My story: Becoming a new Neo Geo AES owner! Recommendations?

[ifkz]

The Neo Geo AES home system was always the one that got away.

The first time I came across a system for sale was in 2000 at a local retro game store chain. It had just been brought out and was priced at $200, a good deal. After I went by an ATM for the cash, I returned only to find an empty space where the system was only an hour ago. Oh well, I thought, I am sure there will be other systems...

Time passes, dinosaurs became extinct, it is now the year 2010. I was browsing Craigslist and I came across a heavily modded AES with additional outputs for component video. I know these are expensive mods, but I'm not really into non OEM mods for my consoles. Still, I get in touch with the seller and...during negotiations it gets bought out from under me for probably $180 or so. I am slightly frustrated...

A few weeks ago I pop into another local retro game store and I find the owner beaming with delight as he had just hosed some poor guy selling a Japan region AES to the store. Not for sale, but if it was in the future, $500. I had enough...eBay to the rescue.

After a short search I find what looks to be a complete AES with a buy-it-now of $200, and I go for it. No hesitation. It finally arrived yesterday after a long wait for shipment, completely covered in clear shipping tape. They wrapped the system in it, each of the controllers, then wrapped each part in bubble wrap with even more shipping tape. After hours of residue removal I finally have a nice looking system. I think it is a rarer USA region system, which is a plus, completely unhacked, which I like. I also think it is one of the early models, outputting in RF. One of my first purchases will be composite cables.

Both sticks had their issues, the worst one was taken apart in an "MVS console-azation experiment" gone bad and had wires clipped clean from the pins (still in the housing connector). One pin was actually missing that I had to fabricate from a spare PC USB connector. Soldering was touch and go for a bit, but it metered out okay (continuity test) and was good to go once everything was back together. All of the screws were missing, but ones from an old PC keyboard were perfect fits. This controller that I saved is going to be the one I play the most.

I have no games at the moment, so I hope the system is okay. It does generate video, a nice blue screen. I've been paying a little attention to eBay for a couple of years, it seems like the most affordable games are going to be Magician Lord, Nam 1975, Sengoku, and ASO II (all new imports from a massive find a couple of years back). I am also considering World Heroes II, and both of the early Samurai Showdowns. I refuse to go the multi-cart way, it's not my style. I do hope the multi-carts bring down cartridge prices to more reasonable levels by dampening demand for the originals. The PS2 compilations are also helping...no way I'll be getting rid of my PS2 Art of Fighting collection, Samurai Showdown collection, or the wonderful Metal Slug collection. There has always seemed to be speculators in the AES market, seeing things as more of an investment vehicle than anything else. I'm not that type of collector, I still play my stuff!

Comparisons vs. a Neo Geo CD...
While I said the AES was always the one that got away, I did have the pleasure of purchasing a USA region boxed Neo Geo CD a few years back at the same 2000 era local used game store. I think this is actually the rarer of the SNK USA region home systems for those collecting for rarity alone. I've slowly gotten a nice library together of fast loading games and some of the slightly slower loading fighters. It turns out that the really early games are a lot easier to find and less expensive on the AES vs. the CD so I won't have a lot of duplicates. I'm not going to mind re-buying Samurai Showdown 1 & 2 for the AES. If anyone reading this is only going to have a CD, it is more than worth it for you to pick up a pair of the original AES joysticks. Trust me, there is no going back to the pads after using the sticks..

Sorry for the story of my life here, I'm a passionate collector and it shows.

[megasdkirby]

Cool you have a console, though this topic makes me realize two things:

1)The horrid condition Ebay items can be in, which is why I prefer getting games and systems from message boards like DP than on Ebay. Just too much of a gamble. I personally would contact the seller and state the condition it was in, specially the controllers.

2)The incredible urge I have to post a "Cool Story Bro" picture as a response!

[ifkz]

The seller was upfront about...one of the controllers having a problem. I also saw the packing tape on everything in the auction picture, so I knew what I was getting into. Thankfully my skills were evolved enough to fix everything. The long shipping time wasn't mentioned, but the seller explained that too; the auction was meant to be an auction and not buy-it-now. He said I got the "deal of the month." I'll leave him 100% positive feedback when I get a game to test the system. As you can tell, I'm pretty happy after all these years of wanting one.

Glad someone out there likes my story.

[Rev. Link]

I, too, waited to find a US system with no mods. It took me a while to find one with a price I was comfortable with. Finally got one off eBay a few years back. Everything looked good, except the guy accidentally shipped me the video cables for a Turbo Duo instead of the AES. I let him know and he apologized, said he'd ship the correct cables. About a week goes by and my package comes. I open it to find another Duo cable...

I just let it go, figured the seller was kind of clueless. To this day I still don't have video cables for my AES, I just never got around to hunting them down. I don't have any games for it, either. I'd like to get some, but I was too busy concentrating on my NES collection.

[WanganRunner]

What's the advantage of going with an AES when a consolized MVS is generally the same price with less expensive games?

Just coolness factor?

[ifkz]

Think of it as chasing after that high priced luxury item that there was no way a person could afford back then. I, sadly, do not have room for another arcade cab to go the MVS route. And even if I did have room, that wasn't what I wanted. There are lots of ways to play the games nowadays; this wasn't about going as cheap as possible, just feeling good about the price I paid for what I wanted.

[Aussie2B]

My recommendation would be to not become an AES owner, but I see it's too late for that. :P I don't know why you're so resistant to mods either. The AES is known for having shitty video output out of the box. I understand the collector mindset of wanting to keep it like new, but you'd really be gaining so much more than you'd be losing, if you ask me.

Sorry if it seems like I'm crapping on your excitement. It is very cool to own an AES, so congratulations on that. However, the reality is that you should expect to have a woefully limited collection unless you're willing to put down a LOT of money, which, from the perspective of someone who wants to play, it's money wasted when the MVS exists. If you had gotten a cabinet or a consolized MVS, you could get the games at a fraction of the price, and, with universal bios, you could play in home mode. Add in some shockboxes, and you can even get the aesthetic of an AES collection if so desired. THAT is my recommendation, but, in lieu of that, I think there's a converter that allows MVS carts to be played on AES, right? Even if that is pricey, I think it would be worth it.

I wouldn't expect the multicart or compilations to ever significantly lower the prices of AES games or MVS games for that matter. Collectors want the real deal and those games are expensive because they're rare (and in many cases very good games too, so that doesn't help). I mean, if 20 million new carts of World Class Track Meet were suddenly made it isn't going to lower the price of Stadium Events.

[ifkz]

Thanks for the input on all of this, I enjoy reading it and keeping up with the thread. I went into this expecting to have a small collection. Even if I just get one game to go along with the system, I'll be happy. I probably have the skills to pull off the video mods on my own, but I have no desire to take a drill to the back end of my case (or solder anything onto the board). It looks like the video connector is compatible with the Sega Master System and Genesis 1 video connector, so I think I just saved $10. Anything above RF is fine by me; my game TV is 20 inch flat tube TV. I grew up playing on an RF only 19 inch TV, anything bigger just doesn't seem right, I've tried. I guess I'm a creature of habit, to borrow an old phrase.

[stalepie]

Thanks for the input on all of this, I enjoy reading it and keeping up with the thread. I went into this expecting to have a small collection. Even if I just get one game to go along with the system, I'll be happy. I probably have the skills to pull off the video mods on my own, but I have no desire to take a drill to the back end of my case (or solder anything onto the board). It looks like the video connector is compatible with the Sega Master System and Genesis 1 video connector, so I think I just saved $10. Anything above RF is fine by me; my game TV is 20 inch flat tube TV. I grew up playing on an RF only 19 inch TV, anything bigger just doesn't seem right, I've tried. I guess I'm a creature of habit, to borrow an old phrase.

Well the bigger the TV the more the game is stretched to fit it (the more blurry it'll be). You tend to just sit farther back from a big TV anyway.

I like composite for 16-bit systems.

[gum_drops]

Couple things to note:

1) You can do a $15 internal video mod taking advantage of the onboard sony encoder to output s-video which is a nice upgrade to composite. You would need to drill a single hole for the s-video connector though. Jamma-nation-x has a tutorial and the s-video kit for sale. The owner of the site is pretty helpful too if you have questions.

2) The MVS multi cart doesn't work with the home system, even with the converter adapter. For the $200+ that the converter costs you could just get a supergun and a MVS board.

3) Prices for US homecarts are at an all time high, especially for the rarer stuff. Japanese games are more affordable since they are much more abundant. The only difference between jp and us games being the printed artwork, the boards are exactly the same. System bios determines the region that the cart will be displayed in.

4) Are you sure your console is a US/PAL version? You usually have to put in a game cart and see what comes up on screen. Some games display in english anyway so you have to find a title known to have noticeable differences in content or language. Street Hoop displays one of three different titles for example, based on region.

Personally, I would go the MVS route. Too many good games that are either overly expensive or not released on the home console:

garou mark of the wolves
shock troopers 1 and 2
All the metal slugs
blazing star
prehistoric isle 2
sengoku 3
twinkle star sprites
bomberman
neo turf masters
Breakers
Etc Etc

[FABombjoy]

4) Are you sure your console is a US/PAL version? You usually have to put in a game cart and see what comes up on screen. Some games display in english anyway so you have to find a title known to have noticeable differences in content or language.

Ya mean US/NTSC?

The other ways to tell, without opening it up, is:

1: US systems have an FCC sticker on the bottom
2: US systems have metal shielding on the inside, which can be felt through the cart port

[ifkz]

For fun I checked my system and it is indeed a US system because it has the FCC ID tag. My serial number is #019349. I love the look of the console, controllers, and the little scratches and nicks it has picked up over the years; they all let me know it's vintage. The joystick ball top wear is my favorite, I love the cracked spiderweb look they all develop. I don't know how they are still whole. Here is a picture of the cleaned up system and controllers:

[savageone]

I'd recommend getting an RGB cable and a RGB to component converter. You can find a cable here that also taps stereo sound from the headphone jack. RGB to component converters can be had for ~$50 and you'll be able to use it with all/most your game systems. A lot like the Genesis the AES has pretty cruddy RF and composite output but the RGB is stellar.

You can still pick up some early titles for fair prices. Like these. Early games in the Samurai Shodown, Fatal Fury, World Heroes, etc series are usually not too expensive either. For the really expensive games there is no shortage of conversions but those still run ~$200 each. Another option for those games is to buy an MVS converter and MVS carts which are abundant.

For mods I recommend replacing the BIOS with the UniBIOS. It does a lot of stuff like change languages, enables blood, boss characters, various cheats, unlimited credits, jukebox mode, etc.. It's basically like having a game genie built in to the system.

[Icarus Moonsight]

2) The MVS multi cart doesn't work with the home system, even with the converter adapter. For the $200+ that the converter costs you could just get a supergun and a MVS board.

It works fine and dandy if the AES has a Unibios installed.

Why AES hardware over console mod MVS or supergunning one? Simple. You can't spell aesthetics without AES. One of the most gorgeous looking systems to my eye, hand down.

I came to the AES party last year about this time, and I've learned a few things. First, pace yourself. I got my system with a few games (5, I think) and I bought 10 others within a month or two after first getting my system bundle. Since that initial rash, I've bought one game and that was at the end of last summer. I pulled some great games for cheap off of eBay when I bought the second group, but I'm guessing that it was simply luck. From one seller I purchased Robo Army, Last Resort and Andro Dunos all new for ~$225 shipped. You got to be patient, know the typical going prices and don't hesitate when you find low hangers. Then the AES isn't so bad.

Second, get a custom bios. You can piggyback the install, but I do recommend that you socket it (I was fortunate enough to have bought a system with a socket already installed). Double underline with italics if you have a US system. Some games are gimped running in US region mode. I mostly run mine in Euro MVS mode to bypass the censor crap and keep everything in engrish. Also required if you ever want to run MVS originals or the multi-bootlegs. It has other useful features (the cart verify tool comes to mind) but the above is the main point why you want one.

Next, get on to RGB or get s-vid and/or component mod. Later systems have nice composite though, with washed RGB. Early serials have poor composite, but super lush RGB with great darkness levels. The later systems take some work to get real nice RGB out of them like the early units, but it can be done. It looks like your serial might ride a line, though I can't be certain because I don't recall the cutoffs specifically. You can check the insides to get a better fix on what you are dealing with, of course. Somewhere between the earlies and the lates there was a rev with a composite video amp daughterboard over the memory card cradle. With the serial you gave, that's what I'd look for. There is a website with this info... But it's buried in my bookmarks. If you need the url I can get it to you, but it might not be right away.

Is there an echo in here, or is it just me? Oh, did I mention pace yourself?

[Aussie2B]

Why AES hardware over console mod MVS or supergunning one? Simple. You can't spell aesthetics without AES.

I don't buy that. There's no rule that a MVS consolization has to look ugly (but even if it does, what are we doing, staring at our systems or PLAYING our systems?). There are plenty of people that have made really slick consolizations. And you can get shockboxes with covers that look basically identical to AES ones. In fact, you can get shockbox covers that look BETTER than AES covers because if you're limited to early AES games due to prices then you're probably mostly stuck with the games that have nothing on the backs but a square of four screen shots and a couple paragraphs of plain text. You can't tell me that this is all that visually appealing:

http://image.com.com/gamespot/images...86394_back.jpg

And honestly, if not for the extra protection, I wouldn't even bother with shockboxes. My MVS carts were impressive looking enough as it was just lined up on a shelf.

[gum_drops]

It works fine and dandy if the AES has a Unibios installed.

Ah yes, forgot about the unibios, very handy to have installed.

As for AES versus CMVS or Supergun, I agree the AES is aesthetically great looking, but to play say shock troopers you would need to use a conversion of the game or a 1XX in 1 cart, neither of which are options I personally like.

I agree about the shock boxes. I initially bought 50 of them at $6.50 and was going to spend another $50+ on printing inserts. I ended up selling all but 5 of them and with the money bought a complete Ninja Masters Kit, Sengoku 2 kit and a garou MOTW cart. I don't knock people who go the shock box route, whatever makes you happy with your collection, I just re-thought it and decided for the cost it just was not worth it to me.

[Icarus Moonsight]

I don't buy that.

Yeah, neither did I. I traded for my AES. Helps destroy the OMFG cost hurdle. I can run either AES or MVS now... Does an MVS do that? No.

AES is bi-winning.

[JLukas]

I'll echo the above comments that you're really missing out if the system is without some kind of s-video/component/RGB, a unibios, and MVS adapter. The RF/composite is awful and such a waste for a system with best-of-the-best 2D. While it's somewhat easy to get started buying the early $50 launch titles like Magician Lord, there's tons of later releases that are all $300+ in AES form. Yes, the adapter costs a lot but it's the only sane way to afford a Neo Geo setup without going the consolized/supergun/cab route.

[ifkz]

I am surprised none of you have mentioned the Neo Geo CD as a great way to play the games on the cheap(er than AES). Per video clarity, it has built in S-video.

Even though I now have an AES, there is no way I would give up the CD version of the system. The load times on the games I have are very short, except for a lot of the one on one fighters. I guess it isn't widely available as an option for most collectors, or to at least see one in action. The one on one fighters can be slow loading, but that is why I got the AES. Even the guy on videogamecritic.net has both systems.

The hard to find early games on the CD are actually cheaper on the AES (or very close), so I can collect and enjoy a little bit of both systems. If the market for AES games drops in the future, I can pick up more then, "no rush" to borrow from a post above. I figure I'll get the handful of good, cheap, early AES games and from then on look for the "low hanging fruit" (thanks to the original poster above).

[rwbivins]

You should definately get SamSho 2. IMHO one of the best games in the library and
cheap to get ahold of to boot. Great system, great game. Great story. :highfive: