Morality, ethics, steals and deals of collecting

[Diatribal Deity]

So...last Sunday I got the heads up from a friend that the Microsoft Store was offering the Modern Warfare 2 Bundle with Dragon Age Origins, Assassins Creed 2 and 3 months of LIve for 399.99 (+tax, free shipping). Earlier in the weekend you had to call, but that day I jumped online to check things out.

Now I have an older 360 already but I could always use another especially with the big HD and Jasper and the games were very attractive as well. So I start adding items to my cart:

(1) MW 2 Bundle 399.99
(2) DAO 0.00
(1) AC2 0.00
(1) 3 month Live 0.00

Total: 399.99 + tax

Oops..added an extra DAO there...but wait, it still says 0.00. Interesting, let me try something:

(1) MW 2 Bundle 399.99
(5) DAO 0.00
(5) AC2 0.00
(5) 3 month Live 0.00

Total: 399.99 + tax

So as I sat there pondering and amazed at the glitch, I began recollecting times where I actually was hit with a moral dilemma while either purchasing, trading, and collecting games.

The last time I was in a somewhat different yet related quandary is when I received a few Neo Geo games I bought off Ebay for a great price, but the seller left a few memory cards in the cases. The seller did not have the greatest feedback and took a few reminders to eventually actually ship the stuff (thus also the great price I got) but now I felt guilty. Nevermind the value of these things, but how 'bout the fact he/she could have some important saves on there.

Now, I'm not going to tell you the actual final actions I took in these situations (as differnet people may judge it in different ways) and I would not expect you to do the same. But I am interested in situations you have been put in whether it be morally or ethically while purchasing games or collecting.

This right now, as I continue to do my Xmas shopping online and notice that the current normal 8% cash back using Bing for Ebay magically transforms to 15% if you do a search for Nintendo WII...hmmm...maybe Karma is coming back at Microsoft with a vengeance as a result of that RROD.

[TonyTheTiger]

I think there's a difference between getting a deal and screwing somebody over.

Somebody selling a Turbo Duo at a flea market for $8? That's a good deal. I don't think the buyer has any moral obligation to say anything. If he does anyway then that's just going above the standard making him a better man that I am. Now saying something after the purchase? "Yo, this Turbo Duo you sold me for $8? Ha, it's worth triple digits." That's just being a dick. Say thank you and leave.

Now if you bought the Turbo Duo for $8 and there's a CD in there the seller didn't know about? Or the seller made a computation error and gave too much change? I think there's a moral imperative to at least make a reasonable effort to bring up the issue. In some cases this might be impossible. You buy the thing in Florida at a random yard sale while on vacation and don't realize something is wrong until you get home to California. But in most cases I think honest mistakes of that sort are relatively easy to spot and easy to fix.

The reason I see it this way is because I'm a big balance junkie. If the reverse happened, where the seller made a mistake and sold the unit as less than he intended the buyer would rightfully expect the seller to do something about it. If the Turbo Duo were sold as working for a normal price but it turned out to be broken the buyer would expect either refund of all or some of the money or for the seller to fix the item. If the buyer is forced to eat a bad deal it's often done begrudgingly so.

Where is the balance if the buyer says "if something goes wrong for the seller and right for me then I win" and simultaneously "if something goes right for the seller and wrong for me then I refuse to lose"?

[Gameguy]

Somebody selling a Turbo Duo at a flea market for $8? That's a good deal. I don't think the buyer has any moral obligation to say anything. If he does anyway then that's just going above the standard making him a better man that I am. Now saying something after the purchase? "Yo, this Turbo Duo you sold me for $8? Ha, it's worth triple digits." That's just being a dick. Say thank you and leave.
What about haggling it down to $5? To me that would be a jerk move too, though plenty of people seem to haggle down anything they can.


Now if you bought the Turbo Duo for $8 and there's a CD in there the seller didn't know about?
I might mention it to the seller if there's plenty of the same type of games being sold separately, but if they just had the system with the one game inside I might not. It could be that the seller didn't bother to check because they never bothered to test the system. I actually sold an untested Model 1 Sega CD and later the buyer told me there was a game inside, I wasn't mad at him because I didn't check the system out and it was my fault, not his. Plus it wasn't a copy of Snatcher or something like that so I didn't mind.

Edit: I should mention that I sold the Sega CD as untested, I made sure the buyer knew this before buying it. I didn't have the hookups and couldn't test it at the time, and I just wanted it gone.

[ScourDX]

The way I look at it if the user selling at that price, then I don't have to tell them how much it is actually worth. At time I purchased DC games from a kid, he was selling them for $5 a piece. So I manage to picked up Powerstone 2 and few other rarity for that price. Later on he regrets selling it for that cheap and wants more money. So do I say yes you can have more money or should I ignore him? I ignore him because it was his mistake selling his stuff for $5/game.

At one time I use the price mistake from a Circuit City website. They listed Assassins Creed Limited edition for $19.99, but in fact it was the regular edition for that price. So I went to Bestbuy ask for price match. They give it to me for $16.99. So I got the Limited edition for cheap. Is it unethical? You can argue both ways.

[Fuyukaze]

Ethics in gaming. What a novel concept. When it comes to gaming, I often find most throw such things as morality and ethics to the wind. I myself am no different as I'd never pass up a chance to get something for as little as possible. Brag about getting something for cheap? Sure, I'd do that. To my friends or on a message board. I fail to see where it lacks in tact either. To the seller's face? No, that's insulting and hatefull. It's one thing to jump on a deal, it's another to insult a seller. Take something I didnt pay for by intent? If it's trash, it's fair game. If it's not, then it is stealing. If it came with what I bought, I dont see a problem. Point is, the burden of getting what they want isnt upon the buyer but on the seller. If the seller cant be bothered to check the content of what they are selling, I dont feel guilty if I get something extra. If they have so much to sell that they cant take the time to check, I cant force them to be more responsible. It's not nice, I dont liike it, but I'm not going to force people to care about something that should be more important to them then to myself.

[TonyTheTiger]

I think it's the times that we know we can get away with something that we must remain the most ethical. Specifically because those are the times it's easiest to toss values aside.

Take situations where there's no actual "theft" going on but you are still getting something for nothing and essentially screwing over the next guy, whoever that may be. For example, walking into a GameStop, going through all the used DS and Wii games, and copying down the registration codes to earn points on Nintendo's website?

On one hand, GameStop does not guarantee those codes will work so technically the next buyer should not expect that they will. As far as GameStop is concerned, the registration codes in used games are junk. If people buy used games and the codes works, they got lucky. If not, they got what they paid for.

On the other hand, you still got something for nothing. And the actual buyer, who would have gotten lucky, lost out on that little perk.

Is this unethical?


What about haggling it down to $5? To me that would be a jerk move too, though plenty of people seem to haggle down anything they can.

I'm inclined to say no. I think even in a good buying situation it's ok to negotiate since you aren't forcing the other party to accept the deal. I don't think trying to turn a good deal into a great deal is a bad thing. I think ethical problems start when there's some sort of absconding with something the seller did not intend you to abscond with and the mistake is obvious. You buy something for $15 and pay with a $20. The seller accidentally gives you a ten instead of a five. You realize the mistake but keep quiet and leave. Yes, the seller should have been paying attention. But at this point I'd say the ethical thing to do is speak up about it.

The reason is, again, balance. If you left and only later realized the seller gave you a single instead of a five you'd want the remaining four dollars. If you expect the seller to eat his loss you should be willing to eat your loss when things don't go your way. But nobody ever does that kind of math. Nobody who gets screwed on Ebay says "well, this time I ended up paying full price for a broken Turbo Duo but last time I bought a Sega CD and the seller accidentally left a copy of Snatcher inside. So I guess I won't file a complaint here because the previous "win" makes up for today's loss."

[Cornelius]

Ah, the 'bonus' game. I love those. My best was an NES I bought with 30 games or so. It was a great deal to begin with, but when I got home I found it had Dragon Warrior II in it. Yay! This one is pretty clear, though, as even if I pointed it out, they were just selling all of it and it wouldn't have mattered. I've gotten bonuses in PS1s and 2s, too.

On the other hand, I bought a PS2 once that was in a little plastic bin. After paying I was looking it over some more and underneath was NES Sesame Street 123/ABC, an uncommon game that I'd actually had an eye out for. Well, had it been a PS2 game I wouldn't have said anything, but since it didn't 'belong', I did mention it. Frankly, I figured they'd just give it to me or want a few bucks for it, but I felt it would have been wrong to just keep it. Well, the woman was like 'OMG, that's a super rare game that's worth like 30 or 40 bucks!' Well, no, no it isn't really worth anything. Hard to find, sure, but worthless. So I just walked away after handing it to her.

[Icarus Moonsight]

Any trade, be it in money and/or goods, that is done voluntarily by both parties is completely, totally and absolutely ethical and moral. Any other means of exchange is the direct opposite. End of story. I can say that so convicted because there is no way that you can twist "Gaming Stuff Acquisition" into "Stealing Bread for Survival".

Even in the case of your bonus item glitch find... If you put it in your cart, let their site give you the price, checkout and then they still ship it to you, without the order flagging for the obvious "WTF!?" reasons... You're clear.

I thought I found an insane deal similar to that recently. They were 'giving away' some items through an online shop and they had no apparent limit, so I went mad with the quantity edits. I was stopped at checkout though because each item carried a $25 shipping and handling charge... Yup, sometimes 'free' is just a trap. LOL

[ScourDX]

Take situations where there's no actual "theft" going on but you are still getting something for nothing and essentially screwing over the next guy, whoever that may be. For example, walking into a GameStop, going through all the used DS and Wii games, and copying down the registration codes to earn points on Nintendo's website?

On one hand, GameStop does not guarantee those codes will work so technically the next buyer should not expect that they will. As far as GameStop is concerned, the registration codes in used games are junk. If people buy used games and the codes works, they got lucky. If not, they got what they paid for.

On the other hand, you still got something for nothing. And the actual buyer, who would have gotten lucky, lost out on that little perk.

Is this unethical?

Something can be said about used Xbox360 games with their exclusive DLC code. What really piss me off is when someone steal the code for the new game. I've purchased new copy only to find the code was used by someone else. Mind you Gamestop/EB Games isn't the best when it comes to selling gutted copy as new.

[Gameguy]

I'm inclined to say no. I think even in a good buying situation it's ok to negotiate since you aren't forcing the other party to accept the deal. I don't think trying to turn a good deal into a great deal is a bad thing. I think ethical problems start when there's some sort of absconding with something the seller did not intend you to abscond with and the mistake is obvious. You buy something for $15 and pay with a $20. The seller accidentally gives you a ten instead of a five. You realize the mistake but keep quiet and leave. Yes, the seller should have been paying attention. But at this point I'd say the ethical thing to do is speak up about it.

The reason is, again, balance. If you left and only later realized the seller gave you a single instead of a five you'd want the remaining four dollars. If you expect the seller to eat his loss you should be willing to eat your loss when things don't go your way. But nobody ever does that kind of math. Nobody who gets screwed on Ebay says "well, this time I ended up paying full price for a broken Turbo Duo but last time I bought a Sega CD and the seller accidentally left a copy of Snatcher inside. So I guess I won't file a complaint here because the previous "win" makes up for today's loss."
I agree with the correct change situations, I wouldn't just keep extra money. That actually happened to me in some thrift stores where the cashier was giving me too much back, I told her it was too much. I know at the end of the day the cash register would be checked and if it's short, she'd get in trouble.

I do feel bad about one situation, I was selling a game on Kijiji for $40 and a kid with his dad showed up to meet with me. The kid paid for it with his own money, he handed me a ziploc bag full of mostly pennies, nickels, dimes, and quarters. There were a few small bills inside too(no more than $20 worth, if that much), I trusted him so I didn't count it then as it would have taken a long time. I just kept the bag of cash aside at home, but eventually I got around to checking it and there was $41 there. I would have given the $1 back if I had counted it then, I remember them saying they traveled pretty far to meet with me(like over an hour each way by highway) so I don't think they would have met with me again to get $1 back. Gas would have cost more than that. This was a few years ago, I don't even know if I still had their email address when I got around to counting it.

I personally wouldn't haggle on an already great deal unless I didn't have enough money with me to pay that much, I don't try to haggle that much. There have been a few times when I actually offered to pay more than the asking price, and not just because there were other people already interested in it. Some things were just way too low for me to feel comfortable with buying it, even with what I offered to them they were still great deals in my opinion. And I'm not someone that feels it's only right to pay the going rate, I like buying stuff priced well below that.

[portnoyd]

http://i38.tinypic.com/243rlok.jpg

[wfnjstallion]

What about ethics when you go retro video game shopping with a friend? Awhile back I did just that and it just so happens both of us were looking for TMNT IV Turtles In Time (among many other games) and I spotted it first & other than reaching over the counter & grabbing the clerk before my friend spotted it snagged the game 1st. My feeling is first come first serve and from what I can tell he agreed.

On an unrelated note portnoyd I love the over the door shoe hanger as a way of storing VG controllers, BRILLIANT!!!

[joshnickerson]

What about ethics when you go retro video game shopping with a friend?

Me and my friend usually hunt for different systems, but if we find a game we both want, we handle it as mature adults would.

We Roshambo for it.

A couple of months ago, I was at the dirt mall and some lady was selling games and DVDs. The games were four bux each and the DVDs were a dollar. I picked out a couple of Gamecube games I needed for the collection and handed her a ten. She was busy with a couple of other customers, so she took the ten and handed me back eight bucks. For a brief second, I ALMOST walked away, but thought better of it. "Uh, I got two GAMES ma'am," handing her back a five and a single. "OH! I thought they were movies!" she said, taking the bills, "Thank you for being honest." Could I have just walked away? Absolutely. But I wouldn't have felt proud of myself.

[jferio]

I had one of those at the Entertainmart in Colorado Springs... I saw Final Fantasy VII for the PS1 there on the shelf... for $4. Complete. They had other copies, with higher pricing on them, that enabled me to verify that it was a sweetly good deal at that price. So I bought it.

I still haven't attempted to play through it, though.

[awbacon]

once...not on this forum, a seller had a game for sale at like 1/3 the going rate....something rare (who knows if anyone saw this)...it wasnt a 'oh shit...bills are due' sale, and I didn't want it.

So I sent the guy a pm saying "yo, I dont know if you meant to sell it at that, but check this price list"...he was super appreciative

I just did it cause if I made that mistake, i'd like it if someone gave me the heads up as well

[Zthun]

Here's my take on this, and at the risk of losing all respect of everyone on these forums (which I probably don't have anyway), I will be completely honest.

In these situations, I don't believe in karma. I am a complete and utter ass hole; if the deal is in my favor, I am out for myself (as long as I won't get jail time for it, which in this case I might POSSIBLY think twice about ordering too much). OP, I congratulate you on being a good human being or I congratulate you on getting a great deal (whatever you choose); if it was me, I would have made off with the goods. I'd love to tell everyone here that I'm a saint and an angel, but I'm not. Have a nice day!

[Icarus Moonsight]

Lose respect for that? Certainly not from me. The thing about people selling things for far under usual going rates is, if they were even trying to gauge that "market price" and sorely missed it, they still get something of value from the exchange after they realize that they miscalculated. A somewhat painful and sore seller's remorse that will remind and nag them to do their homework in the future. When in doubt, it never hurts to ask around with more knowledgeable people either. Pain has a purpose, it's a life experience feedback mechanism. No matter how many times you tell a little kid not to touch the stove/oven or radiator, because it will burn and hurt, the reality of the lesson doesn't truly strike home, and become properly integrated into their knowledge base, until they actually burn themselves and discover it for themselves.

[nhm]

Here's my take on this, and at the risk of losing all respect of everyone on these forums (which I probably don't have anyway), I will be completely honest.

In these situations, I don't believe in karma. I am a complete and utter ass hole; if the deal is in my favor, I am out for myself (as long as I won't get jail time for it, which in this case I might POSSIBLY think twice about ordering too much). OP, I congratulate you on being a good human being or I congratulate you on getting a great deal (whatever you choose); if it was me, I would have made off with the goods. I'd love to tell everyone here that I'm a saint and an angel, but I'm not. Have a nice day!

Doesn't matter, you still pay for it. Stores just add the cost of losses into their prices. So, in a way, you are screwing over the people who do the right thing and pay for those games.

[Icarus Moonsight]

As opposed to a wrong thing? Please, connect the dots for me.

[nhm]

As opposed to a wrong thing? Please, connect the dots for me.

You were advocating that the OP take advantage of a website mistake and get as many games as possible. That would be the wrong thing. Those games will be written off as losses and the cost of those losses are passed on to the consumers who actually PAY to own those games. TANSTAAFL. If you don't know what that means, you should look it up.

[Zthun]

You were advocating that the OP take advantage of a website mistake and get as many games as possible. That would be the wrong thing. Those games will be written off as losses and the cost of those losses are passed on to the consumers who actually PAY to own those games. TANSTAAFL. If you don't know what that means, you should look it up.

Very true, but the cost goes to someone else, not the person who buys the games.

TANSTAAFL - There ain't no such thing as a free lunch. Always has been true on a global economic scale, but on an individual level, it doesn't hold as strongly.

And what, prey do tell, give anyone the right to be Mr. Righteous? Right and wrong are opinionated - they are not fact - they are what you were taught. They are never written in stone. What you are talking about is good and bad. Those come from experience. For example, it is probably a bad idea to touch a hot stove since you probably have a VERY good idea what the outcome is going to be. Doesn't make it right or wrong.

[nhm]

Very true, but the cost goes to someone else, not the person who buys the games.

How do you think companies make up the losses? They pass it on to the customer in their prices. So, yes the person buying the game is absorbing the cost of theives.


And what, prey do tell, give anyone the right to be Mr. Righteous? Right and wrong are opinionated - they are not fact - they are what you were taught. They are never written in stone. What you are talking about is good and bad. Those come from experience. For example, it is probably a bad idea to touch a hot stove since you probably have a VERY good idea what the outcome is going to be. Doesn't make it right or wrong.

Call me "righteous", but theivery is wrong.

[Zthun]

How do you think companies make up the losses? They pass it on to the customer in their prices. So, yes the person buying the game is absorbing the cost of theives.



Call me "righteous", but theivery is wrong.

Either way, I would have considered it a deal and taken the games.

[Oobgarm]

If a website glitches and you can take advantage of it, why not? They should have the ability to negate those extra orders at their discretion. If it gets through, then it's their loss for not noticing it. Live and learn, as they say.

If someone is selling an item of value for a low price, why not buy it without a word? They are charging an amount based on their perceived value of said item. If they wanted more, then they should have done the legwork in valuating it.

Had something kinda similar happen during the PSP launch with a rechargeable Blockbuster gift card I had. I traded in a pile of games, worth over $250 to them. They attempted to put it on the gift card for me, but the gift card was having a tough time getting approved. So they decided to credit my account for the $250 instead. Went back up to the store another day, used the credit on the account, had them check the gift card and the amount was on there, too. They were not the same employees who'd helped me previously, so I said nothing and proceeded to spend the whole thing. Made for a good score. Did I feel bad about it? Not at all.

[BetaWolf47]

What about ethics when you go retro video game shopping with a friend? Awhile back I did just that and it just so happens both of us were looking for TMNT IV Turtles In Time (among many other games) and I spotted it first & other than reaching over the counter & grabbing the clerk before my friend spotted it snagged the game 1st. My feeling is first come first serve and from what I can tell he agreed.

The argument here should be who needs it more. Look at it from this point of view: you're with someone who's just beginning to collect, while you have over 1000 games. You guys spot a huge lot of games including Final Fantasy 1-3 (US), Earthbound, Super Mario RPG, Final Fantasy VII-IX, Chrono Trigger, Breath of Fire I & II, Lufia I & II, Super Metroid, Castlevania I-IV, and Zelda 1-3. You spot it first, and ask the seller the price. He says $60, which would be a steal for that lot. While you want that deal badly, you already own a bunch of other games. The right thing to do here would be to grab your friend and ask if he wants it.

[TonyTheTiger]

snip.

How do you feel about copying down (or simply remembering) registration codes and DLC codes from used or shelf copies sitting in a GameStop?

[Zthun]

How do you feel about copying down (or simply remembering) registration codes and DLC codes from used or shelf copies sitting in a GameStop?

Holy shit! You can do that?

[Porksta]

Holy shit! You can do that?

Yeah, you can do it with Guitar Hero transfer codes pretty easily... or so I heard...


How about this scenario:

Guy posts that he is really in need of money and needs to sell some things. One of the things he lists is say Dragon Age Origins for 360. You offer him $25 - not a rip, but not near market value. Does the seller have any right to be upset? After all what is more important - the seller getting near market value for his game, or the seller getting money, which he said he very badly needs?

[Zthun]

Yeah, you can do it with Guitar Hero transfer codes pretty easily... or so I heard...


How about this scenario:

Guy posts that he is really in need of money and needs to sell some things. One of the things he lists is say Dragon Age Origins for 360. You offer him $25 - not a rip, but not near market value. Does the seller have any right to be upset? After all what is more important - the seller getting near market value for his game, or the seller getting money, which he said he very badly needs?

Yeah, he can be upset. I posted about this in the What's it Worth forums about whether or not you get offended if you receive a bad offer. In reality, he can be upset and pissed all he wants (I probably would be irritated too), but in the end, if he choose to sell me the game, or sell it to anyone for that matter, that's his issue; the way I see it, the buyer got a great deal.

On a serious note from the scenario above: Taking codes off the wall and writing them down does not involve an exchange of goods. This scenario is no different than me taking a game off the shelf and running out of the store with it (and if it was gutted - me looking pretty stupid later). Now with the original scenario, the OP was getting a package deal that came with multiple games. He is still paying for the package, but he's getting an outrageous discount that the original vendors probably don't want him to have. It would be like me paying $5 at Goodwill for a copy of Earthbound. They're just ignorant to what they have - and I get a great deal for it and I can smile about it later. Lucky break for me.

[Icarus Moonsight]

Besides, if MS can't code their damn store software properly, they have bigger problems than giving out unintentional free games and LIVE service...

There is morality and then there is aesthetics... Morality is black/white (well, in my mind. Rape is a immoral because it's initiated violence, and it's ridiculous to claim to have raped in self-defense). Aesthetics are the gray areas, and even cultural and more trivial social norms like etiquette, politeness etc. They also cover mentioning when you get too much change, sending a email to MS about the OP scenario, or even trying to take advantage of it and so forth. There is a clear division between them.

[Gameguy]

it's ridiculous to claim to have raped in self-defense
A person with a gun breaks into your workplace, threatens to kill you and everyone else there unless you rape a co-worker. What happens then? It happened in a Law and Order episode, something like that where the men were forced to rape the women.

[nebrazca78]

A person with a gun breaks into your workplace, threatens to kill you and everyone else there unless you rape a co-worker. What happens then? It happened in a Law and Order episode, something like that where the men were forced to rape the women.

Well if it's happened in Law and Order...



Once I was working at a local Kwik-E-Mart and a woman gave me a $100 bill thinking it was $10. I gave it back to her.



On a gaming note I once hit a BIN on eBay for tons of Sega games and hardware for $200 shipped. One of the games was Spider-Man for 32X which was worth about $150 at the time. I was not about to contact the seller and ask if I could pay extra money.

[Icarus Moonsight]

A person with a gun breaks into your workplace, threatens to kill you and everyone else there unless you rape a co-worker. What happens then? It happened in a Law and Order episode, something like that where the men were forced to rape the women.

That would not really be rape on their part though. The proper self-defense in that instance would be to beatdown, if not kill, the guy with the gun making the threats and ultimatums. The gunman committed both a threat of life on others, and at least an attempt of multiple rapes by proxy. Easy peasy. Gun's in play, choice is out the window. Either you have to neutralize the threat or do what they say in an attempt to preserve life. Life/existence is the primary value common among all humans. So violating that value is the crux of immorality. Anything else is pretty much aesthetics. You don't have to like it when people violate your aesthetic values, but you can take no forcible action against them for violating that value, well, morally speaking. You could, but then you are correcting aesthetic breaches of personal preference with universal moral violations. Kinda like opening a can of soup with a grenade. Overkill. LOL

[Joshie]

The argument here should be who needs it more. Look at it from this point of view: you're with someone who's just beginning to collect, while you have over 1000 games. You guys spot a huge lot of games including Final Fantasy 1-3 (US), Earthbound, Super Mario RPG, Final Fantasy VII-IX, Chrono Trigger, Breath of Fire I & II, Lufia I & II, Super Metroid, Castlevania I-IV, and Zelda 1-3. You spot it first, and ask the seller the price. He says $60, which would be a steal for that lot. While you want that deal badly, you already own a bunch of other games. The right thing to do here would be to grab your friend and ask if he wants it.

Or you buy the lot yourself, take what you need in your collection, and give him the rest as a gift. I do not see any bad karma in that situation!

[Icarus Moonsight]

Cherry picking for charity... Sounds like Goodwill Industries. :p

[Fear The Turtle]

A thing you have to realize about these deals with private people is a lot of people just DON'T CARE what the market value for a game is. They beat a game, they sell the game. It can be Chrono trigger SNES and they just see it as another old game and try to sell it for 10 bucks, never knowing it costs more than that on eBay. If they wanted to sell it for a lot of money, they'd put it on eBay. So, sometimes you have to realize people don't really care what their games are worth, and not everyone's in this hobby simply to have the nicest collection going.

[BetaWolf47]

Or you buy the lot yourself, take what you need in your collection, and give him the rest as a gift. I do not see any bad karma in that situation!

Yeah, that too. But if it's just one game neither of you have, and it's an amazing deal, I think it's best to let the person who has the inferior collection to have it.

[Icarus Moonsight]

Inferior huh? How congenial. :p

[Cornelius]

Or you buy the lot yourself, take what you need in your collection, and give him the rest as a gift. I do not see any bad karma in that situation!

I'm on board with this. To me, the person with the more complete collection has a much harder time finding anything to add to their collection. Sometimes lots are the only reasonable way to do it. So in a case like this, I'd almost say the person with fewer holes to fill has more 'right' to those items that will fill holes than the person that can use everything.

Interesting question to think about. With the people I know, it would pretty much be whoever got it first, but I'm we'd also sell to each other 'at cost' any items we weren't keeping. I don't really know any collectors, but I've hooked friends up that just want DDR or a NES at cost.

[Joshie]

Interesting question to think about. With the people I know, it would pretty much be whoever got it first, but I'm we'd also sell to each other 'at cost' any items we weren't keeping. I don't really know any collectors, but I've hooked friends up that just want DDR or a NES at cost.
I have this thing about making profit from my friends. It makes me feel bad. I tend to buy multiple copies of the things in my collection if the price is amazing because I know eventually a friend will need it and i can either give it to a friend or sell it for the price I bought it for.

However, this becomes a hassle when I am actually trying to sell off something face value to strangers and my friends want the usual friend treatment...

[Gameguy]

That would not really be rape on their part though. The proper self-defense in that instance would be to beatdown, if not kill, the guy with the gun making the threats and ultimatums. The gunman committed both a threat of life on others, and at least an attempt of multiple rapes by proxy. Easy peasy. Gun's in play, choice is out the window. Either you have to neutralize the threat or do what they say in an attempt to preserve life. Life/existence is the primary value common among all humans. So violating that value is the crux of immorality. Anything else is pretty much aesthetics. You don't have to like it when people violate your aesthetic values, but you can take no forcible action against them for violating that value, well, morally speaking. You could, but then you are correcting aesthetic breaches of personal preference with universal moral violations. Kinda like opening a can of soup with a grenade. Overkill. LOL
Yeah, the best thing to do would be to overpower the guy with the gun. I basically meant that if you couldn't do that and you were forced to rape someone or he'd start killing everyone else, would you have a valid defense as to why you raped someone.

It really depends on someone's morals, some people believe that any acts of violence are wrong and wouldn't commit any, even if it meant that other people would die as a result. Some people would rather choose death.



As to that other point about buying that awesome game lot instead of your friend who's with you, I'd buy the lot myself no problem. My friends aren't all that generous and they'd do the same thing to me. If anything, I'd buy the lot, keep what I want, and offer the rest to them at the original price so I'd break even. They'd probably offer the same to me, if not keep it to sell at a profit.

[Icarus Moonsight]

Yeah, the best thing to do would be to overpower the guy with the gun. I basically meant that if you couldn't do that and you were forced to rape someone or he'd start killing everyone else, would you have a valid defense as to why you raped someone.

It really depends on someone's morals, some people believe that any acts of violence are wrong and wouldn't commit any, even if it meant that other people would die as a result. Some people would rather choose death.

The dude with the gun is in control. It's all on him, no matter what happens.

[Gameguy]

The dude with the gun is in control. It's all on him, no matter what happens.
Legally it's all on him. You could still choose to refuse and take the bullet instead, even if that would mean everyone else would take the bullet too. I'm not saying that would necessarily be the better choice in the situation, it would mean death for everyone else who's there with you.

[SegaAges]

With the topic at hand: There is a huge, HUGE difference between snagging dlc codes, gaming morals, buyer morals, seller morals, and somebody who wrote up code for discounts and it obviously did not get tested good enough.

I am going to flip this. If Microsoft allows for shitty code to get through to production, than that is their bad, not yours. Microsoft is a big place, so it is safe to say that their massive QA department should have picked up that issue with discounted bundles.

There are many, many reasons why that chunk of code went through, but if that chunk of code hit production and is not fixed incredibly fast, I would say take advantage.

Is it morally wrong to take advantage of code that supposedly went through the QA department, which means it is ready to deploy to the masses? No, because if they wanted that code to act differently, than their QA department should have picked up on it.

Sure, glitches happen in the any system that even hits production, but if it is a glitch that deals with money, then they should be extra careful with their QA testing. I say take advantage of the fact that the chunk of code made it to production and you can use it.

[LaughingMAN.S9]

Either way, I would have considered it a deal and taken the games.

damn fucking right i would have, morality is a cheap human construct, im out for me and no one else, if i would have caught that glitch at the microsoft site, i would have bankrupted them lol


i know this is the internet and we all come from different walks of life, but seriously....pull your fuckin skirts up u pansies, if i see a deal im taking it, if i see someone drop a hundred dollar bill, its mine, i dont believe in karma because the righteous tend to get fucked simply for being righteous.


im not talking about stealing (thats a whole nother topic) but if some dumbass seller was too busy to check out what he was selling meticulously and price it accordingly, how is that my fault for exploiting him? im not made of money, if i saw radiant silvergun being sold for 20 dollars by some old lady at a flea market, im not going to stand there like a moron and corrrect her, how does help me? im going to very politely hand her a 20 dollar bill, then run off full speed to my car before someone more informed can connect the dots and tell her what just happened.


if you choose to live your life by the "moral" and "ethical" way, thats fine, but dont act high and mighty when others such as myself dont choose to play by your same rules, it'll be your own fault if u get taken advantage of. everything is subjective, morality and ethics included. there is no such thing as universal right and wrong.

[nebrazca78]

damn fucking right i would have, morality is a cheap human construct, im out for me and no one else,

i know this is the internet and we all come from different walks of life, but seriously....pull your fuckin skirts up u pansies, if i see a deal im taking it, if i see someone drop a hundred dollar bill, its mine, i dont believe in karma because the righteous tend to get fucked simply for being righteous.

if you choose to live your life by the "moral" and "ethical" way, thats fine, but dont act high and mighty when others such as myself dont choose to play by your same rules, it'll be your own fault if u get taken advantage of. everything is subjective, morality and ethics included. there is no such thing as universal right and wrong.

Why not portray you as a lesser? You come off like a total self-centered scumbag low-class human being. From what I've seen in my life you are the minority, most of us care about other people and try not to screw them over. We've all made mistakes but at least we try. You make yourself sound like a total jerk, do you have friends or people who care about you? If you don't you're the one I feel sorry for.

[Ed Oscuro]

Taking a $100 somebody right in front of you just dropped is pretty damn low. Once I was outside a highschool scoopin' up some Hamiltons and the guy who dropped them came out; I handed all I'd gotten right over. I mean, that's decent. Taking a $100 you see somebody drop right there is next thing to putting your hand in their back pocket.

Incidentally, interesting article on Slate about how buying green can make you seem evil: link (http://www.slate.com/id/2237674/)

And how's this: I got to the thrift and they had some beat up old NES carts, some with really worn labels. There's a Metal Gear there. I was thinking I should've picked it up, but after checking eBay...eh, no thanks. The rest was even worse; there was an R5 in Cliffhanger but that means nothing - it's even cheaper than MG. I'm savin' for something.

[LaughingMAN.S9]

Why not portray you as a lesser? You come off like a total self-centered scumbag low-class human being. From what I've seen in my life you are the minority, most of us care about other people and try not to screw them over. We've all made mistakes but at least we try. You make yourself sound like a total jerk, do you have friends or people who care about you? If you don't you're the one I feel sorry for.

i must be if i dont agree with you right? at least i give others the maneuvering room to live their lives as they see fit, i dont preach to others and condemn them because they wont think like i think, i dont have that right, no one does, but u seem to think its ok to dictate what is right and what is wrong in absolute terms. my way is not the only way, it is as the name implies...MY way, i dont pass out judgements to anyone that deviates from my way of thinking but its ok fof you tho, cuz im going to hell and you're going to heaven so it'll all work itself out in the end amirite?


pffffffft, wheres your morality now :angel:

[TonyTheTiger]

if i see someone drop a hundred dollar bill, its mine.


im not talking about stealing (thats a whole nother topic)

Funny you should say that. Because according to at least New York, and likely most other jurisdictions, your example above is petit larceny, a class A misdemeanor. N.Y. Penal Code §§ 155.05, 155.25.

So what about stealing again?

I'll defer to this:


Taking a $100 somebody right in front of you just dropped is pretty damn low.

[LaughingMAN.S9]

low by your standards, finders keepers


and for the sake of clarity, i dont mean like some guy dropping a hundred dollar bill and i hop over a counter run full speed and tackle him out of the way like "mine mine!!!"

but if he drops it and i see him drop it, and he walks away, pffffft, fuck that guy, its my money now chump :(

[TonyTheTiger]

but if he drops it and i see him drop it, and he walks away, pffffft, fuck that guy, its my money now chump :(

And you have then just committed larceny, "for the sake of clarity" or otherwise.

[LaughingMAN.S9]

then in ny, thats a bullshit law, im still gonna do it :angry:

[Gameguy]

If you actually see who dropped it, it should be returned to that person. If you just found a loose bill on the ground and there's nobody else around then it's probably ok as there's no way to know who it belonged to.

[TonyTheTiger]

then in ny, thats a bullshit law, im still gonna do it :angry:

Then would you care to comment on this?


im not talking about stealing.

And I'm pretty confident that "bullshit law" is on the books in every state of the union as well as most other civilized countries.

[Diatribal Deity]

As the OP of this thread, I was hoping this would not turn into some trivial argument over right versus wrong and personal views as clearly outlined in my original post. At least, I was hoping to keep it game related. Feel free to post in off topic as it relates to your views on general theft. I think the majority of us understand these general arguments as they are pretty old, pointless and played out.

[LaughingMAN.S9]

Then would you care to comment on this?



And I'm pretty confident that "bullshit law" is on the books in every state of the union as well as most other civilized countries.

its not stealing in my opinion as i had no hand in the guy being so careless he'd drop a hundred dollar bill on the ground, the law and justice were never the same thing, i stand by what i said, its a bullshit law and if the guy walks away and the money is there, its mine, case closed.

[Icarus Moonsight]

How do you feel about copying down (or simply remembering) registration codes and DLC codes from used or shelf copies sitting in a GameStop?

Even though you are not taking any tangible property, you are taking it from the person who ends up purchasing that code. I'd call that one preemptive theft.

Laughingman... *facepalm*


Legally it's all on him. You could still choose to refuse and take the bullet instead, even if that would mean everyone else would take the bullet too. I'm not saying that would necessarily be the better choice in the situation, it would mean death for everyone else who's there with you.

Truthfully, I couldn't care less what the legalities are when my life is involved... And your scenario is a bit rare and extreme to begin with. It's about choice of action. The guy with the gun is the only person capable of making free rational choices in the scenario you offer. He's using threats of violence to compel compliance. He might as well be doing the raping, because he is directly causing them to occur. He could put down the gun and leave, or better yet, not try to force people to rape each other at gunpoint to begin with. If your only options are do ____, or die -- It's implicit that you really don't have a choice, unless you don't value life to begin with. In that case, take the bullet so in the confusion the people that want to live may be given an opportunity to flee or take the bastard down.

The whole thing is absurd really. Stop watching TV. LOL

[Joshie]

... if i see someone drop a hundred dollar bill, its mine, i dont believe in karma because the righteous tend to get fucked simply for being righteous.

..

im not talking about stealing (thats a whole nother topic)...


if you choose to live your life by the "moral" and "ethical" way, thats fine, but dont act high and mighty when others such as myself dont choose to play by your same rules, it'll be your own fault if u get taken advantage of. everything is subjective, morality and ethics included. there is no such thing as universal right and wrong.
If you followed what you are showing to be your morality code, you should have no problem with stealing. However, assuming you really don't have one, then what stops you from stealing is consequences (this also makes you a total pansy by your own definition for fearing them).

Any of the actions you stated above also have consequences, you just probably do not possess the cognitive or imaginative skills to see them. I'm sure if someone found out you took their hundred dollar bill, you might have a very real chance of getting the stuffing ripped from you.

You are only afforded the chance to live in a civil society because of the very morals you trash. If everyone had your moral set (and I am sure a lot of people do), the world would crash down until collectively we do "moral" things to avoid the outcome alone.

Sorry I continued the off topic banter. It was too interesting. If we had a moderator split the topic... :)

[WanganRunner]

I flip cars on the side for fun and profit.

I've run into these situations with cars, but the money involved is MUCH larger and thus so is the potential moral quandry.

That rusted-out 69 Dodge Daytona the poor widow is selling for $600 that's worth fifty grand? Yeah, I'd probably buy it, sell it for fifty grand, and then kick her $10k of my profits because I'm a nice guy and it's a huge windfall.

But outside of extreme cases like the above (real example, but someone else beat me to the car and thus I didn't make a thing), I'll just take it and run. If someone is selling their 70's 911 for $5-8000 less than it's worth......they should've done their homework. It's the efficiency of markets rule, without people like me (or people like bond traders, or whomever), prices would NEVER adjust to the proper level. Only via the seeking of arbitrage profits will prices adjust, it's a natural force of the market. It isn't evil.

[BetaWolf47]

If someone is selling their 70's 911 for $5-8000 less than it's worth......they should've done their homework. It's the efficiency of markets rule, without people like me (or people like bond traders, or whomever), prices would NEVER adjust to the proper level. Only via the seeking of arbitrage profits will prices adjust, it's a natural force of the market. It isn't evil.

Okay, that's fine, but okay, how about the people actually looking for a car? You're filling your pockets when there's people who need cars and can only afford to pay what you've been paying for them. The problem with flipping isn't buying things. It never was. The moral issue is stealing the deal from someone who actually needs it.

[Icarus Moonsight]

Stealing the deal? LMAO Now I've heard everything!

[Atarileaf]

its not stealing in my opinion .

If it is a law, your opinion is null and void.


its a bullshit law

People say that about a lot of different laws. Again, how you feel about it doesn't change a thing.

[Zthun]

Some of you went way off topic. A lot of you equated stealing with getting a deal largely in your favor. If I saw a copy of Panzer Dragoon Saga at the flea market for $10, I'm going to buy it without saying anything. Hell, I might even try to get them to go lower.

If I saw someone drop a $100 dollar bill right in front of me, I'll say, "Hey friend, you dropped this," but if I found a $100 dollar bill abandoned, I'm just going to pocket it. But this has nothing to do with getting a great deal.


Okay, that's fine, but okay, how about the people actually looking for a car? You're filling your pockets when there's people who need cars and can only afford to pay what you've been paying for them. The problem with flipping isn't buying things. It never was. The moral issue is stealing the deal from someone who actually needs it.

How do you steal a deal? If someone offers you something for cheap, how is that stealing?

[ryborg]

Okay, that's fine, but okay, how about the people actually looking for a car? You're filling your pockets when there's people who need cars and can only afford to pay what you've been paying for them. The problem with flipping isn't buying things. It never was. The moral issue is stealing the deal from someone who actually needs it.

You're confusing wants vs. needs. Using your car analogy, the person with less money to spend doesn't NEED to buy the '69 Daytona. Even the smallest of small towns have plenty of old cheap cars.

Also lol @ "stealing the deal."

[BetaWolf47]

How do you steal a deal? If someone offers you something for cheap, how is that stealing?

Because like I said, there's people who need a car and can't afford paying $18,000 for a brand new one. Even if my car analogy is off, I still stand by what I'm saying. If I saw a game that was worth $40+ for dirt cheap, and I already owned it, I'd either leave it for the next person or snatch it up to give someone who wants it for his/her collection.

[Zthun]

Because like I said, there's people who need a car and can't afford paying $18,000 for a brand new one. Even if my car analogy is off, I still stand by what I'm saying. If I saw a game that was worth $40+ for dirt cheap, and I already owned it, I'd either leave it for the next person or snatch it up to give someone who wants it for his/her collection.

That doesn't answer the question. You haven't described anything above that is considered stealing. Getting a deal isn't stealing.

[BetaWolf47]

That's because it isn't. I flat-out used the wrong term there. But really, buying something you don't need for dirt cheap, just so you can sell it to someone else for a higher value, just to fill your pockets... that's downright immoral, especially when there's other people around who would've appreciated getting that deal and made really good use of the item in question.

[Porksta]

I buy cheap games all the time with the point of reselling them. Seriously, who actually still plays old consoles except for collectors and for nostalgia? It isn't like some kid who's main console is the Saturn that has been looking everywhere for DragonForce.

[NESGamer24]

This has happened to me a few times. Most recently was Black Friday. Went to Best Buy to pick up Left 4 Dead 2 for 360 and picked up a few other things. Simpsons Season 12 and NHL 10 for PS3.

I get to the register and hear my cashier telling another how she gets off in an hour and that she had been there since 4:30am. It was 1pm when I was there. Really nice lady rings up my stuff and I realized it was less then I figured when I was walking around the stroe. So I realized she didn't scan the Simpsons but I already processed my credit card. I told her and we ran another order for the Simpsons. I know it was just $14.99 and that its a big coglomorate like Best Buy but I felt for her. What if she got in trouble if they were looking at the security tapes. I know some stores look at those heavily to see if cashiers scan every item. She was obvioulsy there a long time and was tired. She couldn't thank me enough and when I just mentioned that I felt like being honest I have never heard anyone in my life sound so sincere when she told me "You don't know how nice of a thing that was that you did."

I guess you can see it either way but I try to be ethical all the time.

[Gameguy]

Truthfully, I couldn't care less what the legalities are when my life is involved... And your scenario is a bit rare and extreme to begin with. It's about choice of action. The guy with the gun is the only person capable of making free rational choices in the scenario you offer. He's using threats of violence to compel compliance. He might as well be doing the raping, because he is directly causing them to occur. He could put down the gun and leave, or better yet, not try to force people to rape each other at gunpoint to begin with. If your only options are do ____, or die -- It's implicit that you really don't have a choice, unless you don't value life to begin with. In that case, take the bullet so in the confusion the people that want to live may be given an opportunity to flee or take the bastard down.

The whole thing is absurd really. Stop watching TV. LOL
Yeah, I agree it's absurd and highly unlikely to ever happen. It's really only with the extreme situations that you can think about what is truly moral, everything else is so well defined that's there's no point in thinking further about it. Murdering someone for fun is obviously wrong, that's clear enough so there's no point in further discussions about it.

It all depends on peoples viewpoints, some people would rather choose death because they believe in re-incarnation or that they'll be rewarded in the afterlife. They would believe that if they choose any inappropriate actions while alive that they would be punished for them so choosing to live would actually be worse for them. Some of the other people there might not care about your personal beliefs and would rather you do anything so they can live, as they don't believe in the afterlife.

The less you think about it, the happier you'll be. If you believe you're doing the right thing, that's pretty much all that matters. Well, it's all that matters for a persons own happiness.


I buy cheap games all the time with the point of reselling them. Seriously, who actually still plays old consoles except for collectors and for nostalgia? It isn't like some kid who's main console is the Saturn that has been looking everywhere for DragonForce.
How do people become collectors exactly? I only got into collecting around 8 or 9 years ago when I came across and NES system with a few games, that's when I started looking around for them because I liked playing them. I didn't have nostalgia for it as I had a Genesis growing up. I was a bit into classic arcade compilations for the PC before that, I don't think I started buying games for consoles until I found that small lot of games, except for the Game Boy Pocket which is what I mostly played so I had games for that. I didn't consider myself as a collector of Game Boy games at that point, I just played them.

I actually talked to vendors who mentioned that their grandchildren only like to play NES or SNES games and none of the current consoles. I'm pretty sure more kids would like to play the older games if they had the chance to. Most kids don't even know about the older systems as they only get to see the newer ones in stores.




I'll try to stick on topic for a bit. When I used to sell my games I used to price several of them much cheaper than the going rate as I wanted to give some other people a good deal. Most were just bought by resellers who wanted to flip them for a profit so I don't do that anymore, I price them for the true value. I may give a lower price if I know the buyer or if they're buying a lot of games, but that's usually it. I don't see a reason to help out a guy who immediately throws the game on his own table to sell, while he just told me he wanted it for his personal collection and asked for a further discount. Being lied to my face kind of took care of my overall generosity. Would anybody here lie to get a better deal?

As for buying something at a great price, I feel that the seller should be the one to do proper research and if they price things too low it's their own fault for not putting enough effort into research. I would pay their asking price. I wouldn't haggle it lower though, if I know it's worth well more than their asking price I'd feel that by haggling it lower I'd be taking unfair advantage of them. I'd have an advantage in knowing the true value of something when they didn't, and I would be using it against them to get even further ahead. I feel that's a bit different than asking them how much they want for something and accepting their offer, I'm giving them the chance to ask for any amount they want. If a game I want is priced higher than what I believe it to be worth I'll haggle then, that's pretty much it.

[TonyTheTiger]

That's because it isn't. I flat-out used the wrong term there. But really, buying something you don't need for dirt cheap, just so you can sell it to someone else for a higher value, just to fill your pockets... that's downright immoral, especially when there's other people around who would've appreciated getting that deal and made really good use of the item in question.

I think you're point has some theoretical validity...but not in this scenario. If there were a widespread famine and somebody somehow manged to obtain all the food and water and was using it to manipulate the population? Yes, that would be immoral. But we're talking about luxuries and entertainment. I think context really matters here.

[Ryaan1234]

I don't see a reason to help out a guy who immediately throws the game on his own table to sell, while he just told me he wanted it for his personal collection and asked for a further discount. Being lied to my face kind of took care of my overall generosity. Would anybody here lie to get a better deal?

This. There's this guy at my local flea market who buys NES stuff, nothing else. He's a college-aged guy so I figured that he buys for the nostalgia factor. He bought Super C, Kirby's Adventure, and some other NES doubles from me for $3 a piece. When I asked what he'd do with them he said he collects them. Fair enough. Fast foward to a few months ago when my dad and I set up again. My dad had 5 extra copies of SMB 3 that he just didn't want to put the time into selling on eBay. The same guy bought ALL 5 COPIES. Really, he was "buying for his collection"? Grrr.... and this guy is so annoying. He goes to every booth with this stupid "I know something you don't" smile on his face and asks "do you have any Nintendo stuff?" I don't see him as much of a threat, though. He passed up Castlevania 3 and Mega Man 2 at a booth for $2 each so obviously there's a thing or two that he doesn't know about NES stuff. This isn't the only guy who buys from us and resells, though. It's really also really annoying to see the same NES games that you sold for $3-5 at a booth with Mexican resalers trying to get $7-10 for them. Sheesh, talk about honesty with resaling. At least I don't outwardly show the amount I get for the stuff I buy from garage sales/dock sale to the person selling the item to me.

[Zthun]

That's because it isn't. I flat-out used the wrong term there. But really, buying something you don't need for dirt cheap, just so you can sell it to someone else for a higher value, just to fill your pockets... that's downright immoral, especially when there's other people around who would've appreciated getting that deal and made really good use of the item in question.

How do you think resellers of products make money? Do you think Gamestop sells games at the developer price (I would love it if they did)? Take printer ink for example. You go to the store and you shit your pants at paying $60 for ink which is almost as much as the printer itself. Do you know how much most companies pay for that ink? Try less than a dollar. It's called markup. Now I'm not the know it all when it comes to business, but I do know that this concept is pretty basic. Buy low, sell high. If this is immoral, then you should really consider moving to a communist country, and seriously, most of us know that communism doesn't work.


This. There's this guy at my local flea market who buys NES stuff, nothing else. He's a college-aged guy so I figured that he buys for the nostalgia factor. He bought Super C, Kirby's Adventure, and some other NES doubles from me for $3 a piece. When I asked what he'd do with them he said he collects them. Fair enough. Fast foward to a few months ago when my dad and I set up again. My dad had 5 extra copies of SMB 3 that he just didn't want to put the time into selling on eBay. The same guy bought ALL 5 COPIES. Really, he was "buying for his collection"? Grrr.... and this guy is so annoying. He goes to every booth with this stupid "I know something you don't" smile on his face and asks "do you have any Nintendo stuff?" I don't see him as much of a threat, though. He passed up Castlevania 3 and Mega Man 2 at a booth for $2 each so obviously there's a thing or two that he doesn't know about NES stuff. This isn't the only guy who buys from us and resells, though. It's really also really annoying to see the same NES games that you sold for $3-5 at a booth with Mexican resalers trying to get $7-10 for them. Sheesh, talk about honesty with resaling. At least I don't outwardly show the amount I get for the stuff I buy from garage sales/dock sale to the person selling the item to me.

I don't see how it's any of your business what a customer does with the product that you're selling. I've bought and sold games before, but I never ask a person what they are going to do with it.

[Garry Silljo]

But really, buying something you don't need for dirt cheap, just so you can sell it to someone else for a higher value, just to fill your pockets... that's downright immoral,

Actually that's called business. You know all that stuff you buy in a store? ... The store paid less for it. They bought it cheap and sold it to you for a higher value, just to fill their pockets. It wasn't the least bit immoral.

[Ryaan1234]

I don't see how it's any of your business what a customer does with the product that you're selling. I've bought and sold games before, but I never ask a person what they are going to do with it.
I was just curious about what he was going to do with the games. Asking him was also just my way of making small talk, as it seems that I can never find someone outside of Digital Press that's into older games. And about the resalers, I don't even meddle in their business. They put the same product that they just bought from me out at their booths 5 minutes after buying it. I know they don't care what I think and I don't expect them to. I just get a chuckle when I see the same games I sold them sitting at their booth 6 months later LOL