Playing rpgs before strat guides

[googlefest1]

I'm still stuck playing Beggar Prince.

so am i - i think there was a missing translation or a few

so far this is the only game id like a guide for -- i feel using guides is cheating - but in this case i think there is an error some where and im became stuck

[BetaWolf47]

I prefer not to use guides myself, but when I get stuck, it seems that the answer is so cryptic and twisted that I'd be surprised if anyone had beaten the game before guides came out. Even today, there's no way in heck I'm beating Phantasy Star without a strategy guide.

Then again, it's almost as annoying when a game spoonfeeds you directions the whole way through. For example, in contrast to Phantasy Star, Phantasy Star IV literally tells you where to go and what to do in every cutscene. It's almost like playing the game with a strategy guide, without actually using a strategy guide.

Developers really had to strive to achieve balance between being cryptic and holding your hand. Not an easy feat.

[WhatsMyUsername]

I don't like to resort to guides if it is at all possible. However, like it has been said a lot of modern RPG's almost require you to use a guide. It often bothers me because I'll be stuck either spending hours figuring things out or get a guide and get the answer right away. Another thing is I find it ridiculous when there are situations where you can either go without a secret item or area and have a much harder time in the game or use a guide to find it. Often these secrets are so ridiculously hidden finding it is near impossible. That's why I often end up using guides a fair bit for the newer RPG's but try to avoid them unless I am absolutely stuck with the older ones. At least for my first playthrough, if I do a secondary playthrough I'll use a guide and try to get and do everything there is to do. For instance right now I am playing through Lufia and the Fortress of Doom for the first time (I know I am a little late ) and with this first playthrough I am avoiding the use of a guide completly unless I get stuck at some part later in the game.

[Ace Comics]

I don't like to resort to guides if it is at all possible. However, like it has been said a lot of modern RPG's almost require you to use a guide.

Especially those with miss-able side quests. Like (theoretically) where you need to talk to the king's daughter... after you leave the castle, but before you leave the city. If you don't... the cut-scene won't trigger... and well, you're still 20 hours into the game... not like you're going to restart.

[Sherblock]

The only time I see using a guide as "okay" are in games like Pokemon, where the they can ease some stress, as well as giving very helpful hints. The second is games like CoDMW2, so you can easily get hints, and do things like learn how to unlock new avatars and perks.

[Sosage]

I only have one thing to say: graph paper. Lots and lots of graph paper.

[fahlim003]

It can be argued that games that don't require strategy guides for completion are too easy or simply designed well, although I think games that do require them when speaking for myself are to save time. I don't have a tonne of time which suffice to say should almost eliminate RPG's from my schedule but at the same time some games seem interesting so regardless of genre I follow my gut.

As for RPG's I've used guides with?
FF7 (only after completing the game, I used the guide to obtain a gold chocobo)
FF3 (FF6, used it to solve the code for Edgar's Chainsaw in Zozo)
Xenogears (got lost near the end of disc 2, plus many years between plays)
Fire Emblem 7 & Advance Wars 2 (both have some challenging missions, so I think although I didn't use guides so much as watching youtube clips)
FF Tactics (not really sure how much I used a guide but this game is very tough for me and so I expect to use guides/replays for this in the future to be sure)
DQ8 (used it to check boss HP values, that's it although recipes would be nice)

FE/AW and Xenogears are slightly disappointing but I guess I'm not up to specification or as mentioned elsewhere they weren't balanced properly when they were designed. My intention won't change though, no guides until a serious road block comes up for any future games.

[Mr.Platypus]

I remember this. I remember playing SwordQuest on the 2600, and having no idea what was going on, or what I was supposed to do. There was no internet, no 1-800 number. Nothing. The game was just one big mystery, and you would just have to accept it. Lots of games were like this for me. Raiders of the Lost Ark on 2600, Wing War on Coleco, Maze-A-Tron for Intellivision. Part of my deep fascination with video games was just how profoundly mysterious these things were. Usually I was just blindly poking at walls, getting nowhere. But sometimes, occasionally, something magical would happen. I never knew what to expect. I felt like anything could happen in those games.

I remember later renting Shadowgate and Phantasy Star, and getting stuck in all the predictable places. Sometimes you would take a game home for the weekend, and you would just get stuck. I would spend an entire Saturday playing a game, and not make any progress at all. Sometimes there were friends or Nintendo Power to help, but probably not. Sometimes I would just return the game, and accept that I could never finish it. Every game I rented carried the same risk. Imagine if you can, going to the video store and renting a movie, knowing that there was a possibility that the movie could suddenly and seriously freeze up. And unless you were clever or lucky enough to figure it out, it would remain forever unresolved. And imagine there was nothing you could do about it. And then imagine every movie on the shelf could be like that.

That's how I remember the days before FAQs and Internet and the like. I had to learn when to just give up, and accept the loss. But also it felt really good to preserver and be rewarded with progress. This is something that today's generation doesn't encounter, I don't think. I doubt anybody gets stuck renting some PS2 game, fights with it all weekend, and just returns it without hope. It's too easy now to just go online and end the frustration. Am I right? Does anyone ever just give up in adventure games anymore?

Also I wonder if this generation is somehow missing out on something. Is it better to play games in a world where you have almost no help? Does it make the reward more satisfying? I know that Phantasy Star and Shadowgate had a kind of awe-inspiring mystery about them. There were always games around me that would be eternal riddles. I don't feel that way anymore. I kinda feel like something has been lost.

[Arkhan]

man sword quest. That game was lame EVEN if you had the comic book it was designed to be played with.


Graph paper is your friend. Wizardry 1 and 2 without graph paper is just insane!

[Mr.Platypus]

Actually, I thought SwordQuest was really awesome at the time. My friend had the game, but he promptly lost the instructions and comic book. Everything about this game was mysterious to me. There was this scary minotaur on the cart, and there were strange symbols and sometimes that rainbow would fill the screen and show you some inscrutable numbers. I thought the game was just too advanced and complicated for me, and if I could just figure it out, there was some grand adventure in there.

I never got anywhere, but I was sure that the game was awesome. Now that I'm older and I better understand what's going on, Swordquest doesn't carry quite the same charm it did. I was better when I didn't get it

[BydoEmpire]

I would spend an entire Saturday playing a game, and not make any progress at all.

I could put up with that when I was younger, but there's no way I'm doing that now. If a game does anything close to that now it's going back on the shelf never to be played again. I simply don't have time - there are too many other games and too many othe things to do.

I only have one thing to say: graph paper. Lots and lots of graph paper.

Amen to that.

I did pick up a strategy guide for FF 12 because I stopped playing the game for about six months and I had a hard time remembering what I was doing when I wanted to pick it up again. It's just a time saver.

Also, I loved the Swordquest series. I had them all loose, so no instructions or comic books, and never came remotely close to finishing them, but I thought they were still fun and engaging games.

[Aussie2B]

Considering my love for Japanese imports and the fact that I've written some guides myself, I can't reasonably look down on anyone that turns to a guide. I know guides have helped me enjoy imports that I otherwise couldn't play or wouldn't consider buying in the first place, and I think my guides on Japanese games have allowed the same for others. And since I often like to obsessively do every last little thing in a game, guides help me out with that. Unless a game is Japanese, I generally don't bother with walkthroughs much. I more often refer to in-depth guides that focus on one aspect of a game that would usually be ridiculous to figure out on your own. With actual strategy guide books, I like owning them, but there are few that I've used to any great extent. They're nice for looking at art and what have you.

Of course, with all the obscure stuff that I play, I'm frequently in the position where there is no guide to turn to even if I desperately wanted one. But even with that option, I appreciate a hard-earned accomplishment and will try to do things the "old school" way whenever I can. Even in this day and age, I'm still quite happy to take handwritten notes and meticulously draw my own maps. Just doing those things in and of themselves feels like an accomplishment since I know so many others with buckle under the slightest resistance a game puts up.

And I'm guilty of using those hint lines back in the day. I remember I was hopelessly stuck on finding the 5 golden leaves in Link's Awakening. I also called when I got to the mandatory temple in Lufia II with the scrambled graphics, which totally confused the game counselor, haha. Can't remember exactly what he told me, but none of it was useful, obviously, considering it's a glitch in every cart. I think he was suggesting that I tried doing that section of the game again to see if it was the same, but I think he was also wondering if my game was dirty or defective. All I could do was randomly press directions until I made my way through. Thankfully it's fairly straightforward. I remember Nintendo also had an automated line with commonly asked questions for the time, and I'd use that on occasion.

[Trebuken]

I have never used a strategy guide. I have browsed FAQs and walkthroughs for certain parts of games -- generally I do that before I lose interest because I am stuck, or impatient. I often find myself simply wanting to finish a game so I can start another.

Truely though I started with back in the day with graph paper as well. Commodore 64, and an early PC. Might and Magic I and II were insane. Also Bards Tale series and the gold box AD&D games. You had to graph them to find all the secret spots. In the old says there were no hints or shadows where secret doors were, you had to check every spot...

[mobiusclimber]

I forgot about this but some strategy guides are really just awesome reads. Casey Loe (or Loye? Lowe?) for instance has written a couple that are just great fun because there's all these little secrets and tidbits scattered about. For instance, the unofficial FF7 one had little sidebars about graffiti in the game and things like that. Also the RE3 one was like that, full of humorous asides every other page just about.

[kupomogli]

I don't buy strategy guides at all. What's the point in playing a game if you're going to have everything spoon fed to you?

Now I will admit lately there are some games that have secrets that are so ridiculously hidden or cryptic that I had to use a strategy guide, but that's about the only time I'll look one up(example: almost all end game secrets in FF10.) There aren't many I've actually used a guide with at all though, to completion or not. Also, unless it's something impossible to figure out or near impossible, I won't use a guide at all before game completion.