Best and Worst N64 games?

[A Black Falcon]

I for one am prepared to defend a controller design that doesn't make all its buttons accessible...TO THE DEATH. Because what do we use these things for again?
For using two different ways depending on which kind of game you're using with it. You know, like how two-prong-controller systems often have games that use either the left analog stick or dpad. Dpad games usually make no use of the analog stick, and only some analog stick games use the d-pad. The N64 controller is like that, just with a more comfortable design that fits both styles better than any two-side controller could.


Just a few minor changes could've pleased both groups...the people who like maximum control on the one hand, and the people who play RPGs and two-button action games on the other. Nobody's comfort had to be sacrificed.

p.s. In case it's gone over your head, "legitimate / constructive criticsm" is not the same thing as "this is the worst thing ever," so don't get too excited.
Minor changes? Like what, that Hori thing? No thanks...


See my post above. That's not my argument or even a reasonable way of trying to twist it.
I don't know, it seems like a good point... games usually don't use every button and stick on a controller. Different kinds of games use different things. What's so wrong with keeping that in mind when designing the controller originally?

[Ed Oscuro]

What's so wrong with keeping that in mind when designing the controller originally?
What's wrong with designing the controller so you can access every button without changing your grip? This is REALLY low-hanging fruit, man.

[A Black Falcon]

What's wrong with designing the controller so you can access every button without changing your grip? This is REALLY low-hanging fruit, man.

Why do you care so much if you can access buttons that you have no need to access in the games where you hold it that way?

Seriously, your entire argument makes no sense. You'll have to put down the controller anyway to get up and put in a different game, why do you care so much if you also pick it up a different way after doing so? It makes no sense. Stop thinking that you need to use buttons you don't need to use. They exist for the d-pad style, not the analog one.

[Panzerfuzion]

The N64 has a great D-Pad.

[RP2A03]

The N64 has a great D-Pad.

Not really.

[Rob2600]

The N64 controller is very comfortable.

And a few of you are viewing the controller as one single controller, which is of course understandable. However, the N64 controller is more like three different controllers in one. Most N64 games use the "left hand on the middle prong and right hand on the right prong" position. Some games use the "left hand on the left prong and right hand on the right prong" position. And the third position is "left hand on the left prong and right hand on the middle prong".

Only one position is ever meant to be used at a time. N64 game designers knew this and didn't require changing positions mid-game. Some buttons are inaccessible in each position and game designers took that into account.

[goldenband]

4:
http://www.videogamecollectors.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=201540&g2_serialNumber=1

Assuming you're serious, glad to see Tigger's Honey Hunt getting some love. It's pretty, controls well, has lovely music, and though it's a great fit for kids, it actually offers some real challenge if you try to get 100% completion. Plus it captures the mood of the books quite well.

It's not perfect or mind-blowing, but it's still a very nice 2.5D platformer. I haven't tried the PS1 version, but it wouldn't surprise me if I prefer the N64's unvoiced/non-FMV cutscenes.

[Aussie2B]

I've been wanting to pick that and Tarzan up some time. I don't expect amazing things, given that they're licensed and aimed at little kids mostly, but I'm a sucker for 2.5D platformers. When done well, I absolutely love the look and how they play. Goemon's Great Adventure is right up there in my top couple N64 games (only Wonder Project J2 could edge it out, but that's an entirely different kind of game so it's hard to compare one against the other), and I really enjoyed Kirby 64 as well.

[Ed Oscuro]

I'm a sucker for really simplistic and small games, like the arena Turok (that's Rage Wars I think) or Battletanx. Well, I wouldn't pay a lot of money for them, but seeing them makes me smile.

I was recently really happy to discover that, although I sold my original a long time ago, I found a loose Blast Corps somewhere. Classic game with crazy ideas slapped over a seemingly-straightforward (but kind of insane) premise.

Sometime I need to get Last Legion UX, and look again at the Aero Fighters 3D entry.

[Mondomedia123]

Best (IN NO PARTICULAR ORDER!):
-Ocarina of Time
-Super Mario 64
-Goldeneye 007
-Wave Race 64
-Majora's Mask
-WWF No Mercy
-South Park
-Turok: Dinosaur Hunter
-Mario Party 3
Worst:
-Superman 64
Cant think of any more at the moment @_@

[ProjectCamaro]

My favorite in no particular order are:
- Goldeneye 007
- Zelda: OoT
- Forsaken 64
- Mario 64
- Rush 2
- Turok 2
- Star Wars: Roque Squadron
- 1080 Snowboarding
- Perfect Dark
- Star Fox 64
- Pilotwings 64

I really don't have a worst of list, I'm pretty OCD so I would research the games I wanted to death before I bought them. Plus I didn't have enough money to buy anything that I didn't know would be great.

[BydoEmpire]

Lets all look back at the title, and then discuss that.Amen to that.

[needler420]

IMO the N64 controller separates the men from the boys.

I notice people who were good with a N64 controller went on to newer generations with more precise skills and better aim in FPS and what not.

I mean let's face it if you were pawning your friend in Goldeneye all day then it's probably because your friend doesn''t know how to use a N64 controller.

I remember playing it the year it came out in 1996. Between the 3D and 1st analog stick on a console it separated the boys from the men. Either you learned how to master Mario's moves quickly and went on to progress as I did and collected all 120 stars. Or if you suck with the controller you probably had a steep learning curve before you weren't constantly walking into walls.

[BricatSegaFan]

IMO the N64 controller separates the men from the boys.

I notice people who were good with a N64 controller went on to newer generations with more precise skills and better aim in FPS and what not.

I mean let's face it if you were pawning your friend in Goldeneye all day then it's probably because your friend doesn''t know how to use a N64 controller.

I remember playing it the year it came out in 1996. Between the 3D and 1st analog stick on a console it separated the boys from the men. Either you learned how to master Mario's moves quickly and went on to progress as I did and collected all 120 stars. Or if you suck with the controller you probably had a steep learning curve before you weren't constantly walking into walls.

I was decent with the controller then when it was new, but now its an awkward unresponsive mess. I really wanna play my n64 collection but sheesh these controllers blow.

I wish I can use my Saturn 3d pad on it :(

[YoshiM]

I was decent with the controller then when it was new, but now its an awkward unresponsive mess. I really wanna play my n64 collection but sheesh these controllers blow.

Is the stick worn out? That's the only flaw I have with the controller-the sticks wear out quickly. However, those sticks are TIGHT in the control department.

Play F-Zero X then play F-Zero GX on the GameCube. The control handling is almost night and day. In X you can make hard turns by cranking the stick but to pull off that same turn requires the shoulder trigger in GX. It's not a huge deal to most but it was a awakening for me who logged a LOT of hours on the N64.

Otherwise, it was a forward thinking controller. Designed for 3D graphic gaming with the digital throwback made it a great controller except if you liked fighting games.

[BricatSegaFan]

Is the stick worn out? That's the only flaw I have with the controller-the sticks wear out quickly. However, those sticks are TIGHT in the control department.

Play F-Zero X then play F-Zero GX on the GameCube. The control handling is almost night and day. In X you can make hard turns by cranking the stick but to pull off that same turn requires the shoulder trigger in GX. It's not a huge deal to most but it was a awakening for me who logged a LOT of hours on the N64.

Otherwise, it was a forward thinking controller. Designed for 3D graphic gaming with the digital throwback made it a great controller except if you liked fighting games.

Well yes the stick was worn out. But still the layout was kinda weird. I remember being able to play duke nukem zero hour with no problem when I was younger. Its very difficult to play now. Ehh oh well.

[Guru of Time and Space]

Numerous mentions of Mario Kart as one of the best games on the Nintendo 64 but only ONE of Diddy Kong Racing and simply as an "honorable mention"?

What's that smell?

Something is fishy here...

...do you guys even play videogames?

-GoTaS

[SOL BADGUY]

Numerous mentions of Mario Kart as one of the best games on the Nintendo 64 but only ONE of Diddy Kong Racing and simply as an "honorable mention"?

What's that smell?

Something is fishy here...

...do you guys even play videogames?

-GoTaS

Played Diddy Racing, Mario Kart is better.

[j_factor]

Why do you care so much if you can access buttons that you have no need to access in the games where you hold it that way?

Because then the game developers would have been free to use more buttons.

I don't see what is gained by forcing the d-pad and analog stick to be completely separate. What detriment would there have been to putting the analog stick by the d-pad and eliminating the middle prong? The only downside I see is it would eliminate the middle + left prong control option, which I don't recall any game really using.

Here's why I don't like it. Look again at the "right way to hold it" picture:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/01/N64-Controller-in-Hand.jpg

That is not a natural position to keep your hands in. They're not at the same angle, or the same distance from your body. It just doesn't feel right; it's weird and diagonal. Almost every other controller has you holding your hands in a normal side by side position -- with the few exceptions being controllers that are mostly panned by gamers, like the Intellivision. This is no coincidence.

[The Adventurer]

Typicality you hold it more like this, because its more comfortable.

http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/9720/n64proper.jpg

[PreZZ]

Played Diddy Racing, Mario Kart is better.

Single player winner=diddy kong racing
multi player winner=mario kart 64

[A Black Falcon]

Because then the game developers would have been free to use more buttons.
How many games then really needed more than 9 buttons plus an analog stick or d-pad? I don't see it. I mean, Sony had rarely-used stuff on its controllers too (do even a double digit number of PS1 games support the analog click buttons?). They're not on a separate part of the controller, but regardless, that extra pad/stick and button really weren't needed. Games should not require you to use both the d-pad and analog stick at the same time, for one thing, and for the third shoulder button... really, two should be enough.


I don't see what is gained by forcing the d-pad and analog stick to be completely separate. What detriment would there have been to putting the analog stick by the d-pad and eliminating the middle prong? The only downside I see is it would eliminate the middle + left prong control option, which I don't recall any game really using.
Have you not read any of my explanations about how it allows you to have ideal thumb positioning for both dpad AND analog games, which isn't possible on any two-prongs-only controller? That's one reason why the N64 controller is better the way it is, because it's more comfortable this way.

The other reason is that Nintendo was trying to make a controller that would be familiar to people used to digital-only controllers, but also one with analog, and they thought that a good way to do that would be to have a left and right "traditional" controller look, with the analog stick elsewhere. That's the other reason.


Here's why I don't like it. Look again at the "right way to hold it" picture:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/01/N64-Controller-in-Hand.jpg

That is not a natural position to keep your hands in. They're not at the same angle, or the same distance from your body. It just doesn't feel right; it's weird and diagonal. Almost every other controller has you holding your hands in a normal side by side position -- with the few exceptions being controllers that are mostly panned by gamers, like the Intellivision. This is no coincidence.

As the post below yours pointed out, the hands in that picture aren't holding the controller quite right.


Typicality you hold it more like this, because its more comfortable.

http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/9720/n64proper.jpg
Yeah, I'd hold it more like that. Both hands can be at a similar angle, and it's comfortable and good for long play sessions. I do often not put my finger over the R button unless it's a game which requires it, but I do that with lots of systems (it's the same with handhelds for example, stuff like the GBA is more comfortable when NOT held so that my fingers are over L and R... DS too somewhat, etc.) But that's just my general dislike of shoulder buttons when compared to the much more comfortable triggers.

On that note, if I had to say something bad about the N64 controller, it'd be that I wish that it had two Z-style buttons, instead of Z and R.

[j_factor]

Typicality you hold it more like this, because its more comfortable.

http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/9720/n64proper.jpg

Yeah, I always "want" to hold it like that, but I can't really play games that way. The right prong is way at the wrong angle and it just kills my wrist. Not to mention up on the stick becomes up-left.


How many games then really needed more than 9 buttons plus an analog stick or d-pad? I don't see it.

There are some games, such as the Saturn version of MechWarrior 2, that use d-pad and analog stick simultaneously. There are also Playstation games that use dual analog rather effectively, doing back to the system's original analog joystick and games like Descent.

Is it a lot of games? Not really, but I bet it's larger than the number of games that "needed" the N64 controller's setup. The only thing that comes to mind is Robotron 64.


Have you not read any of my explanations about how it allows you to have ideal thumb positioning for both dpad AND analog games, which isn't possible on any two-prongs-only controller? That's one reason why the N64 controller is better the way it is, because it's more comfortable this way.

I guess I just don't see that. I have no issue whatsoever on Saturn, Dreamcast, Gamecube, or Xbox switching between the analog stick and d-pad. I don't find my thumb to be in a poor position either way.


The other reason is that Nintendo was trying to make a controller that would be familiar to people used to digital-only controllers, but also one with analog, and they thought that a good way to do that would be to have a left and right "traditional" controller look, with the analog stick elsewhere. That's the other reason.

I really don't think that's accurate. The N64 controller is the weirdest-looking, most unfamiliar controller of its time.

[j_factor]

sorry, double post

[understatement]

Yeah, I always "want" to hold it like that, but I can't really play games that way. The right prong is way at the wrong angle and it just kills my wrist. Not to mention up on the stick becomes up-left.


I was starting to think I was the only one that had this problem. LOL

[frogofdeath]

The tilted picture post made me laugh. Best post of the year! No problems with the N64 controller. Still has the best placed trigger button (Z-button) of any controller.

As for the actual topic, here are some of my favorites:

WWF No Mercy: still the best wrestling game I've played (better than Virtual Pro Wrestling 2)
Dr. Mario 64: I'm pretty sure new version have 4-player, but still a great time with friends
Conker's Bad Fur Day: behind the over-focus on the "adult" content is a really solid platformer
Pokemon Snap: I'm not a big fan of Pokemon, but this game is all around great
Bomberman 64: enjoyed the single-player and actually prefer the multi-player over traditional Bomberman

Of course there is also Super Mario 64, Goldeneye, Zelda Ocarina of Time, and others already mentioned.

[A Black Falcon]

Yeah, I always "want" to hold it like that, but I can't really play games that way. The right prong is way at the wrong angle and it just kills my wrist. Not to mention up on the stick becomes up-left.
Always a new excuse, it seems.


There are some games, such as the Saturn version of MechWarrior 2, that use d-pad and analog stick simultaneously.
If you're playing MechWarrior 2 for Saturn with anything other than the Mission Stick, I feel kind of bad for you... (the same goes for the Panzer Dragoon games)! And on the Mission Stick, the game works great (far better than it ever could on a gamepad) with just a single stick and buttons. The key is that the throttle wheel controls movement forward and back.

On that note, one unique thing about the N64 when compared to the Saturn and PS1 is that it doesn't have a pile of alternate controllers. Both of those other systems have 3-4 different major first-party controllers, each with some games that require it for best control, plus on the PS1 several third-party controllers on top of that which games require them for best control, while the N64 has exactly one controller, the N64 controller. Other than optional third party controllers which games don't usually really support like the systems' wheels and the UltraRacer 64, there is only one N64 controller. There's no joystick, no (official) wheel, no neGcon, no mouse or keyboard, etc. (Well, there is a keyboard and maybe a mouse, but it/they are only for the 64DD's online service, so they don't have much use anymore obviously.)

The negative of that is that you don't get anything like MechWarrior 2 or Panzer Dragoon with the Mission Stick, but the positive is that every game should be ideally suited for a controller which every system owner has, something VERY definitely not true with the PS1 or Saturn. Overall, as much as I find the various PS1 and Saturn controllers interesting, I think that the N64's is the better design -- one great controller, which everything works with, and is versatile enough to handle any of them. Good design.


There are also Playstation games that use dual analog rather effectively, doing back to the system's original analog joystick and games like Descent.
Sure, there are a few, but it's a very few; Ape Escape, some FPSes like Medal of Honor, not that much else. And the analog stick click buttons, are they supported by any games at all? Some PS2 and PS3 games use them, but on the PS1 they were pretty much never used. I assume that the issue was that games almost always had digital controller support (Ape Escape is the only analog-required game in the US, after all; not sure if Japan had any others), so they couldn't do that much with analog-only buttons like those... so they were just never used. You can find a way to make use of the stick in some games, but the analog click buttons? They were pretty much a waste of money on the Dual Shock 1.


Is it a lot of games? Not really, but I bet it's larger than the number of games that "needed" the N64 controller's setup. The only thing that comes to mind is Robotron 64.
As far as games that "needed" the N64's setup... considering that nobody else had an analog stick when the N64 controller was introduced, how about every single game on the platform that has analog support? :)

Beyond that, all the FPSes have fantastic controls because of the N64 controller. I've said it before, but I absolutely prefer N64-style Turok FPS controls (stick aims, C-buttons move) to dual analog FPS controls. I still can't quite figure those out, but Turok-style N64 controls work fantastically...

And on that note, the N64's C-buttons are pretty much a second "stick", so the PS1 doesn't have much of an advantage there. Plus if games use both sticks, they don't usually use the face buttons for much (minor functions you need to use rarely, because you have to let go of the stick to press them...), while on the N64 using the C-buttons with A and B is easy and natural. Oh, and they're also quite nice for camera control in other games, of course.

But in general, that all N64 games have the analog option was fantastic. You can't quite match that on the PS1 or Saturn, which each have many digital-only-control games. The N64's design was superior from the start, and then the others had to play catchup... but were still left with large libraries of inferior-controlling 3d games with digital-only controls.


I guess I just don't see that. I have no issue whatsoever on Saturn, Dreamcast, Gamecube, or Xbox switching between the analog stick and d-pad. I don't find my thumb to be in a poor position either way.
It's worse on Sony's controllers than on any of those four, though of them the Gamecube's is probably the worst, since that's the most Sony-like of the four controllers you listed there. Because of the somewhat odd angles involved I don't mind it much on the Saturn 3D controller either, but the Gamecube, Dreamcast, Xbox, PS1/2... yeah, both work, but the upper position is definitely more comfortable than the lower.


I really don't think that's accurate. The N64 controller is the weirdest-looking, most unfamiliar controller of its time.
Only in the minds of people who hate it. And yes, I didn't make that up -- that was a very definitely stated goal of Nintendo's from back in 1996. As I said earlier in the thread, though, they under-estimated how many games would use the d-pad, which is part of why it's on the left, along with that "make it more familiar" reason.

[j_factor]

Always a new excuse, it seems.

Oh come on. What is this, third grade? I could've replied to your posts from the get-go with the same lazy, dismissive snideness if I wanted that kind of attitude.


The negative of that is that you don't get anything like MechWarrior 2 or Panzer Dragoon with the Mission Stick, but the positive is that every game should be ideally suited for a controller which every system owner has, something VERY definitely not true with the PS1 or Saturn. Overall, as much as I find the various PS1 and Saturn controllers interesting, I think that the N64's is the better design -- one great controller, which everything works with, and is versatile enough to handle any of them. Good design.

Yeah, I find that less than ideal. While (arguably) the N64 didn't need anything like the Mission Stick, its controller is definitely no substitute for a mouse or light gun.


Sure, there are a few, but it's a very few; Ape Escape, some FPSes like Medal of Honor, not that much else. And the analog stick click buttons, are they supported by any games at all? Some PS2 and PS3 games use them, but on the PS1 they were pretty much never used. I assume that the issue was that games almost always had digital controller support (Ape Escape is the only analog-required game in the US, after all; not sure if Japan had any others), so they couldn't do that much with analog-only buttons like those... so they were just never used. You can find a way to make use of the stick in some games, but the analog click buttons? They were pretty much a waste of money on the Dual Shock 1.

I'm not sure why you keep harping on those. What difference does it make? They're not necessary, they don't get in the way. It's pretty easy to just not notice that they're there.

(To answer your question, a few driving games let you click to activate turbo and/or rear view.)


As far as games that "needed" the N64's setup... considering that nobody else had an analog stick when the N64 controller was introduced, how about every single game on the platform that has analog support? :)

You know what I meant.


Beyond that, all the FPSes have fantastic controls because of the N64 controller. I've said it before, but I absolutely prefer N64-style Turok FPS controls (stick aims, C-buttons move) to dual analog FPS controls. I still can't quite figure those out, but Turok-style N64 controls work fantastically...

I don't see how Turok would control any worse if you got rid of the middle prong and put the analog stick on the left.


And on that note, the N64's C-buttons are pretty much a second "stick", so the PS1 doesn't have much of an advantage there. Plus if games use both sticks, they don't usually use the face buttons for much (minor functions you need to use rarely, because you have to let go of the stick to press them...), while on the N64 using the C-buttons with A and B is easy and natural. Oh, and they're also quite nice for camera control in other games, of course.

The C buttons aren't analog, though. So you couldn't quite replicate something like Medal of Honor; you'd need a "walk" button. A and B are replaced by L2 and R2, I don't see any difference there.


But in general, that all N64 games have the analog option was fantastic. You can't quite match that on the PS1 or Saturn, which each have many digital-only-control games. The N64's design was superior from the start, and then the others had to play catchup... but were still left with large libraries of inferior-controlling 3d games with digital-only controls.

Large libraries of inferior-controlling 3d games with digital-only controls? Like what? There really aren't that many Playstation or Saturn games that were digital-only and suffered from it. I don't feel that, say, Jumping Flash needed analog control.


Only in the minds of people who hate it. And yes, I didn't make that up -- that was a very definitely stated goal of Nintendo's from back in 1996. As I said earlier in the thread, though, they under-estimated how many games would use the d-pad, which is part of why it's on the left, along with that "make it more familiar" reason.

Well if that was their goal, they failed, because the N64 controller is clearly the most unfamiliar. Previous controllers did not have multiple handles for using them in different ways. Hell, just look at the argument earlier in this thread about how to hold the N64 controller. How many other controllers have people disagreeing on how to hold them? It's not just "the minds of people who hate it"; the controller had a mixed reception from the start, and its use had to be demonstrated by Nintendo, rather than being readily apparent.

[A Black Falcon]

Yeah, I find that less than ideal. While (arguably) the N64 didn't need anything like the Mission Stick, its controller is definitely no substitute for a mouse or light gun.
As much as I like teh Mission Stick, the N64 (or Xbox, or most modern consoles)'s way is better overall, because you don't need a bunch of expensive, uncommon controllers to get ideal control in games; you have it with the default pad.

I mean, sure, a joystick for the N64 might have been nice, but a mouse? Console mice are rarely very useful... and as for a light gun, I'm terrible with those anyway so I usually do just as well (or better) with a gamepad... though the N64 has only one lightgun-ish game, and it's average at best, I guess if it had a gun you'd think it'd have had more? I don't think that was much of a loss though.


I'm not sure why you keep harping on those. What difference does it make? They're not necessary, they don't get in the way. It's pretty easy to just not notice that they're there.
Just pointing out that Sony's controller has legitimately useless buttons, while Nintendo's doesn't.


(To answer your question, a few driving games let you click to activate turbo and/or rear view.)
It's used in very, VERY few games.


You know what I meant.
Pointing out that the N64 controller was the first console gamepad in a long time with analog is a very valid point, though... the others were inspired by them, pretty much. That does matter.


I don't see how Turok would control any worse if you got rid of the middle prong and put the analog stick on the left.
Because then were would the d-pad go? As I've said, "both on the same prong" is not quite as good design, I think. And also, the Z button needs to be there, not just a boring shoulder button like L. You need that trigger.


The C buttons aren't analog, though. So you couldn't quite replicate something like Medal of Honor; you'd need a "walk" button. A and B are replaced by L2 and R2, I don't see any difference there.
What, as if you actually walk around in any non-stealth FPS? Since when? PC FPSes usually have a "walk" button, but almost no one ever uses it... no, I don't see that as a relevant factor at all. In FPSes, you generally want to run all the time.

And if a "walk" button really is so important, then map it to something. Put it on R or something maybe, I don't know.


Large libraries of inferior-controlling 3d games with digital-only controls? Like what? There really aren't that many Playstation or Saturn games that were digital-only and suffered from it. I don't feel that, say, Jumping Flash needed analog control.
Pretty much any 3d game (not counting fighting games, since those are better with digital control) released on the PS1 or Saturn that doesn't have analog support would be better with it. That's a lot of games. There isn't much reason to list examples because of how many there are, but if you really need examples, fine, I'll list a few... how about Solar Eclipse, Independence Day, TigerShark, Impact Racing, Psybadek, Bubsy 3D, Critical Depth, Willy Wombat, JetMoto, ShipWreckers, Total Eclipse Turbo, Tunnel B1, Bug!, Bug Too!, Street Racer, Bravo Air Race, Warhawk, Off-World Interceptor Extreme, CyberSpeed, Hi-Octane... and plenty more I'm sure. Lots of stuff on PS1/Saturn from 1994-1997. A lot of 3d games on the Jaguar also could be listed here, and any 3DO ones that don't have gun or flightstick support.


Well if that was their goal, they failed, because the N64 controller is clearly the most unfamiliar.
In your opinion.

Previous controllers did not have multiple handles for using them in different ways. Hell, just look at the argument earlier in this thread about how to hold the N64 controller. How many other controllers have people disagreeing on how to hold them?
There isn't really an argument, just some people who hold it wrong. I'm sure that there are other controllers than could be held wrong too. It's not hard to learn, and I do not agree that this is a negative for the controller. Once learned, it works great, and that's what matters.


It's not just "the minds of people who hate it"; the controller had a mixed reception from the start, and its use had to be demonstrated by Nintendo, rather than being readily apparent.
A lot of people liked it once they used it. Some didn't, sure, but almost every controller has its critics. The N64 controller might be more divisive than some, but given that some people really love it, can't you tell that it is a good design? I mean, we're not talking about something like the Jaguar here, where only a tiny number of people like it while almost everyone else hates the thing!

[Manga4life]

My absolute favorite N64 games had to be Super Mario 64 and Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time, but I loved NBA Courtside 2: Featuring Kobe Bryant and WWF: No Mercy as far as sports games went. Goldeneye 007 was amazing for a shooting title, Star Fox 64 was a fun flying/shooting game, and there were a few other titles that made the Nintendo 64 a fun system.

I kind of miss the PSX/N64 era of gaming. It's funny I say that because I wasn't too into it at the time, I enjoyed it but missed the 16-bit era of gaming around this time.....funny how time changes feelings.