right after emailing Joe) I don't know, but I'm quite certain he wouldn't have needed any help emailing Joe if he hadn't already.

You don't speak for Joe, or John, or me, or anyone else directly involved with DP. And since you're not directly involved with DP, I'll kindly ask you to stop giving people the impression that you are.