Bungie thinks game companies should pocket money on used game sales

[diskoboy]

http://www.joystiq.com/2008/09/26/bu...om-used-sales/

Interesting thought. But I'd have to say I'm against it. I think in the long run, it would probably hurt consumers.

Discuss.....

[alexkidd2000]

Why are gaming companies so fucking special? Does Ford get a cut of used car sales? Does Toshiba get a cut when you resell you TV? Well those are all cutting into new sales. These guys need to get a grip on reality.

[TheRealist50]

thats just greedy, if its a used game that means it was bought new at one point which they already got money from. That means they want extra money if its sold again but this time used? uh...what?!

[Half Japanese]

They seem to be confusing royalties with retail. Unless you can give me a solid reason why you should get a cut every time someone sells to someone else what they originally bought from you, you're just another greedy twat in a world overfull of them. This is the kind of thinking that launched and subsequently buried Divx and keeps people with a brain from buying DRM-laden media.

At some point this does eventually turn the used marketplace into a buyer's market, which is why used DVDs are pretty much worthless. Herein lies another giant hole in this half-assed 'theory': The game market has essentially 'reset' itself every 5 years or so for the past two decades, and while pundits might argue otherwise for the future, wait to see what happens. I don't think anyone at Bungie's eating baloney sandwiches out of necessity.

[chrisbid]

used game sales allow kids without much money to buy new games


these idiots have no idea how their customer base buys their products

[otoko]

Yea.. I have to give them a swing and a miss on this one too. I figure that not only are they being ridiculous, but it'd be almost impossible to ensure they'd get money from every sale. Unless they... wait... better not get into that dark place.

[exit]

So they already got everyone who bought their games money and now they want the money of the person that buys the game second hand? Talking about coming back for seconds, I hope Bungie realizes that something like this will never happen.

[swlovinist]

If it wasnt for used game sales, many less people would know about and play Halo

Making big budget games is getting harder to do, but cutting out used sales will backfire on the market

I see the market going to all digital to "curb" the used game issue, but there will always be a market for used games.

[Mianrtcv]

This is the type of greed that is crippling our economy. Too many executives and corporations set unrealistic growth forecasts and them become enslaved to the ideas and will do anything to "succeed". Their "success" may make them rich, it also may cause their company to crumble thus sacrificing 95 % of its workforce. Then it leaves the vacuum of failure behind it.

Epic Fail

[otoko]

Epic Fail

Agreed..

I wonder who let this person release those comments outside the company and to the general press in the first place. Such a bad thing to say.

[Clownzilla]

1. Consumers complain about rising prices of games

+

2. Piracy of games is at an all time high


How do we bring in more LEGAL PAYING customers? MAKE THE GAMES EVEN MORE EXPENSIVE THROUGH USED GAME RESIDUALS! BRILLIANT!

[noname11]

given that most PC software is "licensed" to us, this idea isnt too far off. as we tread into the world of digital downloads, these type of ideas might limit our ability to resell our consoles.


imagine 5 years from now, selling a wii with about 30 VC or wiiware games on it on ebay. And having nintendo kill the auction because the software was licensed to you and is non-transferrable!

[swlovinist]

1. Consumers complain about rising prices of games

+

2. Piracy of games is at an all time high


How do we bring in more LEGAL PAYING customers? MAKE THE GAMES EVEN MORE EXPENSIVE THROUGH USED GAME RESIDUALS! BRILLIANT!

Consumers are tired of overhyped bullshit

Consumer have more choices than they ever have had before

Consumers are tired of paying for a game that half is not on the media disc only to be milked with additional micro transactions

If the game companies want to bring in more customers, they need to stop short selling customers with half baked ideas, sequels that don't need to be made, and shovel ware that is purly made for profit and not quality.

I agree that third party companies are in for a rough ride right now, with high dev costs and fierce competition. The easy money of the game industry is pretty much gone, but I feel that a correction is more than overdue. While I dont put bungie in this same category necessarily, they are far from perfect and could use a little wake up call.

[exit]

Let's not forget that our economy is slowly turning to shit, so while we're here waiting to see what happens, Bungie is worried about the sales for some garbage game at Gamestop. This type of thing drives me away from buying any game that they develop, not that they've developed much besides outside of Halo, so they wouldn't be getting my money regardless.

[Flack]

That article (and the comments below it) make a point I've been saying for a long time, which is, companies view second hand sales the way they view piracy. They don't make money from either one, so to them, they are one and the same. Seems bizarre when thinking about it from a consumer's point of view.

[kingpong]

What the game companies have an issue with, and this is what differentiates used game sales from things like used car sales, is that the vendors are effectively offering a lower priced item that has not depreciated in value. There wouldn't be much complaining if the used game sale took place 6 months after release, when only a trickle of sales is expected. The problem is all the sales close to release. As long as you don't mind buying a used game, if you buy a month old used game you're getting a new game. You only saved $5, but $5 is $5. You're happy about getting a new game and saving a few bucks, and the store is happy because it made more profit than it would have off a new sale. The only entity who loses out is the game company, and for what? It's not like the $5 off determined whether or not you bought the game. They've lost a sale and somebody else (the store) is making the profit the game company expected to make.

What makes the problem worse is perception due to the attitude of the stores - Gamestop is the obvious offender. Gamestop would love nothing more than to stop carrying new games. They want your pre-order so they can get some cash early and they can limit the risk associated with carrying new stock. Then they push used games on you because their margins are so much better than new games. If you're the game company this has to drive you nuts - the most prominent game store would rather not have to bother with carrying your new product. It is one thing to follow this business practice, but it is another to be so glib about it (like their commerical - over 150 games worth over $15, but they'll sell them back to you for at least $25 more than they pay).

An interesting comparison can be made to movies. For better or worse, these days all that matters for a movie is how it opens. Promote the movie for weeks before the release, then look at the first week box office results and decide if you're going to do a sequel. The promotions are dropped and the rest of the run doesn't matter that much. With a movie you don't have any choice but to see it in a theater if you want to see it when it is new. Imagine if a week after it hit the theaters you could watch it at home. Those "new" sales would drop dramatically. At least in the movie industry it is the movie company making the DVD and making money off of it - the way the used game industry works would be like the movie theater selling hand-cam copies of the movie for $1 less than the ticket price, but with no loss in quality.

Once the game has depreciated in value the gloves are off, but during the period the game can be considered new the game companies get hosed. Gamestop might as well be selling bootleg copies on the shelf right next to legitimate copies, as the end result is the same for the game company.

[Poofta!]

i think companies like gamestop should be legally obliged to pay royalties to game developers to the tune of 10-20% of the profit of each game resold for 2 years after the game's initial release. gamestop is making a killing off of this, and even try to push you to buy used. that is a fortune they do not deserve. when the difference in price is 5$, ill choose NEW any DAY. DEVELOPERS do not make much, most money goes to publishers. and if everyone here would like to bitch about expensive games, think of all the great development studios that had to close down and you still bitched (maxis, bullfrog, troika, ensemble, the list goes on) when a studio doesnt have firm sales, (for whatever reason) it is bought out, bankrupt, or closed down.

and to be fair, what was mentioned earlier is true, to companies, you kids with not a lot of money who buy used, might as well pirate the damn thing, youre all little shits in the publisher's eyes. having the lack of choice to ONLY buy new, would promote good games and studios, since youd be a lot more careful on what you bought. whether it was 60$ on release day or 40$ a year later.

im only against ENORMOUS firms a la Gamestop who make an absolute killing (did you SEE their PROFIT last year? OMFG) off of used games.

[Oobgarm]

that is a fortune they do not deserve.

So if you thought up this idea and made a huge profit off of it, you wouldn't deserve it?

[Rob2600]

Why are gaming companies so fucking special? Does Ford get a cut of used car sales? Does Toshiba get a cut when you resell you TV? Well those are all cutting into new sales. These guys need to get a grip on reality.

There's a difference. People don't sell their cars or TVs a week after buying them.

Stores like GameStop sell used copies of games a week after they were released, which affects sales of new copies.

thats just greedy, if its a used game that means it was bought new at one point which they already got money from. That means they want extra money if its sold again but this time used? uh...what?!

Again, stores like GameStop sell used copies of games a week after they were released, which affects sales of new copies.

What the game companies have an issue with, and this is what differentiates used game sales from things like used car sales, is that the vendors are effectively offering a lower priced item that has not depreciated in value. There wouldn't be much complaining if the used game sale took place 6 months after release, when only a trickle of sales is expected. The problem is all the sales close to release.

...

Once the game has depreciated in value the gloves are off, but during the period the game can be considered new the game companies get hosed. Gamestop might as well be selling bootleg copies on the shelf right next to legitimate copies, as the end result is the same for the game company.

Exactly.

[Kid Ice]

Again, stores like GameStop sell used copies of games a week after they were released, which affects sales of new copies.

So why does the $60 new game purchase only last a week?

I know the hardest of the hardcore are going to buy Game Sequel VI and do all there is to do in a week and bring the game back for a trade in. But will store shelves get flooded with used games this way?

The more likely scenario is the kid puts down his $60, finds the game sucks when he takes it home, and trades it in.

Is it reasonable for me to argue the games simply aren't good enough to be worth $60 in the first place? And if they are *that good* they won't show up used for a few months after release?

My answer is to make the games worth what they cost in the first place....which IMO applies to 3 or 4 games in a given month out of the 100 or so that are released.