What's so great about RPGs?
Hi everyone,
What is so awesome about rpgs?
Why are they so expensive?
What are the best titles for beginners or for those who enjoy more fast paced games?
I would like to truley understand what it is that gamers love about rpgs to really see what I'm missing out on.
Thanks for the answers.
Im looking for Bonk for the NES. No need to pm me though, unless you would accept bits of string for tender.
With most genres, aside from a few changes, it's usually the exact same game with a different coat of paint. Obviously physics, etc, are going to change, but there's only going to be a handful of powerup unique to each game. That's not say any other genre doesn't also carry its share of great games, its just that RPGs feel more diverse. With RPGs, while it'll be similar, they're usually fairly different from types of attacks, strategies, ways you enter battle, etc. For example you're going to have a very different experience playing Wild ARMs 3 over Suikoden 3, or playing Final Fantasy Mystic Quest over 7th Saga, etc.Originally Posted by armonigann
Also. In my opinion, music really adds to the video game and RPGs usually have a much larger soundtrack than any other game(check out the Wild ARMs 3 soundtrack.) It's usually based on the fact that most every game is starting to have multiple battle themes, town themes, dungeon themes, etc. Since RPGs are so large in scope you'll usually have dozens of dungeons so it would be fairly boring to have the same couple tracks in them all(though sometimes but rarely they repeat.)
Then there's the fact that usually RPGs have much more depth to the storylines, last longer, and seem to feel like a more polished experience altogether. They also carry a tried and true system, much like your average FPS, so you just build on that system to make an enjoyable game.
Last edited by kupomogli; 10-29-2010 at 11:15 PM.
Everything in the above post is opinion unless stated otherwise.
The thing is, they have an amazing sense of accomplishment for single-player games. The plot is often rewarding, you get stronger the more you play, and it draws you in. They tend to engage the typical retrogamer a lot more than, say, platformers, shmups, sports games, and the like. We enjoy the feeling that we are involved in something big, like saving the world as a spiky-haired brave dude from a long-haired emo dude with the help of friends.
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Have you not tried out any or have you tried some and just didn't "get" it? There's no genre that'll appeal to everyone, so if you've already tried, then maybe they're just not for you.
If you want ones that are fast-paced, then now is probably the best time to start trying RPGs. Starting with the original PlayStation, a lot of the more modern RPGs have battle systems that are much more frantic and exciting than the older, purely turn-based titles. Since it's my favorite series and offers fast, addictive battles, I'll recommend Star Ocean.
The answer to your question is different for each era. For simplicity's sake, I'm going to assume that you mean console RPGs. If you're talking about computer RPGs, then the simple answer is "it's Dungeons & Dragons on your computer."
80s
Games like Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest took the Dungeons & Dragons number-crunching combat and integrated it in a large-scale fantasy adventure game. At the time, (86-87), games were still more action-oriented. Things like story depth, character development, and the need for multiple sittings to work through the game were very uncommon at the time. Instead of twitch-action, these games had slow complexity. Instead of just an attack button, your character has many abilities. At the time, that sort of thing wasn't possible in a real-time action game, with Zelda being the closest thing. In short, they were great because they offered something new and exciting compared to what had been seen before.
90s
The 90s saw a huge shift in the focus of the RPG. While stories became more complex, the actual plot became more linear. The focus was on telling a more cinematic story than was possible in action and adventure games. You no longer played the generic hero that just had to save the princess, now there's an evil empire to overthrow, and your characters' pasts interfere along the way. Battle systems continued to follow the simulated D&D combat format somewhat, but the battles start to feel disconnected from the story. Most every game has a boss fight where after you win, the villain gets away. Still, 90s RPGs were amazing for their focus on graphics, story, and technical advancements.
2000-2010
This is where RPGs started to really suck. Look at Final Fantasy X, a fully-voiced cinematic production that still follows the old format of field exploration and battles. The battles are such a stark departure from the story that it's hard to take the whole thing seriously. Lost Odyssey isn't much different, though it feels like what FFX should have been. FFXIII's field segments are absolutely worthless, and the battles are linear and boring, making it perhaps the worst RPG ever made. FFXIII is, however, a competent anime, which is what makes modern RPGs "great." Yeah, play a modern RPG if you feel like watching an interactive anime. You're essentially watching an anime where you have to win a boss fight before you're allowed to watch the next episode.
If you've never played an RPG before, I strongly suggest picking up Chrono Trigger DS ($18 new) and Final Fantasy Anthology ($12 new). These games are from the height of what we call the "RPG" genre, and are arguably the best examples of the format. If you want to "play a role," as in play a simulated roleplay, pick up Oblivion, which I would describe as a real-time action-adventure simulation. I wouldn't call Oblivion an "RPG," at least not in the way the term is thrown around in regard to video games, even though it ironically fits the description of role-playing game better than 90% of what we DO call RPGs. The problem is that, being action-adventure video games, the modern western RPGs are still video games, and therefore are not true role-playing games. They're designed to be played with video game logic (I need to level up X skill to beat the boss), not role-playing logic (if I switched sides, I wouldn't have to fight him at all).
As far as why some are so expensive, it's because they had limited print runs. Most RPGs that you see priced above $50 were only produced to meet demand at the time. It took a long time for RPGs to gain mainstream acceptance in the US, so RPG fans were a niche crowd. FF7 is the exception, because while it sold extremely well and even had a rather long Greatest Hits pressing, the demand for it is high enough to drive the price up. Where RPGs used to be a genre embraced by the more literate crowd, FF7's popularity has (for some reason) reached a large number of people that probably can't even spell RPG.
Most Jap RPGs suck, but US based RPGs are the better RPGs to play.
80s had the excellent Ultima series, the Bard's Tale series, Might and Magic series, The Magic Candle series, Questron series, Phantasie series, even the Gold box series. Wizard's Crown is a real classic still today, all these RPGs had excellent charcater development, real depth stories etc....
Later US RPGs like the Kyrandia series during the 90s were always far better, with deeper plots, more funny than any Japanese RPGs. Just play Book 2, it's still a classic.
Last edited by tom; 10-30-2010 at 12:04 PM.
Except the 90's Kyrandia series were all adventure games and not RPGs....
Anyway, I haven't played many RPGs but I'm starting to get into them. I'm playing through Phantasy Star as I found a copy of the Phantasy Star collection for the GBA. I find it interesting that for the most part you're free to travel anywhere you like whenever you want, what limits you is your experience. Obviously it's still pretty linear as you have to go through sections of the game in a certain order so you can progress further, it just doesn't feel as linear compared to games with defined levels. A big motivation with RPGs are the stories, if the story is terrible or boring I won't feel like playing through the game as there's no finished product to work towards.
It seems like RPGs have more story, exploration, customization, and strategy mixed together compared to other genres. I still prefer RPGs that are more linear, I don't like wandering aimlessly for hours without knowing what I'm supposed to do, I like having clear goals that I'm supposed to work towards like knowing where I'm supposed to try heading next or who I'm supposed to search for. I also don't want to be overburdened with too many options to choose from, even having to select which types of characters make up my party(Fighter, Thief, Black Belt, Red Mage, White Mage, Black Mage, etc) is way more choice than I'd want. Eventually I'll try to play the original Final Fantasy again, when I tried it before it just seemed like a ton of work to play it, almost like installing computer hardware.
I could never really get into rpg's...
It sucks cause i know im really missin out on some epic games but I have that short attention span that enjoys instant gradification.!!!
A short while back when i got int rero-gaming i thought that maybe my mind has changed since becoming an adult. I had some friends recomend Zelda II to me as a good beginer rpg since it had some platformig parts. I picked up a clean copy for 5 bucks off a local craigslist ad. I was amazed the game had saves on it from god knows when. I erassed them and started my own adventure. No dice. It just wasant for me...
I still have the game. It looks good in my collection because evryone remembers that gold cart. Hell who knows maybe after another 20 years my mind will have matured enough!!!
I'm the best there is at what I do. But what I do best isn't very nice. -James "Logan" Howlett
Just give the Dragon Quest series a shot, and you will understand..
I never liked RPGs "back in the day"... but in the past 7 years or so have become interested in them as my gaming taste "matured" so to speak. I used to think they were slow and boring and plodding.
But now, I like a sweeping adventure quest... I like talking to townsfolk, gathering clues, hearing random nonsensical gossip, etc. It takes on a life all its own. Video games are about escapism... and nothing does that quite as well as a quality RPG
I couldn't get into the second Zelda game, though it has RPG elements it plays like a sidescroller and I just die way to quick. It may be playable but I have more enjoyable games that I'd rather play instead. Maybe I'll try it again but it won't be that soon.
I couldn't get into Dragon Quest/Dragon Warrior either. I played the first game for 10 minutes before I got sick of it. I couldn't take the stairs without selecting the option "Stairs" from the menu. It's not a complex decision like what to do during a battle, I don't want to be bothered with trivial stuff like that.
I feel RPGs are like crossword or sudoku puzzles, they're mostly something to do just to pass the time. You don't need to blow through it all at once, just work on it when you feel like it. If you lack the patience to do puzzles like that you might not have the patience to play an RPG with all the grinding you'll have to do. You could try the Phantasy Star series, the fourth one is the best but I personally want to play them in order so I started with the first one. Shining Force is a good Tactical RPG, I've only played it briefly but liked it so far. Supposedly Rhapsody: A Musical Adventure for the DS is intended to be a beginner's RPG, I have a copy but haven't got around to trying it yet so I can't comment on how good it is. I'm really not big on RPGs at all(a few years ago I think I said I hated the genre), but I'm actually enjoying some of them now so there could be some out there that you'll enjoy too.
There should be a list of good RPGs, you could try some from this list;
http://www.epinions.com/content_3345850500
That's definitely the wrong Dragon Warrior to start out with if you've ever played another RPG. It was my first RPG and at the time it was amazing game, but it was only amazing because it was the only one I've ever played. Even when Final Fantasy came out I still liked it but Final Fantasy was so much better.
Now that there are many more RPGs to compare it to, the original Dragon Warrior is just one of the worst. Regardless if you play the NES, SNES, or GBA version it's such a boring game. This is from someone who loved the original game.
If you're going to play a Dragon Quest game I'd recommend starting at Dragon Quest 3. The third game is a direct prequel and the second half of the game is the first game pretty much, so in a way I like the first game a lot just really hate how much of a massive grind it is. Now every single NES Dragon Warrior requires you to press the A button to use the stairs, so if you don't want to do that option then either play the Gameboy Color or SNES(fan translated) version. The GBC version is the latest has extra dungeons, but the SNES version has some of the most beautiful graphics on the system. Dragon Quest 4 is good on both the NES and DS in English, Dragon Quest 5 is on DS and SNES in English, Dragon Warrior 7 is tied as my favorite with Dragon Warrior 3, Dragon Warrior 8 on PS2 is okay, and Dragon Quest 9 is pretty boring.
Last edited by kupomogli; 10-30-2010 at 11:24 PM.
Everything in the above post is opinion unless stated otherwise.
I wouldn't say Dragon Quest 9 is pretty boring.. pretty much the opposite. It's extremely well polished and while it's a JRPG through and through, it's obviously a current generation game with pretty much everything learned about JRPG's over the past 2 decades rolled into it. But to each his own.
To answer the original question though, I guess it's just something you have to have the enthusiasm to "immerse" yourself in and view it as an all-encompassing world that you are traveling and having an adventure in. If you don't have the time or the willingness to do that, then you'll probably not enjoy any RPG game no matter the type.
Last edited by NE146; 10-31-2010 at 05:59 AM.
I've always found RPGs to really be a kind of game where it's played for the storyline and music. The overall menu-battle gameplay and grindfests that most RPGs consist of never appealed to me.
I like Dungeon Crawlers, Action RPGs, and Turn-Based Strategy games though. Shining in the Darkness, Popful Mail, and the Fire Emblem series I definitely enjoyed. But games like Chrono Trigger, the Lunars, and the Final Fantasies I don't care for. Even Pokemon I find is too monotonous now.
If you're looking for some to try out, here are my suggestions:
Old:
Chronotrigger (amazing gameplay), Final Fantasy VII (the rpg I was most immersed in)
New:
Mass Effect
I thought new RPG's were absolutely horrible after playing Final Fantasy XIII. Then I played Mass Effect and my faith was renewed.
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If I was telling someone who only played action games to start playing RPGs, I would naturally start them off with action RPGs/fantasy adventures with storylines. Things like Alundra, Baldur's Gate Dark Alliance, Diablo II, Zelda: A Link to the Past, Neutopia, King's Field, Morrowind, Oblivion, Faxanadu or things of those various styles. The appeal of instant gratification of killing monsters might draw them in, then they would get used to stories, talking to characters, leveling up in some cases, and searching for important items.
After that they might enjoy RPGs where actions during fight scenes makes a difference. Beyond the Beyond might be a grindfest, but is well drawn for its 2D world and only having battles in 3D and includes an APS system where if you hit buttons repeatedly you have a chance of scoring critical hits. Paper Mario and The Legend of Dragoon are more respected games that have elements like this.
Pokemon is good for training people to know what elements are usually strong against others. More advanced RPGs like classic Final Fantasy games often have spells that affect certain elements of enemies better than others. Cast fire on ice monsters or thunder on water monsters for example.
The only advantage of starting with Dragon Warrior 1 is that you only have one character to take care of. It does get you used to healing yourself at the appropriate times and makes you remember to buy weapons and stay at inns as needed. If you know where everything is, you can beat the game in less than 16 hours. One day I sat through the whole thing without stopping until I was done.
[quote name='Shidou Mariya' date='Nov 17 2010, 10:05 PM' post='4889940']
I'm a collector, but only to a certain extent.
Not as extreme as Rickstilwell though.[/quote]
In the early days, and for me at least, Japanese RPGs (with exceptions given for games like Baldur's Gate and Planescape Torment) always won out over Western RPGs. I thought the depth of plot, characterization and focus on cinematography were generally superior in games from the east.
Starting in the PS2 days things started to get a little rocky though. There were still tons of fantastic JRPGs but the amount of mediocre quests to embark on steadily grew. Now JRPGs are largely unmitigated garbage. There are a few exceptions (Lost Odyssey being one) but the sheer amount of crap you have to wade through to find a JRPG that's even half playable is pretty disheartening.
I see a couple of reasons for this. First of all, Japanese development houses have had some serious growing pains just adapting to the tech of this generation. If you look at a lot of Japanese developed games they're aesthetically far behind their western counterparts. Simple things like bump offsetting and normal mapping seem be non existent in many Japanese games and it just looks like, technically speaking, Japanese developers aren't nearly as skilled as their Western counterparts. Considering the trend use to be the reverse, I'm kind of surprised.
Another problem is that Japanese RPGs are so niche focused now. Just look at NIS - tons of RPGs designed for the super hardcore uber otaku with jokes, references and systems that are so obscure no one in their right mind would expect them to interesting to mainstream audiences.
However, if you look at western RPGS they've excelled by leaps and bounds. Not only are they technically superior the sheer variety of play style means that no matter what kind of gamer you are you can find a WRPG that suits your tastes.
Like shooters? Check out Borderlands?
Like narrative driven experiences that play like films? Bioware is your answer.
Like hack and slashy action oriented games? Diablo, Torchlight and Deathspank sound up your alley.
Like bizarre, obscure, funny games? Check out Penny Arcade Adventures or Costume Quest.
The versatility of the genre is what makes it so popular and, right now at least, western developers have that nailed.
Heh. Now all your opinions make sense. You're not a console gamer, you're an old school PC gamer.
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NFG: Elephants are so unpredictable.
Tom: Especially in groups of three.
NFG: Two pairs of three, no less.
As most people have already stated, it's basically the whole "immersion" experience that you feel. The plot / storyline sucks you in and you actually feel more accomplished by the end due to all of the experience / levels / skills you've acquired as you've progressed.
It's nice when the game forces you to revisit a previous area after you've leveled up a bit. You encounter the enemies and blow through them realizing just how strong you've become.
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Escapism.
When I was younger, I couldn't appreciate them - much in the same way I didn't appreciate books.
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